Need 158-160" 2.35:1 Fixed Frame, Gain 1.3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 16 Old 05-10-2016, 05:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Need 158-160" 2.35:1 Fixed Frame, Gain 1.3

I will be using a JVC RS400, probably with a 17' Throw Distance, in a moderately light controlled room, onto a fairly large 158-160" 2.35:1 fixed frame screen, and it has been recommended to me by people who know their stuff that a 1.3 or so Gain screen would be advantageous. I will be doing some 3D viewing, which would also be helped with this Gain.

I am looking for options that won't break the bank. The Screen Innovations 160" with Solar White (Gain 1.3) looks like it would be an excellent match, but it costs $1800 before shipping. The budget on my project has been steadily creeping up, and while I may be able to stretch for this, wanted to explore options that wouldn't be quite as costly, and hopefully deliver most of its performance.

I was initially looking at the SilverTicket 158" 2.35:1, with a Gain of 1.1, but apparently that may be a real-world Gain closer to 0.9. $400.

This screen size, and the scope aspect ratio, narrows the available choices, so I'm interested in getting recommendations on other screens to consider somewhere between the cheap $400 and the $1800 SI.

The Carada does have a decent option, with an advertised Gain of 1.4 for $1109, which is attractive. Is the SI worth the additional $700?

For these 3 options, Mike at AVS calculated effective screen brightness at 18 ftL for the SilverTicket, 22 ftL for the Carada, and 26 ftL for the ScreenInnovations, to put things in perspective.

Anyway, any thoughts and experience with these screens, or others I should consider, would be appreciated. And I'd rather not go the DIY route - that just isn't my thing for a variety of reasons.

Thanks.

JVC NX7, DCR Lens, Marantz SR7010, Screen Innovations 160" 2.35:1 Screen
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post #2 of 16 Old 05-13-2016, 09:29 AM
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Originally Posted by DLCPhoto View Post
I will be using a JVC RS400, probably with a 17' Throw Distance, in a moderately light controlled room, onto a fairly large 158-160" 2.35:1 fixed frame screen, and it has been recommended to me by people who know their stuff that a 1.3 or so Gain screen would be advantageous. I will be doing some 3D viewing, which would also be helped with this Gain.

I am looking for options that won't break the bank. The Screen Innovations 160" with Solar White (Gain 1.3) looks like it would be an excellent match, but it costs $1800 before shipping. The budget on my project has been steadily creeping up, and while I may be able to stretch for this, wanted to explore options that wouldn't be quite as costly, and hopefully deliver most of its performance.

I was initially looking at the SilverTicket 158" 2.35:1, with a Gain of 1.1, but apparently that may be a real-world Gain closer to 0.9. $400.

This screen size, and the scope aspect ratio, narrows the available choices, so I'm interested in getting recommendations on other screens to consider somewhere between the cheap $400 and the $1800 SI.

The Carada does have a decent option, with an advertised Gain of 1.4 for $1109, which is attractive. Is the SI worth the additional $700?

For these 3 options, Mike at AVS calculated effective screen brightness at 18 ftL for the SilverTicket, 22 ftL for the Carada, and 26 ftL for the ScreenInnovations, to put things in perspective.

Anyway, any thoughts and experience with these screens, or others I should consider, would be appreciated. And I'd rather not go the DIY route - that just isn't my thing for a variety of reasons.

Thanks.
The Carada isn't really 1.4 gain . I'm going to smash your budget, but for a screen that size, I'd get a Stewart StudioTek 130 G3. In fact, I already have one myself !!

If you haven't read it yet - http://www.accucalhd.com/wp-content/...een_report.pdf
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post #3 of 16 Old 05-13-2016, 09:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post
The Carada isn't really 1.4 gain . I'm going to smash your budget, but for a screen that size, I'd get a Stewart StudioTek 130 G3. In fact, I already have one myself !!

If you haven't read it yet - http://www.accucalhd.com/wp-content/...een_report.pdf
Hi Craig,

Yes, I realize the Carada isn't a full 1.4. Thanks for the link - I had perused it before but lost track of where it was. I'll save a copy for my files.

I had a previous estimate from Jim with Stewart on a screen in the Cima line; I just emailed him again to get a price with this material, for this size.

But I'll have to tell you, regarding to the price escalation that's been going on with this overall project, over the last several months, I keep thinking of Jean Luc Piccard:

Quote:
The line must be drawn here! This far, no further!

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post #4 of 16 Old 05-13-2016, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by DLCPhoto View Post
Hi Craig,

Yes, I realize the Carada isn't a full 1.4. Thanks for the link - I had perused it before but lost track of where it was. I'll save a copy for my files.

I had a previous estimate from Jim with Stewart on a screen in the Cima line; I just emailed him again to get a price with this material, for this size.

But I'll have to tell you, regarding to the price escalation that's been going on with this overall project, over the last several months, I keep thinking of Jean Luc Piccard:



Budgets are like deadlines - I love watching them whiz by................ And yes, the Cima is really close to a ST 130. We can give you a screen quote too !
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post #5 of 16 Old 05-13-2016, 10:16 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post
Budgets are like deadlines - I love watching them whiz by................ And yes, the Cima is really close to a ST 130. We can give you a screen quote too !
PM coming.

