Optoma UHZ65 - 4K laser ($4,500 MSRP) - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 2104 Old 06-14-2017, 01:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Optoma UHZ65 - 4K laser ($4,500 MSRP)

Hadn't seen a thread on this, but I was all in on the UHD65 until I saw this.

https://www.thestreet.com/story/1417...-for-4999.html

Need more info on this, but I am wondering how much better that laser is going to perform than a lamp in the UHD65, and if an extra $2,500 is worth it..
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post #2 of 2104 Old 06-14-2017, 02:53 PM
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Looks like we're going to have some decently priced (eshift-like) laser projectors for 2018. Curious to see what the others announce for next year.
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post #3 of 2104 Old 06-14-2017, 02:55 PM - Thread Starter
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yeah, this really complicates my plans and has me thinking I should wait 9 months or so and to really see what I should be getting...
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post #4 of 2104 Old 06-14-2017, 03:28 PM
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Poop.. No horizontal lens shift. I'm sure it will also have the lens off centered so it won't work on above shelf installs... These DLP manufacturers really like to force ceiling mounts on us.

If it ends up being the best projector available in the price range I'm sure I'll cave and install a ceiling mount but I really like my existing glass shelf. It's perty.
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post #5 of 2104 Old 06-14-2017, 03:37 PM
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Smile

Imagine if the JVC Z1 was Bane and this new Optoma PJ was John Daggett.

The conversation would go something like this:







Seriously

It's good to see some competition breaking in(E-shift or native 4K) at the lower price ranges.

Will also be interested to see the performance capability of this PJ.
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post #6 of 2104 Old 06-14-2017, 04:30 PM
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Ok, this is exciting and exhausting! Was pulling the trigger on the UHD65 when I checked the price on JVCx770r and could get for $4800 and now this. Paralysis....is in play.

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post #7 of 2104 Old 06-14-2017, 04:36 PM
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Originally Posted by TheSony4KRises View Post
Imagine if the JVC Z1 was Bane and this new Optoma PJ was John Daggett.

The conversation would go something like this:







Seriously

It's good to see some competition breaking in(E-shift or native 4K) at the lower price ranges.

Will also be interested to see the performance capability of this PJ.
Ha ha -good one !

Don't hold your breath - it's an Optoma. Not a terribly good track record for performance.
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post #8 of 2104 Old 06-14-2017, 10:22 PM
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Looks like we're going to have some decently priced (eshift-like) laser projectors for 2018. Curious to see what the others announce for next year.
A good indicator that Laser/Phosphor light engines can indeed be in a reasonably priced mainstream product and not need be reserved for high end/high cost. This unit may be e-shift, but it's true 4k per displayed full frame.
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Originally Posted by Highjinx View Post
A good indicator that Laser/Phosphor light engines can indeed be in a reasonably priced mainstream product and not need be reserved for high end/high cost. This unit may be e-shift, but it's true 4k per displayed full frame.
Plus the higher light output might give it a better color gamut
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post #10 of 2104 Old 06-14-2017, 11:21 PM
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Originally Posted by longhornsk57 View Post
Plus the higher light output might give it a better color gamut
2800 Lumens....wonder how much that will drop by once calibrated......with more and more manufactures adopting laser, diode prices are sure to come down!
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post #11 of 2104 Old 06-14-2017, 11:33 PM
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......products such as these will force manufactures to think twice before attempting to charge huge 'Laser' premiums.
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post #12 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 01:39 AM
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If it is 1500~2000 lumens calibrated, it would make a great TV replacement.
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post #13 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 02:02 AM
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Originally Posted by longhornsk57 View Post
Hadn't seen a thread on this, but I was all in on the UHD65 until I saw this.

https://www.thestreet.com/story/1417...-for-4999.html

Need more info on this, but I am wondering how much better that laser is going to perform than a lamp in the UHD65, and if an extra $2,500 is worth it..
Based on the initial specs it looks like it will have (potentially) 20-25% more contrast and 25-30% more lumens than the UHD65. And of course all the benefits of solid state light source over lamp. Whether that's worth $2500 is really up to you.

