Official JVC - 20LTD - RS640 (x990/x9900) - RS540 (X790/x7900) - Owners Thread - Page 394 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #11791 of 12495 Old 06-10-2019, 03:36 AM
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Originally Posted by danielrg View Post
I just purchased a DLA-X790R. I'm designing a theater room for my dad and we were auditioning projectors at the local dealer, and he loved the X790R. They said they were discontinued, but he asked if he could have the demo model and they gave him an okay enough deal on it he bought it.



I picked it up for him. I demo'd it again for 20 minutes against an NX7 (RS2000) and preferred the picture of the X790R over the NX7 - from more than 5 feet away that is :-)



Now I'd been wanting a JVC projector for a long time and always regretted getting my Sony HW55ES instead of the JVC - but back then it would've been a few models back and only the X5 series at the time that I could have afforded. When I heard they dropped the X790 to $4000 MSRP and were selling the last of them I wondered if I'd missed the boat. I'm not ready for full 4K (would need a receiver, player, streamer upgrade to really go 4K) and wanted instead just the contrast and refinement of this particular JVC series, not worrying about the new true 4K series (not yet anyway). But a few casual inquiries and I couldn't find one and figured I'd missed out.



However, after watching Mission Impossible Fallout on BluRay on the demo unit my dad purchased with him, I decided I had to find one of these units, I loved the deep blacks and brightness. But everywhere I looked I couldn't get an RS540 or X790R. I finally got on the JVC website and looked for dealers all over the western US and started emailing them all trying to find an RS540 or X790. Finally I found a dealer who had heard just that day that JVC was going to do a final run of the RS540, and he could get me in on one of them. But I'd have to wait some number of weeks and pay the whole thing up front. I made sure he was legit and he checked out, I was about to pull the trigger - when my local dealer called that very day and said his distributor had just found an X790R in their warehouse and he'd claimed it for me right there as he knew I really wanted one - and without a deposit ordered it in for me. He even gave me a great deal on the unit. It was awesome.



Three days later (on my birthday no less) it showed up and I picked the unit up & paid. I've been playing with it the last few days and it looks great. What I think is little chromatic aberration (some ghosting around the focus lines) is visible at high zoom but not really noticeable with content... It's in the back of the room projecting off a box on a table right now - waiting to get a mount plate for my Chief RPA Elite mount, as my Chief universal kit that I used for the Sony doesn't fit this beast.



I'm hoping once I mount it (it'll be 5 feet closer to my screen once mounted) it will cut down on the aberration some.



Convergence needed very little tweaking and I cannot believe how many options there are for color, gamma, etc. etc. etc. I haven't ever seen anything so tweakable, I have no idea where to start.



For example, I was watching Sound of Music with my wife last night and the grain seemed extra grainy. After going through menus I played with the smooth function, and it helped some, but then I also noticed that enhance was set to 5. Setting it to 0 made the grain much more realistic. (Enhance seems to be an edge enhancement/sharpening function). Anyway, at first I had been smoothing the sharpening, then realized I could just turn down the sharpening. So many options, you can get the projector to fight itself!



I'm surprised that people complain of black crush on this projector... yes the blacks can seem crushed, but on close inspection the detail is there, it's just the bright parts are so bright that the dark parts seem darker and "crushed". But with so much tweakability, you can play with gamma forever, or pick the built in gamma that favors gradiation (Gamma 'A'), or lighten up the shadows with yet another setting in the gamma menu. So it's easy to tweak the blacks and highlights to your liking as far as I can tell.



And the iris possibilities - great to be able to have dynamic iris and also be able to retain the manual setting as an envelope for dynamic to operate within, anyway it is pretty cool all the options.



After 100 hours, I'll definitely be getting this calibrated (never bothered with my HW55ES)...



Any advice for a new owner of one of these JVC units?



I just feel lucky I was able to get one at this point...
My advise. Buy some 3D

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post #11792 of 12495 Old 06-10-2019, 06:26 AM
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Out of the box there is a bit of black crush but there's a hundred ways to fix that. It's interesting hearing comparisons between this and NX7, seems to be about 50% what one likes.

