Official JVC - 20LTD - RS640 (x990/x9900) - RS540 (X790/x7900) - Owners Thread - Page 422 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #12631 of 12782 Old 11-06-2019, 05:24 AM
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Can anyone point me in the right direction of a good starting point for calibrating the 540 out of the box? I typically go to the first post in this thread but i think i need to go a bit deeper.
SDR looks fairly good, but the HDR is unwatchable as its way too dark. For whatever reason i cant seem to adjust it to anywhere close to normal, so im wondering if something is completely out of wack and i just dont know where to look.

as a side note, i am now using a lumagan radiance pro in my chain, so i wonder if that is causing HDR to be too dark? I havent done any adjustments to that yet, but i'm thinking a factory reset (since i bought it used) might be in order...

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post #12632 of 12782 Old 11-06-2019, 07:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Naylorman32 View Post
Can anyone point me in the right direction of a good starting point for calibrating the 540 out of the box? I typically go to the first post in this thread but i think i need to go a bit deeper.
SDR looks fairly good, but the HDR is unwatchable as its way too dark. For whatever reason i cant seem to adjust it to anywhere close to normal, so im wondering if something is completely out of wack and i just dont know where to look.

as a side note, i am now using a lumagan radiance pro in my chain, so i wonder if that is causing HDR to be too dark? I havent done any adjustments to that yet, but i'm thinking a factory reset (since i bought it used) might be in order...
I'd recommend you seek some feedback in the Radiance Pro thread, were there are several jvc owners of different generations.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/37-vi...ro-series.html

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/37-vi...l#post58779306

I believe you will want to send SDR2020 from the Lumagen, to let the processor do all of the heavy lifting. But again, folks in the Lumagen thread are very proactive at helping users get best results.

Aside from the Lumagen, I have been testing the proposition of Player Led Dolby Vision (LLDV) with the Sony x800m2 -> Vertex (Sony A1 LLDV v2 EDID) -> x990, and I'm getting excellent results. You can read up on the discussion using the link in my signature.
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post #12633 of 12782 Old 11-06-2019, 07:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Naylorman32 View Post
Can anyone point me in the right direction of a good starting point for calibrating the 540 out of the box? I typically go to the first post in this thread but i think i need to go a bit deeper.
SDR looks fairly good, but the HDR is unwatchable as its way too dark. For whatever reason i cant seem to adjust it to anywhere close to normal, so im wondering if something is completely out of wack and i just dont know where to look.

as a side note, i am now using a lumagan radiance pro in my chain, so i wonder if that is causing HDR to be too dark? I havent done any adjustments to that yet, but i'm thinking a factory reset (since i bought it used) might be in order...
The first post does include some settings for HDR. I also have some suggested settings, see links in my signature.

In addition to the lamp power, the overall brightness is controlled mainly by the Picture Tone adjustment, but you also need to set the Dark Level and Bright Level controls to make the picture “look right”.
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Last edited by Dominic Chan; 11-06-2019 at 09:45 AM.
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post #12634 of 12782 Old 11-06-2019, 08:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
The first post does include some settings for HDR. I also have some suggested settings, see links in my signature.

In addition to the lamp power, the overall brightness is controlled mainly by the Picture Tone adjustment, but you need to set the Dark Level and Bright Level controls to make the picture “look right”.
Dominic... please note I have added your links to the 1st post. Thanks!
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post #12635 of 12782 Old 11-06-2019, 02:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Hello friends...

I recently bought a Sony x800m2 4k DV/HDR BD Player. I bought the player as part of a test to observe what the player's LLDV capability might do for my setup.

The result so far, the use of Player Led LLDV in the x800m2, is enabling me to achieve a superior level of DV and HDR10 disc playback performance compared to the Panasonic ub820.

Rather than repeat all of the specifics, please check out a thread I started, echoing another thread Dave Harper has running on another forum.

I welcome any questions you may have.

DV & HDR10 with DTM to a Projector

I have added this new thread as a Hot News item to the 1st post of our owners thread, and will eventually copy over specific instructions to our thread recommendations. All of the info needed is in the new thread, but I'd be happy to answer your questions.

I am hoping to compare this LLDV process to DTM on a nx5/nx9 soon. Since the LLDV performance advantage over the ub820 is apparent, I want see how it compares to the new jvc DTM.

I have really dialed in the LLDV performance with the x800m2. I will start doing the same with an Apple ATV4K64 streaming box later this week. The ATV4K can also be spoofed by the hdfury vertex into out putting LLDV.

Anything we can do to achieve better performance, short of buying a new projector, or investing in more costly xternal DTM alternatives, I figure is something you would want too review.