This is going to make the BenQ X12000 a harder sell, I bet.
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post #14 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 02:04 AM
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Originally Posted by daWill View Post
Poop.. No horizontal lens shift. I'm sure it will also have the lens off centered so it won't work on above shelf installs... These DLP manufacturers really like to force ceiling mounts on us.

If it ends up being the best projector available in the price range I'm sure I'll cave and install a ceiling mount but I really like my existing glass shelf. It's perty.
Lens shift makes the lens - and thus the projector - a lot more expensive
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post #15 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 02:14 AM
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Based on the initial specs it looks like it will have (potentially) 20-25% more contrast and 25-30% more lumens than the UHD65. And of course all the benefits of solid state light source over lamp. Whether that's worth $2500 is really up to you.

This is going to make the BenQ X12000 a harder sell, I bet.
Or wait a year or two when the UHD65 is 1K and the UHZ65 is 2K.
I'm fine with 1080p until then.
I think the Sony 45ES line will have native 4K soon, so they must be under 2K.
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post #16 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 02:18 AM
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Or wait a year or two when the UHD65 is 1K and the UHZ65 is 2K.
I'm fine with 1080p until then.
I think the Sony 45ES line will have native 4K soon, so they must be under 2K.
You might get a UHD65-equivalent in 2yrs for MSRP $1500, the laser equivalent likely won't depreciate as much.

Again though with UHD BD being out for a while some people actually want to try it now. Neither of these projectors are particularly large investments to get started with 4k right now.
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post #17 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 06:42 AM - Thread Starter
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You might get a UHD65-equivalent in 2yrs for MSRP $1500, the laser equivalent likely won't depreciate as much.

Again though with UHD BD being out for a while some people actually want to try it now. Neither of these projectors are particularly large investments to get started with 4k right now.
Agreed.

People who have $2,500 to spend on a IHD65 probably have $5K to spend on this.

Waiting 2 years for a half price drop... I mean by then we'll have $5,000 projectors with 3,000 lumens calibrated full HDR rec2020 with DV support etc.

For $5K this thing looks like an amazing deal.
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post #18 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 07:08 AM
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This does look interesting. I am glad to see the competition. Having the JVC RS600 now. I have hope that when it needs(well maybe a want haha) replacing in 3-4 years. They will have something of what Longhorns said above With my screen being 180" wide. I would love to see a calibrated 3500+ lumen laser with HDR, Rec2020, DV and awesome black levels near the 5-6K mark
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post #19 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 08:25 AM
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Originally Posted by longhornsk57 View Post
Waiting 2 years for a half price drop... I mean by then we'll have $5,000 projectors with 3,000 lumens calibrated full HDR rec2020 with DV support etc.

For $5K this thing looks like an amazing deal.

Personally, I'm waiting until there's a projector with HDMI 2.1, also I want real HDR. 2800-3000 lumens is only equal to about 475 nits peak brightness. 5000 lumens is the least a projector should have to do any type of realistic HDR, ideally 6000 lumens (about = to 1000 nits) or more. The dual projector setup from Sim2 called HDR duo hits 9000 lumens, it fully recreates up to 14 stops of dynamic range. 35mm film negatives have about 12 stops of dynamic range, a projector like this Optoma is only SDR, even if it is "HDR compatible" because it can only render about 7 stops of dynamic range, which is equal to Blu-ray, not UHD Blu-ray or HDR. Any 3000 lumen projector would have that same brightness limitation issue. Don't expect legit HDR10 or rec2020 at 3000 lumens. Hopefully we'll have some 12-bit panels and projectors by 2020, but no guarantees. We will have 8K tvs and 4K RGB inkjet OLED screens that reach up to 98-inch, but we can't be sure when 12-bit will truly launch in display technology, just like we can't be sure when TADF OLED emitters will be ready. Same deal goes for Dolby Vision or HDR10+ on projectors. No spec exists, nor does the technology exist for dynamic metadata decoding via projectors. Even if you could get a projector that hit rec 2020, HDR10 and Dolby Vision use rec2020 only as a container, the WCG color volume encoded in the HDR metadata is only aiming at the DCI P3 color space.

