Sony presented at IFA its new VPL-VW550ES pojector - Page 5 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #121 of 160 Old 10-05-2016, 02:39 PM
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that will be helpful since it only has 1/3 the native of the RS600 wide open.

no 18Gbps, no full P3. I hope you are getting a great deal on it, likely some nice updates this time next year.

You are making a good point, updates next year could include some of the missing elements for the 675. At 40% the price
of the Z1 though it's not out of line for a true 4K machine that makes a calmer , natural picture . No doubt less native
contrast but it does have 30% more ANSI which is very significant when brightness matched. 10.2Gbps will get me all that
is available now and for many years to come, I don't game so that dies not really matter. Full P3 would be nice, 89% is not too
bad though. I never had a problem with contrast on the 665 I demoed or with my old VW600ES. I do have a problem with the
digital like noise the RS600 produces though and I'm having to work too hard to keep it at an acceptable level. But hey, if ultimate
contrast is the goal, the RS600 is there, in Spades , it makes 3D work a little better for sure.


Last night I spent hours trying to reduce that digital noise and did a pretty good job to be honest. Always at the expense of other
variables but it looks much better now. For the price the projector is wonderful, it is not true 4K though .



From John Archers review of the Z1 at IFA


Settling down to watch the Z1 strut its stuff in a blacked out demo room on JVC’s IFA booth, its pictures immediately struck me as far more detailed and far less noisy than those of any of JVC’s previous ‘pseudo 4K’ projector efforts (which use two slightly offset HD chipsets to create a 4K effect).
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post #122 of 160 Old 10-05-2016, 02:52 PM
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remember the Sony's are applying a non defeat-able filter which likely explains why Javs Sony vs. RS500 shootout showed no obvious advantage to the native 4K panel even with an A+ UHD source like Lucy. It sounds like you like this filter. You would likely hate the .95 DC4 Planar which is brutally honest to the source and looks no different with the content you are stating is noisy vs. the JVC. (BvS, etc). That projector has little if any processing, just raw reproduction of the source for good or for bad.

in the US, this projector is 3 times more expensive than the street price of the RS500 so it's tough to consider for no full P3, 18 Gbps chipset and 1/3 the native. Hopefully next year they will increase lumen output, full P3, updated chipset and better native (25K:1 would be a nice baseline). They may also have to adjust the pricing if JVC released the native 4K panels to the RS series.
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post #123 of 160 Old 10-05-2016, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by roxiedog13 View Post
At this level, any of these projectors are going to look good, if set up right that is .

Laser is another level of pricing that is going to cost big time. The only affordable one that I know of is the Epson and the specs on that
one just won't suffice for me, particularly the lack of brightness. Even the RS600 I have now is on that ragged edge of "just" enough for 3D , anything less would not work . Next level above this is the JVC4500
which would be a perfect fit for me in every way but the price is not . My budget maximum right now would be the VW675ES, if it had 2500 lumens and the 18gbps boards I would be happy enough with a lamp
and happy enough to pay extra for those features. OK, full P3, can't forget that one . There's a BIG gap between the JVC RS600, Sony VW675ES and the new JVC Z1 4500, the VW1100 is gone. My guess is
we will be seeing something to fill that gap in the next year and I want to know what that will be now!

The 675ES is more of a lateral move at this point but one that I will likely embrace . The number one feature of the Sony is the calmer, more natural picture that does not appear to be digitally excited all the time.
I watched 4K version of Independence day last night, spent most of my time trying to eliminate the background noise. In the end I had a very, very good handle on this, much better than before. If I can tweak this a
little more it might be good enough for me to leave well enough alone .

Thanks for the feedback with 3D on your 320 , I expect the 675 will be as good especially with the increased contrast . 3D on the JVC is good and the contrast increase over my previous is what makes this so much better. Ghosting is still there
but very subtle and minimal. Didn't notice the ghosting first because I was so focused on the other aspects, but once I settled down I notice the levels are about the same as my previous, which was pretty darn good.

