JVC Calibration Software V6 For 2015 Models (X9000,X7000,X5000,RS400,RS500,RS600) - Page 130 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3871 of 4164 Old 12-03-2018, 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by chadwick537 View Post
I purchased a used X500 (4910) from a forum member about a year ago, the unit was calibrated by Chad B. prior to my purchase. I've verified the calibration is still accurate with my iD3 and ChromaPure.

When Chad B calibrated, he didn't do any standard gamma calibrations on high lamp, only low lamp. I'm now looking to use one of the high lamp modes with straight 2.4 gamma so I can use the UB820 tone mapping. If I use my Spyder 4 and JVC Auto Cal to calibrate 2.4 gamma on high lamp will it effect any of the other changes Chad B did? Each of the custom gamma slots has an imported HDR curve, but they are a little too dark for me.
(You may get better responses in the X500 forum as the Autocal software is not the same as the later models).

The Autocal software for the 4910 does not include any option to save/load the gamma curves, so you can only load custom curves using Arve's Tools. Hopefully Chad B provided the conf files that you can use to reload the custom curves, or you can see if the Arve Pr command can be used to save the curves.

Caibrating at high lamp should not affect any previous calibration done at lamp power, but it would be prudent to check after running Autocal, and if necessary, restore from the backup file.

EDIT: Assuming the custom curves were set for High Lamp mode (not explicitly mentioned in your post, but stands to reason), running autocal will affect the custom curves. Is there any reason why you think gamma 2.4 was not calibrated in High Lamp mode? For the custom curves to work properly the base gamma must be “flat”. He might not have set up any Picture Modes with gamma 2.4 and High Lamp, but that does not mean the combination is uncalibrated.

Last edited by Dominic Chan; 12-03-2018 at 04:00 PM.
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post #3872 of 4164 Old 12-03-2018, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
Are those with different filter, lamp power, or CMD settings? Calibrating one Picture Mode should also fix the other Picture Modes that share those settings.


Unless you have a “known good” meter to verify, you cannot predict whether running colour autocal will make things better or worse.
Yes different settings for them all.

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post #3873 of 4164 Old 12-03-2018, 05:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post

EDIT: Assuming the custom curves were set for High Lamp mode (not explicitly mentioned in your post, but stands to reason), running autocal will affect the custom curves. Is there any reason why you think gamma 2.4 was not calibrated in High Lamp mode? For the custom curves to work properly the base gamma must be “flat”. He might not have set up any Picture Modes with gamma 2.4 and High Lamp, but that does not mean the combination is uncalibrated.
Unfortunately I dont have the original calibration files or access to what the curves are, only the calibration reports showing what settings to use and the results.

I was able to verify the results with my iD3 (offset against a higher end meter) and Chromapure.

When I tried the gamma at 2.4 with high lamp and the bt2020 color profile it was anything but straight. I can get it reasonably close with the 2 pt controls but I thought the autocal would give better results.

Probably not worth losing access to the curves, however.

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post #3874 of 4164 Old 12-03-2018, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by chadwick537 View Post
Unfortunately I dont have the original calibration files or access to what the curves are, only the calibration reports showing what settings to use and the results.

I was able to verify the results with my iD3 (offset against a higher end meter) and Chromapure.

When I tried the gamma at 2.4 with high lamp and the bt2020 color profile it was anything but straight. I can get it reasonably close with the 2 pt controls but I thought the autocal would give better results.

Probably not worth losing access to the curves, however.

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The JVC projectors develop "gamma droop" after a few hundred hours. If gamma 2.4 is not behaving correctly then chances are the custom curves are also not accurate, as they rely on the base gamma. (On the other hand, if the Low Lamp gamma is correct that would indicate no gamma droop developed since the previous calibration).

In any case, assuming you are able to back up the existing curves, you can try creating your own curve to get a brighter picture.

Last edited by Dominic Chan; 12-03-2018 at 05:38 PM.
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post #3875 of 4164 Old 12-04-2018, 02:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
The JVC projectors develop "gamma droop" after a few hundred hours. If gamma 2.4 is not behaving correctly then chances are the custom curves are also not accurate, as they rely on the base gamma. (On the other hand, if the Low Lamp gamma is correct that would indicate no gamma droop developed since the previous calibration).

In any case, assuming you are able to back up the existing curves, you can try creating your own curve to get a brighter picture.
Is there any node based tool to create a custom curve? Or is it a matter of punching in numbers?
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post #3876 of 4164 Old 12-04-2018, 01:27 PM
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Does anyone watch hdr in low lamp mode

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post #3877 of 4164 Old 12-05-2018, 01:32 AM
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Originally Posted by kgveteran View Post
Does anyone watch hdr in low lamp mode
Yes I do.

