Sony HDR-TD10 3D-Capable Camcorder - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 4Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #61 of 1663 Old 04-02-2011, 12:55 AM
Advanced Member
 
icerat4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 518
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Good news. Thanks
icerat4 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #62 of 1663 Old 04-05-2011, 04:01 PM
Advanced Member
 
icerat4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 518
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Still has a date of 4/15. anyone here anything yet.
icerat4 is offline  
post #63 of 1663 Old 04-05-2011, 11:11 PM
Advanced Member
 
TonyW79SFV's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Los Angeles, CA - NE San Fernando Valley
Posts: 681
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I'm anxious to get this camcorder. I went to Best Buy, Sony Store, and Fry's Electronics this past weekend and none have it (in the case of BB and Fry's, they don't seem to carry higher end camcorders anymore). Checking the Canadian Sony Style site, their release date is a week after the US.
TonyW79SFV is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #64 of 1663 Old 04-06-2011, 09:46 AM
Advanced Member
 
TomWheeler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 562
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 109
In January of this year I had my local Sony Professional dealer install a Sony VPL-VW90ES 3D capable projector (replacing a Sony VPL-VW100 that he installed over five years ago). After seeing how much I enjoyed 3D Blu-ray discs on the Sony 90ES on my 100 in. wide Stewart Studiomatte 1.3 screen, I had him place an order for the Sony HDR-TD10 3D camcorder in early February. I have queried my dealer for news on when he expects to receive this camcorder and he in turn has queried his Sony rep on the delivery date for the camcorder. Unfortunately, neither my dealer or his Sony rep have been able to determine anything on when the camcorder is expected in the U.S.

Tom
TomWheeler is offline  
post #65 of 1663 Old 04-06-2011, 12:03 PM
Advanced Member
 
icerat4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 518
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Bummer.
icerat4 is offline  
post #66 of 1663 Old 04-06-2011, 01:04 PM - Thread Starter
 
alk3997's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,691
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 94
The funny thing (OK, maybe not so funny) was the Amazon sent me one of their targeted ad emails - where they noticed I was looking at Camcorders. Number one on their list they sent was the Sony HDR-TD10. A great deal ($1 off) but the status still shows that the camcorder has not been released. I thought for a second that they had received some, but no...
alk3997 is offline  
post #67 of 1663 Old 04-06-2011, 01:35 PM
Member
 
smacarth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Northboro, MA
Posts: 16
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Happened to find this link to a users manual.

http://www.pdfuu.com/sony-hdr-td10e-...eshooting.html
smacarth is offline  
post #68 of 1663 Old 04-06-2011, 03:39 PM
Advanced Member
 
icerat4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 518
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Well thats interesting thanks
icerat4 is offline  
post #69 of 1663 Old 04-06-2011, 09:24 PM
Member
 
sharpnicle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 30
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by smacarth View Post

Happened to find this link to a users manual.

http://www.pdfuu.com/sony-hdr-td10e-...eshooting.html

I downloaded that pdf, what attracted me the most is a chart at page 26, which showcases optimum distances at different zooming levels, and there is a maximum tele level in there

am I too optimism or any, does that mean sony introduced a better solution to 3D formation than JVC did? for JVC as we can see from another thread, brings little 3D effect at tele stop
sharpnicle is offline  
post #70 of 1663 Old 04-10-2011, 06:37 AM
Advanced Member
 
icerat4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 518
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Well this is hopefully the week. Anyone hear anything at all.
icerat4 is offline  
post #71 of 1663 Old 04-10-2011, 05:22 PM
Advanced Member
 
NorthTV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 710
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by icerat4 View Post

Well this is hopefully the week. Anyone hear anything at all.

Does Frank have one of these headed his way? Seems he has tried out everything available on the market so far so any comparisons between the Sony and JVC could be made here first!
NorthTV is offline  
post #72 of 1663 Old 04-12-2011, 12:07 AM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
Don Landis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 12,928
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1485 Post(s)
Liked: 438
icedrat4-

I'm at NAB and Sony has the TD10 on demo along with the new pro version.
The rep here said that they are delayed for 2 weeks but not due to the Tsunami damage. He said first priority will be all preorders and top Sony Dealers.

