Official JVC - 20LTD - RS640 (x990/x9900) - RS540 (X790/x7900) - Owners Thread - Page 366 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #10951 of 12568 Old 02-15-2019, 03:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarryd Bryshun View Post
The screen is a Silver Ticket white screen 1.0 gain. 120 inches. There are no sparkles and it still appears when I put my hand up and the image is on my skin. I can show a video if I can figure out how to post.
To post try...

Quote this post, then near the bottom click Manage Attachments.

In this menu, select Chose file, then select your video file. Then select Upload. Then Close Window.

The file should be added as an attachment.

If that will not work, you may have to upload the video to an external "dropbox" and provide a link.

If its not a screen artifact, which sounds like it should not be with your screen, i have no idea what it might be. I have never heard of anything like what you describe reported in the last 2-3 years with eshift 4 or 5 projectors.

But i hope we can help you figure out what is happening.

Last edited by Bytehoven; 02-15-2019 at 04:07 PM.
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post #10952 of 12568 Old 02-15-2019, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by coxy2416 View Post
Not sure I have had that issue. Would you have a video of it we could see?
I can try to capture the next time it happens. Many times when I backup the scene to replay it's repeatable so it's consistent. That's why I'm not sure if the iris lost its position. If that was the case you would think it would be all over the map as far as repeatibility.
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post #10953 of 12568 Old 02-15-2019, 04:48 PM - Thread Starter
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FedEx tracking says i'll receive bonedoc's isco 3L anamorphic lens early next week. I'll be preping over the weekend...

... finally installing a Seymore XD AT scope screen @ 108" diagonal vs my current Elite 115" diagonal.

... i'll figure out what i need to as far a projector throw once i mount the A lens. With the new 100" screen width, my current projector location at 153" makes for a 1.53x throw ratio. My elite screen would be at a 1.45x ratio. While the Elite screen is a great performer, the flake sparkle component in the screen surface is visible in bright scenes from our front row seating, especially when the image is panning.

Scott "GetGray" has said 1.7x - 1.8x is the ideal throw ratio range to minimize/eliminate any lens distortion (pin cushion) on the outside edges. But the closer i can stay, the more lumens i can preserve for hdr. Fortunately, the Seymore XD has a very useful 3" black felt frame all around, which i could use to hide some pin cushin curve that would remain unobservable in content.

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post #10954 of 12568 Old 02-15-2019, 04:54 PM
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And that the RS540 will be discontinued, more than likely, when parts run out. Or so I heard.
Makes you wonder when that will happen. Its a shame it can not keep on going to have a lower priced alternative
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post #10955 of 12568 Old 02-15-2019, 04:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Makes you wonder when that will happen. Its a shame it can not keep on going to have a lower priced alternative
The complete discontinuation of all eshift 5 models, could extend and enhance resale value?
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post #10956 of 12568 Old 02-16-2019, 02:50 AM
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Originally Posted by talon95 View Post
That's why you don't see it in SDR though. The -11 setting causes the DI to be much less aggressive. You've already closed it down part why I think by setting to -11. Just as a test (I know it won't be bright enough), put the manual iris at -11 for HDR and try that same scene again.

Also, post a timestamp for Infinity War and I'll try it when I get a chance.
That was my theory as well on the DI but I can try lowering it on the HDR material and see what happens.

The scene in Infinity War starts at 13:21 to 17:21 and I will get various pumping while they are inside. Those low light scenes are where I can really see my DI working.
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post #10957 of 12568 Old 02-16-2019, 03:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Bytehoven View Post
The complete discontinuation of all eshift 5 models, could extend and enhance resale value?
Doubtful. Once the gremlins leave the engine bay on the new units I can't see anyone being bothered. I expect the used values will tank

Sent from my G8441 using Tapatalk
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post #10958 of 12568 Old 02-16-2019, 04:20 AM
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Originally Posted by giomania View Post
Since the above documents were posted in this thread, I am assuming JVC has not changed their control codes, and that all these codes will work for the RS540?