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post #3878 of 4164 Old 12-05-2018, 01:42 AM
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I did the calibration again this time with gamma and colour 33 point, I made sure the the spyder was in the middle of the screen and the small round light just under the projector. This time it looks even better. That's the best i have seen it.
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I was reading manni's post and I thought that he said you only have to do that calibration once for normal gamma, and that should take to all the other inputs like cinema user1 and user2. Is that correct. As I have calibrated all of my inputs.

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Last edited by nucky; 12-05-2018 at 02:51 AM.
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post #3879 of 4164 Old 12-05-2018, 03:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nucky View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by kgveteran View Post
Does anyone watch hdr in low lamp mode
Yes I do.
Do you feel its a compromise??

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post #3880 of 4164 Old 12-05-2018, 03:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
The JVC projectors develop "gamma droop" after a few hundred hours. If gamma 2.4 is not behaving correctly then chances are the custom curves are also not accurate, as they rely on the base gamma. (On the other hand, if the Low Lamp gamma is correct that would indicate no gamma droop developed since the previous calibration).

In any case, assuming you are able to back up the existing curves, you can try creating your own curve to get a brighter picture.
Well I got this figured out last night..

When taking measurements I simply changed the gamma from import to 2.4 before taking measurements. The gamma was straight to about 60 and the had a huge rolloff.

I completely forgot to check my contrast setting, assuming it was still correct for high lamp. Once I changed that I had a perfectly calibrated 2.4 gamma =)

Thanks for help!

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post #3881 of 4164 Old 12-05-2018, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by nucky View Post
I did the calibration again this time with gamma and colour 33 point, I made sure the the spyder was in the middle of the screen and the small round light just under the projector. This time it looks even better. That's the best i have seen it.

I was reading manni's post and I thought that he said you only have to do that calibration once for normal gamma, and that should take to all the other inputs like cinema user1 and user2. Is that correct. As I have calibrated all of my inputs.
What do you mean "The small round light just under the PJ?"

I believe you have to do a gamma calibration for each different color mode you use if you use different profiles. At the very least two calibrations one for 1080 rec709 material and one for UHD/HDR... as those are absolutely using two different profiles.
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post #3882 of 4164 Old 12-05-2018, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post
What do you mean "The small round light just under the PJ?"

I believe you have to do a gamma calibration for each different color mode you use if you use different profiles. At the very least two calibrations one for 1080 rec709 material and one for UHD/HDR... as those are absolutely using two different profiles.
The small light is from the reflection from the spyde, you have to make sure it is just under the projector lens.

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Originally Posted by kgveteran View Post
Do you feel its a compromise??
No it is still bright enough for me.

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post #3884 of 4164 Old 12-05-2018, 06:25 PM
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Originally Posted by chadwick537 View Post
Well I got this figured out last night..

When taking measurements I simply changed the gamma from import to 2.4 before taking measurements. The gamma was straight to about 60 and the had a huge rolloff. k
Did you calibrate gamma with a mode set to 2.4?

on the X500 you need to calibrate for Normal gamma. All other gamma settings will reference off that. If you calibrate with 2.4 set autocalc will not get you 2.4. You need to calibrate using normal *then* set to 2.4 or any other desired gamma. I don;t know if this is the case with newer versions.
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post #3885 of 4164 Old 12-05-2018, 06:48 PM
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Did you calibrate gamma with a mode set to 2.4?

on the X500 you need to calibrate for Normal gamma. All other gamma settings will reference off that. If you calibrate with 2.4 set autocalc will not get you 2.4. You need to calibrate using normal *then* set to 2.4 or any other desired gamma. I don;t know if this is the case with newer versions.
Actually if you calibrate with the gamma 2.4 setting you will get gamma 2.4 in that setting after autocal. However, Normal will still be 2.2 regardless, unless you define a custom profile based on gamma 2.4.
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post #3886 of 4164 Old 12-06-2018, 03:30 AM
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Did you calibrate gamma with a mode set to 2.4?

on the X500 you need to calibrate for Normal gamma. All other gamma settings will reference off that. If you calibrate with 2.4 set autocalc will not get you 2.4. You need to calibrate using normal *then* set to 2.4 or any other desired gamma. I don;t know if this is the case with newer versions.
I didn't do the calibration, I was using Chad Bs calibration done for the previous owner.

Once I set the proper contrast the gamma was perfectly calibrated. I'm not sure how to check or calibrate 2020 color space with ChromaPure as I use calibration disc. The internal slides are off due to my computer altering hdmi output.

I'm hoping the X500 has already went through its gamma droop. This bulb has 450 hours and is the 2nd bulb. We shall see!

