BenQ LK970: 4K DLP, laser, $12,999k MSRP - Page 84 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #2491 of 2519 Old 07-26-2019, 07:00 PM
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Originally Posted by mikxa View Post
Yes, of course, I will post details when paint 3.0 is released, they promised release around September.

When i working with an PC or watching movies in 1080p, I would prefer a pure native resolution of the DLP chip.
Therefore, I want to disable the XRP. But I do not understand if I give a signal 4K then the BENQ converts it to 2716x1528, but what will BENQ do if I give a signal 2716x1528.



On the HT9060, my understanding is that it can be accomplished by setting the projector to silent mode to disengage XPR shifting.
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post #2492 of 2519 Old 07-26-2019, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by mikxa View Post
Yes, of course, I will post details when paint 3.0 is released, they promised release around September.

Runko is my favorite, I bought it after reading your post about comparing 0.95 chips and I don’t regret it.
I compare the sharpness and clarity of the pixel of these two projectors, both have excellent optics.
I do not understand what else needs BENQ. I think all this is due to the XRP, except for this I read that the XRP badly affects the contrast.
When i working with an PC or watching movies in 1080p, I would prefer a pure native resolution of the DLP chip.
Therefore, I want to disable the XRP. But I do not understand if I give a signal 4K then the BENQ converts it to 2716x1528, but what will BENQ do if I give a signal 2716x1528.



I have the LS-5 and the BenQ HT9060 which has the same XPR chip and similar lens as your LK. IMO, with mine at least, the Runco chip size allows for better pixel rendering but the BenQ has the better optics by far. For example, I see a good bit of CA on the Runco and focus gets a little softer in the lower corner, but with the BenQ...zero or virtually Zero CA and perfect focus from corner to corner!
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post #2493 of 2519 Old 07-26-2019, 11:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aztar35 View Post
On the HT9060, my understanding is that it can be accomplished by setting the projector to silent mode to disengage XPR shifting.

LK970 does not have such a function, tell me what happens to the pixel when the XPR is disabled




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post #2494 of 2519 Old 07-27-2019, 07:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mystigiandoll View Post
@Citation444 or @tnaik4 or anyone else who has calibrated the LK970 what spectros or colorimeters were you guys using? My i1 Display Pro seems like it can't measure the laser light source correctly. For grayscale I have to basically turn my whole screen red before the I1 Display Pro starts reporting correct measurements to HCFR.
I use an i1 Display Pro profiled to an i1 Pro 2 spectro. I use LightSpace. I do not see the red issue that you see. My screen looks white when the instruments report the correct numbers for white.
I have no doubt a higher resolution spectrometer would report more accurate measurements, but I wonder if the improvement would be visible and justify the additional cost.
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post #2495 of 2519 Old 07-27-2019, 09:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Citation4444 View Post
I use an i1 Display Pro profiled to an i1 Pro 2 spectro. I use LightSpace. I do not see the red issue that you see. My screen looks white when the instruments report the correct numbers for white.
I have no doubt a higher resolution spectrometer would report more accurate measurements, but I wonder if the improvement would be visible and justify the additional cost.
There is a paper from Jeti which plots the theoretical xy differences for different wavelength spectros. Admittedly it focuses on full RGB lasers (which obviously have 3 very narrow peaks, whereas the laser phosphor only has a very narrow peak for blue).

Note it appears the expected difference due to spectro wavelength capabilities of 10nm (i1pro/2) vs something like a 5nm Jeti 1201 is less than the exepcted variance between two properly calibrated spectros (xy +/- 0.002). Of course, this difference is on top of the difference between two spectros, but perhaps it puts it into perspectivs.

https://www.jeti.com/cms/images/jeti...otes/an_27.pdf
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post #2496 of 2519 Old 07-27-2019, 09:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobof View Post
There is a paper from Jeti which plots the theoretical xy differences for different wavelength spectros. Admittedly it focuses on full RGB lasers (which obviously have 3 very narrow peaks, whereas the laser phosphor only has a very narrow peak for blue).