For the documents above, the first document is for the 2015 projectors, and the second and third documents are for the late 2018 projectors.

What are useful for programming my URC MX-850 are the long hex codes, which are in the first document (for the 2015 projectors), so that is what I am looking to use.

Thanks.

Mark
All the codes JVC uses are additional. They don't remove codes. So you can pretty much find the oldest IR doc around from 2008 and use that it will just be missing some stuff. You can also use makehex.exe to output the pronto code for any of the documented 1 byte codes in the document.
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post #10959 of 12568 Old 02-16-2019, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Bytehoven View Post
To post try...

Quote this post, then near the bottom click Manage Attachments.

In this menu, select Chose file, then select your video file. Then select Upload. Then Close Window.

The file should be added as an attachment.

If that will not work, you may have to upload the video to an external "dropbox" and provide a link.

If its not a screen artifact, which sounds like it should not be with your screen, i have no idea what it might be. I have never heard of anything like what you describe reported in the last 2-3 years with eshift 4 or 5 projectors.

But i hope we can help you figure out what is happening.
Not nearly as visible as on the video before it was uploaded to youtube, and that video was also less noticeable than real life.
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post #10960 of 12568 Old 02-16-2019, 11:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Jarryd Bryshun View Post
Not nearly as visible as on the video before it was uploaded to youtube, and that video was also less noticeable than real life.
Ok...

Could go over your settings? Is the dynamic iris on? What is the gamma setting? What is your master contrast? Is this hdr and/or sdr?

What is the source device youre using?

Just as a test, try lowering your master contrast setting to see if you can make the artifact go away.

If your source device has a contrast setting, try lowering that to see what changes.

My 1st thought is the higher end luminance is being overdriven somewhere in the signal chain, such that the signal is oscillating.

You mentioned it got worse on you tube. That sound related as far as how this bright luminance levels are being transcoded.

Do you have an original video file you could post? I could try it on my projector to see what happens.
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post #10961 of 12568 Old 02-16-2019, 04:40 PM
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So had the projector for a week now and just hit the 100hr mark...
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post #10962 of 12568 Old 02-17-2019, 03:29 AM
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So had the projector for a week now and just hit the 100hr mark...
Nice, that's how it's suppose to be. My RS4500 just hit 212 hours in 3 weeks
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post #10963 of 12568 Old 02-17-2019, 07:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Bytehoven View Post
Ok...

Could go over your settings? Is the dynamic iris on? What is the gamma setting? What is your master contrast? Is this hdr and/or sdr?

What is the source device youre using?

Just as a test, try lowering your master contrast setting to see if you can make the artifact go away.

If your source device has a contrast setting, try lowering that to see what changes.

My 1st thought is the higher end luminance is being overdriven somewhere in the signal chain, such that the signal is oscillating.

You mentioned it got worse on you tube. That sound related as far as how this bright luminance levels are being transcoded.

Do you have an original video file you could post? I could try it on my projector to see what happens.
Dynamic iris on. -11 on SDR, -4 on HDR. 200 hours on machine/bulb. Contrast set to 0. Gamma is on THX for SDR with no changes to it. Gamma is HDR with the recommended settings I found here. This is SDR or HDR.

This is from Apple TV 4K, LG UBK90 4K Blu-ray, PS4, and satellite TV. All sources essentially - the one thing they have in common is they go through my Yamaha Rx-1083 (1070 but in Canada)

No changes with master contrast decreased, however it always sits at zero.

No changes to contrast on any of the source settings.

The youtube comment - what I meant is that the artifacts are more visible in real life, the video captures it but not as good as you can see it. When I uploaded it to youtube the quality decreased and it was even less visible.

I do not have a file/video to let you try out - it happens all the time but is not really visible until it is a very light/white screens.
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post #10964 of 12568 Old 02-17-2019, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by MagnumMafia05 View Post
Regular content no. Just when the screen is black.
This doesn't make too much sense. Do you have the dynamic iris disabled or something? When the screen is black, the lamp is almost killed by the iris closing. It wouldn't matter what the panels were doing - you wouldn't see it. If you're in manual iris, then a stuck pixel will be far more noticeable if its only seen on a black screen. If you enable auto iris you may not even see it at all.
Why does it work so much better on 1080p content than UHD/HDR?