I played with the TD10 again and was still impressed with it's quality on output. Since I had not done so at CES, I decided to make a direct comparison between the Sony and the JVC. Both live output to a 3D monitor looked equally good. However, the on camera monitor on the Sony was much superior. The JVC in 3D mode looked pretty rough. In 2D mode it was like an SD LCD display. The Sony on the other hand looked very good in 3D and in 2D looked super sharp with lots of image detail. Other than that it is just a different control layout. I happen to prefer the Sony. Plus the accessories are better on the Sony.

The Sony Pro model has the following extras-

Pro audio attachment to include a professional shotgun mic and twin XLR jacks with manual volume control.
Lens shade
96 Gb internal storage
Can record in 1080 24P x 1920
time code

Price- $3400.00

AS bigbarney already posted in another thread, Sony Vegas 10d upgrade will have the new codec to edit 3D in the full resolution.
LL
LL

My 3D and 360VR videos and more
Don Landis HT System: Projector Sony VPL VW665ES Players: Samsung UBD K8500 OPPO BD93 Sony BDP S6200 All Regions Player Denon AVR S940, 7.1 JBL Professional series and Klipsch PS3, XBOX360, Dish VIP722K; 3D; Apple TV 4K. Edit Suite:Adobe Premiere, Edius7.53, Vegas Pro v13, Power Director16, i9-7980XE/GTX1080Ti, LG 3D TV DM2752
Don Landis is offline  
post #73 of 1663 Old 04-12-2011, 02:09 AM
Advanced Member
 
icerat4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 518
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Bummer before easter would have been nice. Glad i am on the pre list,
icerat4 is offline  
post #74 of 1663 Old 04-12-2011, 10:09 AM
Advanced Member
 
TomWheeler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 562
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 109
My local Sony dealer who installed my Sony VPL-VW90ES projection system and from whom I have had the Sony HDR-TD10 on order form since late January told me yesterday that he had just gotten feedback from his Sony rep that the Sony warehouses in the U.S. will have the 3D camcorder on May 2. He also told me that there are lots of orders for this camcorder. It would not surprise me that the supply of the camcorder will be limited. I am hopeful to receive the TD10 that I have ordered through him sometime in May.

It is great news to hear that Sony Vegas 10d will be able to edit the MVC 3D format shot by this camcorder.

Tom
TomWheeler is offline  
post #75 of 1663 Old 04-12-2011, 01:58 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
W.Mayer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Germany
Posts: 2,154
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 242 Post(s)
Liked: 315
what do you think as the sony have compare to the jvc almost the same sensor size
how the low light performance was between the sony and the jvc?

the sony pro version can record in 3d 2x 1920x1080 at 60i 50i and 24p.
so at least the 2x 24p version will play at my cinema dlp.

do you know if the sony will offers also the adjustment the jvc have to
fix and manual adjust the axis?
W.Mayer is offline  
post #76 of 1663 Old 04-12-2011, 05:54 PM
Advanced Member
 
icerat4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 518
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by W.Mayer View Post

what do you think as the sony have compare to the jvc almost the same sensor size
how the low light performance was between the sony and the jvc?

the sony pro version can record in 3d 2x 1920x1080 at 60i 50i and 24p.
so at least the 2x 24p version will play at my cinema dlp.

do you know if the sony will offers also the adjustment the jvc have to
fix and manual adjust the axis?




yes no yes yes maybe
icerat4 is offline  
post #77 of 1663 Old 04-12-2011, 07:29 PM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
Don Landis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 12,928
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1485 Post(s)
Liked: 438
From what i saw the sony has a manual 3D adjustment on the manual knob where the manual focus and iris is also located. There is a pushbutton to toggle through the different settings.