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post #11793 of 12495 Old 06-10-2019, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Naylorman32 View Post
thank goodness for warranty

So im getting my replacement 540 next week.

Question: is it possible to transfer over my calibration from one unit to the new one? like can I download it then upload it to the new one?
As noted sure you can, but here is an interesting read about settings. Of course this is about TV's but I am sure you will get the point <<< Click Here >>>
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post #11794 of 12495 Old 06-10-2019, 04:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danielrg View Post

After 100 hours, I'll definitely be getting this calibrated (never bothered with my HW55ES)...

Any advice for a new owner of one of these JVC units?

I just feel lucky I was able to get one at this point...

Just get it calibrated is my only advice. I had a 55ES before an RS400 and now a 540. I have nothing good to say about the two Sony's I've owned (panel degradation, poor contrast still after the 55 got an optical block replacement), and plenty good to say about the 400 and 540. Chadb is my calibrator, but others out there I'm sure can do good work.


Put 200 hrs. on it (run it while you're out, etc.) before calibration.
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post #11795 of 12495 Old 06-10-2019, 07:47 PM
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Originally Posted by jorgebetancourt View Post
My advise. Buy some 3D

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Yep. Already got the RF dongle thing and some glasses on ebay. Haven't tried it out yet...
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post #11796 of 12495 Old 06-11-2019, 07:27 AM
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Originally Posted by giomania View Post
Yes it will automatically switch into HDR mode, however you may want to run with or without the DCI-P3 filter, and the process to specifically choose whether it is on or off is detailed in the spreadsheet.

More advanced members figured all tthis stuff out; I just collected all the information in one place.

Mark


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this advice is incorrect (i think).

i assumed that when using madvr to overcome the projectors HDR limitations you do not want to allow madvr to send HDR meta data to the projector as by doing that the projector then goes to its default hdr setting.

the general advice now is to simply use the madvr tone mapping feature which does not then send meta data to the projector. You simply use a blank custom user set up and rename that MY HDR (for example) and then simply customize to choice ie using a BT2020 colour space or HDR

you want to avoid using meta data
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post #11797 of 12495 Old 06-11-2019, 08:20 AM
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Originally Posted by FGEvans View Post
this advice is incorrect (i think).



i assumed that when using madvr to overcome the projectors HDR limitations you do not want to allow madvr to send HDR meta data to the projector as by doing that the projector then goes to its default hdr setting.



the general advice now is to simply use the madvr tone mapping feature which does not then send meta data to the projector. You simply use a blank custom user set up and rename that MY HDR (for example) and then simply customize to choice ie using a BT2020 colour space or HDR



you want to avoid using meta data


Good point; I guess that should have been made clear. I use a Lumagen Radiance Pro, and I send SDR2020 to the projector, and have the HDR flag in the Radiance set to “off”, so it will not trigger HDR mode on the projector.

I am sure there is a way to do the same thing with MadVR.

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post #11798 of 12495 Old 06-11-2019, 10:13 AM
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When using tone mapping on madvr it automatically stops the meta data being sent
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post #11799 of 12495 Old 06-12-2019, 02:57 PM
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I am a newbie to Home Theatre stuff. I have a uestion regarding JVC x990R. I found some folks selling Newer ones on ebay, Echo and Optics. They are giving me a newer one for 4350. They mentioned they offer warranty but i wasnted to ask here as to what your thoughts are.
I have a 150 inch SilverTicket Acoustic screen which has a gain of 1.1. My basement is not a bat cave. It has light grey walls and celing. I can close the blinds and it will become dark but not black. I am used to OLED's in other parts of my home and i am not happy with the LG HU80KA, which i own for blacks. I got a Epson 5050UB which is better but still feel something is lacking. Then i researched and found that JVC's are best for blacks. I also need a reasonable bright picture. So wanted the 2000 lumen than the 1900 and searched for the x990 and found a few.

Let me know.
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post #11800 of 12495 Old 06-12-2019, 03:39 PM
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it's a decent price for that projector and there is no other projector on the planet that will get you closer to an oled. with that said it will struggle to light up that screen well enough and that would be the biggest concern.

