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post #61 of 88 Old 06-24-2017, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
Agree the difference is not large. Affects green the most.
Epson has improved some it appears, but my complaint with the Epson is just the LCD pixel grid, it may not be very visible from seating distance, but it definitely affects the image overall to cause that digital look.

I suppose when Epson does a True 4k panel, then it won't matter anymore, theoretically at that point LCD should look the same as LCOS unless you sit amazingly close to the screen. However, then the problem might be true pixel resolution / sharpness, which is where JVC really shines above the Epson unless you get lucky on convergence. I think the Epsons have gotten sharper, but I think it's still more of a random drawing than it is with JVC convergence.

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post #62 of 88 Old 06-24-2017, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by coderguy View Post
Epson has improved some it appears, but my complaint with the Epson is just the LCD pixel grid, it may not be very visible from seating distance, but it definitely affects the image overall to cause that digital look.

I suppose when Epson does a True 4k panel, then it won't matter anymore, theoretically at that point LCD should look the same as LCOS unless you sit amazingly close to the screen. However, then the problem might be true pixel resolution / sharpness, which is where JVC really shines above the Epson unless you get lucky on convergence. I think the Epsons have gotten sharper, but I think it's still more of a random drawing than it is with JVC convergence.
Epson's laser projectors throw a nicer image than LCD, being LCOQ helps. Also seems to be a calmer looking image, less noise, due to the laser.
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post #63 of 88 Old 06-24-2017, 02:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
Epson's laser projectors throw a nicer image than LCD, being LCOQ helps. Also seems to be a calmer looking image, less noise, due to the laser.
Yes, I head they were good, but I'm waiting to see if laser comes down in price a bit across the board, becomes mass-adopted. My guess is that is probably too far off.

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post #64 of 88 Old 06-24-2017, 04:48 PM
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Originally Posted by coderguy View Post
Yes, I head they were good, but I'm waiting to see if laser comes down in price a bit across the board, becomes mass-adopted. My guess is that is probably too far off.
B-stock LS10000 and at some point LS10500's will probably be available.
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post #65 of 88 Old 06-25-2017, 01:18 AM
 
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Dolby Vision coming to front projectors?

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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
B-stock LS10000 and at some point LS10500's will probably be available.
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Originally Posted by coderguy View Post
Yes, I head they were good, but I'm waiting to see if laser comes down in price a bit across the board, becomes mass-adopted. My guess is that is probably too far off.

Yes, they are very nice, especially with some special "HDR in SDR mode" magic and custom gamma!

Give Mike a shout for those awesome B-Stock deals!
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post #66 of 88 Old 06-25-2017, 02:40 PM
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Dolby Vision coming to front projectors?

...or better still; keep Dolby Vision hidden in service menu, only accessible / possible to activate by ISF/THX pro calibrators after extensive tuning through live measurements! Streaming is now also pointing in the direction of DV only, Vudu for example; currently having Kong available @ UHD, Atmos & Vision @ 29 bucks... When Dolby is giving low cost budget LCDs access, it only makes sense that they should at least consider it for special quality assured channels too... Dolby; ya readin'??


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post #67 of 88 Old 06-25-2017, 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Lygren View Post
...or better still; keep Dolby Vision hidden in service menu, only accessible / possible to activate by ISF/THX pro calibrators after extensive tuning through live measurements! Streaming is now also pointing in the direction of DV only, Vudu for example; currently having Kong available @ UHD, Atmos & Vision @ 29 bucks...
You forgot to add that overcompression and lossy audio are included at no extra cost as well
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post #68 of 88 Old 06-25-2017, 02:48 PM
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Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post
You forgot to add that overcompression and lossy audio are included at no extra cost as well


Sure, never tried it, just found it funny that an online streaming service was selling direct access this early (exclusive for a period too I believe??), but only providing DV, not even regular HDR10 as far as I could read from people using non DV screens reporting...


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post #69 of 88 Old 06-25-2017, 02:50 PM
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...and I also agree that 'live' streaming of these kind of high bandwidth movies should only be allowed if lines are fast enough to both deliver and receive; if not require buffering / downloading first...


