Projector Mini-Shootout Thread - Page 598 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #17911 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 07:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Seegs108 View Post
Just picked up a Runco D-73D projector setup for a decent price. Basically it's two Runco Q750i LED projectors stacked with the ability to have the two images perfectly aligned and then polarized filters can be used for a passive 3D experience. It's similar to commercial theater 3D, but unlike the commercial theater, supposedly you can still get 1080p resolution to each eye despite it not being active 3D. Should be fun to play around with!

Spoiler!
How did this turn out for you?
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post #17912 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 07:50 AM
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Originally Posted by 5mark View Post
For a "get you by for now" projector I wouldn't discount the 285 even for a scope screen. I've found that if you dial in the focus for your 2.35 zoom, then it winds up very close to correct on 16:9 as well(where it's smaller and not as critical). Even better if you configure 16:9 material closer to say 1.9:1 and then blank the top and bottom a little. Then just make sure the projector is perfectly centered horizontally and all you have to change is zoom and vertical lens shift.

Also keep in mind that lens memory is nice but far from perfect. Lens shift needs touching up often and focus can drift at times.

I'd be willing to spend in the $15k range for a projector I was excited about. But I think it would need to have a better lens than anything in that range so far. In the meantime I'm thinking of adding a 285 to my RS620 for a dual projector setup with different strengths. Even though I have a scope screen it doesn't bother me that the 285 doesn't have lens memory. Partly because it's a second projector, and also the reasons mentioned above.
You can always pair a 285 with an Oppo and use the Oppo to do the aspect ratio change from 2.35 to 16:9. Will be quick and accurate every time.
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post #17913 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 08:22 AM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post
get ready for some Bayhem...

these movies are terrible but can't resist for some reason. I'm here for the crazy 3D CGI and LFE..

Spoiler!


one of the few new 3D BD's with ATMOS no remuxing needed on this one
The first half is a mess because there are too many story-lines going on. Once Bay locks in the third act it gets better. I thought it was much too similar to Dark of the Moon, my personal favorite of the series.

This movie has probably 5 different aspect ratios which is absolute turmoil for my CIH screen. I put it in 2.40:1 mode, masked out the rest and basked in the glory.

For the last week I pulled my chair forward and had been sitting 8 feet away from my 136" CIH screen and it has been spectacular. This Transformers movie though, I just about had a seizure 20 minutes in and had to move further away.
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post #17914 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5mark View Post
For a "get you by for now" projector I wouldn't discount the 285 even for a scope screen. I've found that if you dial in the focus for your 2.35 zoom, then it winds up very close to correct on 16:9 as well(where it's smaller and not as critical). Even better if you configure 16:9 material closer to say 1.9:1 and then blank the top and bottom a little. Then just make sure the projector is perfectly centered horizontally and all you have to change is zoom and vertical lens shift.

Also keep in mind that lens memory is nice but far from perfect. Lens shift needs touching up often and focus can drift at times.

I'd be willing to spend in the $15k range for a projector I was excited about. But I think it would need to have a better lens than anything in that range so far. In the meantime I'm thinking of adding a 285 to my RS620 for a dual projector setup with different strengths. Even though I have a scope screen it doesn't bother me that the 285 doesn't have lens memory. Partly because it's a second projector, and also the reasons mentioned above.
You can always pair a 285 with an Oppo and use the Oppo to do the aspect ratio change from 2.35 to 16:9. Will be quick and accurate every time.
Mike, you talking about the stretch mode? I use it on my Oppo 203 and found some BD's won't allow it. Must be something to do with the way they were encoded. Can't remember if I had this issue on my 103. And haven't tried it on any UHD discs yet.
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post #17915 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 09:37 AM
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Originally Posted by biliam1982 View Post
Mike, you talking about the stretch mode? I use it on my Oppo 203 and found some BD's won't allow it. Must be something to do with the way they were encoded. Can't remember if I had this issue on my 103. And haven't tried it on any UHD discs yet.
Stretch mode is for an A-lens. The Oppo will do aspect ratio change like the Lumagen can do, without an A-lens. This is a relatively new feature for Oppo.
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post #17916 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 09:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Dreamliner View Post
The first half is a mess because there are too many story-lines going on. Once Bay locks in the third act it gets better. I thought it was much too similar to Dark of the Moon, my personal favorite of the series.