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post #11801 of 12495 Old 06-12-2019, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted by microwiz View Post
it's a decent price for that projector and there is no other projector on the planet that will get you closer to an oled. with that said it will struggle to light up that screen well enough and that would be the biggest concern.


I think that would be a fair assessment. I only bought the screen a month ago and maybe in a year or so I might change that and go small. My concern is more with is it okay to buy from a seller on eBay and will JVC honor warranty. Seller mentioned that I need to ship item to them and they will get serviced. They appear to be a decent seller with lots of history on eBay. What probability could it be that these models are the B grade products as I read on Internet that there may be B grade JVC’s as well. The model number they gave does not reflect that. X990RBK . And if I do blackout with some curtains on the three sides for like 8 feet and also a 8 feet black rug in the floor that can be removed and installed on demand. This might make it blackout. Will that help with the brightness scenario.
Another issue is I need the projector at 14 ft 8 inch to 14ft 10 inch because of ceiling outlets and some other arrangements. The JVC manual says that for 150 inch the throw required is about 14.83 feet but projector central lists that as 15.25 . Who do I believe and also could projector central calculator be wrong???
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post #11802 of 12495 Old 06-12-2019, 05:15 PM
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I have the opportunity to get my hands on a 540. I was at first looking at a 5050ub but this thread and many others are making think the JVC is going to be the better purchase. I'm still designing my theater and am in the process of moving a support column a few feet but if I figure I need to get this projector now before they are completely gone. I am curious about screen size, I was shooting for a 150" CIH and am wondering if I will have the lumens for an image that large. I was going back and forth on an AT screen also, I am now concerned the light loss on one might be bad considering the size I want. I spoke with Seymour about the XD material and they seem to think I'll be fine but I'd like some of your opinions.

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post #11803 of 12495 Old 06-12-2019, 05:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Krbass View Post
I have the opportunity to get my hands on a 540. I was at first looking at a 5050ub but this thread and many others are making think the JVC is going to be the better purchase. I'm still designing my theater and am in the process of moving a support column a few feet but if I figure I need to get this projector now before they are completely gone. I am curious about screen size, I was shooting for a 150" CIH and am wondering if I will have the lumens for an image that large. I was going back and forth on an AT screen also, I am now concerned the light loss on one might be bad considering the size I want. I spoke with Seymour about the XD material and they seem to think I'll be fine but I'd like some of your opinions.

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I think 150" and AT could be a real lumen load. I love my 540, but it's on 120" diagonal 16x9 1.1 gain Carada BW at around a 16' throw.

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post #11804 of 12495 Old 06-12-2019, 09:09 PM
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I purchased my 790 from echo and optics... Good seller for sure.
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post #11805 of 12495 Old 06-13-2019, 06:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Krbass View Post
I have the opportunity to get my hands on a 540. I was at first looking at a 5050ub but this thread and many others are making think the JVC is going to be the better purchase. I'm still designing my theater and am in the process of moving a support column a few feet but if I figure I need to get this projector now before they are completely gone. I am curious about screen size, I was shooting for a 150" CIH and am wondering if I will have the lumens for an image that large. I was going back and forth on an AT screen also, I am now concerned the light loss on one might be bad considering the size I want. I spoke with Seymour about the XD material and they seem to think I'll be fine but I'd like some of your opinions.
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I think 150" and AT could be a real lumen load. I love my 540, but it's on 120" diagonal 16x9 1.1 gain Carada BW at around a 16' throw.

It's like this:


Going AT? Spandex is best as it is the smoothest possible image with the best AT properties by far, for a Dime on the Dollar budget. And.....
........if so, the 5050 would be the best choice.


Want the very best image quality at 150"? Go with a conventional Non-AT surface and the x790r @ 16' throw
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post #11806 of 12495 Old 06-13-2019, 08:59 AM
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Hello all,

I have a few questions regarding the throw distance for the JVC x990RBK. The documentation manual on JVC website list a 150 screen at 14.86 feet which is what i want. I have the home theater in my basement and in my basement when building i had them put some wood blocks between joists so i can hand the projector form them. So to me that distance works. But the calculation (ScreenWidth)*(ThrowRatio) is 130.7*1.4 which is 15.28 and at this distance i would have to put the projector in drywall and i dont want that. Alos projector central lists the throw distance as 15.25. Can you help with the throw distance.

