JVC Calibration Software V6 For 2015 Models (X9000,X7000,X5000,RS400,RS500,RS600) - Page 129 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3841 of 4164 Old 11-25-2018, 12:53 PM
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Screen size, users & ARVE tool vs. JVC upload?

I installed the JVC Projector Calibration software and have the following questions:

1) In the setup, diagonal screen size is requested; my screen is 4:3 10' diagonal; is that what I should enter even though in 16:9 the image is NOT 10'?
2) If I want to create HDR user mode for both HIGH and LOW lamp, does that require 2 separate users - 1 for BT2020 with filter and another for BT2020 NO filter color profiles, respectively?
3) Since I previously used ARVE's tool to upload custom gamma curves, before downloading the JVC software, is there any advantage to uploading gamma curves with one over the other?

Thanks Dominic for all for all of your continued help! Hopefully I'm finally getting the hang of this. :-)

Last edited by jwhart; 11-25-2018 at 12:59 PM.
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post #3842 of 4164 Old 11-25-2018, 01:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwhart View Post
I installed the JVC Projector Calibration software and have the following questions:

1) In the setup, diagonal screen size is requested; my screen is 4:3 10' diagonal; is that what I should enter even though in 16:9 the image is NOT 10'?
I never bothered with this. If you want to enter it, it should be the “virtual” screen size (92”)
Quote:
2) If I want to create HDR user mode for both HIGH and LOW lamp, does that require 2 separate users - 1 for BT2020 with filter and another for BT2020 NO filter color profiles, respectively?
There’s no specific reason to use the No Filter profile unless you want to maximize the luminance. However, you do need two User modes, as you would be using different curves, andd the colour temperatures may be slightly different between high and low lamp power.

Quote:
3) Since I previously used ARVE's tool to upload custom gamma curves, before downloading the JVC software, is there any advantage to uploading gamma curves with one over the other?
Arves curves are “high resolution” with 256 points. JVC jgd curves are lower resolution (12 points) but more flexible; e.g., use different curves for R,G,B to compensate for colour imbalance, or apply some Black compensation to improve shadow details.
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post #3843 of 4164 Old 11-25-2018, 02:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
I never bothered with this. If you want to enter it, it should be the “virtual” screen size (92”)

There’s no specific reason to use the No Filter profile unless you want to maximize the luminance. However, you do need two User modes, as you would be using different curves, andd the colour temperatures may be slightly different between high and low lamp power.


Arves curves are “high resolution” with 256 points. JVC jgd curves are lower resolution (12 points) but more flexible; e.g., use different curves for R,G,B to compensate for colour imbalance, or apply some Black compensation to improve shadow details.
Thanks again Dominic for your help and patience and the clarification regarding screen size. It appears that I was confused about the "filter" designation. I thought that since a filter on my 990 kicks in when the lamp is on high but now believe it's based on which model is in use; is that correct?

As for the curves, I used Arve's tool to upload Javs curves. However, now that I will be making changes to the User modes for color profiles using the JVC software, it will be easier to upload gamma using the software with the JVC software at the same time.

Thanks again!
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post #3844 of 4164 Old 11-25-2018, 04:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwhart View Post
Thanks again Dominic for your help and patience and the clarification regarding screen size. It appears that I was confused about the "filter" designation. I thought that since a filter on my 990 kicks in when the lamp is on high but now believe it's based on which model is in use; is that correct?
It’s the Colour Profile, not the Picture Model per se, that determines the filter (although each Picture Mode does have an associated Colour Profile)
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post #3845 of 4164 Old 11-25-2018, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
It’s the Colour Profile, not the Picture Model per se, that determines the filter (although each Picture Mode does have an associated Colour Profile)

After reading this thread for a week, can you direct me to a link that will explain the difference between the filter/no filter color profiles and how to determine which is best for you? I've looked most of today and haven't been able to find an explanation.