Waiting two-three years is the wisest choice for those happy with current setups, and without extra cash to burn. I'm about to get a short throw projector, I'm going 1080p, rather than be an early 4K adopter on some overly expensive 'ultra short throw' that does 4K but not 3D, and/or proper HDR. Regular short throw works for me, and why invest $5000 on a 4K projector that cannot accurately render any HDR content, even if it can decode it? Seems like a turkey to me. Early adopters get burned. I'm aware I'm combining talk about short throws and long throws as if they were the same, I realize they aren't, but the same thing goes for long throws and short throws, for the most part. Don't invest 5 thousand on a half-baked projector when two years from now you can get real 6000 lumens HDR for the same price. You're better off getting a 4K tv, if what you really want is a legit HDR display. So far, everything out from Optoma has major compromises. When I go Laser 4K HDR long throw, not sure I'd go with 4K DLP, likely I'll go with Sony or JVC. I need something with 3D, lens memory, and also designed to be used with an anamorphic lens.
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post #20 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 01:31 PM
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Why does everyone keep saying these are like e-shift? They are nothing like them and far superior when it comes to sharpness.

https://translate.google.co.uk/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fcine4home.de%2Ftest-premiere-acer-v9800-4k-hdr-projektor-mit-neuer-dlp-uhd-technik-ein-comeback-von-dlp%2F&edit-text=&act=url[/url]

"There is no question that the 4K DLP chip is capable of producing a 4K video image that is the visual equivalent in image detail of a native 4K chipset."

Just look at the pictures for a comparison of e-shift 4K (Epson TW9300) and DLP 4K (Acer V9800).
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post #21 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 01:41 PM
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Why does everyone keep saying these are like e-shift? They are nothing like them and far superior when it comes to sharpness.

https://translate.google.co.uk/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fcine4home.de%2Ftest-premiere-acer-v9800-4k-hdr-projektor-mit-neuer-dlp-uhd-technik-ein-comeback-von-dlp%2F&edit-text=&act=url[/url]

"There is no question that the 4K DLP chip is capable of producing a 4K video image that is the visual equivalent in image detail of a native 4K chipset."

Just look at the pictures for a comparison of e-shift 4K (Epson TW9300) and DLP 4K (Acer V9800).
I think most people that have seen the new 4k DLP sets say that they produce a sharp 4k image but it's still e-shift.
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post #22 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 01:42 PM
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Why does everyone keep saying these are like e-shift? They are nothing like them and far superior when it comes to sharpness.

https://translate.google.co.uk/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fcine4home.de%2Ftest-premiere-acer-v9800-4k-hdr-projektor-mit-neuer-dlp-uhd-technik-ein-comeback-von-dlp%2F&edit-text=&act=url[/url]

"There is no question that the 4K DLP chip is capable of producing a 4K video image tat is the visual equivalent in image detail of a native 4K chipset."

Just look at the pictures for a comparison of e-shift 4K (Epson TW9300) and DLP 4K (Acer V9800).
It is similar concept to eShift but massively superior for a few reasons:
1. Native resolution is much higher, which results in 8.3M active pixels projected instead of 4.15M like eShift. The eShift pixels are too large and not dense enough to represent 4k.
2. No panel alignment errors that 3lcd/lcos has to spoil the effect
3. Superior motion resolution with DLP makes the higher resolution more believable

As a result, the XPR output actually looks similar to native 4k while eShift looks more like upscaled 1080p IMO. And this is why CTA labels XPR output as true 4k uhd but not eshift output.
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post #23 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 01:58 PM
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I love this hobby!! People are real passionate about what they think is best. Maybe that is why we have 8000 speaker brands.

Unless you are buying that TV on today's front page for 500K there will always be better, and tomorrow there will be "more better".

What is fact, is the performance one person gets is not the same for the next person. My little Epson I guarantee you looks better( and worse) than others with the same projector. Unless you have the same Stewart Screen, Oppo player, HDMI cable, throw distance and environment...not the same.

I am thinking about waiting until we get 16K 35,000 Lumins with HDMI 10.3 for $4000 or maybe for my personal tastes see what I want to pay and what is important to me in a product and just go for it. Too each their own and it doesn't make them wrong with the choice that was right for them.
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I love this hobby!! People are real passionate about what they think is best. Maybe that is why we have 8000 speaker brands.

