BenQ LK970: 4K DLP, laser, $12,999k MSRP - Page 45 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1321 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 05:40 PM
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Originally Posted by tnaik4 View Post
DAVE when are u getting the 990? I wanna know if it is a good idea to step up to it from the 970
Not Dave but...

I will have the LK990 here in a couple of weeks , will be able to compare it directly to the LK970.. and the current PJ,s i have here .

BenQ Australia has been kind enough to offer the LK990 to myself and @Javs for an in depth look and evaluation....

As per usual @Javs will post his " Non Bisaed " and factual impression ...
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post #1322 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnnyWilkinson View Post
Thanks again. When you're dealing with different aspect ratios (ie inbetween 2.35/2.4 and 16:9), does that mean you project light onto the masking?
Not really. Masking is powered, so adjustable.
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post #1323 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 05:53 PM
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That is awesome guys. I look forward to your observations.


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Originally Posted by woofer View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by tnaik4 View Post
DAVE when are u getting the 990? I wanna know if it is a good idea to step up to it from the 970
Not Dave but...

I will have the LK990 here in a couple of weeks , will be able to compare it directly to the LK970.. [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif[/IMG] and the current PJ,s i have here .

BenQ Australia has been kind enough to offer the LK990 to myself and @Javs for an in depth look and evaluation....

As per usual @Javs will post his " Non Bisaed " and factual impression ... [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif[/IMG]
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post #1324 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 06:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Harper View Post
By amplitude I guess I just mean the height in relation to the y axis of the graph, above the rec709 green target point. Sorry, my old TV broadcasting career working with vector-scopes, waveform monitors, etc. comes out sometimes still.

I’ll try to find some graphs from prior sessions and do some new ones, maybe when the 990 arrives. Here’s some that I found on my phone that I am pretty sure are from the LK970.

Pre?)


Post?)


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The Rec709 scans look good. When u get the chance and find them pls do share the BT2020 ones as it does seem like the info at least on some BenQ material seems inaccurate.

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post #1325 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 06:04 PM
 
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Originally Posted by woofer View Post
....



.......As per usual @Javs will post his " Non Bisaed " and factual impression ...

I’m curious, now that you’ve gotten a decent look at the LK970, would you say what I’ve posted about it was “Non Biased” as well?

I’ve ALWAYS said the blacks weren’t the best and if you were a black level freak look elsewhere, but that it did have tons of sharpness, detail, depth, pop, three dimensionality, shadow detail, great colors, etc. So is that your experience as well?
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post #1326 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post
I'll have to compare scenes from the first 10 minutes of that film - most too dark to effectively photograph - before I declare the RS4500 beat by the BenQ. However, if you have a really big screen and a moderate budget, there isn't much else as bright as these at this price, and you can't have it all for this price point.
I just said the LK appears to be sharper from those photos.

Assuming the LK970's black levels are enough to at least meet the definition of ultra high contrast, I think then the question becomes whether the sharpness advantage that I'm seeing in the LK970 is noticeably more than the black level advantage of the RS4500? I would think not. What is nice about the LK970, in addition to the qualities Dave and others point out, is it's so relatively inexpensive for a solid state 8.3 Mill pixel machine with great glass.
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post #1327 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 06:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Harper View Post
I’m curious, now that you’ve gotten a decent look at the LK970, would you say what I’ve posted about it was “Non Biased” as well?

I’ve ALWAYS said the blacks weren’t the best and if you were a black level freak look elsewhere, but that it did have tons of sharpness, detail, depth, pop, three dimensionality, shadow detail, great colors, etc. So is that your experience as well?
Dave, to be clear, I never thought your descriptions of the LK970 ever lacked sincerity. But I was also glad to see others' perceptions had a consistently positive view of this projector's overall performance.
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post #1328 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 06:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Harper View Post

I’ve ALWAYS said the blacks weren’t the best and if you were a black level freak look elsewhere, but that it did have tons of sharpness, detail, depth, pop, three dimensionality, shadow detail, great colors, etc. So is that your experience as well?
Yes...absolutely....
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post #1329 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 06:39 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Aztar35 View Post
Dave, to be clear, I never thought your descriptions of the LK970 ever lacked sincerity. But I was also glad to see others' perceptions had a consistently positive view of this projector's overall performance.

