Dell S718QL - 4K UHD Laser UST Announced - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 696 Old 12-04-2017, 07:28 PM
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Dell S718QL - 4K UHD Laser UST Announced

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Originally Posted by mercuryyy View Post
Now why would they do this "Dells HDR feature has been designed with a PC User in mind"



What type of bad marketing and decision making led them to write that and apply that to their firmware, Im starting to regret ordering this one. Looks so promising on payper.


This is what happens when marketers and engineers fail to coalesce

I wouldn’t be too concerned, if my hunch is right, it will be compatible with most things. HLG won’t be rolled out anytime soon if ever. When or if it does I’m pretty sure it could easily added via an in expensive converter.

Last edited by bix26; 12-04-2017 at 07:36 PM.
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post #32 of 696 Old 12-05-2017, 09:01 AM
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I ordered mine before the price jumped back to $5,999, says estimated arrival is 12/13. Going to try it out in a very sunny living room and a darkened basement theater room to see how it does. Anyone else order one and receive it already?
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post #33 of 696 Old 12-05-2017, 02:11 PM
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Same here but my Estimated arrival is 12/28 (((
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post #34 of 696 Old 12-05-2017, 05:05 PM
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if specs are correct wouldn't this be the only 4k projector that does 4k at 120hz?
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post #35 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 01:44 AM
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From Dell's tech specs: UHD TRP S610 DMD, think this is the same chip being used in all of the other XPR DMD's including; Optoma (UHD 60/65, UHZ65) Vivitek (2288/2299) BenQ (8050) etc. I would imagine colorspace would be the same or similar to those as well 80-85% P3. The UST on this is very appealing and it's laser! Those who caught it on sale, I'm thinking got the deal of the friggin year!! 😃

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post #36 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 05:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Troy LaMont View Post
From Dell's tech specs: UHD TRP S610 DMD, think this is the same chip being used in all of the other XPR DMD's including; Optoma (UHD 60/65, UHZ65) Vivitek (2288/2299) BenQ (8050) etc. I would imagine colorspace would be the same or similar to those as well 80-85% P3. The UST on this is very appealing and it's laser! Those who caught it on sale, I'm thinking got the deal of the friggin year!! 😃
"Single Chip DLP Dual LVDS. UHD TRP S610 DMD with XPR technology"

Dual LVDS

I have no idea what it means, but i think this gives this projector the edge with 120hz over all the other models you mentioned only do 60hz, i think even the sony is only 60hz.
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post #37 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 06:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mercuryyy View Post
"Single Chip DLP Dual LVDS. UHD TRP S610 DMD with XPR technology"

Dual LVDS

I have no idea what it means, but i think this gives this projector the edge with 120hz over all the other models you mentioned only do 60hz, i think even the sony is only 60hz.
LVDS is an embedded systems interface irrelevant to consumer electronics features.

All of the DLP XPRs have 120hz refresh rate. They need it in order to do the XPR shift.

This is the same chip all of the projectors have.
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post #38 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 07:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruined View Post
LVDS is an embedded systems interface irrelevant to consumer electronics features.

All of the DLP XPRs have 120hz refresh rate. They need it in order to do the XPR shift.

This is the same chip all of the projectors have.
Thanks for clearing that up. Do you know why they claim 120hz 4k HDR then?
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post #39 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 08:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mercuryyy View Post
Thanks for clearing that up. Do you know why they claim 120hz 4k HDR then?
Because technically it is 120hz after utilizing the XPR shift technology, even when at 4k60hz. With XPR each frame refreshes a minimum of 2x as fast as a non-XPR projector at any given refresh rate.


Also the whole "dell is designed for PC" thing is simply because Dell sells primarily PCs so it would makes sense to put that in marketing. Although I don't have high hopes that this projector is contrast-optimized at all, likely brightness optimized for PC use etc.

Last edited by Ruined; 12-06-2017 at 08:16 AM.
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post #40 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 09:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruined View Post
Because technically it is 120hz after utilizing the XPR shift technology, even when at 4k60hz. With XPR each frame refreshes a minimum of 2x as fast as a non-XPR projector at any given refresh rate.


Also the whole "dell is designed for PC" thing is simply because Dell sells primarily PCs so it would makes sense to put that in marketing. Although I don't have high hopes that this projector is contrast-optimized at all, likely brightness optimized for PC use etc.
But you can always calibrate it yourself for less brightness more contrast, its native 2000:1 in-itself is higher then the UHZ65 And the New Acer, so if motion as good as the UHZ65 i see no reason why this isnt a total winner for a living room application.
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post #41 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mercuryyy View Post
But you can always calibrate it yourself for less brightness more contrast, its native 2000:1 in-itself is higher then the UHZ65 And the New Acer, so if motion as good as the UHZ65 i see no reason why this isnt a total winner for a living room application.
I would wager a large sum of money the Dell is not actually 2000:1 native contrast even if it is claimed it is. Home theater focused companies (which Dell is not) have not been able to crack 2000:1 native with this DMD thus far under $10k. It is definitely possible to get higher with lightpath contrast optimizations, but Dell is not the company that would do this - in fact they would do the opposite for greater brightness for daytime presentation use.

