NEW JVC RS3000/NX9 RS2000/N7 RS1000/N5 Native 4K Projectors Anticipation Thread - Page 53 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1561 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 04:39 PM
 
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Originally Posted by 703 View Post
Based the x990 tone mapping, this tone map looks pretty extreme. Of course this nx9 must have a different gamma base, but wow.
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post #1562 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 04:42 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ARROW-AV View Post
OK folks I'm shattered... Going to to get some much needed sleep! Laters
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Thanks Nigel and Ran.
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post #1563 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by ARROW-AV View Post
Heres a titbit... ANSI contrast is increased by circa 50%

This is good news, but I fear it only apply to the NK9 light engine. I have a theory that if ANSI contrast does not improve the image it is because the native contrast is too low at the onset, you can’t preserve what you don’t have. ANSI and Native are like a good couple that are best when they are both pulling there weight. I also have a theory that a good ANSI will cause the projector to come out of black much slower meaning the black floor will not drop off as rapidly when the APL is raised (assuming an optimized room).

The ANSI standard uses white field as one measure, but in my judgement the benefit will multiply for complex scenes with both white and color information as it will cause less pollution across all layers including the black field. With all else being equal I also bet the higher ANSI projector will achieve superior color and saturation and without boosting color luminance.
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post #1564 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
The current 65mm lens are very good all glass designs and were overbuilt for E-shift. What probably should have been asked would be if the QC and tolerances have been improved.
I dont agree with that at all. Very good compared to the general competition absolutely. But when we know the variance, its not that good at all.

If QC has drastically improved, then fine, that's a load off, but I saw two bad lens samples in a row compared to my 9500, and have seen dozens more on these forums which are at best, questionable. Honestly its not good enough for true 4K... It resolves 1080p pixels VERY well IF you have a golden sample, but honestly with some room for improvement even there. Now you have 4K pixels entering the inner glass element on the lens, that's twice the density now, you are going to go backwards in system MTF HARD compared to what they could do in the 1080p panels.

This is not good news if the lenses are the same honestly,

Here is an image showing my 9500 vs one of the 9900's I had (Both performed about the same) in the center of the lens. Lowe left + is the 9500 and top right + is the 9900.



If there is this much variance in merely 1080p pixel rendition (eshift is off), I am not convinced that these lenses are acceptable at all. Unless every single lens they are going to use looks like my 9500, but even then, look at the pixel on my 9500, if you chop that into four and retain the some level of blur (MTF) you are going to have very blurry pixels everywhere. Thats not acceptable IMO for 4K.

The jury is out of course, we must know if QC has been drastically improved. Like I said I know of a handful of units returned in Australia for these very same reasons.

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post #1565 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post
I was secretly hoping for that, but not really believing in it. So that sounds like great news! However, IIRC JVC has promised ANSI contrast improvements in the past which didn't really play out. So I'll keep my hat on for now, until measurements actually confirm this. But I'm hopeful!

Hmmmm... As Manni asked, though, is this only for the NX9? E.g. I can imagine the better lens helping with ANSI contrast. Or is this also for N5 and N7?


FWIW, "processing" as in sharpening is something that definitely is a matter of taste. However, there are some sorts of processing which you cannot technically avoid. For example, consumer video is encoded as YCbCr 4:2:0, but displays are RGB 4:4:4, so someone somewhere has to upscale chroma from 4:2:0 to 4:4:4 and then convert that to RGB. Furthermore, if you play a 1080p Blu-Ray on a 4K display, again someone has to upscale the whole video from 1080p to 4K. So the question is not *if* you do that kind of processing, the question is only how high the quality of the algorithm you're using is. There are good and bad ones.


This is actually very near to how madVR's "NGU Sharp" algorithm was designed: It tries to undo/revert a 4K -> 2K downscale in the best possible way. There's zero artificial sharpening going on. The algo is just looking at the 2K downscale and then tries to take a best guess at how the original 4K image might have looked like, by throwing lots and lots of GLOPS on the task. The core part of the whole algo is a neural network (AI) which was carefully trained to "guess" the original 4K image, given only the 2K image. The training of such a neural network works by feeding it with both the downscaled 2K and the original 4K image, and then the training automatically analyzes what the neural network does and how much its output differs from the original 4K image, and then applies small corrections to the neural network to get nearer to the ideal results. This training is done hundreds of thousands of times, over and over again.

