Official JVC DLA-RS400 (X550/X5000) Owner's Thread - Page 166 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #4951 of 5804 Old 01-24-2018, 11:21 AM
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I want to thank everyone for the help on getting my projector a little more dialed in. I loaded the BT2020 color profile and some new gamma tweaks. Hopefully this will fix my issue.

I find it frustrating that the projector goes to gamma D with the input of 4k HDR. That would be a nice update from JVC to fix some of these inconvenient issues.
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post #4952 of 5804 Old 01-24-2018, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phansson View Post
I want to thank everyone for the help on getting my projector a little more dialed in. I loaded the BT2020 color profile and some new gamma tweaks. Hopefully this will fix my issue.

I find it frustrating that the projector goes to gamma D with the input of 4k HDR. That would be a nice update from JVC to fix some of these inconvenient issues.
Agreed - this would be a nice update, but I think the chances of this happening are near zero.

The only want to get around this that I know of is to use the HDFury Linker or Vertex.
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post #4953 of 5804 Old 01-24-2018, 12:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phansson View Post
I want to thank everyone for the help on getting my projector a little more dialed in. I loaded the BT2020 color profile and some new gamma tweaks. Hopefully this will fix my issue.

I find it frustrating that the projector goes to gamma D with the input of 4k HDR. That would be a nice update from JVC to fix some of these inconvenient issues.
Glad you got it all dialed in, I knew you could do it!

JVC won't update the RSx00 projectors to fix ANYTHING. Instead, they decided 'thank' all the RSx00 owners by releasing the RSx20 projectors one year later which has a 'custom' curve built in.

The HD Fury Vertex will (among other things) allow the projector to remember the custom gamma slot and not default to gamma D. Not worth the price for that feature alone, though. Just wait for the movie to actually start playing before switching to custom gamma so you only have to do it once per movie, it often defaults back to gamma D a handful of times before that if you try switching as soon as you put the disc in.
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post #4954 of 5804 Old 01-24-2018, 02:31 PM
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Glad you got it all dialed in, I knew you could do it!

JVC won't update the RSx00 projectors to fix ANYTHING. Instead, they decided 'thank' all the RSx00 owners by releasing the RSx20 projectors one year later which has a 'custom' curve built in.

The HD Fury Vertex will (among other things) allow the projector to remember the custom gamma slot and not default to gamma D. Not worth the price for that feature alone, though. Just wait for the movie to actually start playing before switching to custom gamma so you only have to do it once per movie, it often defaults back to gamma D a handful of times before that if you try switching as soon as you put the disc in.
What does switching to the custom gamma actual look like in practice? Can it be mapped to a button on say a harmony remote? Does it then trigger a long delay like an input switch?

I am really thinking of upgrading... not sure if I should look for a used 400 somewhere or get a 420/440. And once I am up to the 440 level I start thinking about a 520... really tough to decide anything!
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post #4955 of 5804 Old 01-24-2018, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by joepaiii View Post
What does switching to the custom gamma actual look like in practice? Can it be mapped to a button on say a harmony remote? Does it then trigger a long delay like an input switch?

I am really thinking of upgrading... not sure if I should look for a used 400 somewhere or get a 420/440. And once I am up to the 440 level I start thinking about a 520... really tough to decide anything!
There is a Gamma button on the remote that you press multiple times to cycle through all of the different Gammas available. You can map it to the Harmony no problem, I did.

A simple delay won’t work because it will reset to gamma D sometimes when it loads the menu or when you actually play the movie from the menu. Your best to wait until you actually start playing the movie and press the gamma button a couple times.

It looks a lot of RSx20 & RSx40 owners are messing around with making their own gamma curves.

I didn’t really like the way HDR looked on my RS400, even with custom curves...and if the owners of the new models don’t *love* the new built in curve and mess around with custom curves anyway, I didn’t see a point in upgrading. Instead I spent the money on a Panasonic UB900 & HD Fury Vertex (an Oppo 203 will do this by itself) which gave me SDR2020. I love it and am not interested in upgrading at all. I talked about this a bit at the bottom of my JVC 4K QuickStart Guide.

I recently talked to a RS440 owner who was also unhappy with his HDR image. I walked him through all of the steps on my guide and he still ended up going with SDR2020 and now loves his image also.