Today i returned to get further details on the pro version of the camcorder. Confirmed that neither the lens shade nor the pro audio handle assembly will work on the consumer version.

sony pro version records in the same formats as the consumer version plus it does 1080 24p. X 1920 in 3D (same as BluRay). vegas 10d will edit in this native format as well and output for BluRay burning. The way i understood the work flow with 10d. Is that you can bring in consumer version of 1080i x 1920 files, edit, and render the output converted to 24p for bluray.

My 3D and 360VR videos and more
Don Landis HT System: Projector Sony VPL VW665ES Players: Samsung UBD K8500 OPPO BD93 Sony BDP S6200 All Regions Player Denon AVR S940, 7.1 JBL Professional series and Klipsch PS3, XBOX360, Dish VIP722K; 3D; Apple TV 4K. Edit Suite:Adobe Premiere, Edius7.53, Vegas Pro v13, Power Director16, i9-7980XE/GTX1080Ti, LG 3D TV DM2752
Don Landis is offline  
post #78 of 1663 Old 04-12-2011, 11:13 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
bravia3D's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Japan
Posts: 1,208
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 33
JVC can't record in 24p can it?

3D items I own:

Sony 46" LX900 active 3D set

Sony HMZ-T3 (Cushion pads and light blocker mod)

LG LW6500 passive 3D set

PS3 & PS4

Sony BDP-S570 BD3D player

JVC-GS-TD1 (with Cyclopital base extender)

Fujifilm W3

Sony Alpha 55 (for 3D panoramic photos)

Quadcopter + Zenmuse and GoPro Hero 3 (Filming...

bravia3D is offline  
post #79 of 1663 Old 04-13-2011, 12:18 AM
Advanced Member
 
TonyW79SFV's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Los Angeles, CA - NE San Fernando Valley
Posts: 681
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by bravia3D View Post
JVC can't record in 24p can it?
Nope. Looked at their spec and it lists only 60i for MVC (full 3D), and AVCHD (2D and sbs 3D). It's moot anyways as Sony only records 3D in 60i as is the Panasonic cams, although both can do 24p 2D HD.

That's also a bummer that the TD10 is delayed; it seems to be the most anticipated consumer 3D cam. JVC released their full 3D HD camcorder last month without a hitch, let's hope Sony can so the same this upcoming tax day (for the U.S.).
TonyW79SFV is offline  
post #80 of 1663 Old 04-13-2011, 12:46 AM
Advanced Member
 
NorthTV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 710
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Landis View Post
icedrat4-

I'm at NAB and Sony has the TD10 on demo along with the new pro version.
The rep here said that they are delayed for 2 weeks but not due to the Tsunami damage. He said first priority will be all preorders and top Sony Dealers.

I played with the TD10 again and was still impressed with it's quality on output. Since I had not done so at CES, I decided to make a direct comparison between the Sony and the JVC. Both live output to a 3D monitor looked equally good. However, the on camera monitor on the Sony was much superior. The JVC in 3D mode looked pretty rough. In 2D mode it was like an SD LCD display. The Sony on the other hand looked very good in 3D and in 2D looked super sharp with lots of image detail. Other than that it is just a different control layout. I happen to prefer the Sony. Plus the accessories are better on the Sony.

The Sony Pro model has the following extras-

Pro audio attachment to include a professional shotgun mic and twin XLR jacks with manual volume control.
Lens shade
96 Gb internal storage
Can record in 1080 24P x 1920
time code

Price- $3400.00

AS bigbarney already posted in another thread, Sony Vegas 10d upgrade will have the new codec to edit 3D in the full resolution.
Were you able to play with the two models sufficiently to determine how they comparatively perform in low light situations? My guess based on the specs is that it would be hard for the Sony to capture as clean a picture as the JVC with its 1.2 lens would be capable of doing. I suspect for many having a better resulting recording in low light situations is a lot more important than how crisp the viewing screen is on the camera itself. Assuming the Sony consumer version is deficient in this area, is there any suggestion that the Sony pro version at least equals the JVC's low light without noise 3D recording performance???
NorthTV is offline  
post #81 of 1663 Old 04-13-2011, 02:36 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
bravia3D's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Japan
Posts: 1,208
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 33
Well since I bought the JVC, I hope my JVC is better Just so I feel good about my purchase haha