Understood. It just really irks me that nobody took this or me serious for about a year until some “real” pros looked at it and gave their “blessings” just recently. I’ve been doing this crap for a LONG time, longer than almost all of those “unbiased pros”, and have been here on AVS for about 19 years and it feels like quite the slap in the face to be honest not to be taken seriously enough to warrant a look-see or the slightest of real discussions by them at all. Every single person that got one, EVERY ONE that I know had nothing but praise and said the same things I did essentially, but these so called “unbiased” folks didn’t even think to give it a second thought just because “it was a DLP so we know how it will look already”!

OK rant over. This isn’t intended to start a war, so don’t bother because I’m not responding, especially because everything I wrote is true.
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post #1330 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Harper View Post
I’m curious, now that you’ve gotten a decent look at the LK970, would you say what I’ve posted about it was “Non Biased” as well?

I’ve ALWAYS said the blacks weren’t the best and if you were a black level freak look elsewhere, but that it did have tons of sharpness, detail, depth, pop, three dimensionality, shadow detail, great colors, etc. So is that your experience as well?
I think you are paranoid about what others think about your own personal observations. Far as I can tell nobody has doubted you, at least not from over here, I certainly never did...

We know you love it, Woofer seems to dig it pretty hard, hes even thinking of getting rid of his Z1!

I will see what I think of it in the next couple weeks, it may or may not align with others, if it does, or does not... who cares! Thats why there are many brands out there and not some single brand monopoly!

For me, I hope the dimming works OK, and I hope it has some semblance of P3 coverage that I can work with, the rest of the plus' sound pretty awesome, crazy brightness and crazy sharpness... Looking forward to seeing it.

I plan on building a theatre incorporating a 170" diagonal screen in my next home, and I am going to need a cannon for that, it will be good if something along these lines are acceptable since I wont have to part with insane money to get fantastic bright image on the screen.

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post #1331 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 06:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Harper View Post
Understood. It just really irks me that nobody took this or me serious for about a year until some “real” pros looked at it and gave their “blessings” just recently. I’ve been doing this crap for a LONG time, longer than almost all of those “unbiased pros”, and have been here on AVS for about 19 years and it feels like quite the slap in the face to be honest not to be taken seriously enough to warrant a look-see or the slightest of real discussions by them at all. Every single person that got one, EVERY ONE that I know had nothing but praise and said the same things I did essentially, but these so called “unbiased” folks didn’t even think to give it a second thought just because “it was a DLP so we know how it will look already”!

OK rant over. This isn’t intended to start a war, so don’t bother because I’m not responding, especially because everything I wrote is true.
Woofer and Javs own JVCs. And I think many here feel that JVC black level is a good point of reference for comparisons. One of the most difficult things to do with a projector is project light with convincing blacks. I will add that just because they own JVCs doesn't mean they will not point out any issues they happen to find in any machine, even the ones they themselves own.

I, myself, am cognizant that you've had many projectors, including JVCs, but I'm not so sure many of our fellow forum members knew that history.
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post #1332 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 06:56 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Javs View Post
I think you are paranoid about what others think about your own personal observations. Far as I can tell nobody has doubted you, at least not from over here, I certainly never did...

We know you love it, Woofer seems to dig it pretty hard, hes even thinking of getting rid of his Z1!

I will see what I think of it in the next couple weeks, it may or may not align with others, if it does, or does not... who cares! Thats why there are many brands out there and not some single brand monopoly!

For me, I hope the dimming works OK, and I hope it has some semblance of P3 coverage that I can work with, the rest of the plus' sound pretty awesome, crazy brightness and crazy sharpness... Looking forward to seeing it.

I plan on building a theatre incorporating a 170" diagonal screen in my next home, and I am going to need a cannon for that, it will be good if something along these lines are acceptable since I wont have to part with insane money to get fantastic bright image on the screen.

Yeah maybe haha! I’m not disagreeing that others like it too now, but that’s the point. It took a year or more for anyone to listen.

I’m not sure the P3 gamut is awful wide, but it seems to make up for it with its color brightness (3D LUT type stuff). Hey I’ve been meaning to ask, can you send me a no frills easy to setup “setup” and recommended gear to try out MadVR? I have a Radiance Pro but wondering if I can improve on that and have more customization etc.

I look forward to your impressions Javs!
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post #1333 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 06:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Harper View Post
I’m curious, now that you’ve gotten a decent look at the LK970, would you say what I’ve posted about it was “Non Biased” as well?

