BenQ LK970: 4K DLP, laser, $12,999k MSRP - Page 87 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #2581 of 2608 Old 02-20-2020, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by humbland View Post
Thanks for the update:
I have been a DLP fan since our first HT back in the day (Benq PE8720).
FWIW, our current DLP is a Sharp Z30K (1080p from circa 2012). It has powered lens controls and lens memory. As I said, Sony and JVC have had powered lens controls as a standard feature for years. In our low earth orbit cathedral ceiling mount, it's a desired feature. I'm not sure why the DLP makers like Benq and Optoma have not stepped up to try and compete in the middle/high class PJ market? They seem to be focusing on the entry level machines. If Sharp could do it in 2012, then Benq could do it now...
My $.02
That projector was one of a kind under 10K with the automated lens features.. in a compact chassis no less so it could have been done with these monster size BQ's if they wanted to. I still use mine every day and have a backup in case something happens to it.
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post #2582 of 2608 Old 02-20-2020, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post
That projector was one of a kind under 10K with the automated lens features.. in a compact chassis no less so it could have been done with these monster size BQ's if they wanted to. I still use mine every day and have a backup in case something happens to it.
Hi Zombie,
I often think of you when I'm lamenting the lack of progress in DLP land. I wonder how many of us still rock the Sharp Z30K? Ours is taking longer and longer to boot up. I may be consulting your "bulb change flow chart" soon.
I keep hoping that the Sharp will hang in there until Benq or one of the other DLP makers steps up to powered lens controls. How hard can it be? Sharp was doing it 8 years ago...

Just for curiosity, how often do you change your bulb? Do you ever go OEM, or are you still reusing the same housing and just replacing the bulb itself?
Also, where did you score your back up Z30K (and for how much $)?
Thanks
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post #2583 of 2608 Old 02-21-2020, 04:59 AM
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So just been playing with the lk970, have not ceiling mounted it Yet and it's has not being calibrated Either. Use using user1 preset.

Using older version of MadVR on 1080p bluray content. (I still need to update to the latest for HDR tone mapping)

First thing.. this projector is super bright, you almost need sunglasses and I find myself squinting sometimes. Screen size is 120" 16:9 and the high black floor is very apparent even running on eco mode. Not sure how helpful a calibration is going to help.

Since this is a fully light controlled room, from what I've read, a gray screen is not going to help my absolute black level either, is that correct?

Secondly, I see rainbows fairly often.. over the next couple of hours I seemed to have gotten used to it but it does strain my eyes a bit more and if we have white text on black background... it's very hard not to see them which makes it distracting. Could be a deal breaker for me but I'll see if i can get used to it!

Onto the good stuff. The lens on this projector is top notch. It's easy to focus and so so sharp. When watched non low APL scenes there's a clarity in the image which makes it so addictive.

Colour saturation is quite good but it definitely needs calibrating. I first tried watching using my vero 4K and thought maybe I made a mistake.. switching to the htpc using older version of MadVR old Blu-Ray 108"p files made me change my mind and try getting it to work since it looks great.

All in all, its good enough to work with after 1 night with it. I'll try some 4K content using latest MadVR HDR - SDR tomorrow night.

Hope my 1050 ti can perform well!

That's it for now.
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post #2584 of 2608 Old 02-21-2020, 05:31 AM
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Originally Posted by armyplace View Post

First thing.. this projector is super bright, you almost need sunglasses and I find myself squinting sometimes. Screen size is 120" 16:9 and the high black floor is very apparent even running on eco mode. Not sure how helpful a calibration is going to help.
Since this is a fully light controlled room, from what I've read, a gray screen is not going to help my absolute black level either, is that correct?

Secondly, I see rainbows fairly often.. over the next couple of hours I seemed to have gotten used to it but it does strain my eyes a bit more and if we have white text on black background... it's very hard not to see them which makes it distracting. Could be a deal breaker for me but I'll see if i can get used to it!

Onto the good stuff. The lens on this projector is top notch. It's easy to focus and so so sharp. When watched non low APL scenes there's a clarity in the image which makes it so addictive.