Thanks for your help.
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post #11807 of 12495 Old 06-13-2019, 09:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kranthi Vatti View Post
I am a newbie to Home Theatre stuff. I have a uestion regarding JVC x990R. I found some folks selling Newer ones on ebay, Echo and Optics. They are giving me a newer one for 4350. They mentioned they offer warranty but i wasnted to ask here as to what your thoughts are.
I have a 150 inch SilverTicket Acoustic screen which has a gain of 1.1. My basement is not a bat cave. It has light grey walls and celing. I can close the blinds and it will become dark but not black. I am used to OLED's in other parts of my home and i am not happy with the LG HU80KA, which i own for blacks. I got a Epson 5050UB which is better but still feel something is lacking. Then i researched and found that JVC's are best for blacks. I also need a reasonable bright picture. So wanted the 2000 lumen than the 1900 and searched for the x990 and found a few.

Let me know.
The JVC shouldn't really have an issue with a 150" screen if you are talking a 16:9 screen, though this is about the biggest I'd go and you won't get optimal brightness for HDR. 130" to 140" is the best cut-off point, but 150" is still in the workable range. Depends how much of a brightness fanatic you are.

I would suggest treating your room with black velvet curtains or triple black velvet on the walls. It's not all that hard or that expensive, and it makes the projector actually appear brighter because of the dark walls. You can actually get away with less brightness in a treated room and the image will still look brighter. 150" is probably fine in a TBV treated room, in a non-treated room, just depends.

In a fully treated room, the image appears about 25% to 50% brighter than a non-treated room.
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post #11808 of 12495 Old 06-13-2019, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kranthi Vatti View Post
Hello all,

....But the calculation (ScreenWidth)*(ThrowRatio) is 130.7*1.4 which is 15.28 and at this distance i would have to put the projector in drywall and i dont want that. Alos projector central lists the throw distance as 15.25. Can you help with the throw distance.....

.
I have a Carada 143.8" (132.5 x 55.9) 2.37:1 BW 1.4 gain screen with a JVC RS540 shelf mounted at 15 feet 10 inches. I think that has the same throw ratio as the X990R you are looking at. My projector is just about as close to the screen as possible (within 2-4 inches). I would go with the 1.4 throw ratio as being correct. So if your screen is 150” diagonal 16x9, then your calculation of (ScreenWidth)*(ThrowRatio) is 130.7*1.4 which is 15.28 will be as close as you can get.

BTW, I’m running the manual iris between full open and -3, low lamp(150 hrs) with MadVR/SDR2020 and can get around 18fL, Natural picture mode, BT2020. This is just about the right amount of brightness for me.

You’re going to love the JVC X990R’s contrast. I came from an Epson 5030UB and it was quite a step up. When movies do a “Fade to Black”(DI=Auto2), it’s so dark on the JVC, I can’t see my hand in front of my face!
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post #11809 of 12495 Old 06-13-2019, 11:37 PM
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I was lucky enough to get a used DLA-RS540K on ebay for $3k, is that the same as the RS540U?

This is the link to the ad:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/312652768840

What do you guys all think, is this a legit RS540 from a legit seller?

Better go and try to cancel my Epson 5040UB refurb LOL

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post #11810 of 12495 Old 06-14-2019, 05:28 AM
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I was lucky enough to get a used DLA-RS540K on ebay for $3k, is that the same as the RS540U?

This is the link to the ad:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/312652768840

What do you guys all think, is this a legit RS540 from a legit seller?

Better go and try to cancel my Epson 5040UB refurb LOL

That Link is for a RS520...a model that only has 8-bit Color Processing.


The low hours are a plus....but unless it was a 2018 purchase, you might be down to less than a year left on the Warranty


Also...the seller isn't a JVC Dealer, just a Owner.whose real business is :
TecnidentUSA..... manufactures and sells high quality orthodontic supplies

....so don't mouth off. It doesn't seem to be a bad deal though, however..............



For that $2999.00 you could walk into a NEW Epson 5050ub and save over $400.00 to boot. Just sayin'.