Also the UHZ65 has 8x multiplier dynamic contrast, measured at 9300:1 (probably around 1200:1 native, therefore, which makes sense with its RGBY wheel). The effectiveness and quality of the dynamic laser modulation is of paramount importance to these projectors since the native is on the lower side. If Dell has a lesser or no dynamic contrast system it would be far below the UHZ65 in contrast performance.

I am not sure if this Dell is a UHZ65 clone or not, but what is important is whether it was optimized strictly for brightness or otherwise. Dell again isn't a home theater projection company so my assumption is that this is probably going to be optimized for daytime business/classroom use.

Last edited by Ruined; 12-06-2017 at 10:11 AM.
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post #42 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruined View Post
I would wager a large sum of money the Dell is not actually 2000:1 native contrast even if it is claimed it is. Home theater focused companies (which Dell is not) have not been able to crack 2000:1 native with this DMD thus far under $10k. It is definitely possible to get higher with lightpath contrast optimizations, but Dell is not the company that would do this - in fact they would do the opposite for greater brightness for daytime presentation use.

Also the UHZ65 has 8x multiplier dynamic contrast, measured at 9300:1 (probably around 1200:1 native, therefore, which makes sense with its RGBY wheel). The effectiveness and quality of the dynamic laser modulation is of paramount importance to these projectors since the native is on the lower side. If Dell has a lesser or no dynamic contrast system it would be far below the UHZ65 in contrast performance.

I am not sure if this Dell is a UHZ65 clone or not, but what is important is whether it was optimized strictly for brightness or otherwise. Dell again isn't a home theater projection company so my assumption is that this is probably going to be optimized for daytime business/classroom use.
I completely agree, but i think Dell also marketed this for PC Gamers, which do need high motion high contrast. One of the only available videos of the Dell 4k is their official release in gamerscom display -

is it possible they are trying to market a bad product to savvy PC gamers that usually buy 4k UHD 120HZ 24inch screens that have better picture then most premium 4k tv's, Maybe.
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post #43 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 10:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mercuryyy View Post
I completely agree, but i think Dell also marketed this for PC Gamers, which do need high motion high contrast. One of the only available videos of the Dell 4k is their official release in gamerscom display - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrsUsDr1_jU

is it possible they are trying to market a bad product to savvy PC gamers that usually buy 4k UHD 120HZ 24inch screens that have better picture then most premium 4k tv's, Maybe.
I don't think it is going to be a "bad product," but it may not be a home theater optimized one. It may be optimized for ambient light / living rooms / classrooms / boardrooms etc, where is probably where you'd find gaming / presentations happening in most cases. We won't know until its released of course, though the manual should shed some light on the available contrast options. Really don't see it hitting 2000:1 native no matter what, though.
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post #44 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruined View Post
I would wager a large sum of money the Dell is not actually 2000:1 native contrast even if it is claimed it is. Home theater focused companies (which Dell is not) have not been able to crack 2000:1 native with this DMD thus far under $10k. It is definitely possible to get higher with lightpath contrast optimizations, but Dell is not the company that would do this - in fact they would do the opposite for greater brightness for daytime presentation use.



Also the UHZ65 has 8x multiplier dynamic contrast, measured at 9300:1 (probably around 1200:1 native, therefore, which makes sense with its RGBY wheel). The effectiveness and quality of the dynamic laser modulation is of paramount importance to these projectors since the native is on the lower side. If Dell has a lesser or no dynamic contrast system it would be far below the UHZ65 in contrast performance.



I am not sure if this Dell is a UHZ65 clone or not, but what is important is whether it was optimized strictly for brightness or otherwise. Dell again isn't a home theater projection company so my assumption is that this is probably going to be optimized for daytime business/classroom use.


It’s from the Coretronic U50K platform it seem that the Coretronic is intended for home theater. It’s specs claim 4000 lumens vs Dells 5000 lumens. Pretty sure from these different specs your right. Hopefully Optoma releases a home theater iteration it claims here full DCI-P3

https://vsbg.coretronic.com/products...d966ac9/detail
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post #45 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 11:15 AM
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Long time follower, first time poster. I received the Dell S718QL a couple weeks ago. Just had the chance to set it up a couple of days ago. I haven't received my screen yet, so it's just shooting onto a wall at the moment. Ordered a short throw specific screen, should arrive at the end of the month.