Note it appears the expected difference due to spectro wavelength capabilities of 10nm (i1pro/2) vs something like a 5nm Jeti 1201 is less than the exepcted variance between two properly calibrated spectros (xy +/- 0.002). Of course, this difference is on top of the difference between two spectros, but perhaps it puts it into perspectivs.

https://www.jeti.com/cms/images/jeti...otes/an_27.pdf
Thank you for the link to the paper. It helps me justify not spending the money for a higher resolution spectro.
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post #2497 of 2519 Old 07-27-2019, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post
Can you please post details on the LS-5 if you decide to treat the light tunnel. I took mine apart years ago and swapped in a DC4 .95 DMD.

Imagine we could use a DC4 .95 DMD in these BenQs and have the actuator shift to 4Mill pixels?
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post #2498 of 2519 Old 07-27-2019, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by mikxa View Post
LK970 does not have such a function, tell me what happens to the pixel when the XPR is disabled



I'll check when I get a chance.
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post #2499 of 2519 Old 07-27-2019, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Aztar35 View Post
Imagine we could use a DC4 .95 DMD in these BenQs and have the actuator shift to 4Mill pixels?
Except they are different size, so will not fit.
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post #2500 of 2519 Old 07-27-2019, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
Except they are different size, so will not fit.
It's too bad there's almost always something, isn't there.
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post #2501 of 2519 Old 07-27-2019, 02:33 PM
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...tried XPR off and for some content it looks a little cleaner. The down side is that in Silence mode, I can't activate dynamic dimming so I get pretty elevated black levels.
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post #2502 of 2519 Old 07-27-2019, 02:57 PM
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Thanks Citation444, can you let me know what revision your i1 display pro is? Mine is rev a so it was one of the first revisions. I’m gonna call x rite Monday and see if they have any info. My i1 can’t read the lk970 at all so I wonder if the early revisions aren’t capable of reading laser?
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post #2503 of 2519 Old 07-28-2019, 12:44 AM
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After upgrading, I did some tests and watched a few films.
The overall brightness has decreased slightly, the sharpness seems to me better.
But black is much better. I can't believe that simple paint did this. I assume that this is due to an uncoloured chamber. I regret that I did not measure before the upgrade.
I am going to buy a light meter and will try soon post result.



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post #2504 of 2519 Old 07-28-2019, 05:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mystigiandoll View Post
Thanks Citation444, can you let me know what revision your i1 display pro is? Mine is rev a so it was one of the first revisions. I’m gonna call x rite Monday and see if they have any info. My i1 can’t read the lk970 at all so I wonder if the early revisions aren’t capable of reading laser?
I have 3 i1 display pros and they all work similarly with the LK970. I have a Spectracal C6, an i1 display pro OEM circa 2013 (from Chromapure), and an i1 display pro OEM circa 2017 (from LightSpace). I usually use the newer one from LightSpace. None have shown any detectable difference from new.
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post #2505 of 2519 Old 07-29-2019, 10:36 PM
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I made some measurements.
Benq gives out ANSI on/off contrast 1000. With any gamma or brightness setting or lamp mode, always 1000.
Runko with iris 14000, without 3500
But despite this, I would prefer some films like Аvatar to look at Benq.
I mistakenly thought that the gamma 2.8 gives better black
I found that the gamma 2.2 or gamma BENQ makes a brilliant white and better sharpness.
My settings gamma Benq or 2.2, Contrast 60, Brightness 42 ( For SDR )

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Originally Posted by mikxa View Post
I made some measurements.
Benq gives out ANSI on/off contrast 1000. With any gamma or brightness setting or lamp mode, always 1000.
Runko with iris 14000, without 3500
I am always impressed by how far DLP tech has come in a decade...
EDIT: BTW, I guess you don't really mean ANSI...