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post #12636 of 12782 Old 11-07-2019, 10:12 AM
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Not sure if I should be really upset about this or it's just to be expected?
The advanced replacement is a great warranty but sooner or later the new stock will be gone, if they can not swap it, I would guess at that point it would be expected. Hopefully it is taken care of fast........I bet its in the terms and conditions in the Warranty paperwork.
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post #12637 of 12782 Old 11-07-2019, 11:17 AM
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The advanced replacement is a great warranty but sooner or later the new stock will be gone, if they can not swap it, I would guess at that point it would be expected. Hopefully it is taken care of fast........I bet its in the terms and conditions in the Warranty paperwork.
It is in the warranty paperwork, but if that's disclosed anywhere on their website, I couldn't find it. All they advertise is advanced replacement but it's actually advanced replacement if they choose to give it to you.

I may not bother sending it in right now. Just run it with the iris disabled. I'm really concerned they will pull the "we couldn't duplicate the problem" and just send it back. It takes quite a while to happen (maybe an hour) and not all material will trigger the issue.

I don't want to risk shipping it back and forth for possibly no resolution.
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post #12638 of 12782 Old 11-07-2019, 02:41 PM - Thread Starter
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This is a re-post from MadVR Developement thread that was fun to read...

----------------

This is an interesting article which looks at MadVR and JVC dynamic tone mapping :

http://cine4home.de/dynamisches-hdr-...lich-klarheit/

Use google translate for your language of choice.

----------------
Link not working.

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post #12639 of 12782 Old 11-07-2019, 02:44 PM
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This one works

http://cine4home.de/dynamisches-hdr-...lich-klarheit/
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post #12640 of 12782 Old 11-07-2019, 02:55 PM
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Interesting article. Shame it misses in its "brief history of HDR" that folk with Lumagens have been doing DTM over HDMI for a pretty long time. Would have been nice to see a Lumagen box in the comparison.
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post #12641 of 12782 Old 11-07-2019, 03:01 PM
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I would have liked to have seen the comparison using a stock Sony, rather than one that has service menu tweaks and an added filter.
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post #12642 of 12782 Old 11-07-2019, 03:17 PM
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a proper Lumagen vs. MadVR comparison is certainly due, especially with the recent advancements with HSTM which is a massive update and one of the highlight's of ekki's excitement below.

And for the first time, the perfect HDR look came true: The HSTM algorithm increases the contrast of the image considerably, but never more than encoded on the UHD disc. In the picture above, for example, it lowers shadow areas in a meaningful way, without swallowing details, and also retains full tracing in Highlights.

Personally, this was also a key experience for me, because for the first time, the HDR image appeared on screen with madVR as it was used to with televisions.
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post #12643 of 12782 Old 11-09-2019, 06:43 AM
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2k MPC Settings?

I’ve had my MPC set for 4k and 3 on Enhance forever - even changed it after Jeff calibrated it to 0 and 2k. I popped in A New Hope last weekend and saw that the grain field looked too pronounced and like artificial sharpening had been applied (not the way I remembered it), so i started playing with MPC. I noticed at Enhance of 3 was the issue, so I lowered to 0 and continued watching. Last night, I popped in the Accountant and drove my wife nuts going back and forth on Enhance - I settled at 1. I also started to play around with 4k vs 2k (remembered some posts that 2k was sharper). I did not discern a big difference between 4k and 2k, but Enhance is obvious. I like the visible detail, but can’t stand edge halos.

So, what are you all’s settings for Blu-ray MPC (UHD excluded)?

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post #12644 of 12782 Old 11-09-2019, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Naylorman32 View Post
Can anyone point me in the right direction of a good starting point for calibrating the 540 out of the box? I typically go to the first post in this thread but i think i need to go a bit deeper.

SDR looks fairly good, but the HDR is unwatchable as its way too dark. For whatever reason i cant seem to adjust it to anywhere close to normal, so im wondering if something is completely out of wack and i just dont know where to look.



as a side note, i am now using a lumagan radiance pro in my chain, so i wonder if that is causing HDR to be too dark? I havent done any adjustments to that yet, but i'm thinking a factory reset (since i bought it used) might be in order...


I have collected various recommended settings I found in this thread, as well as my own specific variations of those recommendations in a spreadsheet, which you can access at the link below. I decided these guys know a lot more about this than I do. I am also using a Lumagen Radiance Pro, and also have worksheets for the projector settings I am using for that device.

You I also find my Radiance Pro setup document useful; the link is in my signature.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/1E2jN...letype=msexcel




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
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post #12645 of 12782 Old 11-09-2019, 08:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by giomania View Post
I have collected various recommended settings I found in this thread, as well as my own specific variations of those recommendations in a spreadsheet, which you can access at the link below. I decided these guys know a lot more about this than I do. I am also using a Lumagen Radiance Pro, and also have worksheets for the projector settings I am using for that device.