Sadly, if a video wasn't actually downscaled from 4K -> 2K, but is actually a native 2K source, the algorithm doesn't produce as good results as otherwise, but it's usually still noticably better than conventional upscaling algorithms.
This is a very excellent post!

In grad school I used a math theory refered to as Numerical Analysis which is used to estimate a solution for unsolvable problems. You select an error for the solution and solved the problem to the target error. If you have no idea what the solution looks like you select a larger error (usually 2-3% ) for a faster convergence. If you know what the solution should look like you can set the error to 0.001% or less if desired. I believe madVR may be using this algorithm.

As MadVR has the original 4K source information (exact solution) the algorithm can potentially cary an immeasurable error given the processing power; this is a very powerful upscaling algorithm.
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post #1566 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Javs View Post
I dont agree with that at all. Very good compared to the general competition absolutely. But when we know the variance, its not that good at all.

If QC has drastically improved, then fine, that's a load off, but I saw two bad lens samples in a row compared to my 9500, and have seen dozens more on these forums which are at best, questionable. Honestly its not good enough for true 4K... It resolves 1080p pixels VERY well IF you have a golden sample, but honestly with some room for improvement even there. Now you have 4K pixels entering the inner glass element on the lens, that's twice the density now, you are going to go backwards in system MTF HARD compared to what they could do in the 1080p panels.

This is not good news if the lenses are the same honestly,

Here is an image showing my 9500 vs one of the 9900's I had (Both performed about the same) in the center of the lens. Lowe left + is the 9500 and top right + is the 9900.



If there is this much variance in merely 1080p pixel rendition (eshift is off), I am not convinced that these lenses are acceptable at all. Unless every single lens they are going to use looks like my 9500, but even then, look at the pixel on my 9500, if you chop that into four and retain the some level of blur (MTF) you are going to have very blurry pixels everywhere. Thats not acceptable IMO for 4K.

The jury is out of course, we must know if QC has been drastically improved. Like I said I know of a handful of units returned in Australia for these very same reasons.
Definitely seem better than 1080p spec but not quite there for the best 4K experience. Maybe the IFA rep was not briefed by the engineer or it just can’t be done economically on a 65mm lens.
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post #1567 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 05:57 PM
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Just out of interest to add to the above. I took a shot of my 9500 pixel grid into photoshop and compared it to an image I had created (assuming pixel gaps remain the same - which I dont think is actually true - I believe the gap is smaller now) consiting of 2k, 4k, and 8k pixels in an array.

I then added blur to the image to try to replicate the general level of MTF I have on my lens which is pretty much IMO the best you can get of this particular design.



That looks like this when blown up. If the pixel gap is now smaller on the 4k pixels, its going to be more difficult to make them out individually thus MTF is considerably lower overall. Forget 8k, that's just a line. Almost no MTF at all there.



I suppose it could be considered acceptable though. But as posted earlier, what if the lens was like that worse sample? Surely they need to address QC to ensure all the lenses are at the very least like my 9500 sample.

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post #1568 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 06:05 PM
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Why does anyone care what Epson is going to do? If you want grey blacks, buy an optoma.
You don’t have to like Epson, but you should respect them. They gobble up market share year after year.
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post #1569 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 06:06 PM
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IDK I think I will be quite happy with my 540 (plus Panasonic 820) for the foreseeable future. If I could ask for anything it would be a bit more brightness. The prices on the new projectors seem to have really popped but not the performance - especially for the two lower tier projectors. But I'll keep watching.
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post #1570 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 06:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Javs View Post

I suppose it could be considered acceptable though. But as posted earlier, what if the lens was like that worse sample? Surely they need to address QC to ensure all the lenses are at the very least like my 9500 sample.
Can't see you biting the bullet for anything less than a NX9 Mr. Javs
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post #1571 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 06:12 PM
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Can't see you biting the bullet for anything less than a NX9 Mr. Javs
That lens has a lot of attention..
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post #1572 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 06:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Pultzar View Post
Now that they are hitting 2200 lumens at 4k with good contrast, I think that they should come in with laser at 4000-5000 lumens. Of course this will be more $ but will help separate the lines.

Assuming of course that JVC plans to continue down the laser path for HT.
Well, we don't really know yet if they are hitting 2200 lumens. It's in the spec, but what about post-calibration... Also no laser pj except the Sony 5000 reaches into the 4000-5000 lumen range and given the cost of the 5000 I do not expect to get that amount of light output for a long time. Even though with my screen I definitely need it for better HDR.

