NEW JVC RS3000/NX9 RS2000/N7 RS1000/N5 Native 4K Projectors Anticipation Thread - Page 52 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1531 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 01:27 PM - Thread Starter
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post #1532 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 01:31 PM
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Hey Arrow, any reasoning why they've raised the prices again? That seems like pretty bad PR, having to increase the amount only a day after announcement.
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post #1533 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 01:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biliam1982 View Post
To top it off, who's going to spend almost $20k on a lamp based projector?
Me

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Originally Posted by biliam1982 View Post
Isn't a new Sony Laser about to drop around that price range?
Nope. I expect the SONY 995ES will be probably circa $30,000 or $35,000 MSRP

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post #1534 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 01:34 PM
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I was asked earlier what was the source that was used for the demo, well it was an Oppo UHD player playing UHD discs and some stuff from a USB stick.

No idea how it was set-up, but the noise was there ON ALL content i.e 1080p and 4k.

Hopefully this, and the banding I saw (pretty bad actually, and several times) will be ironed out in the production unit.

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post #1535 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 01:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by christoffeldg View Post
Hey Arrow, any reasoning why they've raised the prices again? That seems like pretty bad PR, having to increase the amount only a day after announcement.
"they" = the press, not JVC... Correct me if I am wrong, but as far as I am aware JVC has not published definitive pricing, it's only press articles? Who it would appear have posted different pricing? This would not be the first instance of the press getting things wrong
.
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post #1536 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 01:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Ran View Post
I was asked earlier what was the source that was used for the demo, well it was an Oppo UHD player playing UHD discs and some stuff from a USB stick.

No idea how it was set-up, but the noise was there ON ALL content i.e 1080p and 4k.

Hopefully this, and the banding I saw (pretty bad actually, and several times) will be ironed out in the production unit.

Ran
Did you see this with the native 4K test patterns that I put on?
.
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post #1537 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 01:38 PM - Thread Starter
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The nice thing about this go around is competition... Sony, JVC... and will Epson join the party with native 4K?

Prices can't get too out hand with more manufacturers fighting for our dollars. Right now I am happy with my 590R. If stuff gets too crazy I have no problem keeping it or picking up a 790/990 before the end of the year. If it sticks around I will have over 1,000 hrs on it by the end of the year and over 2,000 by this time next year.
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post #1539 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 02:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RaceCarDriver View Post
The nice thing about this go around is competition... Sony, JVC... and will Epson join the party with native 4K?

Prices can't get too out hand with more manufacturers fighting for our dollars. Right now I am happy with my 590R. If stuff gets too crazy I have no problem keeping it or picking up a 790/990 before the end of the year. If it sticks around I will have over 1,000 hrs on it by the end of the year and over 2,000 by this time next year.
Looks like Epson was content sitting this year out on native 4K and putting in the updated HDMI. Once June passed without an announcement I was pretty sure that was what was going to happen. They announced the 5040 in late June of 2016 and had them for sale in September which was 3 years after the 5030. This is only year 2.
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post #1540 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 02:05 PM
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I thought with the recent 10500 price drop we were due a replacement (or it's being discontinued altogether maybe), but so far only the upgraded 7400 and 9400. No chance for anything at CEDIA?

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post #1541 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ran View Post
I was asked earlier . . .
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Originally Posted by ARROW-AV View Post
OK folks I'm shattered . . .
Nigel and Ran, thank you very much for your efforts and feedback on the new JVC unit, it’s good of you both to take the time to ask the pertinent questions, and even more so to write the answers up for the benefit of this community. Keep up the good work.
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post #1542 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by farsider3000 View Post
Totally agree about 8K eshift. Maybe if I sit 3 ft from my screen I will discern a slight difference
If you have 20/20 vision........

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Prices can't get too out hand with more manufacturers fighting for our dollars. Right now I am happy with my 590R. If stuff gets too crazy I have no problem keeping it
That unit is no slouch.......
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post #1543 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 02:10 PM
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post #1544 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 02:27 PM
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Thanks @Nexgen76 for the video, not much new except a menu at 7:35 showing the new auto tonemapping feature. There is a Mapping Level option, which might be a way to adjust the tonemapping to the actual peak brightness of the PJ. If I'm correct, it means that someone with 50nits can get a different tonemapping than someone with 200nits by adjusting this mapping level slider.