3D items I own:

Sony 46" LX900 active 3D set

Sony HMZ-T3 (Cushion pads and light blocker mod)

LG LW6500 passive 3D set

PS3 & PS4

Sony BDP-S570 BD3D player

JVC-GS-TD1 (with Cyclopital base extender)

Fujifilm W3

Sony Alpha 55 (for 3D panoramic photos)

Quadcopter + Zenmuse and GoPro Hero 3 (Filming...

bravia3D is offline  
post #82 of 1663 Old 04-13-2011, 03:05 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
W.Mayer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Germany
Posts: 2,154
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 242 Post(s)
Liked: 315
one difference between the jvc and the sony is that the sony
start at 34.4mm focal length the jvc offers only 42mm (all compare to 35mm film)

so the sony can record a wider picture.

i dont think that there will be a huge difference that the jvc have a optic that
can capture more light as in 3d we need higher f ratio as one of the golden rules in
3d are that all record material have to be sharp from front to infinity.
W.Mayer is offline  
post #83 of 1663 Old 04-13-2011, 10:53 AM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
Don Landis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 12,928
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1485 Post(s)
Liked: 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthTV View Post

Were you able to play with the two models sufficiently to determine how they comparatively perform in low light situations? My guess based on the specs is that it would be hard for the Sony to capture as clean a picture as the JVC with its 1.2 lens would be capable of doing. I suspect for many having a better resulting recording in low light situations is a lot more important than how crisp the viewing screen is on the camera itself. Assuming the Sony consumer version is deficient in this area, is there any suggestion that the Sony pro version at least equals the JVC's low light without noise 3D recording performance???

I actually think too many amateur shooters make too big a deal over such subtle differences. As a professional shooter for broadcast TV, I feel if one shoots in too low a light condition he is either doing Detective work or wasting his time. Given the choice of a tool to shoot stunning images, such as a monitor that allows for perfect focus adjustment as opposed to not being able to see what you are shooting due to a coarse monitor and the use of a 1.2 lens vs a slightly slower lens, I'll choose the better, higher resolution monitor any day of the week. You will not be able to see the difference between these two lenses, trust me. Now what you will want in a better lens is a wider angle, especially important for 3D as most of your shooting will be in the widest angle possible. This is where you need to be setting your goals. Besides, you made an assumption that the signal to noise is deficient in the Sony. Is it really? As far as the pro version, The NX, I already listed the basic differences. The main one is the ability to shoot in 24P. Do you really need that?

Here's the bottom line on choosing a camcorder for 3D- Understand that within a category, all these companies will make a high quality product. The main difference will be in the ergonomics and major features. Second is the ability to have accessory support by both the manufacturer and 3rd party. Beyond that your most rewarding return on your investment is to concentrate on shooting skills and story telling.

So, if you are in the field and you try to grab a shot in 3D in low light level- How do you make your 3D adjustments if the image on the monitor is fuzzy and you can't detect what the heck you are adjusting? Answer- put everything in auto and hope for the best. Or, you have a sharp high res monitor and can set the camera for the best image under those conditions. Now you record your scene and have confidence what you shot will work, or you know that shooting will just not give you any results.


For those who want to believe what they bought is better than the competition. I say stop worrying about excuses and start shooting. The more you shoot the better you will be. You will learn to work around your camera's shortcomings. All cameras have them. When I played with the JVC and had trouble with the monitor seeing the 3D effect and focus adjustments, I finally pointed the camera at a very well lighted subject and the 3D began to show up and then I was able to adjust it for eliminating the double image in the shot.