Feel free to ask questions. Can't comment much on the quality of the image as my wall is tinted egg white and doesn't help determine the quality of the projection itself.
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post #46 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 11:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bix26 View Post
It’s from the Coretronic U50K platform it seem that the Coretronic is intended for home theater. It’s specs claim 4000 lumens vs Dells 5000 lumens. Pretty sure from these different specs your right. Hopefully Optoma releases a home theater iteration it claims here full DCI-P3

https://vsbg.coretronic.com/products...d966ac9/detail
Great find, basically same manufacture.

dell "S610 DMD Chip" vs U50K "S660 DMD Chip"

dell "unknown color gamut" vs UK50 "Wider color gamut up to DCI-P3 (130% REC709) coverage" Thats almost 100% DCI-P3

dell "unknown motion handling" vs UK50 "Install Motion Estimation & Motion Compensation (MEMC) to catch transient action without lagging"



@zee.dh

Thanks for taking the time to register and comment. Some questions ...

What does the manual say about the DLP chip is it 610 or 660, does the manual say anything about native and dynamic contrast and DCI-P3 color %
is there a dynamic contrast / dynamic blacks options in the menu


Can you share some images, and a videos of fast motion bits and maybe some menu settings

Much Much appreciated!
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post #47 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mercuryyy View Post
Great find, basically same manufacture.



dell "S610 DMD Chip" vs U50K "S660 DMD Chip"



dell "unknown color gamut" vs UK50 "Wider color gamut up to DCI-P3 (130% REC709) coverage" Thats almost 100% DCI-P3



dell "unknown motion handling" vs UK50 "Install Motion Estimation & Motion Compensation (MEMC) to catch transient action without lagging"






@zee.dh



Thanks for taking the time to register and comment. Some questions ...



What does the manual say about the DLP chip is it 610 or 660, does the manual say anything about native and dynamic contrast and DCI-P3 color %

is there a dynamic contrast / dynamic blacks options in the menu





Can you share some images, and a videos of fast motion bits and maybe some menu settings



Much Much appreciated!


Sorry, I don’t have the unit as it’s unfortunately not sold in the US. I was posting the info to support speculation that Dell’s version is most likely optimized for business use. Not that it won’t make for a good home entertainment projector, just something to consider before purchasing the Dell.
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post #48 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mercuryyy View Post
Great find, basically same manufacture.

dell "S610 DMD Chip" vs U50K "S660 DMD Chip"

dell "unknown color gamut" vs UK50 "Wider color gamut up to DCI-P3 (130% REC709) coverage" Thats almost 100% DCI-P3

dell "unknown motion handling" vs UK50 "Install Motion Estimation & Motion Compensation (MEMC) to catch transient action without lagging"



@zee.dh

Thanks for taking the time to register and comment. Some questions ...

What does the manual say about the DLP chip is it 610 or 660, does the manual say anything about native and dynamic contrast and DCI-P3 color %
is there a dynamic contrast / dynamic blacks options in the menu


Can you share some images, and a videos of fast motion bits and maybe some menu settings

Much Much appreciated!
Light Valve 0.66" UHD TRP S610 DMD, DarkChip3™
Brightness 5000 ANSI Lumens (Max.)
Contrast Ratio 1300:1 Typical (Full On/Full Off)

I'll try and have some images, and videos soon. I might set up an old screen I have to use while I wait for my Short Throw one.
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post #49 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 12:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zee.dh View Post
Light Valve 0.66" UHD TRP S610 DMD, DarkChip3™
Brightness 5000 ANSI Lumens (Max.)
Contrast Ratio 1300:1 Typical (Full On/Full Off)

I'll try and have some images, and videos soon. I might set up an old screen I have to use while I wait for my Short Throw one.
Thank you!

"Contrast Ratio 1300:1 Typical (Full On/Full Off)"

On their product page they clearly say "Native: 2,000:1 Typical (Full On/Full Off)"

dell.com/en-us/shop/accessories/apd/210-amtg


False advertising? Not cool
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post #50 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mercuryyy View Post
Great find, basically same manufacture.

dell "S610 DMD Chip" vs U50K "S660 DMD Chip"

What does the manual say about the DLP chip is it 610 or 660
It's the same chip. Only one 4k DMD exists in this size.

DLP660TE 0.66 4K UHD DMD is part of the Series 610. See page 3:
http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/dlp660te.pdf

RE: Contrast ratios - these are almost *always* falsely advertised for projectors in some way or another

Last edited by Ruined; 12-06-2017 at 12:39 PM.
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post #51 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 01:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruined View Post
It's the same chip. Only one 4k DMD exists in this size.