My iris moves on both, but I only really get fade to black on 1080p movies. Not as dark on UHD.

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post #10965 of 12568 Old 02-17-2019, 10:00 AM
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Why does it work so much better on 1080p content than UHD/HDR?

My iris moves on both, but I only really get fade to black on 1080p movies. Not as dark on UHD.
How do you run 1080p? My xbox x wont do native. Even if I choose 1080p for resolution and click the 4k option for apps and games.. it defaulted to 4k. I have to manually click the 4k option off everytime.

Is it better to just have 1080p upscale from whatever source you are playing the content from or we better off running it native to the projector?

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post #10966 of 12568 Old 02-17-2019, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Erod View Post
Why does it work so much better on 1080p content than UHD/HDR?

My iris moves on both, but I only really get fade to black on 1080p movies. Not as dark on UHD.
How do you run 1080p? My xbox x wont do native. Even if I choose 1080p for resolution and click the 4k option for apps and games.. it defaulted to 4k. I have to manually click the 4k option off everytime.

Is it better to just have 1080p upscale from whatever source you are playing the content from or we better off running it native to the projector?
I upscale everything, but a Panny 820 is going to play anything better than an Xbox.

Both 1080p and UHD look great, but I only get fade to black fully with 1080p. That's what I was referring to.

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post #10967 of 12568 Old 02-17-2019, 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Erod View Post
I upscale everything, but a Panny 820 is going to play anything better than an Xbox.

Both 1080p and UHD look great, but I only get fade to black fully with 1080p. That's what I was referring to.
A lot of HDR has a raised black floor and your HDR settings might be different than SDR which might explain why the iris behaves differently.

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post #10968 of 12568 Old 02-17-2019, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Jarryd Bryshun View Post
Not nearly as visible as on the video before it was uploaded to youtube, and that video was also less noticeable than real life.
https://youtu.be/gqhQYfMH4VU
The video is pretty unwatchable. I can barely see what looks like digital compression artifacts. Too bad the phone wasn't rotated so we could see the video properly.

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post #10969 of 12568 Old 02-17-2019, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erod View Post
I upscale everything, but a Panny 820 is going to play anything better than an Xbox.

Both 1080p and UHD look great, but I only get fade to black fully with 1080p. That's what I was referring to.
A lot of HDR has a raised black floor and your HDR settings might be different than SDR which might explain why the iris behaves differently.
I send SDR2020 out of the ub820 with Chad B customized user settings on the projector for SDR2020. Looks fantastic, but don't get fade to black to the same level as I do with 1080p.

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post #10970 of 12568 Old 02-17-2019, 06:06 PM
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Originally Posted by coxy2416 View Post
That was my theory as well on the DI but I can try lowering it on the HDR material and see what happens.

The scene in Infinity War starts at 13:21 to 17:21 and I will get various pumping while they are inside. Those low light scenes are where I can really see my DI working.
I just got done watching that scene twice. Once with the lamp iris set to 0. Once with it set to -6.

With it at 0, all I saw was one instance where the DI visibly closed down around the 14:00 mark with a shot of Tony and a dark background. Otherwise it appears to stay closed down for most of that scene. I tried watching the lens a while and it had the diamond shape the entire time I watched with some minor changes in size.

With it at -6, I didn't see it close down at the 14:00 mark, but I thought I might have seen it pumping once or twice. Fairly slight though. Not 100% sure even.

Either you are much more sensitive to it, or there is some other difference.

Right now I'm running with the gamma autocal and Dominic's 135nit curve. I did tweak the last couple of points on the curve to push the very bottom end down slightly as I still felt the autocal was too bright at 5% and below. It did darken the 0-5% bars some. I didn't test to see if that changed the DI behavior significantly.
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post #10971 of 12568 Old 02-17-2019, 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by talon95 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by coxy2416 View Post
That was my theory as well on the DI but I can try lowering it on the HDR material and see what happens.