I'm not saying the Sony is the better camcorder for you. Just that for me it fits in my tool kit better because of support structure. I rely on my experience and talent to take what the camera delivers, under my control, and sell the result. If you have no tool kit, maybe what you select is best based on availability and cost. But don't be fooled by specs that in the end won't make you an award winning or money making videographer.

My 3D and 360VR videos and more
Don Landis HT System: Projector Sony VPL VW665ES Players: Samsung UBD K8500 OPPO BD93 Sony BDP S6200 All Regions Player Denon AVR S940, 7.1 JBL Professional series and Klipsch PS3, XBOX360, Dish VIP722K; 3D; Apple TV 4K. Edit Suite:Adobe Premiere, Edius7.53, Vegas Pro v13, Power Director16, i9-7980XE/GTX1080Ti, LG 3D TV DM2752
Don Landis is offline  
post #84 of 1663 Old 04-13-2011, 11:13 AM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
Don Landis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 12,928
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1485 Post(s)
Liked: 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by W.Mayer View Post

one difference between the jvc and the sony is that the sony
start at 34.4mm focal length the jvc offers only 42mm (all compare to 35mm film)

so the sony can record a wider picture.

i dont think that there will be a huge difference that the jvc have a optic that
can capture more light as in 3d we need higher f ratio as one of the golden rules in
3d are that all record material have to be sharp from front to infinity.

Hey, thanks for the info. I actually didn't bother to look it up as I worked with the cameras and made the observation about wide angle capability. On my other cameras I can add wide angle lenses as needed but that option is not available on 3D camcorders so this was a key issue to me.

Technically speaking when you go faster lens, as in F1.2 and maintain the same diameter glass, you lose maximum wide angle. I saw the JVC did not go as wide as the Sony but didn't know the focal length. When it comes to Glass, you can't fight the laws of physics, but with image noise, you can easily make up for a faster lens with better S/N in the electronics.

Interestingly, the bigger format cameras shooting in 3D use larger imagers and need bigger glass too. For 3D the separation of the center axis of the lens also affects how close you can shoot 3D. The closer the lenses the the closer you can shoot. Big cameras that have large lenses need to use a special overhead second camera to squeeze the lenses closer together than the diameter of the glass will permit. This is what RED does in their 3D rig using a one way glass. The need to separate the lenses for better stereo effect is a myth and is laughed at by the engineers who design these 3D systems.
LL

My 3D and 360VR videos and more
Don Landis HT System: Projector Sony VPL VW665ES Players: Samsung UBD K8500 OPPO BD93 Sony BDP S6200 All Regions Player Denon AVR S940, 7.1 JBL Professional series and Klipsch PS3, XBOX360, Dish VIP722K; 3D; Apple TV 4K. Edit Suite:Adobe Premiere, Edius7.53, Vegas Pro v13, Power Director16, i9-7980XE/GTX1080Ti, LG 3D TV DM2752
Don Landis is offline  
post #85 of 1663 Old 04-13-2011, 01:56 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Frank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Dept. of Offense
Posts: 4,836
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Landis View Post

The need to separate the lenses for better stereo effect is a myth and is laughed at by the engineers who design these 3D systems.

That's absurd. The one inch IA of the Sony makes it worthless to me for everything except close in work indoors.

Did IQ's suddenly drop sharply while I was away?
I enjoy 3D in spite of HDMI 1.4!
Full screen only 3D doesn't cut it!
Frank is offline  
post #86 of 1663 Old 04-13-2011, 02:51 PM
Advanced Member
 
icerat4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 518
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank View Post

That's absurd. The one inch IA of the Sony makes it worthless to me for everything except close in work indoors.



Dont take this the wrong way Frank. But i know none of these consumer cams are for you. Your in a different leauge all together. Not thats a bad thing. But you judging these cams is unfair in a sence. I am sure there ok for the avaerage idiot like me who just shoots now and then AND never edits anything. Ya get where i am going right. They dont have what you would have built them with . But i am sure they work ok. For us rookie idiots . Peace frank.
icerat4 is offline  
post #87 of 1663 Old 04-13-2011, 08:57 PM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
Don Landis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 12,928
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1485 Post(s)
Liked: 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank View Post

That's absurd. The one inch IA of the Sony makes it worthless to me for everything except close in work indoors.

