Official Nakamichi Shockwafe 9.2 and 7.2 dts:x dual subwoofers soundbars thread - Page 39 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1141 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 05:35 AM
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Originally Posted by NorthJersey View Post
probably best to wait to hear Nakamichi's announcement, which is what I'm doing, before biting. The 7.1 is the older unit; the 7.2 is the newer model.
who knows if the Atmos will be a faux-Atmos, or if a new model is coming out with upfiring speakers.
You must be referring to the older 7.1 sound bar. The 7.1 Pro DTS:X is just as new as the 7.2 and 9.2.
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post #1142 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 05:53 AM
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Originally Posted by ari821 View Post
I think it’s more realistic to expect a firmware upgrade. Having said that I am still not sure what kind of firmware upgrade they r going to push (if at all they do as rumored) without any upward firing speakers
I had that exact thought when I read the news here. Without upward firing speakers, adding ATMOS is a moot point. If they add the speakers to the new systems, then it makes sense.

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post #1143 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 06:09 AM
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Could they just add virtual atmos capabilities with a firmware upgrade? Not sure how that would be different from Neural X? With the disappointing Vizio news, my choices have pretty much narrowed to a Nakamichi 7.1 pro dts:x/7.2 or the much maligned LG sk10y (Sony Ht-Z9f is a possibility if it ever goes on sale- too expensive right now for only virtual surround sound). Now if there is any future indication that virtual atmos support would be added to the naka 7.1/7.2 that would make the choice a bit clearer on my end.

Edited... found out from much earlier on in this thread that atmos content would be mixed via Neural X on this soundbar.

A separate question: the entirety of my TV/movie watching will be streaming (either from a roku or an xbox x), and from a variety of apps (Netflix (which now supports Atmos if used with an xbox), HBO, Amazon, etc..). Has Nakamichi released a firmware update yet to support Dolby Digital Plus (which many apps use for their audio)? Thanks

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post #1144 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 06:26 AM
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Quick question: since updating the firmware a week ago on my 7.1 Pro DTS:X, I've had 2 instances where the Naka has turned on during the middle of the night. Seems very random, both nights wife and I were watching TV until about 10:30, turned off the system and went to bed. Then, one night about 3 am, another about 5 am, the sound of the TV downstairs woke me up. Went downstairs, the Naka was on.

My set up is Directv Genie and LG UHD player running into Naka via HDMI 2 and 3, with HDMI 1 (ARC) connected to Vizio M series. Run everything with a Harmony One remote.

I Googled and CEC seems to come up as an issue that can cause this although it never happened in the 7 months I've had the Naka prior to doing the latest (July 6, 2018) firmware update, and it doesn't happen all the time.

Any ideas are appreciated!

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post #1145 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 06:39 AM
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Since ATMOS is object based audio, I suppose there is "something" to gain by adding the firmware. You would get more accurate sound placed in the exact location the director intended creating a 3D like sound environment. But, without upfiring speakers or ceiling speakers, you can't fake the sound from above.

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post #1146 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 06:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 33sun33 View Post
Could they just add virtual atmos capabilities with a firmware upgrade? Not sure how that would be different from Neural X? With the disappointing Vizio news, my choices have pretty much narrowed to a Nakamichi 7.1 pro dts:x/7.2 or the much maligned LG sk10y (Sony Ht-Z9f is a possibility if it ever goes on sale- too expensive right now for only virtual surround sound). Now if there is any future indication that virtual atmos support would be added to the naka 7.1/7.2 that would make the choice a bit clearer on my end.

Edited... found out from much earlier on in this thread that atmos content would be mixed via Neural X on this soundbar.

A separate question: the entirety of my TV/movie watching will be streaming (either from a roku or an xbox x), and from a variety of apps (Netflix (which now supports Atmos if used with an xbox), HBO, Amazon, etc..). Has Nakamichi released a firmware update yet to support Dolby Digital Plus (which many apps use for their audio)? Thanks
The new Samsung Hw-N950 7.1.4 soundbar is awesome. DTS X and Atmos. I was lurking on this thread for a while as Nakamichi would have been my #1 choice if it had Atmos.