I’ve ALWAYS said the blacks weren’t the best and if you were a black level freak look elsewhere, but that it did have tons of sharpness, detail, depth, pop, three dimensionality, shadow detail, great colors, etc. So is that your experience as well?
I think a lot of it has to do with your wording. Look at how you phrased it above. It makes it sound like if you favor another projector over the LK970, you must be a black level freak.
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post #1334 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 07:00 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Aztar35 View Post
Woofer and Javs own JVCs. And I think many here feel that JVC black level is a good point of reference for comparisons. One of the most difficult things to do with a projector is project light with convincing blacks. I will add that just because they own JVCs doesn't mean they will not point out any issues they happen to find in any machine, even the ones they themselves own.......
They weren’t the ones I was referring to, but I get ya.



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.......I, myself, am cognizant that you've had many projectors, including JVCs, but I'm not so sure many of our fellow forum members knew that history.

I don’t know how that can even be possible!
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post #1335 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 07:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Javs View Post
We know you love it, Woofer seems to dig it pretty hard, hes even thinking of getting rid of his Z1!
I already held a good impression of the LK970 going by Dave's, other's, and Woofer's photos...

...but if Woofer is thinking of selling his Z1 .....
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Originally Posted by Aztar35 View Post
I just said the LK appears to be sharper from those photos.

Assuming the LK970's black levels are enough to at least meet the definition of ultra high contrast, I think then the question becomes whether the sharpness advantage that I'm seeing in the LK970 is noticeably more than the black level advantage of the RS4500? I would think not. What is nice about the LK970, in addition to the qualities Dave and others point out, is it's so relatively inexpensive for a solid state 8.3 Mill pixel machine with great glass.
Do you think 1,000:1 native, 4,000:1 dynamic meets the definition of ultra high contrast? I don't think so, but I think everyone knows that going in. You have to decide if the positives outweigh that negative.
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post #1337 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Aztar35 View Post
I already held a good impression of the LK970 going by Dave's, other's, and Woofer's photos...

...but if Woofer is thinking of selling his Z1 .....
Well, unless one is totally frugal with money, one has to start thinking, is it worth really having all that money tied up in a unit, when you can get an equal amount of smiles for something 1/3rd the price... That makes sense to me. It always has to factor in, unless you are stinking rich.

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I think a lot of it has to do with your wording. Look at how you phrased it above. It makes it sound like if you favor another projector over the LK970, you must be a black level freak.

I only worded it that way to show that the only real thing I feel is better image wise are the black levels and native contrast. Plus I’m not the only one that was praising it. Everyone that was here was basically ignored as being “ignorant to the truth”.

If you read it that way, sorry Mike. Turns out it was true though.
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It should be all water under the bridge now. I understand where Dave is coming from on this one. I for sure appreciate his enthusiasm and have been enjoying my unit for almost 8 months. Most importantly now is that more members are getting to see the unit and like it. Let’s keep it going since we are all enthusiasts and care about getting a great image independent of any specific brand.



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Originally Posted by Aztar35 View Post
Dave, to be clear, I never thought your descriptions of the LK970 ever lacked sincerity. But I was also glad to see others' perceptions had a consistently positive view of this projector's overall performance.

Understood. It just really irks me that nobody took this or me serious for about a year until some “real” pros looked at it and gave their “blessings” just recently. I’ve been doing this crap for a LONG time, longer than almost all of those “unbiased pros”, and have been here on AVS for about 19 years and it feels like quite the slap in the face to be honest not to be taken seriously enough to warrant a look-see or the slightest of real discussions by them at all. Every single person that got one, EVERY ONE that I know had nothing but praise and said the same things I did essentially, but these so called “unbiased” folks didn’t even think to give it a second thought just because “it was a DLP so we know how it will look already”!

OK rant over. This isn’t intended to start a war, so don’t bother because I’m not responding, especially because everything I wrote is true.
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post #1340 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 07:09 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
Do you think 1,000:1 native, 4,000:1 dynamic meets the definition of ultra high contrast? I don't think so, but I think everyone knows that going in. You have to decide if the positives outweigh that negative.

Does it really matter when the image is so much better overall when compared to others in the same range and some way above it?

I think you need to see one setup well too Mike.

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I already held a good impression of the LK970 going by Dave's, other's, and Woofer's photos...



...but if Woofer is thinking of selling his Z1 .....