Frank, it might be time you got to know some of these engineers who build the 3D systems for the major motion picture industry. it's just possible you could learn something that could help you in making your custom 3D system. there must be many a need for the dual camera setups in the industry because i saw quite a few companies offering rails to mount cameras for 3D.

I had not seen the overhead mounting before and had to learn why they needed that. Why not just a simpler mount side by side. The answer was to decrease minimum shooting distance. Farther apart the cameras are, the greater the minimum shooting distance. In the RED system they had the center to center distance at just over an inch and a half. If shooting 30 ft away then it doesn't matter much and they could get away with side by side.

My 3D and 360VR videos and more
Don Landis HT System: Projector Sony VPL VW665ES Players: Samsung UBD K8500 OPPO BD93 Sony BDP S6200 All Regions Player Denon AVR S940, 7.1 JBL Professional series and Klipsch PS3, XBOX360, Dish VIP722K; 3D; Apple TV 4K. Edit Suite:Adobe Premiere, Edius7.53, Vegas Pro v13, Power Director16, i9-7980XE/GTX1080Ti, LG 3D TV DM2752
Don Landis is offline  
post #88 of 1663 Old 04-14-2011, 01:26 AM
Advanced Member
 
NorthTV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 710
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Landis View Post

I actually think too many amateur shooters make too big a deal over such subtle differences. As a professional shooter for broadcast TV, I feel if one shoots in too low a light condition he is either doing Detective work or wasting his time. Given the choice of a tool to shoot stunning images, such as a monitor that allows for perfect focus adjustment as opposed to not being able to see what you are shooting due to a coarse monitor and the use of a 1.2 lens vs a slightly slower lens, I'll choose the better, higher resolution monitor any day of the week. You will not be able to see the difference between these two lenses, trust me. Now what you will want in a better lens is a wider angle, especially important for 3D as most of your shooting will be in the widest angle possible. This is where you need to be setting your goals. Besides, you made an assumption that the signal to noise is deficient in the Sony. Is it really? As far as the pro version, The NX, I already listed the basic differences. The main one is the ability to shoot in 24P. Do you really need that?

Here's the bottom line on choosing a camcorder for 3D- Understand that within a category, all these companies will make a high quality product. The main difference will be in the ergonomics and major features. Second is the ability to have accessory support by both the manufacturer and 3rd party. Beyond that your most rewarding return on your investment is to concentrate on shooting skills and story telling.

So, if you are in the field and you try to grab a shot in 3D in low light level- How do you make your 3D adjustments if the image on the monitor is fuzzy and you can't detect what the heck you are adjusting? Answer- put everything in auto and hope for the best. Or, you have a sharp high res monitor and can set the camera for the best image under those conditions. Now you record your scene and have confidence what you shot will work, or you know that shooting will just not give you any results.


For those who want to believe what they bought is better than the competition. I say stop worrying about excuses and start shooting. The more you shoot the better you will be. You will learn to work around your camera's shortcomings. All cameras have them. When I played with the JVC and had trouble with the monitor seeing the 3D effect and focus adjustments, I finally pointed the camera at a very well lighted subject and the 3D began to show up and then I was able to adjust it for eliminating the double image in the shot.

I'm not saying the Sony is the better camcorder for you. Just that for me it fits in my tool kit better because of support structure. I rely on my experience and talent to take what the camera delivers, under my control, and sell the result. If you have no tool kit, maybe what you select is best based on availability and cost. But don't be fooled by specs that in the end won't make you an award winning or money making videographer.