Thanks AGAIN!
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post #3846 of 4164 Old 11-25-2018, 05:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwhart View Post
After reading this thread for a week, can you direct me to a link that will explain the difference between the filter/no filter color profiles and how to determine which is best for you? I've looked most of today and haven't been able to find an explanation.
I’m not aware of any specific link, but essentially with the filter the colour gamut gets close to DCI-P3, but loses some luminance in doing so.
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post #3847 of 4164 Old 11-26-2018, 03:50 PM
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Has someone successfully resolved the issue of uploading color profiles in Windows 10 running in Parallels 13 on a Mac recently? Although the JVC software reports the network OK, I get "no input signal or unsupported format" when selecting the upload/download option.


Glad that I'm retired and now have so much time available!


BR,


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post #3848 of 4164 Old 11-26-2018, 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by jwhart View Post
Has someone successfully resolved the issue of uploading color profiles in Windows 10 running in Parallels 13 on a Mac recently? Although the JVC software reports the network OK, I get "no input signal or unsupported format" when selecting the upload/download option.


Glad that I'm retired and now have so much time available!


BR,


Jack
The message "no input signal or unsupported format" refers to video input, not network input. You need to have a valid video input connected to the projector at all times.
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post #3849 of 4164 Old 11-26-2018, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
The message "no input signal or unsupported format" refers to video input, not network input. You need to have a valid video input connected to the projector at all times.

WOW Dominic you are GREAT and always so helpful. I knew that was part of the calibration process but didn't realize that it was also required just to upload color profiles since JVC's CP import PDF file doesn't mention it.


Thanks again!


PS Just confirming that I can now access the upload/download option.

Last edited by jwhart; 11-26-2018 at 04:22 PM.
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post #3850 of 4164 Old 11-26-2018, 10:36 PM
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wow 4000 posts is alot to go through, so I guess I'll ask here. Sorry if it's already been asnswered somewhere else.

I have a simple question i've been trying to get answered.
Can I use the OEM version of the xrite i1 pro 1 with my JVC x5000? And if so, what software would I need to look at?
I know it's not compatible with the JVC auto cal, but i'm ok with that if it means it's a beter color meter over the Spyder express 5.

Thanks
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post #3851 of 4164 Old 11-27-2018, 12:46 AM
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No, JVC x5000 works with Spyder only. You need newer projectors than x5000 to be able to connect Xrite spectros. Officialy pro2 but I saw some info that you could also use pro1.


Quote:
Originally Posted by netgod2002 View Post
wow 4000 posts is alot to go through, so I guess I'll ask here. Sorry if it's already been asnswered somewhere else.

I have a simple question i've been trying to get answered.
Can I use the OEM version of the xrite i1 pro 1 with my JVC x5000? And if so, what software would I need to look at?
I know it's not compatible with the JVC auto cal, but i'm ok with that if it means it's a beter color meter over the Spyder express 5.

Thanks

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post #3852 of 4164 Old 11-27-2018, 05:25 AM
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Originally Posted by netgod2002 View Post
wow 4000 posts is alot to go through, so I guess I'll ask here. Sorry if it's already been asnswered somewhere else.

I have a simple question i've been trying to get answered.
Can I use the OEM version of the xrite i1 pro 1 with my JVC x5000? And if so, what software would I need to look at?
I know it's not compatible with the JVC auto cal, but i'm ok with that if it means it's a beter color meter over the Spyder express 5.

Thanks
You can use the Spyder to run autocal, and then use the i1Pro to measure and correct the colours using the “spreadsheet method”. The first 10 posts give you most of the information.
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post #3853 of 4164 Old 11-27-2018, 10:38 AM
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After upload Manni's 2020 & 709 color profiles and setting the User 1 mode as suggested, the picture is so washed out it's unwatchable. I don't yet have the Spyder5 to do the calibration but other posts in this thread indicated that just installing the new profile would be a big improvement.