Colour saturation is quite good but it definitely needs calibrating. I first tried watching using my vero 4K and thought maybe I made a mistake.. switching to the htpc using older version of MadVR old Blu-Ray 108"p files made me change my mind and try getting it to work since it looks great.

All in all, its good enough to work with after 1 night with it. I'll try some 4K content using latest MadVR HDR - SDR tomorrow night.

Hope my 1050 ti can perform well!

That's it for now.
Calibration probably won't help. This thing has 1000:1 contrast at best and laser dimming does nothing. You're better off with an HT9060 here. It has 5x the contrast ratio, no color wheel so no rainbows, and would be plenty bright for a 120" screen.

A 1050TI will *not* be good enough for madVR tone mapping or NGU upscaling to 4K, either. A 1060, with a lot of compromises, is the absolute minimum.

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post #2585 of 2608 Old 02-21-2020, 06:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armyplace View Post
So just been playing with the lk970, have not ceiling mounted it Yet and it's has not being calibrated Either. Use using user1 preset.

Using older version of MadVR on 1080p bluray content. (I still need to update to the latest for HDR tone mapping)

First thing.. this projector is super bright, you almost need sunglasses and I find myself squinting sometimes. Screen size is 120" 16:9 and the high black floor is very apparent even running on eco mode. Not sure how helpful a calibration is going to help.

Since this is a fully light controlled room, from what I've read, a gray screen is not going to help my absolute black level either, is that correct?

Secondly, I see rainbows fairly often.. over the next couple of hours I seemed to have gotten used to it but it does strain my eyes a bit more and if we have white text on black background... it's very hard not to see them which makes it distracting. Could be a deal breaker for me but I'll see if i can get used to it!

Onto the good stuff. The lens on this projector is top notch. It's easy to focus and so so sharp. When watched non low APL scenes there's a clarity in the image which makes it so addictive.

Colour saturation is quite good but it definitely needs calibrating. I first tried watching using my vero 4K and thought maybe I made a mistake.. switching to the htpc using older version of MadVR old Blu-Ray 108"p files made me change my mind and try getting it to work since it looks great.

All in all, its good enough to work with after 1 night with it. I'll try some 4K content using latest MadVR HDR - SDR tomorrow night.

Hope my 1050 ti can perform well!

That's it for now.
You did not need a light cannon like this for a 120" screen in a light controlled room.
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post #2586 of 2608 Old 02-21-2020, 06:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
You did not need a light cannon like this for a 120" screen in a light controlled room.
This is very very true. And if you are susceptible to the rainbow effect you double whammied yourself. However, since your 1050 isn't powerful enough you might go with a Vertex2 from HDFury which will improve your picture immensely in HDR. Your projector will look amazing with that small tweak. So don't bust yourself if you are stuck with it. I have it's little brother the BenQ LK952, same lumens but in a very lit room, and I am absolutely amazed at the image and all I have is a 1.5 gain Carl's ALR screen. I can see why you are happy with many aspects of your projector. If I could have, I would have gotten the 970 or the 990 (even brighter) but they weren't available in the price range I was looking.

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post #2587 of 2608 Old 02-28-2020, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by TimHuey View Post

This is very very true. And if you are susceptible to the rainbow effect you double whammied yourself. However, since your 1050 isn't powerful enough you might go with a Vertex2 from HDFury which will improve your picture immensely in HDR. Your projector will look amazing with that small tweak. So don't bust yourself if you are stuck with it. I have it's little brother the BenQ LK952, same lumens but in a very lit room, and I am absolutely amazed at the image and all I have is a 1.5 gain Carl's ALR screen. I can see why you are happy with many aspects of your projector. If I could have, I would have gotten the 970 or the 990 (even brighter) but they weren't available in the price range I was looking.
Hi Tim
I have a similiar set up as yours with carls alr screen. Would appreciate if you can post your calibrated setting here. I would love to try them and see if mine gets any better.
Thanks