The scene in Infinity War starts at 13:21 to 17:21 and I will get various pumping while they are inside. Those low light scenes are where I can really see my DI working.
I just got done watching that scene twice. Once with the lamp iris set to 0. Once with it set to -6.

With it at 0, all I saw was one instance where the DI visibly closed down around the 14:00 mark with a shot of Tony and a dark background. Otherwise it appears to stay closed down for most of that scene. I tried watching the lens a while and it had the diamond shape the entire time I watched with some minor changes in size.

With it at -6, I didn't see it close down at the 14:00 mark, but I thought I might have seen it pumping once or twice. Fairly slight though. Not 100% sure even.

Either you are much more sensitive to it, or there is some other difference.

Right now I'm running with the gamma autocal and Dominic's 135nit curve. I did tweak the last couple of points on the curve to push the very bottom end down slightly as I still felt the autocal was too bright at 5% and below. It did darken the 0-5% bars some. I didn't test to see if that changed the DI behavior significantly.
Appreciate you looking into that for me. And yes I think I may just be susceptible to the DI working. I am currently using Javs V3 curve and that has been loaded though the Arve tool. Black level has also been set properly. I have also tried Dominic’s curves as well as the standard HDR curve that comes with the projector. I have had 3 different X790’s and have seen the DI pumping or dimming on everyone of them.

I watched Bohemiam Rhapsody the other day and the movie had the DI going crazy. So it is either something in my settings or others just don’t notice is much as i do.

I watched Black Panther today and left the iris set at -2 on manual. The black level was still fantastic and I really on miss the fade to black scenes. Otherwise I wasn’t seeing pumping or scenes being dimmed that other wise shouldn’t be.

I think the DI works amazingly for SDR material but I think it’s to aggressive on HDR material. Sounds like JVC have adjusted the DI for the new models as some are saying the DI works much better for HDR material.
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post #10972 of 12568 Old 02-17-2019, 06:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by talon95 View Post
Right now I'm running with the gamma autocal and Dominic's 135nit curve. I did tweak the last couple of points on the curve to push the very bottom end down slightly as I still felt the autocal was too bright at 5% and below. It did darken the 0-5% bars some. I didn't test to see if that changed the DI behavior significantly.
Some of my curves include black compensation at 0.002 nits or 0.005 nits. If you have good black level you should probably use curves without black compensation.
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post #10973 of 12568 Old 02-17-2019, 06:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by coxy2416 View Post
Appreciate you looking into that for me. And yes I think I may just be susceptible to the DI working. I am currently using Javs V3 curve and that has been loaded though the Arve tool. Black level has also been set properly. I have also tried Dominic’s curves as well as the standard HDR curve that comes with the projector. I have had 3 different X790’s and have seen the DI pumping or dimming on everyone of them.

I watched Bohemiam Rhapsody the other day and the movie had the DI going crazy. So it is either something in my settings or others just don’t notice is much as i do.

I watched Black Panther today and left the iris set at -2 on manual. The black level was still fantastic and I really on miss the fade to black scenes. Otherwise I wasn’t seeing pumping or scenes being dimmed that other wise shouldn’t be.

I think the DI works amazingly for SDR material but I think it’s to aggressive on HDR material. Sounds like JVC have adjusted the DI for the new models as some are saying the DI works much better for HDR material.
Our sat nite movie club was Orsen Wells Chimes at Midnight and Bohemian Rhapsody. We watched both in manual iris (-5) and also lowered master brightness on Orsen's flick due to elevated blacks in the dvd.

I have all but abandoned DI due to the native contrast range of my jvc. What momentary advantage running DI may provide, is offset by the range of unwelcome compromises.

Other projector alternatives may require some form of dynamic iris or dimming, but the native contrast performance of our projectors provides the real opportunity to avoid the technique all together.
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post #10974 of 12568 Old 02-17-2019, 07:27 PM
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Until I watched the samsung OLED demo 4k on YouTube and watched from a angle , I saw how much that thing moves! I havent notice while watching anything that would make me think the iris is acting up. Hope it stays that way! Sorry to hear your story.