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post #2507 of 2519 Old 07-30-2019, 10:36 PM
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I am always impressed by how far DLP tech has come in a decade...
EDIT: BTW, I guess you don't really mean ANSI...

I measured with a lux meter a point on a white screen 500 and a point on black 0.5
But i agree with others there is something else besides black.
For my living room at the moment there is nothing better. For the crypt, I prefer Runco or maybe JVC DLA-NX7



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post #2508 of 2519 Old 07-31-2019, 12:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Citation4444 View Post
I have 3 i1 display pros and they all work similarly with the LK970. I have a Spectracal C6, an i1 display pro OEM circa 2013 (from Chromapure), and an i1 display pro OEM circa 2017 (from LightSpace). I usually use the newer one from LightSpace. None have shown any detectable difference from new.
That's interesting; Tom Huffman did a group test of a load of these meters and found there was quite a spread between them. Are you using them after correction with a spectro and not noting any difference then, or pre-correction?
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post #2509 of 2519 Old 07-31-2019, 05:30 AM
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That's interesting; Tom Huffman did a group test of a load of these meters and found there was quite a spread between them. Are you using them after correction with a spectro and not noting any difference then, or pre-correction?
I said they work similarly, not identical. When used alone, they measure different, but not by a whole lot. I haven't documented the measurements, but subjectively the Chromapure Pro meter and the LightSpace meter give close results. The C6 clearly under-reports R, resulting in a slight red push if used alone. I never use any of these meters without first profiling it to the i1Pro 2.
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I measured with a lux meter a point on a white screen 500 and a point on black 0.5
But i agree with others there is something else besides black.
For my living room at the moment there is nothing better. For the crypt, I prefer Runco or maybe JVC DLA-NX7

Yes, so you don't mean ANSI. You are measuring on/off contrast.
ANSI constrast is measuring simultaneous contrast when displaying the 4x4 black / white checkerboard.
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Originally Posted by Citation4444 View Post
I said they work similarly, not identical. When used alone, they measure different, but not by a whole lot. I haven't documented the measurements, but subjectively the Chromapure Pro meter and the LightSpace meter give close results. The C6 clearly under-reports R, resulting in a slight red push if used alone. I never use any of these meters without first profiling it to the i1Pro 2.
Sorry, I read "None have shown any detectable difference from new." differently.
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post #2512 of 2519 Old 07-31-2019, 08:48 AM
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I said they work similarly, not identical. When used alone, they measure different, but not by a whole lot. I haven't documented the measurements, but subjectively the Chromapure Pro meter and the LightSpace meter give close results. The C6 clearly under-reports R, resulting in a slight red push if used alone. I never use any of these meters without first profiling it to the i1Pro 2.


I’ll be trying to calibrate and create a 3DLUT for madVR an LK 970 with an i1Pro2 and i1Display 3 Pro soon.

It seems you have done this. Are there any tips you have for me?

Can you tell me what mode you calibrated and what projector settings you used? Like any Cinemamaster color enhancer or things of that sort?

Thanks!

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post #2513 of 2519 Old 08-01-2019, 04:59 AM
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Sorry, I read "None have shown any detectable difference from new." differently.
I could have stated that better. What I meant is each meter has shown no detectable difference in its performance as it has aged from its new state.
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post #2514 of 2519 Old 08-01-2019, 05:48 AM
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I’ll be trying to calibrate and create a 3DLUT for madVR an LK 970 with an i1Pro2 and i1Display 3 Pro soon.

It seems you have done this. Are there any tips you have for me?

Can you tell me what mode you calibrated and what projector settings you used? Like any Cinemamaster color enhancer or things of that sort?