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100%. I would totally pay a bit extra for a VW870ES over the NX9. If starved for lumens, the NX9 could easily burn through hundreds of dollars worth of bulbs (if not thousands, depending on how long you keep it) if one was looking for a long-term purchase between these two.
I think the 870 is going to cost a lot more than just "a bit extra". What lumens do you expect the 870 to put out post-calibration?

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Originally Posted by Manni01 View Post
Thanks @Nexgen76 for the video, not much new except a menu at 7:35 showing the new auto tonemapping feature. There is a Mapping Level option, which might be a way to adjust the tonemapping to the actual peak brightness of the PJ. If I'm correct, it means that someone with 50nits can get a different tonemapping than someone with 200nits by adjusting this mapping level slider.

Of course it needs to be confirmed, but if true it's a nice move by JVC that might please those with a very dim (or very bright) screen, as it means that the new JVCs might be adjusting the tonemapping not only according to the content (static HDR10 metadata), but also to the brightness level of a given setup (depending on zoom, iris, lamp mode, screen size, gain, lamp age, etc). Of course it would have to be set manually, but it would be better than having no correction, and it could be done according to taste (no meter needed). Still not much improvement to expect from a PQ point of view from 2-3 good custom curves, but simple and elegant. Far easier to use, that's for sure.

Take this with a pinch of salt, I'm only deducting from the menu, I could be wrong of course.
Great find! Yes, hopefully that is exactly what this setting is for. As many will recall, I only get low 40 nits in my setup with 4K BT2020 filter in place and zoomed for 2.40 AR. It would be great not to have to mess with custom curves and Vertex automation, and rather have all this functionality baked in. Assuming of course JVC's implementation is excellent. Hopefully that slider covers a large range (lots of granularity). If the feature is what we are thinking, it would help people a lot in low nit situations, as well as people that wanted to optimize their HDR viewing based on their preferences, such as running on low lamp with a smaller screen and so forth.

It seems that JVC has been paying attention to what the community has been doing to work around the shortcomings of Gamma D and the built-in curve, and the need for much greater flexibility - again, assuming this feature is what we think. I do not think you can do custom curves like this with the Sony, automatically or manually - which gives the JVC a big advantage especially for low nit set ups.

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Originally Posted by Manni01 View Post
Oh and I forgot to say, either this new chassis is huge, or the presenter is very small
LOL! I was thinking the same thing. I know it was posted somewhere - but does anyone know where the HWD dimensions are for the NX9?

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Originally Posted by Spizz View Post
Hi Ran,

The mosquito noise and banding you saw, with shipment for production units in a few months did JVC indicate this problems would be ironed out as you mentioned or could this happen after shipment via a firmware update?

A shame about the bright corner issue. Does this problem occur on the 4500/Z1 and if not why does it occur on these 4K models?

Thank you for your report and impressions.
I've quite confident that the banding Ran reported will be resolved in production units. After all, none of their current units or 4500 have this issue. I would think they'd realize that no one would accept a unit with that type of banding. Now if they said these were production units, I'd be a little concerned. But if anything, it was just the opposite. From the sounds of it it seems these units were rushed to get ready for a public showing. Like anything I'm sure the team would have liked "just two more weeks", but eventually the deadline to show it publicly must come. Hence the dynamic iris was not even working, and of course they'd have that working for production units. Bottom line is that it looks to me like this is a very early cut and there's a lot of work still to do, which is a good thing really.

Regarding what you said about bright corners - unless I misunderstood, Ran did NOT report that this unit suffered from bright corners. Now that I think about it, he did not comment on it one way or the other. Rather, he raised the general concern about bright corners that have been with DILA (and SXRD version) for years and years, and asked when we can expect them to be gone for good.

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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
No way, they will add it to the 4500. That unit uses a manual adjustable iris with dynamic laser dimming. I am not convinced of the benefits of a dynamic iris and dynamic laser dimming. I would not expect JVC to lay out their road map on projector design. We will have reviews that show us exactly what the units are getting and good numbers are all any of us really need. I don't plan to try and build a projector and compete.