Of course it needs to be confirmed, but if true it's a nice move by JVC that might please those with a very dim (or very bright) screen, as it means that the new JVCs might be adjusting the tonemapping not only according to the content (static HDR10 metadata), but also to the brightness level of a given setup (depending on zoom, iris, lamp mode, screen size, gain, lamp age, etc). Of course it would have to be set manually, but it would be better than having no correction, and it could be done according to taste (no meter needed). Still not much improvement to expect from a PQ point of view from 2-3 good custom curves, but simple and elegant. Far easier to use, that's for sure.

Take this with a pinch of salt, I'm only deducting from the menu, I could be wrong of course.
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post #1545 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 03:03 PM
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Oh and I forgot to say, either this new chassis is huge, or the presenter is very small
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post #1546 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 03:16 PM
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^ WOW, nice @Manni01 .
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post #1547 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manni01 View Post
Oh and I forgot to say, either this new chassis is huge, or the presenter is very small
I was going to say the same thing Manni. Christian looks small next the new chassis. The projectors did grow in every dimension compared to our RS500's. The height is the biggest increase.
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post #1548 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 03:51 PM
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Does no one else think JVC is shooting themselves in the foot with these prices?
Who is paying MSRP for JVC?
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post #1549 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 04:05 PM
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The current 65mm lens are very good all glass designs and were overbuilt for E-shift. What probably should have been asked would be if the QC and tolerances have been improved.
The same iris is being used as in the 2018 models in these lenses as stated, so it's perhaps a clue that the same lens is being used. As you say it must be a very good lens, must be capable of resolving all those small pixels. We'll soon know either way.

Brand new iris design in the NX9 lens, will it find it's way into the next RS4500.

Disappointing they did not want to say how the contrast hike was achieved, so not patentable? I thought JVC would be braggin' from the rooftops! C4H chassis dive should reveal how.

Great info Ran & Arrow!

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My PJ is the X 950 which has the same lumens as the N7. Though the N7 and N5 were not in use, reviews about them will come, probably, at the end of october. But, it seems to me, for what was told about the N9, that the N7 will not be so superior (if it really comes to be) than the RS 640. My unit has 580 hours of use, and gama G is not a problem to me, because I use the Oppo 205 video processing, so I'm able to get an excellent image of 3840 X 2160, 12 bits, with upscaling. A much better image with UHD pictures downloaded. UHD BD is unbeatable. Of course I'm a noob, don't have the vision of my earlier days, so not prone to see artifacts than the trained technical eyes such as the great majority of the members in this forum (Thanks God). I'll be following the developments in this thread, but at the end, if the N7 (I'm interested in) does not offer considerable advantages in image over the RS 640, I'll keep mine for another year, to invest my money in a pj with improvements that I can see.
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post #1551 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Manni01 View Post
Oh and I forgot to say, either this new chassis is huge, or the presenter is very small
Oh look it shrunk!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ran View Post

Hopefully this, and the banding I saw (pretty bad actually, and several times) will be ironed out in the production unit.

Ran
Hi Ran,

The mosquito noise and banding you saw, with shipment for production units in a few months did JVC indicate this problems would be ironed out as you mentioned or could this happen after shipment via a firmware update?

A shame about the bright corner issue. Does this problem occur on the 4500/Z1 and if not why does it occur on these 4K models?

Thank you for your report and impressions.
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post #1553 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 04:14 PM
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Originally Posted by farsider3000 View Post
I agree about 8K being overkill. But the key here is that the projector only needs to accept a 4K HDR signal and we only need 18Gbps for that. The 8K e-shift enhances the 4K image. 8K e-shift is not about accepting an 8K signal.

My only concern is that I hope we can leave the e-shift off for 4K signals if we want to.


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Can't 8k/24/no hdr work on 18gbit? That might be good enough for say pc showing still photos.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by RaceCarDriver View Post
The nice thing about this go around is competition... Sony, JVC... and will Epson join the party with native 4K?