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post #1147 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 06:44 AM
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Originally Posted by PlasmaHiDef View Post
Since ATMOS is object based audio, I suppose there is "something" to gain by adding the firmware. You would get more accurate sound placed in the exact location the director intended creating a 3D like sound environment. But, without upfiring speakers or ceiling speakers, you can't fake the sound from above.
You can add atmos to any 5.1 setup with atmos upfiring modules. They basically would sit on top of your front and or rears and only bounce atmos affects up. Like this for example
https://www.googleadservices.com/pag...aACCJMD&adurl=
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post #1148 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 06:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Micarina View Post
I noticed there is a Left Right surround balance adjustment but the degree is not very significant. For your case, you have more than 2x the difference in distance between left and right surround. I would suggest to move your right surround speaker further away, at least 7 feet away from the listening position.

I guess comparing vizio with 9.2 system is unfair. 9.2 system runs on full discrete channel with dual subs while vizio only just 5.1.4 channel. the surround effect is definitely not as complete as 9.2 which you get 4 surround speakers. so it is all down to what is your expectation on a soundbar system. if you want to go with something budget friendly, I guess vizio will be your best choice. IMO the nak 9.2 system is the much of a completed system with the best surround and best bass. if it can upgrade to atmos compatible that will be perfect.
Thanks Micarina! The only way I could make the 9.2 work in my space is via the Dipole Set up (rears and sides attached to the left and right of the listening position). Would the 9.2 in a Dipole set-up be worth the extra $$ over a 7.2 system?

My main focus is to get the best sound when playing streaming content (netflix, amazon, etc..) with, preferably, some atmos-like height effects (the fact that the 9.2 will get future atmos support is heartening).
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post #1149 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 06:57 AM
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Originally Posted by ivallt View Post
You can add atmos to any 5.1 setup with atmos upfiring modules. They basically would sit on top of your front and or rears and only bounce atmos affects up. Like this for example
https://www.googleadservices.com/pag...aACCJMD&adurl=
That is true. You can add other speakers. I was specifically talking about the current systems, as is, without the need to add more speakers to a current set up. I would not want to place more speakers around. That is why a sound bar sytems suits me.

I don't know everything about ATMOS. Without adding additional speakers, do you know if there is a benefit to adding ATMOS via firmware?

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post #1150 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 07:02 AM
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Originally Posted by PlasmaHiDef View Post
That is true. You can add other speakers. I was specifically talking about the current systems, as is, without the need to add more speakers to a current set up. I would not want to place more speakers around on the floor. That is why a sound bar sytems suits me.

I don't know everything about ATMOS. Without adding additional speakers, do you know if there is a benefit to adding ATMOS via firmware?
Atmos only works if it has upfiring speakers for the ceiling. I guess they could use those side firing tweeter for some effects ,but i would think you would also have to turn the rear speakers on their sides so they fire up. Ideally i dont think they can offcially do it unless they have the correct speaker setup.

I think they really need to come out with a new bar soon.
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post #1151 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Micarina View Post
yes there is a possibility that it might interferes with the 5GHz band of the wifi routers. As far as I know, there is a standard 5.8ghz wireless frequency band used by all wireless subwoofers so if you experience some sort of audio drop out on subwoofer, you can change the wifi frequency band on your router to different channel. that should solve the problem.
https://www.helpdesk.nakamichi-usa.c...dio-distortion

For Samsung TV remote, I have no experience with it so I suggest you can drop them an email to check with them. they are pretty responsive in any query.

The way they pack these houses in my neighborhood, and with Comcast transmitting multiple 2.4 GHz signals I use (my Centurylink) 5Ghz for everything: ATVs, MacBooks, iPads, TVs and iPhones. I have not had any interference between my Nakamichi and any devices. And I do have some neighbors 5 GHz leaking in here too.
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post #1152 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 06:47 PM
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Originally Posted by ari821 View Post
Thanks Micarina,



Though I was trying to get an opinion on naka 7.2 vs the vizio (5.1.2) & 5.1.4(whenever released) as both should be in near similar price range



I have never heard the naka, so trying to figure should I wait for new naka models as suggested by others in this forum and also get an opinion on the 5.1.4 whenever it releases(given the 5.1.4 promises most of the new codecs support)


Totally understand. It is a process of surveying the market and hope to get the most suitable system for the purchase.