Added
We will also learn exactly what the lens can resolve, once someone can show a 4K test pattern.
I'm curious why you are wondering what the lens can resolve. Earlier you said its the same exact lens from the 4500, and that the 4500 is stellar and can resolve the full 4K. So I'd expect no less. Then again, it will be reassuring for someone to actual confirm it, since these are new chips and a new design.

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Based the x990 tone mapping, this tone map looks pretty extreme. Of course this nx9 must have a different gamma base, but wow.
Indeed! Especially if the feature Manni pointed out is what we think it may be, allowing a way for us to tell the unit what our peak brightness is (in a range from super dim to super bright, hopefully) and have it adjust the curve for that as well as tone mapping based on static meta data. Even cooler would be if the unit would be able to measure its own brightness and set the slider based on the measurements. Who knows, maybe this type of HDR tuning will be part of the improved auto-calibration these units are rumored to have.
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post #1573 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 06:30 PM
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One question that keeps going around in my head is how does JVC expect to sell many NX9 units with no HDMI 2.1 at a high MSRP, when the value of these units may drop like a rock in 12 months when they roll out HDMI 2.1 rev b of the NX9? Any thoughts on whether they would offer a service to send the unit in and have the HDMI upgraded to 2.1? Isn't this the sort of thing Sony did, offering a HDMI upgrade for VW1000 owners to keep their pjs up to date? Other manufactuers are doing this as well - for instance Marantz announced with the launch of the 8805 that down the road when HDMI 2.1 is ready for prime time that they will offer a relatively cheap service to send the unit in and have it upgraded to HDMI 2.1. I feel like if JVC was to offer that option that would be a different story.
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post #1574 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Ran View Post

In summery, coming from the X9500, I think that the N7 will be quite risky in terms of contrast and perhaps it might become an issue.

Ran
JVC should follow what everyone else is doing, if a unit is a good seller, leave it on the market. You're still making money from it, let the consumers decide. So if the new units is a flop, based on pricing or whatever, then you still have a safety net.

Apple is still selling the 4 year old iphone6 disguised as an iPoD. Nothing wrong with that. People who want the latest model can, people who want the n-1 model can too.

The new JVC price doesn’t overlap with the old anyway?

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post #1575 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 06:50 PM
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Well, we don't really know yet if they are hitting 2200 lumens. It's in the spec, but what about post-calibration... Also no laser pj except the Sony 5000 reaches into the 4000-5000 lumen range and given the cost of the 5000 I do not expect to get that amount of light output for a long time. Even though with my screen I definitely need it for better HDR.



I think the 870 is going to cost a lot more than just "a bit extra". What lumens do you expect the 870 to put out post-calibration?



Great find! Yes, hopefully that is exactly what this setting is for. As many will recall, I only get low 40 nits in my setup with 4K BT2020 filter in place and zoomed for 2.40 AR. It would be great not to have to mess with custom curves and Vertex automation, and rather have all this functionality baked in. Assuming of course JVC's implementation is excellent. Hopefully that slider covers a large range (lots of granularity). If the feature is what we are thinking, it would help people a lot in low nit situations, as well as people that wanted to optimize their HDR viewing based on their preferences, such as running on low lamp with a smaller screen and so forth.

It seems that JVC has been paying attention to what the community has been doing to work around the shortcomings of Gamma D and the built-in curve, and the need for much greater flexibility - again, assuming this feature is what we think. I do not think you can do custom curves like this with the Sony, automatically or manually - which gives the JVC a big advantage especially for low nit set ups.



LOL! I was thinking the same thing. I know it was posted somewhere - but does anyone know where the HWD dimensions are for the NX9?



I've quite confident that the banding Ran reported will be resolved in production units. After all, none of their current units or 4500 have this issue. I would think they'd realize that no one would accept a unit with that type of banding. Now if they said these were production units, I'd be a little concerned. But if anything, it was just the opposite. From the sounds of it it seems these units were rushed to get ready for a public showing. Like anything I'm sure the team would have liked "just two more weeks", but eventually the deadline to show it publicly must come. Hence the dynamic iris was not even working, and of course they'd have that working for production units. Bottom line is that it looks to me like this is a very early cut and there's a lot of work still to do, which is a good thing really.

Regarding what you said about bright corners - unless I misunderstood, Ran did NOT report that this unit suffered from bright corners. Now that I think about it, he did not comment on it one way or the other. Rather, he raised the general concern about bright corners that have been with DILA (and SXRD version) for years and years, and asked when we can expect them to be gone for good.