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post #6 of 16 Old 05-19-2016, 02:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DLCPhoto View Post
I will be using a JVC RS400, probably with a 17' Throw Distance, in a moderately light controlled room, onto a fairly large 158-160" 2.35:1 fixed frame screen, and it has been recommended to me by people who know their stuff that a 1.3 or so Gain screen would be advantageous. I will be doing some 3D viewing, which would also be helped with this Gain.

I am looking for options that won't break the bank. The Screen Innovations 160" with Solar White (Gain 1.3) looks like it would be an excellent match, but it costs $1800 before shipping. The budget on my project has been steadily creeping up, and while I may be able to stretch for this, wanted to explore options that wouldn't be quite as costly, and hopefully deliver most of its performance.

I was initially looking at the SilverTicket 158" 2.35:1, with a Gain of 1.1, but apparently that may be a real-world Gain closer to 0.9. $400.

This screen size, and the scope aspect ratio, narrows the available choices, so I'm interested in getting recommendations on other screens to consider somewhere between the cheap $400 and the $1800 SI.

The Carada does have a decent option, with an advertised Gain of 1.4 for $1109, which is attractive. Is the SI worth the additional $700?

For these 3 options, Mike at AVS calculated effective screen brightness at 18 ftL for the SilverTicket, 22 ftL for the Carada, and 26 ftL for the ScreenInnovations, to put things in perspective.

Anyway, any thoughts and experience with these screens, or others I should consider, would be appreciated. And I'd rather not go the DIY route - that just isn't my thing for a variety of reasons.

Thanks.
If you are going to be using one of the JVC 4k projectors than you really need to be only looking at a textureless surface to prevent any degradation to the 4k pixels geometry as it is thrown on a textured surface.

The Stewart CIMA line offers a couple great textureless surfaces for 4k projection, the Tiburon G2 0.8 and the Neve 1.1.

For a 1.3 gain textureless surface, we really also like the Grandview UHD130 (ISF certified),however it is not available here in the US on a 2.35:1 model yet.

Da-lite offers a 1.3 textureless surface as well, the HD Progressive 1.3. It is not ISF certified like the Stewart or Grandview surfaces, however we have not seen any discernible color shift.

https://www.projectorscreen.com/blog...aces-Explained
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post #7 of 16 Old 05-19-2016, 02:46 PM
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I would have to disagree with the Da-lite HD Pro 1.3 being textureless. I had the 1.1 and had to return it because the sparklies were too distracting, but different strokes for different folks.
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post #8 of 16 Old 05-19-2016, 03:28 PM
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I would have to disagree with the Da-lite HD Pro 1.3 being textureless. I had the 1.1 and had to return it because the sparklies were too distracting, but different strokes for different folks.
Sheen / sparkles due to gain, could be considered different than " texture ". Anyway, I'll bet you weren't watching on a 160" diagonal screen. The larger the screen, the less " sparkles " you'll see, as it won't be nearly as bright. It's all about trade offs. Step right up and pick your poison!
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post #9 of 16 Old 05-19-2016, 03:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ProjectionHead View Post
If you are going to be using one of the JVC 4k projectors than you really need to be only looking at a textureless surface to prevent any degradation to the 4k pixels geometry as it is thrown on a textured surface.

The Stewart CIMA line offers a couple great textureless surfaces for 4k projection, the Tiburon G2 0.8 and the Neve 1.1.

For a 1.3 gain textureless surface, we really also like the Grandview UHD130 (ISF certified),however it is not available here in the US on a 2.35:1 model yet.

Da-lite offers a 1.3 textureless surface as well, the HD Progressive 1.3. It is not ISF certified like the Stewart or Grandview surfaces, however we have not seen any discernible color shift.

https://www.projectorscreen.com/blog...aces-Explained
Thanks for the reply and input, Brian.

As Craig points out, everything is a compromise; also, funds are never unlimited.

The Stewart line speaks for itself, and I had looked at the Cima Neve. With a gain of 1.1, vs 1.3 with the Screen Innovations Solar White, there is some concern about adequate brightness in my 'less than a bat cave' room and fairly large screen (based on exchanges with MikeG). That's at least in part why I lean toward the SI, not to mention perhaps $600 more in cost for the Stewart. And considering that my original budget included the $400 Silver Ticket screen, and a Vivitek projector, I've been doing quite a bit of stretching already!

Going to the ST130 line to get higher gain is just out of the question at this point, and I'm cautiously optimistic that I'll be pretty happy with the already expensive/budget-busting SI screen.

Perhaps I'll regret it down the road, and wish I spent more for the Stewart; you never know. If so, I'll deal with that then. But hopefully the SI will be fine. I'm new to front projectors, and have mellowed as I've aged, so I'm thinking it's going to be such a huge change for the better that I'm not going to be inclined to nit-pick.

But all that said, I appreciate your reply, and haven't yet bought a screen, so will keep it all in mind. I'm starting to receive the other stuff, getting my room set up, and will purchase the screen last after I've had some opportunity to play with the projector.

