Originally Posted by alpin3r
To the gamers out there.. what are the settings on the RS500 that best minimize input lag? Disabling eShift and CMD obviously, but is there anything else major?
I know this is by no means a gaming projector, but I do occasionally do very light gaming with friends, nothing competitive, no FPS
CMD is the only thing that significantly affects the input lag, it adds something like 20ms. 130ms is about the minimum possible. I posted numbers, probably in the RS4910 thread.
Originally Posted by Manni01
That's exactly what's need, Ypeak. And yes it's not enough for Dolby because the end user can and will screw that measurement up, or will enter anything they want to "experiment", which means that we won't be seeing Dobly Vision. This is why I said that the only hope for DV on projectors was to have an internal meter, like on the Sony 4K PJs, so that the PJ can measure and add up to what it knows (iris setting, lamp mode, zoom factor etc) to make the precise calculations.
I guess I get it, but at the same time it's disappointing/silly. I do have some (very very small) hope that projector manufacturers will add that for "HDR10", even without DV. Though that's why a Radiance Pro is on my wish list, seems the only realistic hope for quality HDR on projectors.
The new models bring nothing that we can't get with the current ones, they just make it simpler and they add labels. They are still not able to take into account the way the content has been mastered, or to enable the DI , which are the two things that make HDR a pain on the JVCs. It's not easy to imagine that if they are unable to make things fundamentally better on the new models (it's not changing 10000nits to a fixed 2000nits that changes anything, it's still a fixed approximation for something that isn't fixed). You can get EXACTLY the same results setting a user mode with gamma D and the correct parameters. The fact that they haven't even "reset" the gamma D settings but are keeping more or less the same ones is adding insult to injury. I'm not even sure if the raised black levels issue is solved in the new models.
Arguably the biggest problem is the broken Dark Level control, that raises the black level if set above +2. They really should have at least fixed that.
Really? They are not embarrassed to sell a broken CMS (although since Autocal we doen't need an external solution to get a decent calibration), or to ship high-end models with bright corners or convergence issues, so what makes you think any of this would embarrass them? There are three issues: 1) marketing rules 2) bean counters rule and 3) their knowledge of calibration is VERY limited. They simply don't understand this, so it makes it more difficult for them to fix it. They do make great projectors though, but calibration isn't their forte. They are always 2-3 years behind the curve.
All those would embarass me, but I'm well aware of schedule, budget, and knowledge issues in development, I deal with them every day. Also I never said I expected it fixed immediately, or even in the current models, just that if it were my product, I wouldn't just "give up" like you implied they could, because Lumagen/Panasonic/Oppo have a bandaid. Sure the RS600 and RS620 have shipped and are done, but JVC shouldn't, nor should we let them, give up on HDR for their future models. There is some evidence they're working on it, as the "DI" is available on the RS4500 for HDR.
And not to dispute that, but the HDR brokenness is a much bigger issue than the others IMO. Bright corners seem to have been improved (judging by the drop in chatter) from the early models. CMS, while important, doesn't smack you in the face out of the box. On the RS500/600, you can't even get close to reasonable HDR performance with the out of the box settings, you have to use settings in a paper that I wouldn't even know about if it weren't for this forum (well I'm sure Craig probably told me too), and even those aren't really good settings to use.
If whatever replaces the RSx20's has the same HDR problems, I'd say that's a big problem, JVC needs to do something before their next product refresh. It's not like they're the first or anything.
I don't let JVC off the hook, I'm just realistic. They never fix anything they don't have to, and they never provide new features through f/w upgrade. They simply don't have the competence, the resources and the knowledge (not to mention the will) to fix anything in relation to HDR as it is implemented (ie without a finished standard). They will produce something decent (hopefully) when there is a working standard for projectors. Lumagen, Oppo and Panasonic have engineers who do understand calibration issues. JVC don't.
Maybe that's where the wires are crossed, I'm not expecting any changes to come from JVC for my RS600, or even for the RSx20's. I just don't think we should be letting them off the hook and saying the current situation is OK. This is yet another reason why a Lumagen is on my wish list, I really don't expect
great HDR from JVC, or anyone else for that matter. My RS600 is great, from a raw picture quality perspective, there's really very little I'm left wanting.
A Radiance Pro should solve the HDR problems, and guarantee excellent results for not just my RS600, but any projector I upgrade to in the future and
any source I add. And that's really key, while it's great what Pansonic and Oppo are doing, they have a fatal flaw in that it only applies to their internal player, and not streaming apps. As HDR continues to gain steam with streaming, not having a good HDR display solution is going to be a bigger and bigger problem, and streaming apps and streaming devices are always stripped down, bottom of the barrel when it comes to video processing.
And FWIW, I'm speaking with my $'s, I'd have upgraded to a RSx20 from my RS600 if they'd have actually done something to fix HDR. That and the input lag are my gripes with my RS600, they got one, but not the other, so here I sit, with my RS600, and I'll probably keep sitting on it. If they bring out laser, I might change my mind, we'll see what the consensus is when/if that happens. But I highly doubt (and I've probably said this before) that I'll get another lamp based JVC, especially if they don't fix HDR.