DLP660TE 0.66 4K UHD DMD is part of the Series 610. See page 3:
http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/dlp660te.pdf

RE: Contrast ratios - these are almost *always* falsely advertised for projectors in some way or another

Its one thing to falsely advertise but another to write 2000:1 on their official product page and 1300:1 on the product manual that plain fraud.
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post #52 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mercuryyy View Post
Its one thing to falsely advertise but another to write 2000:1 on their official product page and 1300:1 on the product manual that plain fraud.
Yeah, was a bit disappointed with this. Which is why I opted to get a short-throw oriented screen to help with maximize projection quality. Those of us who picked it up at $4500 USD got quite a steal in my opinion. Can't find anything else at that price point! I was actually debating between the Dell and the Hisense Laser Cast TV that just came out recently.

The Gamerscom video made the projector look quite good. Will be pairing the projector with a Xbox One X when I get it later this month. Will be sure to update with videos when I can!
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post #53 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 02:12 PM
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Shipping time

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Originally Posted by zee.dh View Post
Long time follower, first time poster. I received the Dell S718QL a couple weeks ago. Just had the chance to set it up a couple of days ago. I haven't received my screen yet, so it's just shooting onto a wall at the moment. Ordered a short throw specific screen, should arrive at the end of the month.

Feel free to ask questions. Can't comment much on the quality of the image as my wall is tinted egg white and doesn't help determine the quality of the projection itself.
How long did it take to receive your order from Dell? I also ordered in November while on sale. My order says confirmed but my delivery date is nearing and I haven't gotten any shipment updates nor will they have time to make the promised date. I've talked to a Dell customer rep and he was no help at all.
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post #54 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 02:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Bigtime-ag View Post
How long did it take to receive your order from Dell? I also ordered in November while on sale. My order says confirmed but my delivery date is nearing and I haven't gotten any shipment updates nor will they have time to make the promised date. I've talked to a Dell customer rep and he was no help at all.
Dell regular customer service is the worst. I was talking to a business rep who was a lot more helpful. Ordered on Nov 6th. Got an official email invoice on the 8th. Shipped on 13th. Received a week later.

It could just be an overall busy time with the holidays? Even now it shows a 14-day lead time to ship. Odd considering you just need to ship it out from a warehouse.
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post #55 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 03:08 PM
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So I'm pretty sure they held back on shipping, this might be due to a firmware update or maybe even a hardware issue, @zee.dh i would suggest you contact dell business support and ask them if there are any recalls or firmware updates available for your model. They only shipped very few units and then just suddenly stopped the shipping completely and delayed it by 1-2 months.

zee.dh, how many pages is the manual can you possibly publish a copy? For some reason they are not publishing the manual on the dell website or anywhere else.
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post #56 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 03:32 PM
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Alright this must just been added today because i did not see this

Full manual PDF - http://downloads.dell.com/manuals/al...uide_en-us.pdf
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post #57 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 03:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mercuryyy View Post
Alright this must just been added today because i did not see this



Full manual PDF - http://downloads.dell.com/manuals/al...uide_en-us.pdf


Looks like it’s been removed.
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post #58 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 03:49 PM
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Its still there, i tried again form a new browser.

Didnt find much in there, beside the disappointing " 1300:1 Typical (Full On/Full Off)"

where in their website they clearly write 2000:1 which was probably what made me pull the trigger. 1300:1 might have not.

The manual seems to clearly be focused of presentations and bluetooth crap, Has zero mention of color gamat or calibration options.

@zee.dh can you go through the settings in display option and let us know if they allow to change the gamma, customize it, change the RGB wheel colors and any other calibration options? (High Contrast Ratio options, dynamic black options)
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post #59 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 03:51 PM
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The box didn't come with a manual. It says to visit the online support link posted. It's always been there for me, and still is there @bix26

I was actually in contact with the product manager, so I'll check in with him to see if there is any issues. It's funny because in the PDF he sent me (attached) it also says "2000:1" contrast ratio.
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post #60 of 696 Old 12-06-2017, 03:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mercuryyy View Post
Its still there, i tried again form a new browser.

Didnt find much in there, beside the disappointing " 1300:1 Typical (Full On/Full Off)"

where in their website they clearly write 2000:1 which was probably what made me pull the trigger. 1300:1 might have not.

The manual seems to clearly be focused of presentations and bluetooth crap, Has zero mention of color gamat or calibration options.

@zee.dh can you go through the settings in display option and let us know if they allow to change the gamma, customize it, change the RGB wheel colors and any other calibration options? (High Contrast Ratio options, dynamic black options)
Sorry, forgot to attach in my last post. The PDF is attached here.

I'll go through the settings and let you know. I know you can change color and contrast. Didn't see gamma yesterday when I was playing with it.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Dell Advanced 4K Laser Projector S718QL Spec Sheet - 2017 Oct.pdf (649.7 KB, 108 views)
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