You I also find my Radiance Pro setup document useful; the link is in my signature.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/1E2jN...letype=msexcel
Thanks Giomania. I gave added you excel file link to the 1st post.
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post #12646 of 12782 Old 11-09-2019, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by giomania View Post
I have collected various recommended settings I found in this thread, as well as my own specific variations of those recommendations in a spreadsheet, which you can access at the link below. I decided these guys know a lot more about this than I do. I am also using a Lumagen Radiance Pro, and also have worksheets for the projector settings I am using for that device.

You I also find my Radiance Pro setup document useful; the link is in my signature.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/1E2jN...letype=msexcel




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Quote:
Originally Posted by giomania View Post
I have collected various recommended settings I found in this thread, as well as my own specific variations of those recommendations in a spreadsheet, which you can access at the link below. I decided these guys know a lot more about this than I do. I am also using a Lumagen Radiance Pro, and also have worksheets for the projector settings I am using for that device.

You I also find my Radiance Pro setup document useful; the link is in my signature.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/1E2jN...letype=msexcel




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Thanks. I see that your sheet says 3 has heavy grain and 5 has light grain. Wouldn’t 5 have heavier grain. I was under the impression that 0 was no sharpening and up was more? Is 5 the actual midpoint, so going down from 5 is actually softening the picture?

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post #12647 of 12782 Old 11-09-2019, 11:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks. I see that your sheet says 3 has heavy grain and 5 has light grain. Wouldn’t 5 have heavier grain. I was under the impression that 0 was no sharpening and up was more? Is 5 the actual midpoint, so going down from 5 is actually softening the picture?
Use 3 when film has heavier grain, 5 when film has less grain.
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post #12648 of 12782 Old 11-09-2019, 01:16 PM
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Use 3 when film has heavier grain, 5 when film has less grain.


I guess that is what I meant, but I can probably make it more clear?


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post #12649 of 12782 Old 11-10-2019, 05:55 AM
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I guess that is what I meant, but I can probably make it more clear?


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I was scratching my head. My Sony tv has sharpness at 50, but that is no artificial sharpening applied. So, if you raise it from 50, you’re sharpening, and lowering, you’re softening. I thought maybe that’s what it meant, since it states 5 is the default.

I will keep playing around with it. I may land back at 3, or may just jump up to 2.

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post #12650 of 12782 Old 11-10-2019, 07:01 AM
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Wouldn’t 5 have heavier grain. I was under the impression that 0 was no sharpening and up was more? Is 5 the actual midpoint, so going down from 5 is actually softening the picture?
5 is the default (and the midpoint of the scale), but 0 is no sharpening; i.e., the default has a fair bit of sharpening applied.
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post #12651 of 12782 Old 11-11-2019, 04:39 AM
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Wouldn’️t 5 have heavier grain. I was under the impression that 0 was no sharpening and up was more? Is 5 the actual midpoint, so going down from 5 is actually softening the picture?
5 is the default (and the midpoint of the scale), but 0 is no sharpening; i.e., the default has a fair bit of sharpening applied.
For most newer films I am usually at 5 at the moment. I find anything less and the picture looks to soft to me but it’s a preference and each person will be different.
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post #12652 of 12782 Old 11-11-2019, 06:22 AM
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For most newer films I am usually at 5 at the moment. I find anything less and the picture looks to soft to me but it’s a preference and each person will be different.
It's worth evaluating with a Sharpness pattern like on the Spears & Munsil UHD disc. I find with >2 the ringing artifacts start to become quite noticeable from my seated position, though as you say it is personal preference.
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post #12653 of 12782 Old 11-11-2019, 09:25 AM
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Chad B told me that the MPC settings often introduce extra noise and other unwanted artifacts, so he suggested leaving them off. I believe him because my projector looks fantastic with his settings.

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post #12654 of 12782 Old 11-11-2019, 10:04 AM
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Chad B told me that the MPC settings often introduce extra noise and other unwanted artifacts, so he suggested leaving them off. I believe him because my projector looks fantastic with his settings.
As I mentioned it’s more of a personal preferences in my mind whether it adds artifacts or not. Some people will notice while others do not.

That’s why the settings are present so the projector can be tuned to the users liking.

You may want to try moving that slider a click or two. You may end up liking the look.

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post #12655 of 12782 Old 11-11-2019, 10:11 AM
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Quote:
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For most newer films I am usually at 5 at the moment. I find anything less and the picture looks to soft to me but it’️s a preference and each person will be different.
It's worth evaluating with a Sharpness pattern like on the Spears & Munsil UHD disc. I find with >2 the ringing artifacts start to become quite noticeable from my seated position, though as you say it is personal preference.
I just evaluate it by eye until what is on the screen is pleasing to my eye. I just played with the settings and find a setting of 5 is good for my tastes for 4K and a setting of 4 for my SDR material.