The JVC RS600 is an awesome projector, even if I hold on I will be more than happy until I see what will fill the BIG price gap.

Oh, btw almost forgot, the 675/550 also has DI in HDR , also a nice little feature bonus.
Pretty much agree. The reason why I picked up the 320 and not the 520 recently was simply due to the uncertainty of the market it was obvious a successor would come out soon and here it is the 675, the big advantage of it will be the use of DI when viewing HDR and the new slider (I know the current models will also receive an update). I am sure J users will agree they would trade some color to get their superior blacks back.

Yes that Epson is the only one in that price range and it isn't bright enough but I do LOVE the rock solid image it shoots, so if I can stretch the budget (really hope I can) it will be the JVC Z1 otherwise will need to see the 675 and Epson in action.

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post #124 of 160 Old 10-05-2016, 05:01 PM
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remember the Sony's are applying a non defeat-able filter which likely explains why Javs Sony vs. RS500 shootout showed no obvious advantage to the native 4K panel even with an A+ UHD source like Lucy. It sounds like you like this filter. You would likely hate the .95 DC4 Planar which is brutally honest to the source and looks no different with the content you are stating is noisy vs. the JVC. (BvS, etc). That projector has little if any processing, just raw reproduction of the source for good or for bad.

in the US, this projector is 3 times more expensive than the street price of the RS500 so it's tough to consider for no full P3, 18 Gbps chipset and 1/3 the native. Hopefully next year they will increase lumen output, full P3, updated chipset and better native (25K:1 would be a nice baseline). They may also have to adjust the pricing if JVC released the native 4K panels to the RS series.

If any form of pixel shift was just as good it would be in the Z1, end of story. Even the Z1 has lost quite a bit on contrast compared to the RS600 as I read in the reviews obviously a lot more to the picture on the screen than black. With the VW5000ES at 15,000:1 contrast and the JVC Z1( unpublished) lower than current models I suspect there is a lot more going on first and foremost is a calm, natural picture . If the eshift or other digital process could do it as good as a true 4K chip then I suppose they would have used it and saved all of us a bunch of money. eshift4 is great but as many have already concluded it has limitations, and never will be 4K.
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post #125 of 160 Old 10-05-2016, 05:41 PM
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If any form of pixel shift was just as good it would be in the Z1, end of story. Even the Z1 has lost quite a bit on contrast compared to the RS600 as I read in the reviews obviously a lot more to the picture on the screen than black. With the VW5000ES at 15,000:1 contrast and the JVC Z1( unpublished) lower than current models I suspect there is a lot more going on first and foremost is a calm, natural picture . If the eshift or other digital process could do it as good as a true 4K chip then I suppose they would have used it and saved all of us a bunch of money. eshift4 is great but as many have already concluded it has limitations, and never will be 4K.
no one has seen a production release Z1/RS4500 yet, I wouldn't be judging the info provided from a pre-production unit at a tradeshow. We do know the 5000ES is ~10K:1 native. There is a pretty good chance with the dual iris in the JVC that it's going to be something better than 10K:1.

The 675 is not much of an upgrade for 665 owners since they are getting the firmware update with most of the features. It would have been a nice update if they bumped the lumens a bit, full P3 filter and 18Gbps chipset. The Sony's are the one projector with the low lag time for gamers and could have pushed a dual GTX1080 system with max PQ. I bet next year they will have the full bandwidth chipset in the 685. And maybe FI in UHD as a major feature.
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post #126 of 160 Old 10-05-2016, 08:13 PM
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no one has seen a production release Z1/RS4500 yet, I wouldn't be judging the info provided from a pre-production unit at a tradeshow. We do know the 5000ES is ~10K:1 native. There is a pretty good chance with the dual iris in the JVC that it's going to be something better than 10K:1.