Not sure about the price for vizio 5.1.4 but based on their usual price range, I believe we should be looking at 599, still relatively cheaper compared to 7.2.


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post #1153 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 06:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Micarina View Post
Totally understand. It is a process of surveying the market and hope to get the most suitable system for the purchase.

Not sure about the price for vizio 5.1.4 but based on their usual price range, I believe we should be looking at 599, still relatively cheaper compared to 7.2.


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The biggest difference between the Vizio and the Naka will probably be 1 HDMI on the Vizio with no 4k passthrough vs the Naka with multiple HDMI, all with 4k passthrough. I haven't seen the final specs on the Vizio but I doubt it will have multiple HDMI.

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post #1154 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 06:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Micarina View Post
Totally understand. It is a process of surveying the market and hope to get the most suitable system for the purchase.

Not sure about the price for vizio 5.1.4 but based on their usual price range, I believe we should be looking at 599, still relatively cheaper compared to 7.2.


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They officially listed the 5.1.4 price at $1000
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post #1155 of 5172 Old 09-18-2018, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by atfree View Post
The biggest difference between the Vizio and the Naka will probably be 1 HDMI on the Vizio with no 4k passthrough vs the Naka with multiple HDMI, all with 4k passthrough. I haven't seen the final specs on the Vizio but I doubt it will have multiple HDMI.

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Vizio 5.1.2 has 4k passthrough with hdr & dv but only 1 hdmi. No info yet on the 5.1.4 except it’s retail $999

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post #1156 of 5172 Old 09-19-2018, 02:47 AM
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Originally Posted by 33sun33 View Post
Could they just add virtual atmos capabilities with a firmware upgrade? Not sure how that would be different from Neural X? With the disappointing Vizio news, my choices have pretty much narrowed to a Nakamichi 7.1 pro dts:x/7.2 or the much maligned LG sk10y (Sony Ht-Z9f is a possibility if it ever goes on sale- too expensive right now for only virtual surround sound). Now if there is any future indication that virtual atmos support would be added to the naka 7.1/7.2 that would make the choice a bit clearer on my end.

Edited... found out from much earlier on in this thread that atmos content would be mixed via Neural X on this soundbar.

A separate question: the entirety of my TV/movie watching will be streaming (either from a roku or an xbox x), and from a variety of apps (Netflix (which now supports Atmos if used with an xbox), HBO, Amazon, etc..). Has Nakamichi released a firmware update yet to support Dolby Digital Plus (which many apps use for their audio)? Thanks
I guess the chances of having the atmos feature virtually is high if the existing unit can be upgraded using firmware.

oh man didn't know the 5.1.4 model is going to be at $1000. topping up a bit more you can get other brands like sony z9f with rear speakers @ $1200

Atmos content would be mixed via neural X - partially correct as it only works on bluray players in this manner. For atmos content on streaming devices, the content device like xbox need to reencode it into dolby digital. still, I feel the neural x did a fantastic job to upmix the dd version of it.
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post #1157 of 5172 Old 09-19-2018, 02:49 AM
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They officially listed the 5.1.4 price at $1000
This is crazy. definitely out of question for 1000 bux. prefer to just top up another 99 bux to get the ultra 9.2. comparing for height effects, the dual subs and multiple surround speakers definitely worth the spend

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post #1158 of 5172 Old 09-19-2018, 03:06 AM
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Thanks Micarina! The only way I could make the 9.2 work in my space is via the Dipole Set up (rears and sides attached to the left and right of the listening position). Would the 9.2 in a Dipole set-up be worth the extra $$ over a 7.2 system?