This movie has probably 5 different aspect ratios which is absolute turmoil for my CIH screen. I put it in 2.40:1 mode, masked out the rest and basked in the glory.

For the last week I pulled my chair forward and had been sitting 8 feet away from my 136" CIH screen and it has been spectacular. This Transformers movie though, I just about had a seizure 20 minutes in and had to move further away.
Seegs ended up selling the Runco 3D stack, the alignment was very difficult.

Thanks for heads up on aspect change, I'll leave my masks off for this one and go full mini-imax. I actually enjoy this - the whole ghostbusters crossing into the scope bars was pretty cool. (waiting for toe's head to explode on this comment.. )

Apollo 13 is due out in October and is a 4K scan from the original 35mm film, looking forward to re-visiting that movie.
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post #17917 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
Stretch mode is for an A-lens. The Oppo will do aspect ratio change like the Lumagen can do, without an A-lens. This is a relatively new feature for Oppo.
Interesting... is that also using the zoom button? Or is it in the menus somewhere? Because I see many different options of zooming when I press the icon on the remote.

On a side note, I see they finally added HDR10 support for the HDMI input. Thanks god! It was a pain trying to skim all the different threads of streaming, media players, game consoles, player, etc. to find out what supports what.

I've mentioned this before somewhere,but that should be an article AVS should do. Give a master list of X device having Y apps and supports Z formats and playback speeds.
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post #17918 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 10:03 AM
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Apollo 13 should look great, but I believe I will blind-buy (again!!!) to hear the soundtrack in Dolby Atmos...(hopefully it will have ATMOS!!!)
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post #17919 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 10:06 AM
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oh, and on another note, I am on the fence concerning the recent purchase of a SPYDER 5 to calibrate my new JVC X570R. It looks fairly involved, and my 'tweaking days' are not as tweaky' as they used to be I wouldn't want to mess up my new pj, but the idea of getting the right gamma curve and color is awful tempting.
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post #17920 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 10:51 AM
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It sounds a lot more complicated than it is. It's mainly just make sure you understand the steps when you do it the first time.

Basically it's just plug in the spider, put it to the right side of the box, and then go. But there's potential pitfalls along the way that make it seem more complicated. It's really just that first time that's "hard" and that's just taking your time/care to make sure you get it right.
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post #17921 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post
It sounds a lot more complicated than it is. It's mainly just make sure you understand the steps when you do it the first time.

Basically it's just plug in the spider, put it to the right side of the box, and then go. But there's potential pitfalls along the way that make it seem more complicated. It's really just that first time that's "hard" and that's just taking your time/care to make sure you get it right.
The biggest issue is how accurate is the meter.
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post #17922 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 11:54 AM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post
Seegs ended up selling the Runco 3D stack, the alignment was very difficult.

Thanks for heads up on aspect change, I'll leave my masks off for this one and go full mini-imax. I actually enjoy this - the whole ghostbusters crossing into the scope bars was pretty cool. (waiting for toe's head to explode on this comment.. )

Apollo 13 is due out in October and is a 4K scan from the original 35mm film, looking forward to re-visiting that movie.
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post #17923 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by KBMAN View Post
Apollo 13 should look great, but I believe I will blind-buy (again!!!) to hear the soundtrack in Dolby Atmos...(hopefully it will have ATMOS!!!)


That is actually my favorite film of all time.

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post #17924 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post
Apollo 13 is due out in October and is a 4K scan from the original 35mm film, looking forward to re-visiting that movie.
I look forward to Apollo 13 too (and hopefully one day The Right Stuff on 4k and maybe even From the Earth to the Moon on BD). But I'm a little concerned.

I saw Close Encounters of the Third Kind in the Dolby Cinema for its re-release. I was a little disappointed. It seemed a little better in terms of PQ, but much. Be interested to read how the 4k disc turned out.

And idk if it was mixed in ATMOS, but the audio was terrible. It seemed off, and at times, only coming from the left stage when clearly.it should have been center or right speakers in use.

Hopefully they don't screw up this epic masterpiece...
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post #17925 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 02:55 PM
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I look forward to Apollo 13 too (and hopefully one day The Right Stuff on 4k and maybe even From the Earth to the Moon on BD). But I'm a little concerned.

I saw Close Encounters of the Third Kind in the Dolby Cinema for its re-release. I was a little disappointed. It seemed a little better in terms of PQ, but much. Be interested to read how the 4k disc turned out.