I dont have IF on disc but its on netflix. I dont have time today but after work I'll try what's posted.

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post #10975 of 12568 Old 02-18-2019, 05:14 PM
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I have about 130 hours on my 540 and run it in Auto 2 for both SDR and HDR. I’ve found it to be a lot less noticeable than Auto 1 when the Iris changes.

We watched Bohemina Rhapsody on UHD and both thr Harry Potter Deathly Hallows this weekend. All of them looked great and I didn’t notice any pumping of the iris, even with the torture test of Deathly Hallows part II - boy this projector produces deep blacks! Bohemian Rhapsody had a great picture and the scene that shows the changing cities for concert had some deep blacks! Of course, the highlight was the Live Aid concert at the end. It was a competition between picture and sound - both were winners!

I’m curious if Jeff Meier will calibrate the unit with the iris in an Auto mode or manual. Either way, I will trust the expert!

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post #10976 of 12568 Old 02-18-2019, 05:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Riddle View Post
I have about 130 hours on my 540 and run it in Auto 2 for both SDR and HDR. I’ve found it to be a lot less noticeable than Auto 1 when the Iris changes.

We watched Bohemina Rhapsody on UHD and both thr Harry Potter Deathly Hallows this weekend. All of them looked great and I didn’t notice any pumping of the iris, even with the torture test of Deathly Hallows part II - boy this projector produces deep blacks! Bohemian Rhapsody had a great picture and the scene that shows the changing cities for concert had some deep blacks! Of course, the highlight was the Live Aid concert at the end. It was a competition between picture and sound - both were winners!

I’m curious if Jeff Meier will calibrate the unit with the iris in an Auto mode or manual. Either way, I will trust the expert!
I think for calibration you always disable the iris. You don't want it getting in the way for measurements. But you should be able to enable the iris afterwards and it won't impact calibration.
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post #10977 of 12568 Old 02-19-2019, 01:17 AM
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Originally Posted by bobof View Post

Turns out you can turn on the filter while in Profile Off mode. Did you know this? Minor annoyance is that it retracts on an HDMI resync (I guess because it re-sets all the correct state for Profile Off mode, which triggers the filter to retract).

Looks to behave as you'd expect. LUTs build absolutely fine, RGB separation is perfect, no autocal gamma applied. It really is just pushing the filter in.

Using @markmon1 's JVCControl for now to send the appropriate command to move the wide colour gamut solenoid (found it here:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-di...-software.html )

The commands are from here. The note accompanying it seems to be incomplete (at least in the case of the X7900) as it does work with a signal being input, you don't have to be in test pattern mode.
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Originally Posted by Manni01 View Post
That’s an interesting app but not really usable if the setting doesn’t stick and needs to be constantly re-applied.
Well, there is a little easter-egg in the behaviour of the profile off on my X7900 at least, which looks like it might make it useable for some. If you are happy to always have "Profile Off" with the DCI filter engaged, then if you issue the "Filter On" command and immediately power down the unit while in filter on it does stick for the next boot AND subsequent HDMI resyncs. It isn't completely permanent though, the next time you shut down the unit in a filter off mode, when you boot up again the filter won't come in when you change back to profile off.

The above behaviour should make it "relatively" simple to have your unit always come up in profile off, filter on mode, and stay that way, for some use cases.

Last edited by bobof; 09-08-2019 at 03:53 AM.
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post #10978 of 12568 Old 02-19-2019, 02:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Tom Riddle View Post
I have about 130 hours on my 540 and run it in Auto 2 for both SDR and HDR. I’ve found it to be a lot less noticeable than Auto 1 when the Iris changes.