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post #70 of 88 Old 06-26-2017, 09:44 AM
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Apologies for the dumb question: I watch a lot of Vudu and Netflix and am planning to move from a 1080p projector to a JVC RS520. What happens when the 4k content on those services is "dolby vision?" Will I be able to watch the streaming 4k content at all on the JVC RS520 if Dolby Vision becomes the standard for streaming services?
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post #71 of 88 Old 06-26-2017, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by dgkula View Post
Apologies for the dumb question: I watch a lot of Vudu and Netflix and am planning to move from a 1080p projector to a JVC RS520. What happens when the 4k content on those services is "dolby vision?" Will I be able to watch the streaming 4k content at all on the JVC RS520 if Dolby Vision becomes the standard for streaming services?
You will automaticlly get HDR10.
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post #72 of 88 Old 06-26-2017, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
You will automaticlly get HDR10.
Actually for streaming services, I think you get SDR. The HDR10 fallback is a UHD Blu-ray rule.
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post #73 of 88 Old 06-26-2017, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post
Actually for streaming services, I think you get SDR. The HDR10 fallback is a UHD Blu-ray rule.
You are correct. Even though he was asking about streaming, I had BD in my mind.
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post #74 of 88 Old 06-26-2017, 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post
Actually for streaming services, I think you get SDR. The HDR10 fallback is a UHD Blu-ray rule.
Are you sure about that? I thought that Dolby came out and said that all DV metadata will be built on top of HDR10 stream, so that HDR10 TVs would default to HDR10 and Dolby Vision TVs would default to Dolby Vision.

I know that BD has that requirement but I thought that Dolby actually needed the HDR10 stream to be present and that streaming services should have it as well.
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post #75 of 88 Old 06-26-2017, 12:13 PM
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Are you sure about that?
I'm not sure, but I believe that DV doesn't actually require HDMI 2.0, supposedly it works with HDMI 1.4, which HDR10 doesn't.
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post #76 of 88 Old 06-26-2017, 12:30 PM
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Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post
I'm not sure, but I believe that DV doesn't actually require HDMI 2.0, supposedly it works with HDMI 1.4, which HDR10 doesn't.
I am getting confused too. I remember watching a Home Theater Geeks podcast where Scott Wilkinson interviewed some Dolby Vision expert and I thought from the way he talked that Dolby Vision was always built on top of the HDR10 data stream.

I also saw this article in Forbes and it talks about Amazon Dolby Vision streaming service and the article describes Dolby Vision as being built on top of HDR10. https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarc.../#650150957ef3

But I am not sure it is actually a requirement or not.
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post #77 of 88 Old 06-26-2017, 12:36 PM
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I know Vudu had DV before HDR10 was out, I didn't get through but the first few posts but here's some more info:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/184-vi...udu-hdr10.html
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post #78 of 88 Old 11-10-2017, 09:32 PM
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yes it runs on top of hdr10 stream.
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post #79 of 88 Old 05-18-2018, 04:10 AM
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Any updates to this thread

With a few projectors now supporting HDR10 what really happens when a streaming movie has Dolby Vision and the projector doesn't? Will it default back to HDR10 or SDR? Just hoping someone with a projector that supports HDR10 will be able to tell us the real world result. I am looking at the Epson 5040 and the Optoma UHD65 which both support HDR10.
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post #80 of 88 Old 05-18-2018, 10:13 AM
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Originally Posted by sizzler View Post
With a few projectors now supporting HDR10 what really happens when a streaming movie has Dolby Vision and the projector doesn't? Will it default back to HDR10 or SDR? Just hoping someone with a projector that supports HDR10 will be able to tell us the real world result. I am looking at the Epson 5040 and the Optoma UHD65 which both support HDR10.
All DolbyVision titles are built on top of the HDR10 stream. So all the new projectors that support HDR10 will work with DolbyVision. You won't be able to playback true DolbyVision as it is not supported in projectors but you will be able to play in HDR10 mode not SDR mode. At least that is the way that it has been working for every DolbyVision title I have encountered both Blu-ray and Streaming.