JVC NX7, DCR Lens, Marantz SR7010, Screen Innovations 160" 2.35:1 Screen
Front L/R: Duntech Sovereigns, powered by 2 bridged Adcom GFA-555
Center: Revel C208 powered by Cambridge Audio Azur 851W
Dolby Bed (4): Sony Core SS-CS5, Atmos (4): Ascend Acoustics CBM-170 SE
Subwoofer: DIY 8' sub with 4 18" SI Drivers, powered by iNuke 6000
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post #10 of 16 Old 05-19-2016, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted by DLCPhoto View Post
Thanks for the reply and input, Brian.

As Craig points out, everything is a compromise; also, funds are never unlimited.

The Stewart line speaks for itself, and I had looked at the Cima Neve. With a gain of 1.1, vs 1.3 with the Screen Innovations Solar White, there is some concern about adequate brightness in my 'less than a bat cave' room and fairly large screen (based on exchanges with MikeG). That's at least in part why I lean toward the SI, not to mention perhaps $600 more in cost for the Stewart. And considering that my original budget included the $400 Silver Ticket screen, and a Vivitek projector, I've been doing quite a bit of stretching already!

Going to the ST130 line to get higher gain is just out of the question at this point, and I'm cautiously optimistic that I'll be pretty happy with the already expensive/budget-busting SI screen.

Perhaps I'll regret it down the road, and wish I spent more for the Stewart; you never know. If so, I'll deal with that then. But hopefully the SI will be fine. I'm new to front projectors, and have mellowed as I've aged, so I'm thinking it's going to be such a huge change for the better that I'm not going to be inclined to nit-pick.

But all that said, I appreciate your reply, and haven't yet bought a screen, so will keep it all in mind. I'm starting to receive the other stuff, getting my room set up, and will purchase the screen last after I've had some opportunity to play with the projector.
Just FYI - the Cima Neve tests closer to 1.2+ gain .
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post #11 of 16 Old 05-19-2016, 05:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Just FYI - the Cima Neve tests closer to 1.2+ gain .
You just couldn't resist - had to throw that in there, just to confuse me!!

But seriously, somewhat related, coderguy just replied to my previous inquiries, and the Projector Calculator he developed is now back in operation. Here's a link to his thread, which includes the username/password to access it:

Web Projector Calculator

It provides information on screen brightness, according to projector, calibrated output, screen size, screen gain, etc. Do the results from this calculator seem accurate based on yours and Mike's experience? If reasonably close, this tool would be quite useful to anybody researching projectors.

Thanks.

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post #12 of 16 Old 05-19-2016, 06:57 PM
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Greg is correct and we have been running the Neve material at 1.2 to 1.25 for a while.
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post #13 of 16 Old 05-19-2016, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post
Sheen / sparkles due to gain, could be considered different than " texture ". Anyway, I'll bet you weren't watching on a 160" diagonal screen. The larger the screen, the less " sparkles " you'll see, as it won't be nearly as bright. It's all about trade offs. Step right up and pick your poison!
Hold on, Craig. The size of the screen is irrelevant. I can see sparklies on a 10 inch screen sample from 11 feet back with no issues and it looked no different at 9 feet wide.

I have found a lot of times people refer to texture and sparklies as the same...or the same general idea in mind. People want transparency to the image as much as possible and NOT see any screen...and the HD Pros are just not the best with sparklies. Jeff Meier even noted the sparklies in his screen report. On my 9 foot wide screen, it did not matter how bright the image was within reason and I only view around 12 ftL. I cannot image what HD Pro 1.3 would be like if the 1.1 was distracting (my girlfriend and calibrator had no problem seeing them). Admittedly, some people won't see them and the HD Pros are good screens otherwise. But I am just trying to be honest here. Why take a chance when there are better options here for the most transparency? I would definitely recommend the Stewart Neve instead. Can we agree the Neve is probably the next best option in 'added gain' above 1.0? If I needed something in gain above my ST100 for the next step, I would go with the Neve.

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post #14 of 16 Old 05-19-2016, 08:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Don Stewart View Post
Greg is correct and we have been running the Neve material at 1.2 to 1.25 for a while.
Thanks for the confirmation, Don.

My original plan was for a 160" 2.35:1 screen; the Cima/Neve only goes up to 153". Running the numbers, the 160" is almost 10% larger than the 153" in terms of screen surface area. So I would have to 'downsize' from what I was wanting to run to get the Stewart. I'm sure the response is that I would gain some brightness and contrast with a somewhat smaller screen, in addition to whatever improvement there would be with the Cima/Neve.

Will keep all of this in mind when I have the Projector in the room, and can actually see how the different sizes work in the room, to better determine what size I really want.
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post #15 of 16 Old 02-13-2020, 01:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Don Stewart View Post
Greg is correct and we have been running the Neve material at 1.2 to 1.25 for a while.
Hi @Don Stewart . Is the Neve material still running 1.2-1.25 gain?

Ross

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post #16 of 16 Old 02-13-2020, 11:58 AM
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Hi @Don Stewart . Is the Neve material still running 1.2-1.25 gain?

Ross
I don't think it's changed at all since then.
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