The 675 is not much of an upgrade for 665 owners since they are getting the firmware update with most of the features. It would have been a nice update if they bumped the lumens a bit, full P3 filter and 18Gbps chipset. The Sony's are the one projector with the low lag time for gamers and could have pushed a dual GTX1080 system with max PQ. I bet next year they will have the full bandwidth chipset in the 685. And maybe FI in UHD as a major feature.

Agree 100% . If I owned a 665 now, shifting to the 675 would be almost pointless. To be honest, after just watching Life of Pi 4K UHD I'd have to ask myself
why would I even consider the 675 myself . I flipped back and forth between HDR and SDRBT2020, which I feel I have a great handle on, and all I can say is wow. I've said this all along, for digital material, the RS600 is the king . Life if Pi was shot with the Arri Alexa digital cameras and as much as I enjoyed the 3D version, the 4K SDR BT2020 trumps all . It's all that film grain that sends the RS600 into fits, I'm learning to tame it though, just taking time and patience .

If it is a VW685 next year , with the additional features you suggest the price will go up. Now, if they can bump it to 2200 lumens+ P3, 18Gbps and FI on HDR game on. JVC would only need to add the 4K chip and a better lamp. Would be worth more to me indeed, may have to wait one more year. May have enough in the piggy bank for the Z1 or equivalent by then.


I'm not a gamer at all, well, not in the sense you are talking about. I do have a dedicated computer that I use for flight simulation but that has a custom aircraft
panel , yoke, rudder pedals and radio stack that is fixed. Anyway point is, gaming on the Projector is not a feature that I need. The 18Gbps would be necessary to game at 60f correct? I put the latest cards in my computer last year was still 900 series, now you are saying GTX1080 is the latest. Man I can never catch up.

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post #127 of 160 Old 10-05-2016, 10:22 PM
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I'm not a gamer at all, well, not in the sense you are talking about. I do have a dedicated computer that I use for flight simulation but that has a custom aircraft
panel , yoke, rudder pedals and radio stack that is fixed. Anyway point is, gaming on the Projector is not a feature that I need. The 18Gbps would be necessary to game at 60f correct? I put the latest cards in my computer last year was still 900 series, now you are saying GTX1080 is the latest. Man I can never catch up.
I used to run the same flight sim setup. Have you tried that on the JVC?

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post #128 of 160 Old 10-06-2016, 04:01 AM
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I used to run the same flight sim setup. Have you tried that on the JVC?
Would love to but the flight control components are just too bulky, they are fixed and not really moveable. At present I have a triple monitor display for visuals but giving thought to a rear projection with moving platform. I may change the back of my theater room into the flight simulator section , but not saying that too loud just yet at the little missus might get wind of it.

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Would love to but the flight control components are just too bulky, they are fixed and not really moveable. At present I have a triple monitor display for visuals but giving thought to a rear projection with moving platform. I may change the back of my theater room into the flight simulator section , but not saying that too loud just yet at the little missus might get wind of it.
..just saying, its awesome on the large screen
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post #130 of 160 Old 10-06-2016, 06:32 AM
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..just saying, its awesome on the large screen


Even better in VR.

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post #131 of 160 Old 10-06-2016, 11:50 AM
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Even better in VR.
You know, that's a freakin good idea except, how do you use the controls and radios with that VR headset on . My simulator is not a game for entertainment as much as it is a learning tool.

I have to use see all the instruments on the panel, knobs, buttons, flaps, the radios, GPS panel etc.

VR is great when you have a single controller in hand , I suppose .

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You know, that's a freakin good idea except, how do you use the controls and radios with that VR headset on . My simulator is not a game for entertainment as much as it is a learning tool.

I have to use see all the instruments on the panel, knobs, buttons, flaps, the radios, GPS panel etc.

VR is great when you have a single controller in hand , I suppose .
A full HOTAS setup is all you need.

But if you have light aircraft controls, you can actually see through the nose gap on the rift headset if you look down with your eyes. But I hear ya.
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You know, that's a freakin good idea except, how do you use the controls and radios with that VR headset on . My simulator is not a game for entertainment as much as it is a learning tool.