My main focus is to get the best sound when playing streaming content (netflix, amazon, etc..) with, preferably, some atmos-like height effects (the fact that the 9.2 will get future atmos support is heartening).
IMO I think it worth the extra $$ as for 9.2 you will get better surround effect even it is in dipole mode. plus you will be getting more powerful 10" subs, more powerful system overall.

it works well with my fire tv cube and xbox for Netflix and amazon prime. I think adding atmos support will complete the soundbar feature and likely to last quite awhile since there isn't any new tech coming out.

atmos height effect is very content-dependent. I was watching the avengers infinity the other day at my friend house with sony atmos soundbar and the height effect wasn't very prominent. could be the content issue.
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post #1159 of 5172 Old 09-19-2018, 03:08 AM
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Originally Posted by 33sun33 View Post

A separate question: the entirety of my TV/movie watching will be streaming (either from a roku or an xbox x), and from a variety of apps (Netflix (which now supports Atmos if used with an xbox), HBO, Amazon, etc..). Has Nakamichi released a firmware update yet to support Dolby Digital Plus (which many apps use for their audio)? Thanks
For now it doesn't support DD+, so unless your TV supports DD+ transcode to DD through ARC you wouldn't be able to use Netflix with DD.
although from the rumors, DD+ support should arrive with the Atmos support, so I would wait for that (prices could go up as a result though)

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post #1160 of 5172 Old 09-19-2018, 03:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Micarina View Post
IMO I think it worth the extra $$ as for 9.2 you will get better surround effect even it is in dipole mode. plus you will be getting more powerful 10" subs, more powerful system overall.

it works well with my fire tv cube and xbox for Netflix and amazon prime. I think adding atmos support will complete the soundbar feature and likely to last quite awhile since there isn't any new tech coming out.

atmos height effect is very content-dependent. I was watching the avengers infinity the other day at my friend house with sony atmos soundbar and the height effect wasn't very prominent. could be the content issue.
How do you like the fire TV cube?
Does the ir work nice with the naka?
Do you connect it to your TV or straight to the naka?

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post #1161 of 5172 Old 09-19-2018, 03:17 AM
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Originally Posted by 33sun33 View Post
Thanks Micarina! The only way I could make the 9.2 work in my space is via the Dipole Set up (rears and sides attached to the left and right of the listening position). Would the 9.2 in a Dipole set-up be worth the extra $$ over a 7.2 system?

My main focus is to get the best sound when playing streaming content (netflix, amazon, etc..) with, preferably, some atmos-like height effects (the fact that the 9.2 will get future atmos support is heartening).
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Atmos only works if it has upfiring speakers for the ceiling. I guess they could use those side firing tweeter for some effects ,but i would think you would also have to turn the rear speakers on their sides so they fire up. Ideally i dont think they can offcially do it unless they have the correct speaker setup.

I think they really need to come out with a new bar soon.
techincally this was true before 2018. this year there is a few atmos soundbars with simulated atmos effects which doesn't require up firing speaker anymore. up firing speakers could be challenging because it depends on your ceiling condition. the height, surface finishing, etc, especially I don't see a good reason for soundbar to include a tiny up firing speaker. it need more power to bounce back from the ceiling for the effect.

personally, I feel clear dialog, strong bass for the explosion and impact and fully enclosed surround are more important. height effect is too difficult to relate with the scene on screen.
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post #1162 of 5172 Old 09-19-2018, 03:20 AM
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For now it doesn't support DD+, so unless your TV supports DD+ transcode to DD through ARC you wouldn't be able to use Netflix with DD.
although from the rumors, DD+ support should arrive with the Atmos support, so I would wait for that (prices could go up as a result though)

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thats correct and Netflix requires DD+ for surround output. streaming devices like fire tv cube and Apple TV 4k do a good job to output DD 5.1 for better compatibility. it is actually a requirement by dolby to be backward compatible for DD+ format. and yes with atmos support it should come with DD+ native decode
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post #1163 of 5172 Old 09-19-2018, 03:25 AM
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Originally Posted by nadavar View Post
How do you like the fire TV cube?
Does the ir work nice with the naka?
Do you connect it to your TV or straight to the naka?

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fire tv cube is great. very convenient with built in Alexa feature. im started to get lazy to use amazon remote.

I think the IR works as intended. It can control power on/off, volume up down mute and switch to fire cube connected input source of the soundbar. setup process was pretty straightforward. just follow the on screen instruction.

