The first Atmos Soundbar-Yamaha YSP 5600 - Page 4 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #91 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 10:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by splogue View Post

...I think I'm still going to take the plunge, despite my mostly missing third wall, because I simply have no room whatsoever for even bookshelf speakers in that room...

Sean
As another "no third wall" poster. I'll be very interested in your impressions. Is your ceiling flat or vaulted?
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post #92 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 10:47 AM
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There are some sort of reflective "things" you can put in your room if your room isn't up to par for the 5600.

I thought I saw them on Yamaha's website somewhere.

EDIT - I found it, page 100 in the 5600 manual:

YRB-100 - Sound Reflection Board.

Last edited by New24K; 11-15-2015 at 11:13 AM.
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post #93 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 11:06 AM
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According to the manual, the Wireless Subwoofer Kit (SWK-W16) is included with the 5600.
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post #94 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 12:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by New24K View Post
According to the manual, the Wireless Subwoofer Kit (SWK-W16) is included with the 5600.
Wow - if that's true, that's very good news!

Now if they would just toss a wall bracket into the box...

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post #95 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 12:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by New24K View Post
There are some sort of reflective "things" you can put in your room if your room isn't up to par for the 5600.

I thought I saw them on Yamaha's website somewhere.

EDIT - I found it, page 100 in the 5600 manual:

YRB-100 - Sound Reflection Board.
Wait, people buy this reflecting soundbar because they can't put speakers in the room, but because they don't have reflecting walls they use these boards which fill up the exact same space as a speaker would. Looks like Yamaha found a solution to a problem that didn't exist
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post #96 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 12:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taichi4 View Post
I don't think that most people in the industry think that Atmos using reflection is "bogus" as a previous poster said.

In Atmos theaters, ceiling mounted speakers are much higher and further from the listener than in the home, and therefore are bound to lose some of the directionality that would cue the listener to think "there's a speaker up there," which would undesirable.

I think there's an argument to be made that reflected Atmos might be at least as good as ceiling mounted speakers in optimal environments.
You present a good argument.
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post #97 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 12:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
Wait, people buy this reflecting soundbar because they can't put speakers in the room, but because they don't have reflecting walls they use these boards which fill up the exact same space as a speaker would. Looks like Yamaha found a solution to a problem that didn't exist
That's not the only reason people buy a soundbar - and certainly not this Atmos/DTS:X soundbar.

A lot of those people don't want all of those speakers and their speaker wires, an AVR, etc.

And now with Atmos - there are even more speakers/speaker wires, etc.

Some people just want their living room to look like a living room - and not a theater.

The small reflecting boards are, I believe on stands, etc. - which can be put away when not in use.

It is a very novel solution to those who would otherwise not be able to achieve the full benefit of the 5600.

IMO of course.
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post #98 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted by palavering View Post
You present a good argument.
Not really. "There is a speaker up there" is exactly what you want. The mix makes single sources sound distinct or spacious. If you design a speaker that can't be localized then all sounds coming from it will sound the same, spatially indistinct.
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Last edited by markus767; 11-15-2015 at 12:28 PM.
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post #99 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 12:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by New24K View Post
That's not the only reason people buy a soundbar - and certainly not this Atmos/DTS:X soundbar.

A lot of those people don't want all of those speakers and their speaker wires, an AVR, etc.

And now with Atmos - there are even more speakers/speaker wires, etc.

Some people just want their living room to look like a living room - and not a theater.

The small reflecting boards are, I believe on stands, etc. - which can be put away when not in use.

It is a very novel solution to those who would otherwise not be able to achieve the full benefit of the 5600.

IMO of course.
Putting them away when not in use doesn't sound very realistic, it also isn't easy to do. Those boards need to be in exact positions.

Those boards aren't exactly "small" – 11-3/4" x 7-5/8". On or in-wall speakers are probably visually less obtrusive.

In order to work properly such a board needs to be bigger than the wavelength it has to reflect. 7-5/8" reflects only about 1700Hz and higher.

Markus

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Last edited by markus767; 11-15-2015 at 12:36 PM.
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post #100 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 12:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taichi4 View Post
As another "no third wall" poster. I'll be very interested in your impressions. Is your ceiling flat or vaulted?
The ceiling is flat, but 11 feet high. I don't think the height will matter.

There are short walls on both the front and back of the "missing side." One is the fireplace, which is beside where the soundbar will be mounted. The other is a closet, that comes out into the room. Both of them are angled outward from the room, which might even help the sound beams rather than hurt them.