Many many many people disagree with me on this topic and that’s fine. Any JVC owner is able to walk through the steps in my guide and decide for themselves.

As far as what projector you should get: A Time Machine...A couple weeks ago AVS was selling RS400 projectors on closeout for less than half price. They might still have a RS500 closeout available and I’d get that. I do wish the native black level was better on the RS400, it isn’t as good as my old RS46 but it is WAY brighter and looks MUCH better, even for HD & 3D. At the end of the day, I’m happy with my purchase.
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post #4956 of 5804 Old 01-24-2018, 06:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Dreamliner View Post
There is a Gamma button on the remote that you press multiple times to cycle through all of the different Gammas available. You can map it to the Harmony no problem, I did.

A simple delay won’t work because it will reset to gamma D sometimes when it loads the menu or when you actually play the movie from the menu. Your best to wait until you actually start playing the movie and press the gamma button a couple times.

It looks a lot of RSx20 & RSx40 owners are messing around with making their own gamma curves.

I didn’t really like the way HDR looked on my RS400, even with custom curves...and if the owners of the new models don’t *love* the new built in curve and mess around with custom curves anyway, I didn’t see a point in upgrading. Instead I spent the money on a Panasonic UB900 & HD Fury Vertex (an Oppo 203 will do this by itself) which gave me SDR2020. I love it and am not interested in upgrading at all. I talked about this a bit at the bottom of my JVC 4K QuickStart Guide.

I recently talked to a RS440 owner who was also unhappy with his HDR image. I walked him through all of the steps on my guide and he still ended up going with SDR2020 and now loves his image also.

Many many many people disagree with me on this topic and that’s fine. Any JVC owner is able to walk through the steps in my guide and decide for themselves.

As far as what projector you should get: A Time Machine...A couple weeks ago AVS was selling RS400 projectors on closeout for less than half price. They might still have a RS500 closeout available and I’d get that. I do wish the native black level was better on the RS400, it isn’t as good as my old RS46 but it is WAY brighter and looks MUCH better, even for HD & 3D. At the end of the day, I’m happy with my purchase.
By delay I was just trying to understand how quickly it switches to new gamma settings... worried about slow input switching and wouldn't want to deal with a long delay to load the new settings just to watch the movie.
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post #4957 of 5804 Old 01-24-2018, 07:58 PM
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Originally Posted by joepaiii View Post
By delay I was just trying to understand how quickly it switches to new gamma settings... worried about slow input switching and wouldn't want to deal with a long delay to load the new settings just to watch the movie.
Switching gamma is instantaneous as it does not involve resynch.
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post #4958 of 5804 Old 01-25-2018, 01:20 AM
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Agreed - this would be a nice update, but I think the chances of this happening are near zero.

The only want to get around this that I know of is to use the HDFury Linker or Vertex.
I'd say Less Than Zero.
They knew it was garbage, but had some hacker fiddle with the settings instead of releasing a proper update...just released a new line with a better implementation, and I don't believe even that was close to sufficient.. counting on JVC to do the right thing will only leave you with an empty wallet, a broken heart...and busted gear if you have a real bad temper.
Forget it, hands have been washed.

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post #4959 of 5804 Old 01-25-2018, 01:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
I suggest you first try Manni's (new) Dolby Vision Emulation curve. I posted my curves (not finely tuned) mostly to get around the "dark video" issue with the original DVE curve. The new DVE curve is quite a bit brighter.

Sorry Dominic, but what is Manni's (new) Dolby Vision Emulation curve? Where can I find it?
Thanks again
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post #4960 of 5804 Old 01-25-2018, 07:02 AM
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Sorry Dominic, but what is Manni's (new) Dolby Vision Emulation curve? Where can I find it?
Thanks again
Here's the link to the curve:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...l#post55492380

I have attached a copy here, together with my own curve that I created using HCFR.
Attached Files
File Type: zip Custom_Curves.zip (351 Bytes, 52 views)
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post #4961 of 5804 Old 01-25-2018, 07:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
Here's the link to the curve:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...l#post55492380

I have attached a copy here, together with my own curve that I created using HCFR.
Thanks very much. I will import both curves
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post #4962 of 5804 Old 01-25-2018, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
Here's the link to the curve:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...l#post55492380

I have attached a copy here, together with my own curve that I created using HCFR.
Thanks for putting yours in there Dominic, Im still running through the calibration thread, but its nice to be able to try different curves in the interim. For the darker movies im liking the gamma adj30 that Dreamliner links to. Manni's DV is slightly darker but on Guardians of the Galaxy 2 it was phenomenal, it took me 8 months but its great to get a good HDR picture and room to improve.