I am connecting straight to naka although the amazon and naka tech support advised me to connecting the cube directly to tv instead. I feel connecting it to soundbar the sound is better. it could be due to the way my tv is handling the audio.
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post #1164 of 5172 Old 09-19-2018, 04:47 AM
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thats correct and Netflix requires DD+ for surround output. streaming devices like fire tv cube and Apple TV 4k do a good job to output DD 5.1 for better compatibility. it is actually a requirement by dolby to be backward compatible for DD+ format. and yes with atmos support it should come with DD+ native decode
Thanks- to complicate matters, my "tv" is actually a projector (Benq w1070), so it doesn't decode any audio/video formats. Rather, I plan to run an hdmi cord from either my roku ultra streaming box or xbox x directly to the soundbar hdmi 1 in; and then run an hdmi cord from the soundbar's hdmi out back to the projector. I "think" this will work based on what Ive read elsewhere (and just my past usage of the projector with a dedicated receiver).
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post #1165 of 5172 Old 09-19-2018, 05:23 AM
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Thanks- to complicate matters, my "tv" is actually a projector (Benq w1070), so it doesn't decode any audio/video formats. Rather, I plan to run an hdmi cord from either my roku ultra streaming box or xbox x directly to the soundbar hdmi 1 in; and then run an hdmi cord from the soundbar's hdmi out back to the projector. I "think" this will work based on what Ive read elsewhere (and just my past usage of the projector with a dedicated receiver).
I think thats alright. your only choice is to connect everything into the soundbar then hdmi out to projector hdmi in port. I guess xbox x could be better in this case since it can support lots of streaming service and can compatible with Netflix in DD format (instead of DD+) which roku cant do it. I guess projection setup is easier compared to tv since projector doesn't come with cec and arc which sometime might complicate the setup.

you just have to make sure you got decent hdmi cable for long distance transmission.
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post #1166 of 5172 Old 09-20-2018, 05:44 AM
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Hello all,

As many here probably know, Nakamichi is issuing a press release within the next two weeks concerning atmos capabilities (and perhaps other things as well). In my emails with Nakamichi (they are SO responsive!), they gave me a fairly heavy hint that even the 7.1 or 7.2 systems may have some sort of atmos support in the future (perhaps not until Q1 2019, but still!).

Does anyone know whether NK is planning on announcing brand new bars in the next two weeks, or just new firmware upgrade plans? I would like to pull the trigger on a naka 7.1 or 7.2 (the 9.2 is out of price range, unless i can find a refurb), but will hold off if they might be releasing new versions of the bar soon. Thanks
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post #1167 of 5172 Old 09-20-2018, 08:58 AM
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Let's hope they have in development sound bars with true height drivers.
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post #1168 of 5172 Old 09-20-2018, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by taichi4 View Post
Let's hope they have in development sound bars with true height drivers.
Though dedicated upward firing drivers should be great, but I feel Atmos is so much dependent on these specifications of perfect roof and sitting position that I feel it’s not worth the fuss.
DTS-X or faux Atmos is a better feasible solution I guess.
Or a hybrid solution with dedicated upward firing speakers and software to manage roof imperfections as well

Having said this retailers will prefer Atmos Just because they have extra speakers to sell 😁
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post #1169 of 5172 Old 09-20-2018, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by 33sun33 View Post
I would like to pull the trigger on a naka 7.1 or 7.2 (the 9.2 is out of price range, unless i can find a refurb), but will hold off if they might be releasing new versions of the bar soon. Thanks
FYI, Nakamichi has their own eBay store where they sell their refurbished units with full standard warranty. I can't link to it but the username is "nakamichi-usa". You can regularly find refurbished 9.2 systems on there for $799.
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Last edited by Nouniard; 09-20-2018 at 03:22 PM.
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post #1170 of 5172 Old 09-20-2018, 08:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Nouniard View Post
FYI, Nakamichi has their own eBay store where they sell their refurbished units with full standard warranty. I can't link to it but the username is "nakamichi-usa". You can regularly find refurbished 9.2 systems on there for $799.


Thank you for that!

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