I'm curious why you are wondering what the lens can resolve. Earlier you said its the same exact lens from the 4500, and that the 4500 is stellar and can resolve the full 4K. So I'd expect no less. Then again, it will be reassuring for someone to actual confirm it, since these are new chips and a new design.



Indeed! Especially if the feature Manni pointed out is what we think it may be, allowing a way for us to tell the unit what our peak brightness is (in a range from super dim to super bright, hopefully) and have it adjust the curve for that as well as tone mapping based on static meta data. Even cooler would be if the unit would be able to measure its own brightness and set the slider based on the measurements. Who knows, maybe this type of HDR tuning will be part of the improved auto-calibration these units are rumored to have.
That was in regard to his post about the 65mm N5 and N7 lens.
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post #1576 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 06:53 PM
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Who said anything about paying MSRP?


I'm strictly talking about the price jump in general from the previous generations.
Given these 4K units are built from ground up, it shouldn't have been realistically expected they would stay the same price as the current eshift models which platform has been around for years (so they could be sold cheaper due to product maturity). If we extrapolate from these overseas MSRP prices, it makes these new JVCs competitively priced to the Sony 4K lamp models. And let's not forget, native 4K is still in its infancy with front projection given seemingly only two manufacturers offering it (under $25K pricing anyway).

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post #1577 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 06:55 PM
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I give JVC a lot of credit. Tone mapping was an issue and JVC made efforts here to address that,
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post #1578 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 07:00 PM
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I give JVC a lot of credit. Tone mapping was an issue and JVC made efforts here to address that,
Also, USB updates and sync times reduced to half sound good to me. The bigger chassis also has the benefits of hopefully quieter fan noise and better cooling.
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post #1579 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 07:02 PM
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One question that keeps going around in my head is how does JVC expect to sell many NX9 units with no HDMI 2.1 at a high MSRP, when the value of these units may drop like a rock in 12 months when they roll out HDMI 2.1 rev b of the NX9? Any thoughts on whether they would offer a service to send the unit in and have the HDMI upgraded to 2.1? Isn't this the sort of thing Sony did, offering a HDMI upgrade for VW1000 owners to keep their pjs up to date? Other manufactuers are doing this as well - for instance Marantz announced with the launch of the 8805 that down the road when HDMI 2.1 is ready for prime time that they will offer a relatively cheap service to send the unit in and have it upgraded to HDMI 2.1. I feel like if JVC was to offer that option that would be a different story.

That’s a valid concern. I actually bought my Marantz AV8805 only because they offered the upgrade path to HDMI 2.1.


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post #1580 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by DavidHir View Post
Given these 4K units are built from ground up, it shouldn't have been realistically expected they would stay the same price as the current eshift models which platform has been around for years (so they could be sold cheaper due to product maturity). If we extrapolate from these overseas MSRP prices, it makes these new JVCs competitively priced to the Sony 4K lamp models. And let's not forget, native 4K is still in its infancy with front projection given seemingly only two manufacturers offering it (under $25K pricing anyway).
What is "realistic" is what the market will bear/pay for a given performance level.

If these sell like hotcakes and they can't keep them in stock. JVC wins.

If come a year from now there are many more units available than there are reported to be 440/540/640s today, we all make out like bandits on the clearance sales.
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post #1581 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 07:16 PM
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That was in regard to his post about the 65mm N5 and N7 lens.
I'm thinking, not having an e-shift element in the way may help as well.
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post #1582 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 07:19 PM
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You don’t have to like Epson, but you should respect them. They gobble up market share year after year.
Well sure, why not.. They're a perfectly mediocre option. For those that want a "I guess it's pretty good" theater, they're the way to go. But I don't get the point. Sony and JVC are both significantly better. Optoma / BenQ are both cheaper. Epson is sort of just there.

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post #1583 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 07:20 PM
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Well this is interesting. Nice to see JVC managed to impress everyone this year.


I still don't see myself giving up my current RS600 as it has higher contrast than the N7, and I am doubtful the benefits of moving to a true 4K panel will amount to much for me, in terms of cost-to-benefit ratio. I'm just dipping my toes into 4K anyway, so I will keep the RS600 for at least another year.