And idk if it was mixed in ATMOS, but the audio was terrible. It seemed off, and at times, only coming from the left stage when clearly.it should have been center or right speakers in use.

Hopefully they don't screw up this epic masterpiece...
Close Encounters looks outstanding on UHD BD and like pure film. Do understand the film and conditions how it was made are never going to make this movie look like Avatar; it's inherently a bit softer and grainy.
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post #17926 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 02:57 PM
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Close Encounters looks outstanding on UHD BD and like pure film. Do understand the film and conditions how it was made are never going to make this movie look like Avatar; it's inherently a bit softer and grainy.
Avatar was natively shot in 1080p, so, I hope not!

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post #17927 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 03:00 PM
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Avatar was natively shot in 1080p, so, I hope not!
I used Avatar as an example because for years so many people used that as the standard by which all movies are supposed to look.
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post #17928 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 07:52 PM
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Close Encounters looks outstanding on UHD BD and like pure film. Do understand the film and conditions how it was made are never going to make this movie look like Avatar; it's inherently a bit softer and grainy.
I'm sure Close Encounters is likely limited by poor film stock but the PQ on the 4K disc is quite soft. I never watched the regular Blu-ray so I can't compare but I will say that ET 4K by comparison looks immensely better.

Both are old movies shot on film. Close Encounters doesn't hold a candle to ET. If you're looking to be impressed by CE 4K, I'd suggest NOT watching it back to back with ET, which is what I did. CE after ET is quite disappointing, in more ways than one.
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post #17929 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 08:15 PM
 
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The first half is a mess because there are too many story-lines going on. Once Bay locks in the third act it gets better. I thought it was much too similar to Dark of the Moon, my personal favorite of the series.

This movie has probably 5 different aspect ratios which is absolute turmoil for my CIH screen. I put it in 2.40:1 mode, masked out the rest and basked in the glory.

For the last week I pulled my chair forward and had been sitting 8 feet away from my 136" CIH screen and it has been spectacular. This Transformers movie though, I just about had a seizure 20 minutes in and had to move further away.
I watched it today. Unfortunately I found the constant aspect ratio changes to be more annoying. I agree that zooming to fill my 2.35:1 screen and masking the excess with the projector is the best way to go (it only seemed to chop one 'location description' caption in the lower left) but it felt like watching two hours of a film student who couldn't frame his shots properly. Too many chopped off foreheads etc.

It's a shame since as usual with Bay everything looks great even when the plot is absurd.
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post #17930 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 08:26 PM
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I watched it today. Unfortunately I found the constant aspect ratio changes to be more annoying. I agree that zooming to fill my 2.35:1 screen and masking the excess with the projector is the best way to go (it only seemed to chop one 'location description' caption in the lower left) but it felt like watching two hours of a film student who couldn't frame his shots properly. Too many chopped off foreheads etc.

It's a shame since as usual with Bay everything looks great even when the plot is absurd.
Thanks for the CIH report. I hate variable aspect, but just going to do the same and mask to a constant 2.40 and hope the framing is decent most of the time.
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post #17931 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 08:37 PM
 
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Thanks for the CIH report. I hate variable aspect, but just going to do the same and mask to a constant 2.40 and hope the framing is decent most of the time.
Watch it in 16:9 for part of the time (maybe on a second viewing?). It's laughable how often the aspect changes!
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post #17932 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 08:40 PM
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I'm sure Close Encounters is likely limited by poor film stock but the PQ on the 4K disc is quite soft. I never watched the regular Blu-ray so I can't compare but I will say that ET 4K by comparison looks immensely better.

Both are old movies shot on film. Close Encounters doesn't hold a candle to ET. If you're looking to be impressed by CE 4K, I'd suggest NOT watching it back to back with ET, which is what I did. CE after ET is quite disappointing, in more ways than one.
You've got to look at these films in context and not compare them. It's apples to oranges. Close Encounters was shot anamorphically during the 70s and that was sort of the normal for the softer look. It was also filmed on Eastman 125T 5247 which was fairly new at the time with a little more grain. E.T. was shot later and differently with not even the same film (100T 5247) and filmed spherically for 1:85.