Unless you are buying that TV on today's front page for 500K there will always be better, and tomorrow there will be "more better".

What is fact, is the performance one person gets is not the same for the next person. My little Epson I guarantee you looks better( and worse) than others with the same projector. Unless you have the same Stewart Screen, Oppo player, HDMI cable, throw distance and environment...not the same.

I am thinking about waiting until we get 16K 35,000 Lumins with HDMI 10.3 for $4000 or maybe for my personal tastes see what I want to pay and what is important to me in a product and just go for it. Too each their own and it doesn't make them wrong with the choice that was right for them.
Plan to live a long life.
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post #25 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 03:03 PM
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Plan to live a long life.
We should all just wait until we have a device that jacks in the signal straight to the cerebral cortex!

(anyone get the movie reference?)
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post #26 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 03:21 PM
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We should all just wait until we have a device that jacks in the signal straight to the cerebral cortex!

(anyone get the movie reference?)
Right, not to hijack this thread but I have been thinking a lot about the next 5 years and why wouldn't we be going more toward no projector or screen at all and to a Halo lens type device and have you be totally in the middle of the action. Smaller screen, high resolution immersive video in a headset. Want 10 people to watch at $500 per device, still less than a good projector...... Or just the HoloDeck like Startrek......Maybe I will wait for that....

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post #27 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 03:27 PM
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Right, not to hijack this thread but I have been thinking a lot about the next 5 years and why wouldn't we be going more toward no projector or screen at all and to a Halo lens type device and have you be totally in the middle of the action. Smaller screen, high resolution immersive video in a headset. Want 10 people to watch at $500 per device, still less than a good projector...... Or just the HoloDeck like Startrek......Maybe I will wait for that....


We couldn't get anyone much to wear lightweight shutter glasses , what chance have HMDs got?
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post #28 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 03:33 PM
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Right, not to hijack this thread but I have been thinking a lot about the next 5 years and why wouldn't we be going more toward no projector or screen at all and to a Halo lens type device and have you be totally in the middle of the action. Smaller screen, high resolution immersive video in a headset. Want 10 people to watch at $500 per device, still less than a good projector...... Or just the HoloDeck like Startrek......Maybe I will wait for that....
Only if you like to watch movies by yourself. As $500 is unrealistic per device of that caliber

Plus, it would likely still be more uncomfortable than a screen.

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post #29 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 03:37 PM
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We couldn't get anyone much to wear lightweight shutter glasses , what chance have HMDs got?
Good point....but if the content was cool like you were sitting on the bridge of the enterprise in the action. For me 3D doesn't do it for me so I don't waist my time but with high quality video and you are right there....maybe? Will be fun. With lasers I can see Atmos like devises in the ceiling that will throw characters or objects in the room to give you another dimension.

Home Theater: JVC RS2000, Stewart 120" 2:35 StudioTech 130, Panamorph DCR Lens, B&W 802 Nautilus, HTM1, 4-B&W 805's for surround, 4-Martin Logan 22's ceiling speakers ATMOS, 2- PB-16 Ultra Subs, Marantz 8802A, MacIntosh 8207 AMP and Proceed AMP 5, Panasonic 820, Apple TV, XBox One, HTPC with MadVR, Qnap NAS
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post #30 of 2104 Old 06-15-2017, 05:24 PM
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Originally Posted by BondDonBond View Post
Right, not to hijack this thread but I have been thinking a lot about the next 5 years and why wouldn't we be going more toward no projector or screen at all and to a Halo lens type device and have you be totally in the middle of the action. Smaller screen, high resolution immersive video in a headset. Want 10 people to watch at $500 per device, still less than a good projector...... Or just the HoloDeck like Startrek......Maybe I will wait for that....
The best part of watching " Logan " last night in 4K was watching my guests jump off their seats during wild action scenes. You would totally lose that interaction with your friends with a headset on. Plus, it would make my next " Goldfinger " movie night with martini's ( shaken, not stirred ) hard to do. Nobody could find their martini glass.

Why are you waiting ? Get a projector ( I don't see one listed in your equipment signature ). Waiting just leads to paralysis by analysis.

Last edited by Craig Peer; 06-15-2017 at 05:27 PM.
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