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post #11811 of 12495 Old 06-14-2019, 05:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kranthi Vatti View Post
Hello all,

I have a few questions regarding the throw distance for the JVC x990RBK. The documentation manual on JVC website list a 150 screen at 14.86 feet which is what i want. I have the home theater in my basement and in my basement when building i had them put some wood blocks between joists so i can hand the projector form them. So to me that distance works. But the calculation (ScreenWidth)*(ThrowRatio) is 130.7*1.4 which is 15.28 and at this distance i would have to put the projector in drywall and i dont want that. Alos projector central lists the throw distance as 15.25. Can you help with the throw distance.

Thanks for your help.

The Calculator on PC is giving you a more accurate assessment as to the required Throw for a 150"er, but even then you do NOT want to try to mount the Projector so that it has no Zoom left at all.


You would have to drop down to a puny, picayune 140" diagonal to be able to mount the PJ (Lens) at 14' - 8" At that throw and screen size you would have just 5" to the closest possible Throw....not much, but better than bottoming out your Zoom.


I can help show you how to effect a sturdy Mounting solution without your depending on your original Blocking....if you are willing / can do a little DIY'ing


PM me if you want that assistance





BTW...you have yourself a Projector to die for.....so use it to it's best advantage.

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post #11812 of 12495 Old 06-14-2019, 07:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solarium View Post
I was lucky enough to get a used DLA-RS540K on ebay for $3k, is that the same as the RS540U?

This is the link to the ad:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/312652768840

The link is for a RS540 I thought, it doesn’t say RS520

What do you guys all think, is this a legit RS540 from a legit seller?

Better go and try to cancel my Epson 5040UB refurb LOL

That Link is for a RS520...a model that only has 8-bit Color Processing.


The low hours are a plus....but unless it was a 2018 purchase, you might be down to less than a year left on the Warranty


Also...the seller isn't a JVC Dealer, just a Owner.whose real business is :
TecnidentUSA..... manufactures and sells high quality orthodontic supplies

....so don't mouth off. It doesn't seem to be a bad deal though, however..............



For that $2999.00 you could walk into a NEW Epson 5050ub and save over $400.00 to boot. Just sayin'.
It says it’s a RS540K, not a RS520

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post #11813 of 12495 Old 06-14-2019, 09:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solarium View Post
It says it’s a RS540K, not a RS520



Well, the Link took me to a page whose primary Image was the RS540 with that RS540 in what amounted to being a Banner-like display.


I was fooled!



In any case, and in exception to.... my comments all stand as they are

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post #11814 of 12495 Old 06-14-2019, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post
Well, the Link took me to a page whose primary Image was the RS540 with that RS540 in what amounted to being a Banner-like display.


I was fooled!



In any case, and in exception to.... my comments all stand as they are
No worries It does take awhile to scroll down to the original listing after an item has been sold.

I was just worried that since it says RS540K that it's not the same as RS540U.

Since it was a used product, I'm less worried about it being an authorized dealer.

Looks like they have a 30 day return policy as well.

They said they it has no warranty left, but as far as I know don't all RS540's come with 2 year warranty, and it came out less than 2 years ago? So technically if anything it should have at least a few months left?

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post #11815 of 12495 Old 06-14-2019, 10:31 AM
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What's a decent budget screen to pair with this projector? Will any white material screen work?

I'm thinking of this:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...NPFIPBVL&psc=1

This is for a 135" screen with sitting distance of about 14 feet, in a relatively non-light controlled living room (but it's completely dark at night).

I tested the samples of the Elite Screens Cinegrey and 3D and 5D material but do not find them to be worth the extra costs.

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post #11816 of 12495 Old 06-14-2019, 11:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solarium View Post
What's a decent budget screen to pair with this projector? Will any white material screen work?

I'm thinking of this:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...NPFIPBVL&psc=1

This is for a 135" screen with sitting distance of about 14 feet, in a relatively non-light controlled living room (but it's completely dark at night).

I tested the samples of the Elite Screens Cinegrey and 3D and 5D material but do not find them to be worth the extra costs.