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post #2588 of 2608 Old 02-28-2020, 02:32 PM
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Has anyone seen both the LK970 and the LK990 in person? I'm debating between purchasing a refurbished LK970 or a new LK990. Is the LK990 truly brighter than the LK970? In another thread, a member stated the LK990 appeared less bright than the LK970 and it was stated the LK990 was using bad color accuracy via brilliant color to pump up the lumens spec. Is this true?
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post #2589 of 2608 Old 03-01-2020, 02:15 AM
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Hi Tim
I have a similiar set up as yours with carls alr screen. Would appreciate if you can post your calibrated setting here. I would love to try them and see if mine gets any better.
Thanks
I am using Presentation Mode, with NORMAL Color Temperature and Normal Light Source Mode. I have Gama selected at 2.4 and sometimes 2.3

Projector Central did a quick test and found the RGB Picture mode gave a more accurate color reproduction (closer to target values) but it was dimmer buy 300 lumens I believe. Since I was going to calibrate I figured I start with Presentation and see how close I could get it to acceptable. I totally reset all my calibrated settings when I hung the screen last month and haven't been able to run a new calibration yet. But even without calibrating it's just an amazing picture with the HDFury DolbyVision hack.

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post #2590 of 2608 Old 03-03-2020, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by TimHuey View Post
I am using Presentation Mode, with NORMAL Color Temperature and Normal Light Source Mode. I have Gama selected at 2.4 and sometimes 2.3

Projector Central did a quick test and found the RGB Picture mode gave a more accurate color reproduction (closer to target values) but it was dimmer buy 300 lumens I believe. Since I was going to calibrate I figured I start with Presentation and see how close I could get it to acceptable. I totally reset all my calibrated settings when I hung the screen last month and haven't been able to run a new calibration yet. But even without calibrating it's just an amazing picture with the HDFury DolbyVision hack.

I'm wondering how the Benq LH770 compares to this in terms of perceived clarity. It has a .65" DC3 DMD chip and from what I've read the LH952 is a pixel shifter. I'm wondering if sharpness is close between the two.
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post #2591 of 2608 Old 03-03-2020, 02:37 PM
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I'm wondering how the Benq LH770 compares to this in terms of perceived clarity. It has a .65" DC3 DMD chip and from what I've read the LH952 is a pixel shifter. I'm wondering if sharpness is close between the two.
4k source material, mastered in 4K, will look considerably sharper on the LH952, IMHO. OTOH, there's a lot of 4K material out there that's been mastered in 2K and upscaled to 4K and then differences will be harder to see.

An alternative to the LH770 would be an Optoma ZH506 or similar unit:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/68-di...inl3148hd.html

as it also accepts 4K HDR input while outputting 1080p HDR. Theoretically, the .65in DMD should provide higher on/off contrast.

some others and reviews:

https://www.projectorcentral.com/Opt...-Road-Test.htm

https://www.projectorcentral.com/Opt...tor-Review.htm

and a 2nd opinion:

https://www.projectorreviews.com/opt...jector-review/

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post #2592 of 2608 Old 03-06-2020, 07:50 AM
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Has anyone seen both the LK970 and the LK990 in person? I'm debating between purchasing a refurbished LK970 or a new LK990. Is the LK990 truly brighter than the LK970? In another thread, a member stated the LK990 appeared less bright than the LK970 and it was stated the LK990 was using bad color accuracy via brilliant color to pump up the lumens spec. Is this true?
Is there no one who can answer this question?
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post #2593 of 2608 Old 03-06-2020, 09:18 AM
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Is there no one who can answer this question?
From what I understand, the 990 is the same brightness as the 970 if you disable brilliant color and dial in the white balance on both.

The 990 offers some laser dimming and HDR signal support though.
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post #2594 of 2608 Old 03-11-2020, 07:03 PM
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Sorry. I have only seen (because I own) an LK 990. I love it.
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post #2595 of 2608 Old 03-11-2020, 11:52 PM
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From what I understand, the 990 is the same brightness as the 970 if you disable brilliant color and dial in the white balance on both.

The 990 offers some laser dimming and HDR signal support though.
My understanding is that the LK990 is *far dimmer* than the LK970 if you disable brilliant color.