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post #4963 of 5804 Old 01-26-2018, 09:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Gorilla Killa View Post
Thanks for putting yours in there Dominic, Im still running through the calibration thread, but its nice to be able to try different curves in the interim. For the darker movies im liking the gamma adj30 that Dreamliner links to. Manni's DV is slightly darker but on Guardians of the Galaxy 2 it was phenomenal, it took me 8 months but its great to get a good HDR picture and room to improve.
To me the biggest deciding factor when using “universal curves” is the peak luminance you’re getting, as everything is scaled accordingly. I have posted a curve for relative low luminance situations (84 nits peak):
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...l#post55571786
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post #4964 of 5804 Old 01-27-2018, 01:16 PM
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Gamma D and Apple TV

I apologize if this has been answered before, but I didn't quite find any discussion on this - when I'm playing an HDR title on Netflix on my Apple TV 4k, if I switch Gamma D to a custom setting, after a few seconds it will switch it back to D automatically while the show/movie is playing. I tried a title on Amazon's app and this didn't happen and it stayed on the custom gamma. Is this an issue because Netflix is using Dolby Vision? A cable issue (never had this happen on Netflix playing on other devices such as the Nvidia Shield)?

I just wondered if anyone else had had this happen to them.
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post #4965 of 5804 Old 01-27-2018, 01:26 PM
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I apologize if this has been answered before, but I didn't quite find any discussion on this - when I'm playing an HDR title on Netflix on my Apple TV 4k, if I switch Gamma D to a custom setting, after a few seconds it will switch it back to D automatically while the show/movie is playing. I tried a title on Amazon's app and this didn't happen and it stayed on the custom gamma. Is this an issue because Netflix is using Dolby Vision? A cable issue (never had this happen on Netflix playing on other devices such as the Nvidia Shield)?

I just wondered if anyone else had had this happen to them.
You play the movie FIRST then switch the gamma to custom, correct? I’ve never heard anyone say the projector switches back to gamma D in the middle of a movie by itself without pressing any buttons. If you switch to custom BEFORE playing the movie, it can switch back when you press play. You have to start playing the movie FIRST.
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post #4966 of 5804 Old 01-27-2018, 01:56 PM
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I apologize if this has been answered before, but I didn't quite find any discussion on this - when I'm playing an HDR title on Netflix on my Apple TV 4k, if I switch Gamma D to a custom setting, after a few seconds it will switch it back to D automatically while the show/movie is playing. I tried a title on Amazon's app and this didn't happen and it stayed on the custom gamma. Is this an issue because Netflix is using Dolby Vision? A cable issue (never had this happen on Netflix playing on other devices such as the Nvidia Shield)?

I just wondered if anyone else had had this happen to them.
I reported this exact problem in the RS500 thread:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...l#post55408326

Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any solution or even explanation.
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post #4967 of 5804 Old 01-27-2018, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Dreamliner View Post
You play the movie FIRST then switch the gamma to custom, correct? I’ve never heard anyone say the projector switches back to gamma D in the middle of a movie by itself without pressing any buttons. If you switch to custom BEFORE playing the movie, it can switch back when you press play. You have to start playing the movie FIRST.
Yup, this is after it has been switched when the program begins. You can switch it back to your custom then it will switch it back to D.
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post #4968 of 5804 Old 01-27-2018, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
I reported this exact problem in the RS500 thread:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...l#post55408326

Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any solution or even explanation.
Thank you for the link. Glad I'm not alone.
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post #4969 of 5804 Old 01-27-2018, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
I reported this exact problem in the RS500 thread:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...l#post55408326

Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any solution or even explanation.
Seems like an Apple TV thing or ATV/JVC at least, right?
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post #4970 of 5804 Old 01-27-2018, 02:57 PM
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Seems like an Apple TV thing or ATV/JVC at least, right?
It's really strange. I found one title so far on Netflix which doesn't have this behavior - Godless. Next steps will be to try other DV content on the ATV from other sources. Then it's time to play spin-the-HDMI-cable wheel.
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post #4971 of 5804 Old 01-27-2018, 03:00 PM
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It's really strange. I found one title so far on Netflix which doesn't have this behavior - Godless. Next steps will be to try other DV content on the ATV from other sources. Then it's time to play spin-the-HDMI-cable wheel.
I doubt it’s the cable since Dominic has the same issue. If you do want a new cable, see my sig links. Do you have any other streamers you can try the same title with?
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post #4972 of 5804 Old 01-27-2018, 09:40 PM
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I doubt it’s the cable since Dominic has the same issue. If you do want a new cable, see my sig links. Do you have any other streamers you can try the same title with?
I've never had this issue playing the same HDR titles on Netflix on the Nvidia Shield or my Samsung UHD player.

I tried an iTunes movie, Across the Universe, which was DV and it played fine. I also had The LEGO Movie which was listed as DV and it played in SDR. I have a couple other DV titles which I'll try. Still thinking this is some strangeness related to how ATV handles DV. But it could be a combination of the ATV being wonky and the cable not quite handling it. I can try one of those Monoprice ones you recommended. I can always return it if it doesn't make a difference.
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post #4973 of 5804 Old 01-29-2018, 04:15 PM
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I recently talked to a RS440 owner who was also unhappy with his HDR image. I walked him through all of the steps on my guide and he still ended up going with SDR2020 and now loves his image also.
I'm trying to figure out if I should upgrade my HDMI cable. I'm using the Oppo 203 and love the SDR2020 image as well. But am I missing detail, as my JVC is only stating it is getting 4k - 8 bit. Will 4k - 10bit make a noticeable difference since it's not technically HDR?
Thanks.

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post #4974 of 5804 Old 01-29-2018, 04:24 PM
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I'm trying to figure out if I should upgrade my HDMI cable. I'm using the Oppo 203 and love the SDR2020 image as well. But am I missing detail, as my JVC is only stating it is getting 4k - 8 bit. Will 4k - 10bit make a noticeable difference since it's not technically HDR?

Thanks.
It sounds like you might have an incorrect setting in the Oppo somewhere. If you have signal issues once you figure out how to send 10 bit then the cable should be replaced but it is not the source of your 8 bit conundrum. Hopefully others will chime in soon to help you adjust the Oppo.
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post #4975 of 5804 Old 01-29-2018, 04:49 PM
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It sounds like you might have an incorrect setting in the Oppo somewhere. If you have signal issues once you figure out how to send 10 bit then the cable should be replaced but it is not the source of your 8 bit conundrum. Hopefully others will chime in soon to help you adjust the Oppo.
What happens is when I switch my Yamaha to Mode 1 (which allows for 10 bit 4k), the JVC goes black. Most people have said the cable isn't capable of the full 18 gbps, so I only get a signal when the Yamaha is set to Mode 2. Thanks.

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post #4976 of 5804 Old 01-29-2018, 04:54 PM
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What HDMI cable is it? How long?
See below regarding bit depth at different chroma from Oppo thread:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/showthread.php?p=55595536
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post #4977 of 5804 Old 01-29-2018, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted by SimpleTheater View Post
What happens is when I switch my Yamaha to Mode 1 (which allows for 10 bit 4k), the JVC goes black. Most people have said the cable isn't capable of the full 18 gbps, so I only get a signal when the Yamaha is set to Mode 2. Thanks.
Look at the links in my sig about cables. Don’t deviate and you’ll end up with cables that work.
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post #4978 of 5804 Old 01-31-2018, 10:23 AM
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Question about focus.. If I have different user profiles set does it keep its focus for each individual user setting or stay the same? I'm wondering when I zoom in and out if I have to keep adjusting the focus. I do it every time and I think it may be all in my head.

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post #4979 of 5804 Old 01-31-2018, 10:31 AM
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Question about focus.. If I have different user profiles set does it keep its focus for each individual user setting or stay the same? I'm wondering when I zoom in and out if I have to keep adjusting the focus. I do it every time and I think it may be all in my head.
The Focus (along with Zoom and Shift) is saved as part of Lens Memory, not part of a user profile.
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post #4980 of 5804 Old 01-31-2018, 10:34 AM
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The Focus (along with Zoom and Shift) is saved as part of Lens Memory, not part of a user profile.
Sorry that's what I meant. Memory 1 and 2. Thanks

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DLA-RS400 , DLA-RS500U

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