I have to use see all the instruments on the panel, knobs, buttons, flaps, the radios, GPS panel etc.

VR is great when you have a single controller in hand , I suppose .
Yeah I am not a big fan of VR for this reason and in my experience (about 15 years FS) it is best enjoyed on the largest screen you can afford. Best would be a 3 projector setup. One day

To simulate the VR effect I use head tracking.

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VR is great when you have a single controller in hand , I suppose .
Like the upcoming Ace Combat 7 for the PS4 and VR.

But since the game doesn't revolve around WWII planes but modern jetfighters, I probably can do without VR and focus on my radar screen, instead (but certainly would like to rent the VR set just to get an idea).

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post #135 of 160 Old 10-07-2016, 04:29 AM
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Yeah I am not a big fan of VR for this reason and in my experience (about 15 years FS) it is best enjoyed on the largest screen you can afford. Best would be a 3 projector setup. One day

To simulate the VR effect I use head tracking.
I started with flight simulation from day one, must be 30 years now. Not very active last number of years though.

At present I'm using triple monitors for display, a fourth for instruments. I only have a corner desk allotment of space, there is no way to go bigger with the displays. Now, if I utilize the back of my home theater room I will have a
12 wall to do the large curved display with triple projector. Could probably forego the motion aspect at that point, maybe use seat shakers and MORE subs to move the ground.

That would be my ultimate room, HT on one end , full flight simulation at the other. I'm currently pricing the VW675ES and the JVC Z1 . Maybe I should concentrate on a new flight simulation system instead.
I'm telling my wife it's all your fault.
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Did anyone preorder this PJ?


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post #137 of 160 Old 10-13-2016, 11:57 PM
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Did anyone preorder this PJ?


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I guess we all want to see demos/reviews to see if its worth the upgrade.
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post #138 of 160 Old 10-14-2016, 07:00 PM
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Did anyone preorder this PJ?


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I guess we all want to see demos/reviews to see if its worth the upgrade.
Bandyka, do you still plan to test the Epson LS10000?
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post #139 of 160 Old 10-14-2016, 11:48 PM
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Bandyka, do you still plan to test the Epson LS10000?
Yes picking it up on monday and also have the Fury ready to test WCG. 320ES sold.
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JVC RS620/X9500 in bat cave Anthem MRX-720 + 3xpower amps = 7.1.4, Martin Logan Motion 60XT fronts, ML FX rears, ML Motion 50XT centre, 4 x ML Motion 2 on ceiling Atmos, ML Balanced force 210 as the beast. Panasonic UB900, STAX-3170 earspeakers, HTPC, PS4, PS3, Amiga 500 etc..Epson LS10000 calibration and WCG SDR settings: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...l#post50298297
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post #140 of 160 Old 10-19-2016, 11:43 PM
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Yes picking it up on monday and also have the Fury ready to test WCG. 320ES sold.


That's a pretty strong move to go back to a 1080p projector. I think I'll wait a year and see what's new.


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post #141 of 160 Old 10-20-2016, 12:30 AM
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That's a pretty strong move to go back to a 1080p projector. I think I'll wait a year and see what's new.


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Its no 1080p in performance. When feeding native 4K signal its very close to native 4K. Head over to the LS10000 thread to see my thoughts. I am very happy I moved over.

JVC RS620/X9500 in bat cave Anthem MRX-720 + 3xpower amps = 7.1.4, Martin Logan Motion 60XT fronts, ML FX rears, ML Motion 50XT centre, 4 x ML Motion 2 on ceiling Atmos, ML Balanced force 210 as the beast. Panasonic UB900, STAX-3170 earspeakers, HTPC, PS4, PS3, Amiga 500 etc..Epson LS10000 calibration and WCG SDR settings: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...l#post50298297
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post #142 of 160 Old 10-20-2016, 06:58 AM
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Its no 1080p in performance. When feeding native 4K signal its very close to native 4K. Head over to the LS10000 thread to see my thoughts. I am very happy I moved over.
Bandyka,

Do you think that LS10000 (LS10500) would be bright enough to project in low ambient light to a 100" screen? PM, as this is off-topic here. Thx.
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post #143 of 160 Old 10-20-2016, 07:51 AM
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Bandyka,

Do you think that LS10000 (LS10500) would be bright enough to project in low ambient light to a 100" screen? PM, as this is off-topic here. Thx.
It is IMO. Send me a PM.

