Originally Posted by termite
Now I'd be happy if I can find a way to produce the same quality on the AVCHD 1080/60i disk
playback displayed on Epson. It now defaults to 720/60p (3D) even when I have a direct
connection from the blu-ray player and looks visibly inferior.
So if your Epson will not take the frame-packed signal from your camera, it's not going to take the 1080i/60 disc signal either (from here on out, 1080i/60 refers to frame packed, not SBS). The Blu-Ray player will likely down convert it to 720p so it plays back.
And that to date has been my frustration: this half-baked 3D consumer format. 3D Blu-Ray specs were outlined in 2009, and AVCHD in 2011. You have 1080p/24 or 720p/60 for Blu-Ray 3D (you can do SBS, but that's not officially classified as a Blu-Ray 3D disc), and 1080i/60 for AVCHD. Panasonic releases an SBS camera, Sony and JVC release the AVCHD cameras. And all three companies are member of the Blu-Ray association, 2 of which are director level control companies. Yet, no one could seem to get their head around 3D from a content (professional) and consumer supported formats. It's no wonder 3D is on life support (albeit morphing into VR).
I've read the AVS 3D forums ad-naseum, and my take away is there is no perfect authoring solution for consumer 3D (just personal preference), especially when it comes to 1080i/60 AVCHD. What makes matters worse, even if the workflow existed tomorrow, there's no guarantee your display will accept said format. My Toshiba 3D panel will not accept 1080i/60 frame packed. From the camera, it requires SBS. From the Blu-Ray player (Sony S380) it is downconverted.
This really leaves me (personally) with a few choices, as I want to go deep with 3D, but I don't like the editing formats.
- Sony Vegas, first off, I say major FAIL to Sony for not incorporating an 1080i/60 AVCHD option (disc or SD card) in either Vegas Pro or the cheaper consumer version. It's just dumb to not even offer the format choice that your very own camera operates at. It's sad Sony can't even get it right (and I worked for Sony for 7 years, consumer electronics group is dysfunctional) with their hardware/software. But this is the software that outputs consistent Blu-Ray 3D compliant results. Personally, I hate, absolutely, hate the interface and editing vs. Premiere/Final Cut/etc and the stability across a multitude of system configs is terrible. That's just me, kudos to everyone that loves it.
- Power Director, it's not bad, but before I blow anymore money on software, I wanted to demo it. Can't demo the 3D outputs, that's all been disabled in the trial. Seems to be one of the only other options.
- Pinnacle Studio, no longer allows trials, and again, I'm just weary of wasting more money on another workflow that may/may not work.
- Edius, tried that, it's not bad, but I also don't find it good. Again, just differences in workflows with regards to editing, layout, tools, functionality vs. Adobe Premiere and every other editor out there. Seems to work, but I have reservations, given my 3D output, while it worked flawlessly, was 1/4 the size of the same exact edit/output from Vegas. And at $600+, again, just not comfortable or confident I'm getting a clean and avoiding recompression (on all but actual changes like MainConcept is known for).
Now, I was holding out hope for the new 4K Ultra HD Blu-Ray spec (specifically, a 1080p/60 3D inclusion), and then there could be a path to going from 1080i/60 acquisition to conversion to 1080p/60 (or even 30 - Blu-Ray does not support this format, only supports 1080p/24 or 1080i/30). Well, it's been announced there will be no additional 3D formats/modes added to 4k Ultra HD Blu-Ray spec. Nail in the 3D coffin here.
So, what does that leave users with a choice of (in my opinion):
- Continue to acquire at 1080i/60 and then either change editors (Edius/Power Director/Pinnacle Studio) to burn to a 1080i AVCHD disc, and hope you have compatible equipment that will play it back (and hold onto it, since the spec appears to be all but dead at this point);
- Use the included Sony PMB or PMH software to just burn your disc with little to no editing (the player downconversion is 10x worse than exporting from Sony Vegas at same 720p output)
- Continue to acquire at 1080i/60 and then for your final output, change to 1080p/24 (to much of a frame rate hit for my liking) or 720p/60 (my preference at this point);
- Consider switching to SBS outputs (not an option for me - I don't like the 50% horizontal resolution hit), but has the highest compatibility rate IMO;
- Consider switching to either the JVC HMZ1P or the Sony NX3D1U for native 1080p/24 capture and Blu-Ray output (excluding the $20k Sony and Panasonic 3D cameras) and using one of the above editing programs to stay native all the way through;
Finally, I considered getting the JVC TD1, and just using their POS editor to stay native from import to export, and then use a media player to play the native 1080i/60 s3D files. And yes, the JVC editor is a POS, but I only need cuts and fades (and for music, I could spit out my final edit, bring into Premiere, do my final sound edit, export sound only, bring back into JVC with the single soundtrack file limitation, and export my final edit). But you are still limited to your display accepting the 1080i/60 signal, which it appears many don't, and you can't assume new displays will.
It kills me Adobe didn't incorporate a template into Premiere to edit 3D natively and export to what I consider the three formats (BR 3D 1080p/24, 720p60; AVCHD 1080i/60).
So right now, I may continue shooting with the TD10 and just exporting 720p/60, and may get a NX3D1U and shoot 1080p24 natively, edit with that.
In a perfect world, I could edit in Premiere, export an EDL and import in Sony Vegas just to export to a 3D Blu-Ray, but while Vegas Pro 12/13 supposedly has this ability, all the reviews I've seen says it doesn't work or barely works (for 2D).
Anyway, I'm rambling at this point, but this is what it is, and your ability to play raw or edited 1080i60 s3D is very, very limited.