Yeah but those weren’t posted until months and months later than this model was reported to be something special.
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post #1341 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 07:12 PM
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Do you think 1,000:1 native, 4,000:1 dynamic meets the definition of ultra high contrast? I don't think so, but I think everyone knows that going in. You have to decide if the positives outweigh that negative.
That's a tough one for me, Mike. In all honesty, just going by the numbers for me, 4,000 might barely make the cut --for me. But I also haven't seen it in person where with mixed content its brightness might give the subjective appearance of U/H/C.
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Originally Posted by Javs View Post
Well, unless one is totally frugal with money, one has to start thinking, is it worth really having all that money tied up in a unit, when you can get an equal amount of smiles for something 1/3rd the price... That makes sense to me. It always has to factor in, unless you are stinking rich.

The LKs are that expensive down under?
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BenQ LK970: 4K DLP, laser, $12,999k MSRP

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Originally Posted by Aztar35 View Post
That's a tough one for me, Mike. In all honesty, just going by the numbers for me, 4,000 might barely make the cut --for me. But I also haven't seen it in person where with mixed content its brightness might give the subjective appearance of U/H/C.

I think the bolded part above is the absolute key to these LKs. The numbers do not tell the whole story and this is one of those models that just have to be seen properly setup to get the real true impression of its overall capabilities and total image quality. If all you do is read the specs and some other’s thoughts on it, you’ll be indecisive and unsure until you actually put one through its paces personally.
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post #1344 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Aztar35 View Post
That's a tough one for me, Mike. In all honesty, just going by the numbers for me, 4,000 might barely make the cut --for me. But I also haven't seen it in person where with mixed content its brightness might give the subjective appearance of U/H/C.
I am just saying, no one is going to call this an ultra high contrast projector. One may decide to overlook that fault due to what they like about this projector, but it is never going to be labeled ultra high contrast.
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post #1345 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 07:33 PM
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Yeah but those weren’t posted until months and months later than this model was reported to be something special.
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I think the bolded part above is the absolute key to these LKs.
Well...yes; and yes. It sounds like you're disappointed that only now am I catching the LK970 wave. But that's what I've been trying to tell you all along: I had to demo one first. Quite frankly, you are really wanting it both ways: a) take my word for it; b)you have to see it in person; they can be at odds.

Dave, all I was saying was that I had to at least to rule out RBE and then see if the black levels were good enough. But this thing was like a ghost...no one nearby had one for demo. And now many eyes beginning to report the same thing no RBE; no RBE, over and over and it's all consistent; that's the next best thing to seeing one in person.
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post #1346 of 2564 Old 03-20-2019, 07:35 PM
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I am just saying, no one is going to call this an ultra high contrast projector. One may decide to overlook that fault due to what they like about this projector, but it is never going to be labeled ultra high contrast.
I think you got me there.

EDIT: I just remembered that Art from Projector Reviews characterized the HT9050 as ultra high contrast. So who knows.

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The LKs are that expensive down under?
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BenQ LK970: 4K DLP, laser, $12,999k MSRP

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aztar35 View Post
Well...yes; and yes. It sounds like you're disappointed that only now am I catching the LK970 wave. But that's what I've been trying to tell you all along: I had to demo one first. Quite frankly, you are really wanting it both ways: a) take my word for it; b)you have to see it in person; they can be at odds.



Dave, all I was saying was that I had to at least to rule out RBE and then see if the black levels were good enough. But this thing was like a ghost...no one nearby had one for demo. And now many eyes beginning to report the same thing no RBE; no RBE, over and over and it's all consistent; that's the next best thing to seeing one in person.

Funny thing is, I wasn’t even talking about you at all. Actually you’re one of the first that seemed interested and asked follow on questions. You even PM’d and called me about it if I’m not mistaken Aziz, right?

I guess you’re right in that I was saying it both ways.....Doh!

Hey I wanted to know and always think of this when I think of you and your name. Were you the kid from The Fifth Element in the cave scene with the old archeologist always yelling........”Aziz, LIGHT!!!”?

We used those scenes as demos for our TAW HD800 CRT projector and TAW Rock+ Video Processor at CEDIA and CES and I’ve seen and heard it so many times then that I still hear and see it in my dreams!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
I am just saying, no one is going to call this an ultra high contrast projector. One may decide to overlook that fault due to what they like about this projector, but it is never going to be labeled ultra high contrast.

How about Ultra High ANSI Contrast?

You need to see one.
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post #1349 of 2564 Old 03-21-2019, 12:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Javs View Post
12k rrp
I was told $14999 RRP for the 990.
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post #1350 of 2564 Old 03-21-2019, 01:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squidjammer View Post
I was told $14999 RRP for the 990.
The 970 was 12something...

The 990 seems to be 13999 from these guys:

https://www.wavetrain.com.au/product...ser-projector/

I dont have my pricing yet on these units.

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