JVC RS620/X9500 in bat cave Anthem MRX-720 + 3xpower amps = 7.1.4, Martin Logan Motion 60XT fronts, ML FX rears, ML Motion 50XT centre, 4 x ML Motion 2 on ceiling Atmos, ML Balanced force 210 as the beast. Panasonic UB900, STAX-3170 earspeakers, HTPC, PS4, PS3, Amiga 500 etc..Epson LS10000 calibration and WCG SDR settings: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...l#post50298297
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post #144 of 160 Old 11-13-2016, 03:09 AM
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to Cine4Home and everybody who knows

Did I get it right?
SONY VPL-VW550 is able to take in 10bit 60p signal, but is anable to show it out.
As it is limited to 8bit 60p output. Right?
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post #145 of 160 Old 11-13-2016, 05:33 AM
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Did I get it right?
SONY VPL-VW550 is able to take in 10bit 60p signal, but is anable to show it out.
As it is limited to 8bit 60p output. Right?
it can do 10bit 60hz 4:2:0

JVC RS620/X9500 in bat cave Anthem MRX-720 + 3xpower amps = 7.1.4, Martin Logan Motion 60XT fronts, ML FX rears, ML Motion 50XT centre, 4 x ML Motion 2 on ceiling Atmos, ML Balanced force 210 as the beast. Panasonic UB900, STAX-3170 earspeakers, HTPC, PS4, PS3, Amiga 500 etc..Epson LS10000 calibration and WCG SDR settings: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...l#post50298297
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post #146 of 160 Old 11-14-2016, 08:10 AM
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I own one since a week and i can confirm (like Bandyka said) it can output 10bit 60hz 4:2:0 (or 12 bit if supported by the device)
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post #147 of 160 Old 11-14-2016, 09:43 AM
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I own one since a week and i can confirm (like Bandyka said) it can output 10bit 60hz 4:2:0 (or 12 bit if supported by the device)

Do you have any Xbox One S or PS4 Pro? I'd love to see the 4K compatibility test results.


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post #148 of 160 Old 11-14-2016, 03:39 PM
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me too or even a PC.

JVC RS620/X9500 in bat cave Anthem MRX-720 + 3xpower amps = 7.1.4, Martin Logan Motion 60XT fronts, ML FX rears, ML Motion 50XT centre, 4 x ML Motion 2 on ceiling Atmos, ML Balanced force 210 as the beast. Panasonic UB900, STAX-3170 earspeakers, HTPC, PS4, PS3, Amiga 500 etc..Epson LS10000 calibration and WCG SDR settings: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...l#post50298297
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post #149 of 160 Old 11-14-2016, 04:33 PM
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Hi,

iam only have an xbox.
(in the picture its german for "Your TV supports...")

https://cl.ly/323g082L1p10

On PC the maximum i can output is 4k/60p/4:2:0 @ 12bit. (tested on a Titan XP)
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post #150 of 160 Old 11-14-2016, 07:11 PM
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How is performance? Smooth? Lag? Judder? Getting the full benefit of HDR with games?

JVC RS620/X9500 in bat cave Anthem MRX-720 + 3xpower amps = 7.1.4, Martin Logan Motion 60XT fronts, ML FX rears, ML Motion 50XT centre, 4 x ML Motion 2 on ceiling Atmos, ML Balanced force 210 as the beast. Panasonic UB900, STAX-3170 earspeakers, HTPC, PS4, PS3, Amiga 500 etc..Epson LS10000 calibration and WCG SDR settings: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-dig...l#post50298297
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