We watched Bohemina Rhapsody on UHD and both thr Harry Potter Deathly Hallows this weekend. All of them looked great and I didn’t notice any pumping of the iris, even with the torture test of Deathly Hallows part II - boy this projector produces deep blacks! Bohemian Rhapsody had a great picture and the scene that shows the changing cities for concert had some deep blacks! Of course, the highlight was the Live Aid concert at the end. It was a competition between picture and sound - both were winners!

I’m curious if Jeff Meier will calibrate the unit with the iris in an Auto mode or manual. Either way, I will trust the expert!
Just wondering what your Di is set at for your HDR material? I tried watching Bohemian Rhapsody on the weekend and had my DI at -2 and auto 2. I had to switch it to manual as my DI was absolutely terrible in this movie. As for SDR material I would agree and haven't had any issue with the DI in this setting.

There are many parts of Bohemian Rhapsody that the DI had issue with. Around the 39:50 mark when they are inside recording an album, the DI was pumping a lot. Again around the 1 hour mark when he throws a party, the indoor scene had my DI going pretty good.

I think that I am just more susceptible to noticing the DI working and find it strange that others do not notice it at all. So either the DI works differently from projector to projector or maybe people think what they are seeing is normal

For myself I just leave the projector in manual as it still has great blacks and then I don't have the DI working when it should not be.
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post #10979 of 12568 Old 02-19-2019, 07:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Riddle View Post
I have about 130 hours on my 540 and run it in Auto 2 for both SDR and HDR. I’ve found it to be a lot less noticeable than Auto 1 when the Iris changes.

We watched Bohemina Rhapsody on UHD and both thr Harry Potter Deathly Hallows this weekend. All of them looked great and I didn’t notice any pumping of the iris, even with the torture test of Deathly Hallows part II - boy this projector produces deep blacks! Bohemian Rhapsody had a great picture and the scene that shows the changing cities for concert had some deep blacks! Of course, the highlight was the Live Aid concert at the end. It was a competition between picture and sound - both were winners!

I’m curious if Jeff Meier will calibrate the unit with the iris in an Auto mode or manual. Either way, I will trust the expert!
Tom howdy from Denton,

I have this projector but have not finished my room yet. Right now I am contemplating whether to go with a high end Blu Ray player or stick to streaming. Reading your post I wondered: for the three movies you watched over the weekend were you watching all of them Blu-Ray or did you stream any? What's your percentage of stream vs. Blu-Ray? Are you using VUDU with the UHD streams or something else? Just curious. Thanks for your recommendation with the iris. I am going to take your advice and work from there.
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post #10980 of 12568 Old 02-19-2019, 08:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skipford View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Riddle View Post
I have about 130 hours on my 540 and run it in Auto 2 for both SDR and HDR. I’ve found it to be a lot less noticeable than Auto 1 when the Iris changes.

We watched Bohemina Rhapsody on UHD and both thr Harry Potter Deathly Hallows this weekend. All of them looked great and I didn’t notice any pumping of the iris, even with the torture test of Deathly Hallows part II - boy this projector produces deep blacks! Bohemian Rhapsody had a great picture and the scene that shows the changing cities for concert had some deep blacks! Of course, the highlight was the Live Aid concert at the end. It was a competition between picture and sound - both were winners!

I’m curious if Jeff Meier will calibrate the unit with the iris in an Auto mode or manual. Either way, I will trust the expert!
Tom howdy from Denton,

I have this projector but have not finished my room yet. Right now I am contemplating whether to go with a high end Blu Ray player or stick to streaming. Reading your post I wondered: for the three movies you watched over the weekend were you watching all of them Blu-Ray or did you stream any? What's your percentage of stream vs. Blu-Ray? Are you using VUDU with the UHD streams or something else? Just curious. Thanks for your recommendation with the iris. I am going to take your advice and work from there.
I would suggest something like the Panasonic UB420. This way you can watch blurays as well as stream media. It will have tone mapping as well as up convert your 1080P to 4K. I own the 790 and a good upconverted Blu-Ray can looks as good as some 4K material. This is key for using the eShift on these projectors.

As for streaming, I have used Netflix and while it looks good it’s not as good as an upconverted Blu-ray.
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