If your planning for any amount of Ambient Light viewing, then the Matte White ST screen isn't going to perform up to expectations, regardless. Now I don't know how close to the Screen edges the adjoing Walls and Ceiling are, and that makes all the difference as far as Dark Room viewing. That's because the ST-135 (1.1 Gain) will deliver 34 fl of reflective brightness, so if there is a light colored surface along any side, it's going to pick up and redirect the projected light onto the screen. Washout then occurs.


You could get the ST-135 in a High Contrast Grey (1.0 gain) and that would help resolve both modest amounts of Ambient Light as well as Reflected light. You would need to calibrate to that Grey Shade though...more for Whites than Colors.


Lastly...if you want Cheap (-$150.00 to $200.00), I'd suggest smoothing the Wall (if necessary) and painting on a Screen, or...you might even wind up going Non-Format by painting the entire wall in a 1.2 Gain High Contrast screen paint. Such a solution doesn't have to allow for compromises....it works equally well in every circumstance....in the least doing it stacked against worst case scenarios.



I'll say this....Silver Ticket Screens are a good alternative to other pricier Mfg Screens.....but you can paint a Screen that can measure it's performance against most of the best Mfg Screens available. For less!



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post #11817 of 12495 Old 06-14-2019, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post
If your planning for any amount of Ambient Light viewing, then the Matte White ST screen isn't going to perform up to expectations, regardless. Now I don't know how close to the Screen edges the adjoing Walls and Ceiling are, and that makes all the difference as far as Dark Room viewing. That's because the ST-135 (1.1 Gain) will deliver 34 fl of reflective brightness, so if there is a light colored surface along any side, it's going to pick up and redirect the projected light onto the screen. Washout then occurs.


You could get the ST-135 in a High Contrast Grey (1.0 gain) and that would help resolve both modest amounts of Ambient Light as well as Reflected light. You would need to calibrate to that Grey Shade though...more for Whites than Colors.


Lastly...if you want Cheap (-$150.00 to $200.00), I'd suggest smoothing the Wall (if necessary) and painting on a Screen, or...you might even wind up going Non-Format by painting the entire wall in a 1.2 Gain High Contrast screen paint. Such a solution doesn't have to allow for compromises....it works equally well in every circumstance....in the least doing it stacked against worst case scenarios.



I'll say this....Silver Ticket Screens are a good alternative to other pricier Mfg Screens.....but you can paint a Screen that can measure it's performance against most of the best Mfg Screens available. For less!



Come see us on DIY Screens !
How about this screen, it's not for much more:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...BNPFIPBVL&th=1

Basically the higher gain version of the grey material.

Silver ticket has some amazing prices I have to admit!

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post #11818 of 12495 Old 06-14-2019, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solarium View Post
How about this screen, it's not for much more:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...BNPFIPBVL&th=1

Basically the higher gain version of the grey material.

Silver ticket has some amazing prices I have to admit!

All too visible Screen artifacts. Gives a grainy, almost "dirty screen" effect. Tends to Hot Spot badly as well. As such you don't see it mentioned let alone suggested on here much if really at all these days.



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post #11819 of 12495 Old 06-14-2019, 08:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sittler27 View Post
I own an X970R (sorry couldn't find that thread) that I use a few times a week. Recently had a period of no use lasting 2 weeks.

Now I can hear the iris clicking as it adjusts automatically.

Is there something I need to do to fix it or does it need repair?

It is obviously out of warranty period now.
I know you posted this a number of months ago but did you find a resolution to your issue? My DI has had a few instances where it starts to "click" as it attempts to adjust. Typically it works itself out but it is worrisome especially since I've already had my RS540 replaced once.

Curious if anyone else has noticed this behavior on the DI.
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post #11820 of 12495 Old 06-14-2019, 11:02 PM
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Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post
All too visible Screen artifacts. Gives a grainy, almost "dirty screen" effect. Tends to Hot Spot badly as well. As such you don't see it mentioned let alone suggested on here much if really at all these days.



You can do better......and wind up being a lot prouder. If you chose.....wisely.
Gotcha. Btw, are you recommending:

1. High Contrast Material (0.95 gain)
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...BNPFIPBVL&th=1

or

2. Grey Material (1.0 gain)
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...BNPFIPBVL&th=1

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