One thing I'm curious about though: I do like the idea of not having to use things like the HDfury components. Will the new JVCs allow the use of the dynamic iris while showing 4K/HDR? Or would we still need an HDfury for that?
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post #1584 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 07:21 PM
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Originally Posted by 703 View Post
JVC should follow what everyone else is doing, if a unit is a good seller, leave it on the market. You're still making money from it, let the consumers decide. So if the new units is a flop, based on pricing or whatever, then you still have a safety net.

Apple is still selling the 4 year old iphone6 disguised as an iPoD. Nothing wrong with that. People who want the latest model can, people who want the n-1 model can too.

The new JVC price doesn’t overlap with the old anyway?
I wouldn't worry, I think the sales of the e-shift models were tapering off, with some folks jumping ship to the competition. In a few years these 4k models would have caught up to the contrast of their outgoing brethren.

Grab an e-shift model now if you're a contrast fiend like me.
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post #1585 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 07:24 PM
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Originally Posted by R Harkness View Post
Well this is interesting. Nice to see JVC managed to impress everyone this year.


I still don't see myself giving up my current RS600 as it has higher contrast than the N7, and I am doubtful the benefits of moving to a true 4K panel will amount to much for me, in terms of cost-to-benefit ratio. I'm just dipping my toes into 4K anyway, so I will keep the RS600 for at least another year.


One thing I'm curious about though: I do like the idea of not having to use things like the HDfury components. Will the new JVCs allow the use of the dynamic iris while showing 4K/HDR? Or would we still need an HDfury for that?

They did away with the need for the HD Fury with the RS640, the iris works in HDR mode with it. I guess, so will it with the new models.
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post #1586 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by lovingdvd View Post
One question that keeps going around in my head is how does JVC expect to sell many NX9 units with no HDMI 2.1 at a high MSRP, when the value of these units may drop like a rock in 12 months when they roll out HDMI 2.1 rev b of the NX9? Any thoughts on whether they would offer a service to send the unit in and have the HDMI upgraded to 2.1? Isn't this the sort of thing Sony did, offering a HDMI upgrade for VW1000 owners to keep their pjs up to date? Other manufactuers are doing this as well - for instance Marantz announced with the launch of the 8805 that down the road when HDMI 2.1 is ready for prime time that they will offer a relatively cheap service to send the unit in and have it upgraded to HDMI 2.1. I feel like if JVC was to offer that option that would be a different story.
Because 4K *barely* makes a difference at seating distances. 8K is going to be even less of an impact and require you to be sitting about 4-6 feet from a 130" or bigger screen to even see it. No one is going to be ditching the NX9 for NX9v2 for 8k eshift.

NX9, on paper, sounds perfect to me. A replaceable lamp so I dont have to throw the projector away in a few years, contrast of the RS line with native 4K for games. I'll probably have to buy it.,
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post #1587 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 07:29 PM
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... contrast of the RS line ...
But it does not have that. They don't even claim that it does.
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post #1588 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 07:32 PM
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Because 4K *barely* makes a difference at seating distances. 8K is going to be even less of an impact and require you to be sitting about 4-6 feet from a 130" or bigger screen to even see it. No one is going to be ditching the NX9 for NX9v2 for 8k eshift.

NX9, on paper, sounds perfect to me. A replaceable lamp so I dont have to throw the projector away in a few years, contrast of the RS line with native 4K for games. I'll probably have to buy it.,
They(JVC) are hesitant to talk about how those contrast figures are achieved, is it true native or quasi native? remains to be confirmed.

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Originally Posted by CrazyEddie View Post
But it does not have that. They don't even claim that it does.
100K:1 native contrast is extremely close to the 130K:1 native of the RS540, and the RS440 claims 40K:1 native, which is the exact native of the N5, half of the N7 etc. So I'd say it does have the native contrast of the RS line.

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They(JVC) are hesitant to talk about how those contrast figures are achieved, is it true native or quasi native? remains to be confirmed.
JVC has never exaggerated its contrast measurements. No reason to think they started now. Feel free to be in disbelief, I believe it. Of course, I'll wait for a couple reviewers to verify before I buy anything.

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post #1590 of 13653 Old 08-31-2018, 07:50 PM
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They(JVC) are hesitant to talk about how those contrast figures are achieved, is it true native or quasi native? remains to be confirmed.
JVC has given the native contrast and they have confirmed that the manual iris is not closing down any more than the current generation, as some questioned. So it sure looks like real contrast to me. So I would guess 30,000+ for the NX9 with iris wide open.
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