By the way, I predict DolbyVision will never come to projectors. The reason being is because by the time Dolby gets around to developing a reasonable standard for home projectors, they will be obsoleted by microled larger screen displays like Samsungs "The Wall" and Sony's CrystalLED. Being emissive displays they will blow away all projector specs, you will be able to get them in large sizes over 120" diagonals for reasonable prices, and they will have oled like blacks along with LED like brightness.
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post #81 of 88 Old 05-18-2018, 12:56 PM
 
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Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post
I'm not sure, but I believe that DV doesn't actually require HDMI 2.0, supposedly it works with HDMI 1.4, which HDR10 doesn't.
Didn't the original PS4 get a firmware update to support HDR10 even though it's HDMI chips are 1.4 only?

https://www.digitaltrends.com/home-t...4-and-ps4-pro/

Variable refresh rate support is also possible with HDMI 1.4, on the original Xbox One and PS4s too.
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post #82 of 88 Old 05-18-2018, 03:13 PM
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Yes, when I booted up Mass Effect it shows the HDR logo in the corner.
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post #83 of 88 Old 05-18-2018, 07:52 PM
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Originally Posted by GregCh View Post
All DolbyVision titles are built on top of the HDR10 stream. So all the new projectors that support HDR10 will work with DolbyVision. You won't be able to playback true DolbyVision as it is not supported in projectors but you will be able to play in HDR10 mode not SDR mode. At least that is the way that it has been working for every DolbyVision title I have encountered both Blu-ray and Streaming.

By the way, I predict DolbyVision will never come to projectors. The reason being is because by the time Dolby gets around to developing a reasonable standard for home projectors, they will be obsoleted by microled larger screen displays like Samsungs "The Wall" and Sony's CrystalLED. Being emissive displays they will blow away all projector specs, you will be able to get them in large sizes over 120" diagonals for reasonable prices, and they will have oled like blacks along with LED like brightness.
thanks for the response, just hope one day the new panels will be affordable for the masses
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post #84 of 88 Old 08-14-2019, 01:34 AM
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Dolby Vision coming to front projectors?

....

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post #85 of 88 Old 08-14-2019, 01:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregCh View Post
All DolbyVision titles are built on top of the HDR10 stream. So all the new projectors that support HDR10 will work with DolbyVision. You won't be able to playback true DolbyVision as it is not supported in projectors but you will be able to play in HDR10 mode not SDR mode. At least that is the way that it has been working for every DolbyVision title I have encountered both Blu-ray and Streaming.

By the way, I predict DolbyVision will never come to projectors. The reason being is because by the time Dolby gets around to developing a reasonable standard for home projectors, they will be obsoleted by microled larger screen displays like Samsungs "The Wall" and Sony's CrystalLED. Being emissive displays they will blow away all projector specs, you will be able to get them in large sizes over 120" diagonals for reasonable prices, and they will have oled like blacks along with LED like brightness.
Useless for people like who care more about the audio side of things. I run AT screen now and wouldn't have it any other way. I hope for super bright 8k laser projectors.

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post #86 of 88 Old 08-14-2019, 06:23 AM
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Can we access the DV metadata in a file, or only HDR10 info?

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post #87 of 88 Old 08-14-2019, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by blake View Post
Dolby Vision coming to front projectors?....
No Dolby Vision for projectors. However, you can get the next best thing with either the Lumagen Radiance Pro dynamic tone mapping or by building a HTPC with MadVR or perhaps the new madVR Envy ( hopefully at Cedia ).
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post #88 of 88 Old Yesterday, 05:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregCh View Post
All DolbyVision titles are built on top of the HDR10 stream. So all the new projectors that support HDR10 will work with DolbyVision. You won't be able to playback true DolbyVision as it is not supported in projectors but you will be able to play in HDR10 mode not SDR mode. At least that is the way that it has been working for every DolbyVision title I have encountered both Blu-ray and Streaming.
This is not the case. DV is only built on top of HDR10 base layer for UHD bluray discs because that was the only way they could get a single disc to have both DV and HDR10. For streaming it is an inherently inefficient mechanism and so there are native Dolby Vision profiles used for streaming services without an HDR10 base layer.

The behaviour for playback of such streams is usually that the DV stream is sent to the player, it decodes the DV stream for playback, and then transcodes it on-the-fly to HDR10. In some cases instead the player might request an HDR10 version it knows about (though notably Netflix doesn't do that on AppleTV4k, everything is streamed DV native to AppleTV4k)

If you want to see this in action you can enable the developer HUD on an AppleTV4k and play some HDR from the library. You'll see that the profile indicated (5), when looked up in the Dolby profiles list (https://www.dolby.com/us/en/technolo...les-levels.pdf) doesn't have any cross-compatibility listed.

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