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post #2596 of 2608 Old 03-12-2020, 06:28 AM
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My understanding is that the LK990 is *far dimmer* than the LK970 if you disable brilliant color.
I guess that would surprise me as I calibrated 2 different LK970 and they were about 2500 lumens when calibrated to D65.
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post #2597 of 2608 Old 03-12-2020, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by SirMaster View Post
I guess that would surprise me as I calibrated 2 different LK970 and they were about 2500 lumens when calibrated to D65.
I agree, calibrated, they should be about the same.
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post #2598 of 2608 Old 03-13-2020, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by SirMaster View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
My understanding is that the LK990 is *far dimmer* than the LK970 if you disable brilliant color.
I guess that would surprise me as I calibrated 2 different LK970 and they were about 2500 lumens when calibrated to D65.
I calibrate my LK970 with 3dlut / lightspace / C6 hdr2000 meter , and with high lamp i m getting 210nits on 135inch screen , calculated in Chromapure it translate to around 3400-3500 lumens ( this is calibrating the Srgb mode ).
I m not sure if u have a bigger screen, but on my white 1.1 gain sceeen that is what i m getting.
Also read many places that LK990 loses half brightness if u disable brilliant colors, that alone turned me away from getting one.

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post #2599 of 2608 Old 03-17-2020, 04:37 AM
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I calibrate my LK970 with 3dlut / lightspace / C6 hdr2000 meter , and with high lamp i m getting 210nits on 135inch screen , calculated in Chromapure it translate to around 3400-3500 lumens ( this is calibrating the Srgb mode ).
I m not sure if u have a bigger screen, but on my white 1.1 gain sceeen that is what i m getting.
Also read many places that LK990 loses half brightness if u disable brilliant colors, that alone turned me away from getting one.
Do you mean you are getting 3400 lumens post calibration in normal mode or eco mode? My fear is when will the laser light source began to dim, and when does it get down to half brightness? I've seen every Benq laser projector except for the LK990, and when I saw a 2 year old LK970 with over 10,000 hours on it, it was considerably dimmer than a demo unit I saw with 2800 hours on it.


The brightness and sharpness are what set the Benq HT/LK series apart from other projectors I've seen. However when their brightness decreases over time, their image was lackluster in comparison to Sony or JVC since Benq's black levels lack any depth.

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post #2600 of 2608 Old 03-17-2020, 11:30 AM
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Do you mean you are getting 3400 lumens post calibration in normal mode or eco mode? My fear is when will the laser light source began to dim, and when does it get down to half brightness? I've seen every Benq laser projector except for the LK990, and when I saw a 2 year old LK970 with over 10,000 hours on it, it was considerably dimmer than a demo unit I saw with 2800 hours on it.


The brightness and sharpness are what set the Benq HT/LK series apart from other projectors I've seen. However when their brightness decreases over time, their image was lackluster in comparison to Sony or JVC since Benq's black levels lack any depth.
Were both LK970's using the same settings?

It would take quite a long time for the average user to rack up 10K hrs, but, for example, the one with 10K hrs on it may have had dynamic dimming disabled as well.
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post #2601 of 2608 Old 03-17-2020, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by DunMunro View Post
Were both LK970's using the same settings?

It would take quite a long time for the average user to rack up 10K hrs, but, for example, the one with 10K hrs on it may have had dynamic dimming disabled as well.
Doesn't the manufacturer list 20,000 hours to half life (high laser). If so, then at 10,000 hours it could be down 20% to 25%.
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post #2602 of 2608 Old 03-17-2020, 12:57 PM
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I saw a 2 year old LK970 with over 10,000 hours on it,
You sure ????? Thats 14hrs per day every day for 730 days ( 2 years) ...

The most extreme case i know of is a user with an Z1/RS4500 thats 3+ yrs old...he has just over 6K hours on it as his family treats it like a flat panel in that it goes on in the mornings and runs most times till late evening..
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You sure ????? Thats 14hrs per day every day for 730 days ( 2 years) ...