Kind of like this crude attempt at ASCII art, provided here free of charge by yours truly:

|---------\
|
|
| /
|----TV---/

The wall reflectors look very interesting. They certainly would be a conversation-starter. However, I think if I were going to put tall objects around my room I would just make them speakers and skip the sound bar altogether.

Link to the reflectors: http://usa.yamaha.com/products/audio...ies/yrb-100_w/

Sean

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post #101 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 12:50 PM
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As stated, the reflectors can be put away very easily when not in use.

You can very easily mark (with clear tape or something) the exact location of them.

It really is no big deal.
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post #102 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 01:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by New24K View Post
As stated, the reflectors can be put away very easily when not in use.

You can very easily mark (with clear tape or something) the exact location of them.

It really is no big deal.
I wouldn't do that every day. By the way, you could do the same with real speakers and the results will be much better than any reflecting sound source. If you really want things out of the way do in or on-wall or use headphones

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post #103 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 03:24 PM
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From the article on the front page of AVS, and a number of other articles I read, I don't believe the subwoofer comes with the soundbar at the listed price. I believe it's a $500 option.

Here's an early review that can be read via Google translator, but be prepared for some funky translation.

http://www.areadvd.de/tests/ifa-exkl...uer-2-000-eur/
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post #104 of 681 Old 11-15-2015, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taichi4 View Post
From the article on the front page of AVS, and a number of other articles I read, I don't believe the subwoofer comes with the soundbar at the listed price. I believe it's a $500 option.

Here's an early review that can be read via Google translator, but be prepared for some funky translation.

http://www.areadvd.de/tests/ifa-exkl...uer-2-000-eur/
It seems as though there are differences in the US model vs. other places - go figure.

The US model doesn't seem to come with the wireless subwoofer module - but the UK version does.

The same with packages - it seems as though there are not packages with the subwoofer in the US.
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post #105 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 07:24 AM
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" I’m very optimistic that this new soundbar will deliver on its promise of providing a quality Dolby Atmos and DTS:X 7.1.2 experience from a single device"

You believe in the tooth fairy and the easter bunny, too.
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post #106 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by MichLinton View Post
" I’m very optimistic that this new soundbar will deliver on its promise of providing a quality Dolby Atmos and DTS:X 7.1.2 experience from a single device"

You believe in the tooth fairy and the easter bunny, too.
Lol.
You mean one speaker will not actually produce surround sound?

But I read on the internet that it does so it must be true.
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post #107 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 10:17 AM
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Why is it that people who have never heard this soundbar think they know better than professional reviewers, and others, who actually have?
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post #108 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 10:33 AM
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Lay off the tooth fairy.
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post #109 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 11:09 AM
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Another Review

This is a review from a British magazine "Home Cinema Choice". It is 3 pages. The PDF file was too large to upload so I uploaded three Jpeg files. Hopefully it will be readable.
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post #110 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by New24K View Post
Why is it that people who have never heard this soundbar think they know better than professional reviewers, and others, who actually have?
are you saying that I have to hear this speaker to know that a speaker(sorry- sound projector) in front of me can create sound behind me and above me?

lol
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post #111 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 02:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
Putting them away when not in use doesn't sound very realistic, it also isn't easy to do. Those boards need to be in exact positions.

Those boards aren't exactly "small" – 11-3/4" x 7-5/8". On or in-wall speakers are probably visually less obtrusive.

In order to work properly such a board needs to be bigger than the wavelength it has to reflect. 7-5/8" reflects only about 1700Hz and higher.

That is enough as lower frequencies aren't directional - our ears are not spatially pinpointing sources of low-frequency sounds. Also Yamahas technique is based on interference in sound waves to generate spatial cues which theoretically enables lower frequencies as well. Lots of users here seem to have no understanding of how this sound bar operates and think it's just a lot of speakers randomly thrown on a bar.
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post #112 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Johnny B. Goode View Post
That is enough as lower frequencies aren't directional - our ears are not spatially pinpointing sources of low-frequency sounds.
1700Hz is "low frequencies" for you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny B. Goode View Post
Also Yamahas technique is based on interference in sound waves to generate spatial cues which theoretically enables lower frequencies as well.
Theoretically. Have you ever tested how good reflecting low frequencies from a 11-3/4" x 7-5/8" sized board works?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny B. Goode View Post
Lots of users here seem to have no understanding of how this sound bar operates and think it's just a lot of speakers randomly thrown on a bar.
I agree.