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post #17933 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 08:47 PM
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Watch it in 16:9 for part of the time (maybe on a second viewing?). It's laughable how often the aspect changes!
I'm confident I would find that annoying even on a 1.78 screen. Bi-polar aspect ratio change just isn't my idea of a good time!
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post #17934 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 08:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Apollo 13 should look great, but I believe I will blind-buy (again!!!) to hear the soundtrack in Dolby Atmos...(hopefully it will have ATMOS!!!)
it's being released with a DTS:X track, close enough.

can't wait for this one.

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post #17935 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 09:00 PM
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Watch it in 16:9 for part of the time (maybe on a second viewing?). It's laughable how often the aspect changes!
This is infuriating. I actually love the Transformer movies even though I am a family man over 40 . There is nothing more disturbing than popping in the newest action movie I can't wait to watch and then having to go from my 2.40:1 CIH to my "tiny" 100" 16x9 when some nimrod has decided changing aspect ratios is great fun.
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post #17936 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 09:12 PM - Thread Starter
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This is infuriating. I actually love the Transformer movies even though I am a family man over 40 . There is nothing more disturbing than popping in the newest action movie I can't wait to watch and then having to go from my 2.40:1 CIH to my "tiny" 100" 16x9 when some nimrod has decided changing aspect ratios is great fun.
I know the CIH folks hate this but it can be a blast on my 142" 16:9. Guardians of the Galaxy 3D did this and it was a fun movie to watch it go back and forth. I have masks for full scope movies, CIW works well in my room. Mini Imax goes from 142" -> 135" scope with the velvet masks.

to answer your question from the other thread regarding selling the VW1100, it was sold due to this below. significant contrast loss with very low hours on the projector (~300). A number of the first gen 4K panels had some serious issues and it wasn't easy to get it fixed. Once fixed I was nearing end of 3 year warranty and no way dealing with it again once out of warranty. A number of steps have been done on the newer models to prevent this but was still a poor experience given the high cost of the projector. If this didn't happen, I would likely still have it today.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...4k-panels.html
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post #17937 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 09:20 PM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post
I know the CIH folks hate this but it can be a blast on my 142" 16:9. Guardians of the Galaxy 3D did this and it was a fun movie to watch it go back and forth. I have masks for full scope movies, CIW works well in my room. Mini Imax goes from 142" -> 135" scope with the velvet masks.

to answer your question from the other thread regarding selling the VW1100, it was sold due to this below. significant contrast loss with very low hours on the projector (~300). A number of the first gen 4K panels had some serious issues and it wasn't easy to get it fixed. Once fixed I was nearing end of 3 year warranty and no way dealing with it again once out of warranty. A number of steps have been done on the newer models to prevent this but was still a poor experience given the high cost of the projector. If this didn't happen, I would likely still have it today.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...4k-panels.html
That huge 16x9 must be amazing for 3D and for everything! I love it. If movies keep being produced with varying aspect ratio's I will have to move to a 16x9 with masking panels. I would need a 135" diagonal 16x9 to equal my current 128" diagonal 2.40:1.

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post #17938 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 09:37 PM
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I've been cropping and masking all the variable aspect movies on my CIH screen. With I think the only exception being Hunger Games Catching Fire where I put it back to 16x9 when the game starts.

Unlike my old RS46, the RS400 is able to completely electronically mask the top and bottom. Pretty much all the switching aspect movies are widescreen safe so it's been completely seamless to me with no wall spill to remind me of the crop.
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post #17939 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 09:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by DavidHir View Post
You've got to look at these films in context and not compare them. It's apples to oranges. Close Encounters was shot anamorphically during the 70s and that was sort of the normal for the softer look. It was also filmed on Eastman 125T 5247 which was fairly new at the time with a little more grain. E.T. was shot later and differently with not even the same film (100T 5247) and filmed spherically for 1:85.
Any idea what Alien and Aliens was filmed on? Aliens film grain is pretty rough, especially compared to how good Alien looked 7+ years earlier. I bought Alien on DVHS when it was released.. it looked amazing for the time period.

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post #17940 of 19605 Old 09-27-2017, 09:45 PM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post
Any idea what Alien and Aliens was filmed on? Aliens film grain is pretty rough, especially compared to how good Alien looked 7+ years earlier. I bought Alien on DVHS when it was released.. it looked amazing for the time period.

Its 35mm its just high ISO 35mm which means its mega noisy stock. That lets them shoot with less intense lighting on set and still get decent exposure.

Also Alien was Anamorphic lenses (uses more of the actual negative) and Aliens were spherical lenses.

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