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post #3887 of 4164 Old 12-06-2018, 05:05 AM
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Originally Posted by chadwick537 View Post
Once I set the proper contrast the gamma was perfectly calibrated.
To get the proper HDR curve you need to restore the Contrast setting to where it was.
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I'm not sure how to check or calibrate 2020 color space with ChromaPure as I use calibration disc. The internal slides are off due to my computer altering hdmi output.
You could use the same pattern as Rec709 as the projector would “interpret” them as BT.2020 RGB if you set it to the corresponding colour profile. BUT - people usually calibrate to BT.2020/P3 (not 100% saturation BT.2020); also, for HDR colours are usually measured ar 50% stimulus level instead of 100% stimulus.
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post #3888 of 4164 Old 12-06-2018, 01:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
To get the proper HDR curve you need to restore the Contrast setting to where it was.
So set contrast (and I assume brightness too) back to default/zero before you run the gamma calibration, or set them to where you had previously found them to be accurate? I would think the former, run autocal, then adjust them again after.

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post #3889 of 4164 Old 12-06-2018, 01:38 PM
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So set contrast (and I assume brightness too) back to default/zero before you run the gamma calibration, or set them to where you had previously found them to be accurate? I would think the former, run autocal, then adjust them again after.
In this particular case the projector was calibrated by Chad B with 3 custom HDR curves. Any change in contrast would drastically change the curves.
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post #3890 of 4164 Old 12-06-2018, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
In this particular case the projector was calibrated by Chad B with 3 custom HDR curves. Any change in contrast would drastically change the curves.
I should clarify my statement from a previous response. I took Chad B's HDR calibration (with custom curves) and copied the settings to a new user profile. I wanted to keep the wide color gamut but get 2.4SDR. I had issues with the gamma rolling off at the top end and it wasn't until I realized I was clipping my whites (fixed by adjusting my contrast) that I was able to get nearly perfect 2.4 SDR gamma.

On the HDR calibrations (w/ custom curves) I left everything as when he calibrated as to not alter the calibration.
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post #3891 of 4164 Old 12-06-2018, 01:50 PM
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In this particular case the projector was calibrated by Chad B with 3 custom HDR curves. Any change in contrast would drastically change the curves.
Ok so in a scenario where the PJ hadn't been previously calibrated, would you zero out the contrast and brightness before running autocal for gamma?

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post #3892 of 4164 Old 12-06-2018, 01:55 PM
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Ok so in a scenario where the PJ hadn't been previously calibrated, would you zero out the contrast and brightness before running autocal for gamma?
The contrast and brightness settings do not affect autocal, even though they affect the curves. Autocal essentially ignores those settings (as well as the RGB Gains etc).
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post #3893 of 4164 Old 12-06-2018, 02:01 PM
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The contrast and brightness settings do not affect autocal, even though they affect the curves. Autocal essentially ignores those settings (as well as the RGB Gains etc).
Nice. I am hoping I finally have some time tonight to run a fresh gamma droop correction. At 1200 hours on the bulb, I am long overdue. Any last pointers?

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post #3894 of 4164 Old 12-07-2018, 09:58 AM
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Can someone tell me which type of tool I would use to tighten/un-tighten the 4 screws in the feet of the projector for mounting?
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post #3895 of 4164 Old 12-07-2018, 03:45 PM
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Question re number of JVC Autocals required

I plan to use 4 different viewing profiles, as follows:

User 1 – SDR
User 2 – 4, all HDR with identical settings other than 3 different Jav’s curves.

How many JVC Autocals using the Spyder5 Express do I need to process? 4?

TIA and have a great weekend!
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post #3896 of 4164 Old 12-07-2018, 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by jwhart View Post
I plan to use 4 different viewing profiles, as follows:

User 1 – SDR
User 2 – 4, all HDR with identical settings other than 3 different Jav’s curves.

How many JVC Autocals using the Spyder5 Express do I need to process? 4?

TIA and have a great weekend!
User 2-4 would use the same calibration, based on Normal. The different curves do not have separate calibrations

Last edited by Dominic Chan; 12-07-2018 at 04:45 PM.
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post #3897 of 4164 Old 12-07-2018, 04:35 PM
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User 2-4 would use the same calibration, based on Normal. The different curves do not have e separate calibrations
Thanks Dominic. Therefore, I would only need to do 2? Also, if I choose to have both low and high lamp HDR settings would that require an additional Autocal?
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post #3898 of 4164 Old 12-07-2018, 04:46 PM
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Thanks Dominic. Therefore, I would only need to do 2? Also, if I choose to have both low and high lamp HDR settings would that require an additional Autocal?
Yes, they also need different curves
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post #3899 of 4164 Old 12-07-2018, 08:12 PM
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Yes, they also need different curves
Well, since the curves have already been loaded for each, what does that mean? Will I need to upload them again after the Autocal?

Thanks again!
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post #3900 of 4164 Old 12-07-2018, 08:40 PM
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Well, since the curves have already been loaded for each, what does that mean? Will I need to upload them again after the Autocal?
The curves are meant for specific peak luminance levels. When you change lamp power ideally you should use a different curve; however, if you’re using pre-made curves the it doesn’t really matter. You do need separate autocal for high/low lamp power.
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