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post #113 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 02:56 PM
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How about letting the people who are actually interested in purchasing this soundbar have this thread?

And the people who have no interest in purchasing it - find another thread to take their time up with?

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post #114 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichLinton View Post
" I’m very optimistic that this new soundbar will deliver on its promise of providing a quality Dolby Atmos and DTS:X 7.1.2 experience from a single device"

You believe in the tooth fairy and the easter bunny, too.
Aww shucks, are you really saying the easter bunny is a myth? Thanks for the witty comment and also for making it so easy to read.

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Last edited by imagic; 11-16-2015 at 04:01 PM.
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post #115 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by New24K View Post
How about letting the people who are actually interested in purchasing this soundbar have this thread?

And the people who have no interest in purchasing it - find another thread to take their time up with?

That would be nice, wouldn't it?

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post #116 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 03:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taichi4 View Post
From the article on the front page of AVS, and a number of other articles I read, I don't believe the subwoofer comes with the soundbar at the listed price. I believe it's a $500 option.

Here's an early review that can be read via Google translator, but be prepared for some funky translation.

http://www.areadvd.de/tests/ifa-exkl...uer-2-000-eur/
You can use any sub you want with it, and Yamaha has one that it recommends. It does not come with a sub.

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post #117 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
That would be nice, wouldn't it?
So you're buying it? Like to read how it works in your room

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post #118 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 05:52 PM
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I have one of the older (pre-hdmi) ones and honestly, it does a fantastic job simulating surround sound. I got lucky on ebay when trying to find a soundbar for our bedroom. Had a sony HT-CT150 and it was awful... unless you like the sound of speakers in a coffee can. The geniuses even put the IR receiver and display on the sub. You know, the thing you want to hide in a corner and not see? Yeah... there. I didn't really think it through. In the store, it sounded the best out of 4 or 5 others in the same price range and had the most connections. I didn't realize the IR was on the sub until I had it home and installed. I lived with it for a year or so and sold it to a friend for $50.

I got lucky and won a Yamaha YSP-1000 on eBay for $150 shipped. I had remembered being pretty impressed with one like it (but with HDMI inputs, YSP-4000 I believe) a few years prior and figured why not bid. I half expected it to not work when I got it, but it looked ok and worked perfectly. Was surprised at how much it weighed, very heavy. I plugged in the YPAO mic and let it do it's thing with the mic where our heads would be. It's uncanny how well it processes the sound. The front sound stage is pretty wide, center channel is nice and clean/clear sounding and with our heads against the opposing wall, the "rears" sound very definitive. I have our xfinity x1 child box via coax and a sony blu-ray connected to it via TosLink to play our movies off the network or netflix and we use it quite regularly. Since it's a bedroom device, I did pick up a cheap 100W sub for it, but I never turn it on. It has enough depth for TV watching as it is without having booming while we are trying to sleep or relax at night.

I'd have to expect this new version of it will be even better. Granted, I doubt I'd spend $1000+ on a sound bar myself... but for those that are skeptical, in a fairly square room, it does a really nice job. Ours is mounted about 4.5 feet off the floor so it's about level with our heads and the TV is above it about 15 inches angled down with the dvd/cable box between them. The wall behind it is windows with rubber backed blackout curtains, left wall is flat drywall with a large mirror and the right wall is all wooden solid bifold doors. On center, it's about 6 feet from the left wall, 8 feet from the right, 4 feet from the ceiling and 9-10 feet from our headboard which is against the flat wall. Ceiling is also drywall and the floor is carpeted.
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post #119 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 05:53 PM
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Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
So you're buying it? Like to read how it works in your room
Not buying it, but I've requested a review sample.

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post #120 of 681 Old 11-16-2015, 07:56 PM
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I got to play with one with our Yamaha Rep. I think the Atmos effect is as good as the other speakers trying to bounce sound off the ceiling for Atmos. I think in most homes they are more likely to get an Atmos effect then a surround effect with this sound bar. Unless one has a cathedral, sloped or and odd ceiling most people with flat ceilings will get the Atmos effect. Where many rooms are not ideal for the surround effect and these sound bars. I don't think anyone expects a sound bar to perform as well as ceiling and surround speakers but the Atmos effect on this sound bar has some merit.
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