Thanks!
I am not a user of madVR. However, I have used it once (with massive guidance from tnaik4) to generate a 3DLUT in a form that could be imported into LightSpace and then uploaded to a Radiance Pro. I thought it did a decent job, better than LightSpace at that time. However, with the recently added features that LS has added to deal with reduced gamut, non-linear displays (like the LK970 and many others), I now much prefer the results with LightSpace. I would caution you that it is very easy to introduce posterization and other issues when attempting to calibrate the LK970 with 3DLUTs.
As for the projector settings I used: Cinema mode, B=49, C=50, and everything else at default settings.
I suggest messaging tnaik4 for help with madVR and the LK970.
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post #2515 of 2519 Old 08-01-2019, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by bobof View Post
Yes, so you don't mean ANSI. You are measuring on/off contrast.
ANSI constrast is measuring simultaneous contrast when displaying the 4x4 black / white checkerboard.

ANSI is hard to measure. My measurements of the meter is constantly jumping.
BENQ 600-850, RUNCO 400-700




Мой метр постоянно прыгает

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post #2516 of 2519 Old 08-03-2019, 06:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Citation4444 View Post
I am not a user of madVR. However, I have used it once (with massive guidance from tnaik4) to generate a 3DLUT in a form that could be imported into LightSpace and then uploaded to a Radiance Pro. I thought it did a decent job, better than LightSpace at that time. However, with the recently added features that LS has added to deal with reduced gamut, non-linear displays (like the LK970 and many others), I now much prefer the results with LightSpace. I would caution you that it is very easy to introduce posterization and other issues when attempting to calibrate the LK970 with 3DLUTs.
As for the projector settings I used: Cinema mode, B=49, C=50, and everything else at default settings.
I suggest messaging tnaik4 for help with madVR and the LK970.
is it that much better with latest lightspace update? i have a great 3dlut out of a 9000patch created in displaycal, is it worth it to do it all over again , i m not sure i wanna put all the time it takes to set it up again if its only a small improvement over displaycal generated 3dlut.

JVC DLA X590/RS440
BenQ LK970
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post #2517 of 2519 Old 08-09-2019, 11:14 AM
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Holy S*** that’s some eye candy! So clean and deep and detailed. Colors pop and almost 3D.

I copied in some prior settings and tweaked a little from there by eye based on my LG OLED C8. Not officially measured or anything yet, just playing around for a little while I had time tonight, but wow!

Throw in Guardians of the Galaxy 2, Avengers Infinity War and many others and then hold on for the ride!

UB820 in HDR/BT2020 mode to LK970:



If I buy a Panasonic UB820 to replace my Sony X800 and i use these settings above. Will my picture be better with these settings with the Panny or the same as the X800? Also are these the settings i would want to use for a Panny UB820? Or would my calibrated projector settings i got done already be better than these settings with the Panny? Is the Panny a big enough upgrade from my Sony to justify $500?

Last edited by sound2017; 08-09-2019 at 04:51 PM.
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post #2518 of 2519 Old 08-10-2019, 02:20 PM
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is it that much better with latest lightspace update? i have a great 3dlut out of a 9000patch created in displaycal, is it worth it to do it all over again , i m not sure i wanna put all the time it takes to set it up again if its only a small improvement over displaycal generated 3dlut.
Hey @tnaik4 or @Citation444 do you guys have a CIE chart by chance after your 3DLUT? No matter what I do my 3DLUT comes out basically unusable and i'd love to compare with you guys and perhaps figure out how to overcome it. I will attach my before and after CIE chart. tnaik4 I will put your 3DLUT in again and see what happens. SirMaster was kind enough to send over his settings and 3DLUT also and when I loaded his up I got the same results as mine posted here. He had also made his through DisplayCal for MadVR.

Edit: Citation is post 1683 still your most up to date chart? I would love to figure out how to get even close to that!
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post #2519 of 2519 Old 08-12-2019, 10:50 AM
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Does anyone have display issues from a Chromecast Ultra to the LK970? When I connect the Chromecast to to the HDMI 1 port, the most resolution I can get is [email protected] If I plug the Chromecast into HDMI 2, I get [email protected] I assume it is some HDCP2.2 issue. Has anyone faced this before?

Thanks,

-tj
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