Prices can't get too out hand with more manufacturers fighting for our dollars. Right now I am happy with my 590R. If stuff gets too crazy I have no problem keeping it or picking up a 790/990 before the end of the year. If it sticks around I will have over 1,000 hrs on it by the end of the year and over 2,000 by this time next year.
As of an hour ago, JVC only had two RS640's left.
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post #1555 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 04:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walter Santos Filho View Post
My PJ is the X 950 which has the same lumens as the N7. Though the N7 and N5 were not in use, reviews about them will come, probably, at the end of october. But, it seems to me, for what was told about the N9, that the N7 will not be so superior (if it really comes to be) than the RS 640. My unit has 580 hours of use, and gama G is not a problem to me, because I use the Oppo 205 video processing, so I'm able to get an excellent image of 3840 X 2160, 12 bits, with upscaling. A much better image with UHD pictures downloaded. UHD BD is unbeatable. Of course I'm a noob, don't have the vision of my earlier days, so not prone to see artifacts than the trained technical eyes such as the great majority of the members in this forum (Thanks God). I'll be following the developments in this thread, but at the end, if the N7 (I'm interested in) does not offer considerable advantages in image over the RS 640, I'll keep mine for another year, to invest my money in a pj with improvements that I can see.

Rational thinking sir!

It's always nice to have the latest, but if the latest does not best what you already have by a apperciateable amount, why do so?!
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post #1556 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 04:23 PM
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Who is paying MSRP for JVC?

Who said anything about paying MSRP?


I'm strictly talking about the price jump in general from the previous generations.
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post #1557 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 04:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Highjinx View Post
The same iris is being used as in the 2018 models in these lenses as stated, so it's perhaps a clue that the same lens is being used. As you say it must be a very good lens, must be capable of resolving all those small pixels. We'll soon know either way.

Brand new iris design in the NX9 lens, will it find it's way into the next RS4500.

Disappointing they did not want to say how the contrast hike was achieved, so not patentable? I thought JVC would be braggin' from the rooftops! C4H chassis dive should reveal how.

Great info Ran & Arrow!
No way, they will add it to the 4500. That unit uses a manual adjustable iris with dynamic laser dimming. I am not convinced of the benefits of a dynamic iris and dynamic laser dimming. I would not expect JVC to lay out their road map on projector design. We will have reviews that show us exactly what the units are getting and good numbers are all any of us really need. I don't plan to try and build a projector and compete.

Added
We will also learn exactly what the lens can resolve, once someone can show a 4K test pattern.

Last edited by Mike Garrett; 08-31-2018 at 04:27 PM.
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post #1558 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted by RaceCarDriver View Post
The nice thing about this go around is competition... Sony, JVC... and will Epson join the party with native 4K?

Prices can't get too out hand with more manufacturers fighting for our dollars. Right now I am happy with my 590R. If stuff gets too crazy I have no problem keeping it or picking up a 790/990 before the end of the year. If it sticks around I will have over 1,000 hrs on it by the end of the year and over 2,000 by this time next year.
Why does anyone care what Epson is going to do? If you want grey blacks, buy an optoma.

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post #1559 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 04:36 PM
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What's the difference between their .69 panel and Sony's .74 panel. Is one size better than another? It's the same pixel count?

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post #1560 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 04:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
No way, they will add it to the 4500. That unit uses a manual adjustable iris with dynamic laser dimming. I am not convinced of the benefits of a dynamic iris and dynamic laser dimming. I would not expect JVC to lay out their road map on projector design. We will have reviews that show us exactly what the units are getting and good numbers are all any of us really need. I don't plan to try and build a projector and compete.
I'm gazing into my crystal ball....I see a scene coming up, a star field against an inky black sky, the DI clamps down much further than the setting of the manual iris, the laser power simultaneously increases, the black sky remains black but the stars sparkle like diamonds in the sky!

The alternative is reduce laser power, where there is less brightness for the highlights.

Found this post ny madshi:

Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
He's talking about the laser dimming + dynamic iris. He says you notice the difference immedately. Especially the black level improves. He calls is "sensational". Right after that he talks about improved laser diodes which add 10% light output and he claims the difference is very easy to see. Yeah, sure. Then he calls the black level "reference class", and the projector a "new star in the sky". As you can see, it's a very sober and objective video. Of course, he's a salesman...

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