Also, while I had the 990 connected to the network, I planned to backup the factory INIT file but didn't see an option to do so. Is that only possible after performing a calibration?
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post #3854 of 4164 Old 11-27-2018, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
You can use the Spyder to run autocal, and then use the i1Pro to measure and correct the colours using the “spreadsheet method”. The first 10 posts give you most of the information.
That would essentially mean buying two colormeters though. I'd be happy with just the one method. I'm really not too picky. I just want something that gets me 80% there at this stage with a noticeable improvement over stock.
I spoke to steve at light illusion to give me a run down on the manual method. So looks like i've got some reading to do on the subject, but I was told this is a much better way vs the JVC autocal.
Someone else told me that I could use the arve's tool script to upload some gamma curves? Haven't looked into that yet and not sure if this is something I'd do with the manual method or if they were referring to that with the Autocal.
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post #3855 of 4164 Old 11-27-2018, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by netgod2002 View Post
I spoke to steve at light illusion to give me a run down on the manual method. So looks like i've got some reading to do on the subject, but I was told this is a much better way vs the JVC autocal.
Someone else told me that I could use the arve's tool script to upload some gamma curves? Haven't looked into that yet and not sure if this is something I'd do with the manual method or if they were referring to that with the Autocal.
You can use manual calibration for up to 3 custom curves, but that won’t fix the “base” gamma droop; i.e., you will have to manually adjust the EOTF and cannot use Arve’s curves as those depend on the base gamma.
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post #3856 of 4164 Old 11-27-2018, 05:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
You can use manual calibration for up to 3 custom curves, but that won’t fix the “base” gamma droop; i.e., you will have to manually adjust the EOTF and cannot use Arve’s curves as those depend on the base gamma.
Ok cool. As a noob, can you tell me how to go about fixing the base gamma droop? What does manually adjusting EOTF mean?
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post #3857 of 4164 Old 11-27-2018, 05:45 PM
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Ok cool. As a noob, can you tell me how to go about fixing the base gamma droop? What does manually adjusting EOTF mean?
The only way to fix base gamma is to run autocal.

Manually adjusting EOTF means using the 12 point gamma adjustment to achieve the gamma or EOTF that you’re trying to achieve. (That may not mean too much to you, in which case autocal is the easiest way).
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Last edited by Dominic Chan; 11-27-2018 at 05:49 PM.
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post #3858 of 4164 Old 11-27-2018, 06:19 PM
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The only way to fix base gamma is to run autocal.

Manually adjusting EOTF means using the 12 point gamma adjustment to achieve the gamma or EOTF that you’re trying to achieve. (That may not mean too much to you, in which case autocal is the easiest way).
Ok great. Thanks Dominic!
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post #3859 of 4164 Old 11-30-2018, 05:22 AM
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Silly question, what way do you face the spyder 5 to the projector or the screen. And can I just do the gamma. As some do gamma and colour. And do I just use JVC software and not the spyder 5. Thanks

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post #3860 of 4164 Old 11-30-2018, 04:40 PM
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Silly question, what way do you face the spyder 5 to the projector or the screen. And can I just do the gamma. As some do gamma and colour. And do I just use JVC software and not the spyder 5. Thanks