Thanks for taking the effort to add additional comparisons. Sounds like no one has really done a side-by-side comparison yet of the JVC vs. the Sony in varying light conditions. I have had camcorders in the past that produce beautiful video taken outside but when you use them indoors the result is most disappointing. The whole idea of a camcorder is so you don't have to lug around lighting equipment. I know the 3D video taken with the Fujipix W1 and W3 is best relegated to well lit situations. Hopefully both the Sony and the JVC can improve on that.
NorthTV is offline  
post #89 of 1663 Old 04-14-2011, 09:37 AM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
Don Landis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 12,928
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1485 Post(s)
Liked: 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthTV View Post


Thanks for taking the effort to add additional comparisons. Sounds like no one has really done a side-by-side comparison yet of the JVC vs. the Sony in varying light conditions. I have had camcorders in the past that produce beautiful video taken outside but when you use them indoors the result is most disappointing. The whole idea of a camcorder is so you don't have to lug around lighting equipment. I know the 3D video taken with the Fujipix W1 and W3 is best relegated to well lit situations. Hopefully both the Sony and the JVC can improve on that.

Agreed! What i have seen over the years is a gradual improvement of low light shooting quality. When the CMOS chip sets replaced the CCD there was a dramatic improvement in low light performance. But today comparing one CMOS to another the differences are very subtle. Both JVC and Sony appear to have equal performance for a given low light. Please understand that I find tiny differences unimportant as other differences between the two have greater influence over "getting the shot".

In my travels yesterrday I did some test shooting (with my SR12) and come to the conclusion that the distances I want to shoot, I may need a mattebox but just unsure how filtering will affect the 3D outcome. When I get home, I plan to do some careful studying of the Grand Canyon 3D I have. So, like Frank, I'll be on a quest for something special, the good news for me is that I know the small Matteboxes exist.

My 3D and 360VR videos and more
Don Landis HT System: Projector Sony VPL VW665ES Players: Samsung UBD K8500 OPPO BD93 Sony BDP S6200 All Regions Player Denon AVR S940, 7.1 JBL Professional series and Klipsch PS3, XBOX360, Dish VIP722K; 3D; Apple TV 4K. Edit Suite:Adobe Premiere, Edius7.53, Vegas Pro v13, Power Director16, i9-7980XE/GTX1080Ti, LG 3D TV DM2752
Don Landis is offline  
post #90 of 1663 Old 04-14-2011, 04:35 PM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
Don Landis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 12,928
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1485 Post(s)
Liked: 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by icerat4 View Post


Dont take this the wrong way Frank. But i know none of these consumer cams are for you. Your in a different leauge all together. Not thats a bad thing. But you judging these cams is unfair in a sence. I am sure there ok for the avaerage idiot like me who just shoots now and then AND never edits anything. Ya get where i am going right. They dont have what you would have built them with . But i am sure they work ok. For us rookie idiots . Peace frank.

From what I learned in today's sessions the distances that Frank wants to work in could be better achieved using the slightly larger format designs with a 3" IA. both the Sony and the JVC consumer camcorders are designed to shoot between a couple ft and upto 50 feet. Beyond 50' the 3D effects are just too flat to get a value from them. Using wider interaxial distance like 2.5 to 3" the shooting range extends out to 500 ft but the minimum distance also increases as does the physical dimensions of the equipment. Frank, based on your shooting ranges you might better be served by one of the 3D sports shooting camcorders, or just stick with your two camera setup and work the auto alignment tweak in Vegas 10.0d. It is to be released on April 20th.

My 3D and 360VR videos and more
Don Landis HT System: Projector Sony VPL VW665ES Players: Samsung UBD K8500 OPPO BD93 Sony BDP S6200 All Regions Player Denon AVR S940, 7.1 JBL Professional series and Klipsch PS3, XBOX360, Dish VIP722K; 3D; Apple TV 4K. Edit Suite:Adobe Premiere, Edius7.53, Vegas Pro v13, Power Director16, i9-7980XE/GTX1080Ti, LG 3D TV DM2752
Don Landis is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply 3D Source Components

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off