The most extreme case i know of is a user with an Z1/RS4500 thats 3+ yrs old...he has just over 6K hours on it as his family treats it like a flat panel in that it goes on in the mornings and runs most times till late evening..
Yes this gentleman was using the Benq LK970 as a display in his bar/lounge and it's on 14 hours per day, 7 days per week for two years.
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post #2604 of 2608 Old 03-17-2020, 03:40 PM
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Yes this gentleman was using the Benq LK970 as a display in his bar/lounge and it's on 14 hours per day, 7 days per week for two years.
So this is not a fair comparison to the demo unit you saw two years previous. The unit in the bar may not have been running at full power, for example.
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post #2605 of 2608 Old 03-20-2020, 05:16 AM
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My question is how is one to know what the Laser light sources in these Benq projectors begin to lose 25% or more brightness. 3,000 hours? 5,000 hours? I'm ready to purchase a refurbished LK990 or LK970 however seeing the LK970 on normal mode with 10,000 hours on it was discernibly dimmer than the LK970 I saw with close to 2,500 hours on it.


Besides razor sharp clarity, the LK series best attribute is it's brightness. Without the added brightness, the image quality of the dimmer LK970 was quite average. No depth to the image. And Benq's one year warranty on their refurbished projectors makes me very nervous.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaserLuminary View Post
My question is how is one to know what the Laser light sources in these Benq projectors begin to lose 25% or more brightness. 3,000 hours? 5,000 hours? I'm ready to purchase a refurbished LK990 or LK970 however seeing the LK970 on normal mode with 10,000 hours on it was discernibly dimmer than the LK970 I saw with close to 2,500 hours on it.


Besides razor sharp clarity, the LK series best attribute is it's brightness. Without the added brightness, the image quality of the dimmer LK970 was quite average. No depth to the image. And Benq's one year warranty on their refurbished projectors makes me very nervous.
The one year warranty is easy enough to solve. Just buy an aftermarket extended warranty. But that will not help you as far as dimming of the laser with high hours. The question is how much will you use the projector, as in how long will it take you to get 5,000 or 10,000 hours?
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post #2607 of 2608 Old 03-20-2020, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted by LaserLuminary View Post
Do you mean you are getting 3400 lumens post calibration in normal mode or eco mode? My fear is when will the laser light source began to dim, and when does it get down to half brightness? I've seen every Benq laser projector except for the LK990, and when I saw a 2 year old LK970 with over 10,000 hours on it, it was considerably dimmer than a demo unit I saw with 2800 hours on it.


The brightness and sharpness are what set the Benq HT/LK series apart from other projectors I've seen. However when their brightness decreases over time, their image was lackluster in comparison to Sony or JVC since Benq's black levels lack any depth.
yes 3400 lumens with normal lazer , with eco it ll be around 30% lower, with lazer u lose 50% light at 20 000 hours if using normal mode the whole time , with eco it should be 30 000+ hours so not sure how at 10 000 hours it was half, maybe he was using eco mode and u felt it was dimmer.

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post #2608 of 2608 Old 03-27-2020, 05:13 PM
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Originally Posted by LaserLuminary View Post
My question is how is one to know what the Laser light sources in these Benq projectors begin to lose 25% or more brightness. 3,000 hours? 5,000 hours? I'm ready to purchase a refurbished LK990 or LK970 however seeing the LK970 on normal mode with 10,000 hours on it was discernibly dimmer than the LK970 I saw with close to 2,500 hours on it.


Besides razor sharp clarity, the LK series best attribute is it's brightness. Without the added brightness, the image quality of the dimmer LK970 was quite average. No depth to the image. And Benq's one year warranty on their refurbished projectors makes me very nervous.

I have 1500 hours on my LK970(The one Sir Masters Calibrated for me). I was at 26.2 FtL at 200 hours and I am still at 26.2 FtL at 1500 hours. The only color it has a had time with is bright florescent red. Other than that, I absolutely love this projector(I have a 180" wide screen) and for the price I picked it up for, I will be good until JVC makes a Laser Light canon near the 10K mark that can produce as much light as the LK970. Good thing the LK970 is laser, it might be awhile haha
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