Even if I was to evaluate with a test pattern it would make no difference. The test pattern could tell me it should be set at 2 but that’s no good if i don’t like the look.

No harm moving the slider around until the user is satisfied.
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post #12656 of 12782 Old 11-11-2019, 10:27 AM
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Originally Posted by coxy2416 View Post
I just evaluate it by eye until what is on the screen is pleasing to my eye. I just played with the settings and find a setting of 5 is good for my tastes for 4K and a setting of 4 for my SDR material.

Even if I was to evaluate with a test pattern it would make no difference. The test pattern could tell me it should be set at 2 but that’s no good if i don’t like the look.

No harm moving the slider around until the user is satisfied.
Not just test patterns; the haloing is quite visible at 5 when image contains hard lines and text such as the ATV Settings screen.

Last edited by Dominic Chan; 11-11-2019 at 10:31 AM.
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post #12657 of 12782 Old 11-11-2019, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by coxy2416 View Post
I just evaluate it by eye until what is on the screen is pleasing to my eye. I just played with the settings and find a setting of 5 is good for my tastes for 4K and a setting of 4 for my SDR material.

Even if I was to evaluate with a test pattern it would make no difference. The test pattern could tell me it should be set at 2 but that’️s no good if i don’️t like the look.

No harm moving the slider around until the user is satisfied.
Not just test patterns; the haloing is quite visible at 5 when image contains hard lines and text such as the ATV Settings screen.
I will have to see if I notice that on the text on the PS4 pro.
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post #12658 of 12782 Old 11-11-2019, 11:59 AM
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As I mentioned it’s more of a personal preferences in my mind whether it adds artifacts or not. Some people will notice while others do not.

That’s why the settings are present so the projector can be tuned to the users liking.

You may want to try moving that slider a click or two. You may end up liking the look.

I had the sliders higher before calibration and it introduced unwanted noise and made grain stand out too much. I paid a qualified professional to calibrate my display - why wouldn't I listen to his advice? Because a random person on the internet told me to move a slider around? A Chad B calibration was well worth the money because I no longer have to fiddle with my display to wonder if what I'm seeing is "right." I paid for peace of mind and I got it. Telling someone to futz around when they don't need to is a weird choice. I'd rather tell them to get a pro calibration.

Tim S.
Former 35mm and Digital Projectionist @ Regal Cinemas (circa 2012)

Currently watching on: JVC X790, 106" 0.8 Gain Screen, FireTV Stick 4K, PS4, Oppo 203, w/Marantz SR6011, 2 Outlaw M2200, Outlaw Model 5000, SVS Subs, Def Tech Speakers
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post #12659 of 12782 Old 11-11-2019, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by coxy2416 View Post
As I mentioned it’️s more of a personal preferences in my mind whether it adds artifacts or not. Some people will notice while others do not.

That’️s why the settings are present so the projector can be tuned to the users liking.

You may want to try moving that slider a click or two. You may end up liking the look.

I had the sliders higher before calibration and it introduced unwanted noise and made grain stand out too much. I paid a qualified professional to calibrate my display - why wouldn't I listen to his advice? Because a random person on the internet told me to move a slider around? A Chad B calibration was well worth the money because I no longer have to fiddle with my display to wonder if what I'm seeing is "right." I paid for peace of mind and I got it. Telling someone to futz around when they don't need to is a weird choice. I'd rather tell them to get a pro calibration.
Wow. Thanks for your take on that. It was just a suggestion, no more then that and it would not affect your calibration.

And this random person just tries to help out when he can and throw out a few suggestions here and there. I’m not always right but do my best where I can.

And it was my understanding that these forums are for help and guidance so that we can help out owners with similar projectors and issues.

But what do I know, I am just a “random person”.
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post #12660 of 12782 Old 11-11-2019, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by coxy2416 View Post
Wow. Thanks for your take on that. It was just a suggestion, no more then that and it would not affect your calibration.

And this random person just tries to help out when he can and throw out a few suggestions here and there. I’m not always right but do my best where I can.

And it was my understanding that these forums are for help and guidance so that we can help out owners with similar projectors and issues.

But what do I know, I am just a “random person”.

Perhaps that came across as meaner than I intended. I apologize. I was saying that I trusted Chad B with his recommendation for the reasons that he gave when he was calibrating, not intending to put you down. I firmly believe (and Chad's work made me this way) that a professional calibration for these units is a very small price to pay for a large amount of peace of mind.

Tim S.
Former 35mm and Digital Projectionist @ Regal Cinemas (circa 2012)

Currently watching on: JVC X790, 106" 0.8 Gain Screen, FireTV Stick 4K, PS4, Oppo 203, w/Marantz SR6011, 2 Outlaw M2200, Outlaw Model 5000, SVS Subs, Def Tech Speakers
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