It faces the projector with the cover off. I found this out the hard way
Cant remember if there's a gamma only option but they're all in the settings (last menu selection)
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post #3861 of 4164 Old 11-30-2018, 04:46 PM
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So after a second attempt at doing an autocal and following the guide in this forum to the T, I can proudly say the results were a success and the picture is outstanding compared to what it was. I'm currently using Manni's 709NF colour profile after doing a base gamma cal using the standards profile, and then colour cals for all aperture light settings and CMD on/off, and finally a colour cal using the custom profile.
My question now is... what next?
I curiously ran the AVS black clipping, white clipping test and a few others I found on the website forum to see if my results were adequate, but my settings aren't showing the full range of any of the bars I should be seeing in either the black clipping or white clipping tests?... is this normal? Or have I failed somewhere?
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post #3862 of 4164 Old 11-30-2018, 07:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by netgod2002 View Post
I curiously ran the AVS black clipping, white clipping test and a few others I found on the website forum to see if my results were adequate, but my settings aren't showing the full range of any of the bars I should be seeing in either the black clipping or white clipping tests?... is this normal? Or have I failed somewhere?
What did you use to play the clipping patterns? If properly calibrated they should definitely be visible at least down to level 18, assuming iris is on manual.
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post #3863 of 4164 Old 11-30-2018, 10:10 PM
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What did you use to play the clipping patterns? If properly calibrated they should definitely be visible at least down to level 18, assuming iris is on manual.
hmm back to the drawing board then.
I played them directly from USB off my nvidia shield.

Do I need to load in the backup factory gamma profile everytime I need to re-do gamma from step one, or just run it again as it is?
And do I need to run the enviroment cal before hand?
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post #3864 of 4164 Old 12-01-2018, 05:07 AM
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hmm back to the drawing board then.
I played them directly from USB off my nvidia shield.

Do I need to load in the backup factory gamma profile everytime I need to re-do gamma from step one, or just run it again as it is?
And do I need to run the enviroment cal before hand?
No and no.

Make the the JVC input range matches what Shield is outputting.
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post #3865 of 4164 Old 12-01-2018, 09:17 AM
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Originally Posted by inonefly View Post
Went back to first page and there's the guide on the color profiles, downloaded them and will try later this evening.
Any updates?
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post #3866 of 4164 Old 12-01-2018, 08:39 PM
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No and no.

Make the the JVC input range matches what Shield is outputting.
All sorted. Just a output colour mismatch as you said.

So back to my first question.. what next?
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post #3867 of 4164 Old 12-02-2018, 01:38 AM
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Can someone please tell me what's going on here. My gamma is going out of wack after the autocal.
I started from the factory settings, did a mesurement with Calman and gamma was more or less following the 2.2 curve dropping towards 2.0 on the bright end.
However, after I do an autocal I get this:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...490036&thumb=1
A lot of corrections to the gamma. In Calman it looks like this:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...490038&thumb=1
This is the result of gamma-only autocal. If I do the colors+gamma, the colors are slightly better (but not much), but gamma spike is the same.
This is the first time it happens. Before, if anything, I had gamma dropping on the bright end, and now this.
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post #3868 of 4164 Old 12-03-2018, 09:13 AM
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The spyder has made a very big improvement, I've just done gamma. Should I do gamma and colour. Or just leave it at that.Click image for larger version

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post #3869 of 4164 Old 12-03-2018, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
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The spyder has made a very big improvement, I've just done gamma.
Are those with different filter, lamp power, or CMD settings? Calibrating gamma for one Picture Mode should also fix the other Picture Modes that share those settings.

Quote:
Should I do gamma and colour. Or just leave it at that.
Unless you have a “known good” meter to verify, you cannot predict whether running colour autocal will make things better or worse.

Last edited by Dominic Chan; 12-03-2018 at 03:14 PM.
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post #3870 of 4164 Old 12-03-2018, 10:37 AM
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Hi,

I've read through and tried to search this thread, but haven't been able to find anything.

I purchased a used X500 (4910) from a forum member about a year ago, the unit was calibrated by Chad B. prior to my purchase. I've verified the calibration is still accurate with my iD3 and ChromaPure.

When Chad B calibrated, he didn't do any standard gamma calibrations on high lamp, only low lamp. I'm now looking to use one of the high lamp modes with straight 2.4 gamma so I can use the UB820 tone mapping. If I use my Spyder 4 and JVC Auto Cal to calibrate 2.4 gamma on high lamp will it effect any of the other changes Chad B did? Each of the custom gamma slots has an imported HDR curve, but they are a little too dark for me.

Thanks in advance!
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