Official Sony VPL-VW295ES Owners Thread - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 08:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Des511 View Post
Another owners thread ruined.
There are a few 295 owners over at the JVC thread hammering "them" too...
I don't understand why all this is taken so seriously, it's just a forum on projectors, it's quite entertaining actually.
Life's too short to get upset over all of this.
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post #62 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Des511 View Post
Another owners thread ruined.
I agree they have nothing better to do but troll in the forums. Not sure what their problem is but I've never seen it like this reminds of the HDVD vs Blu Ray Days. People cannot enjoy their projectors with other potential members with out having idiots jump in the threads and just ruin it for everyone. They're life must be absolutely boring too stoop down these levels.

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post #63 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 09:30 AM
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Have people that read Ekki's review of the 270/295 and 570/695 had any luck in understanding what he is saying about tone mapping? He seems to indicate that the new Sony's have an option for dynamic tone mapping which functions similar to HDR10+ on a frame by frame basis. Is this correct? There was absolutely no mention of this feature at CEDIA or at IFA. In addition he says ANSI contrast is now around 400 and that the native contrast was improved. Again no mention of this at CEDIA or IFA. If Ekki is correct or if there isn't something terribly wrong with google translate then it seems there was a lot that was not mentioned at CEDIA and IFA on these new projectors.

P.S. OK after further review, it seems that Ekki is calling the "Contrast Enhancer" option, the dynamic tone mapping he is describing. While contrast enhancer is nice, there is no way I call it equivalent to "dynamic tone mapping" and I would never say it was similar to HDR10+. That is just a ridiculous distortion of the what the "Contrast Enhancer" does. That is why Sony didn't mention it at CEDIA and IFA. It is nothing new.

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post #64 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 09:47 AM
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I never talked about the comparison, I was only speaking about of the Sony blacks themselves.

Let’s stop derailing this thread. We each said what we’re going to say. I’m not calling you a liar or that your images are rigged. I am only saying “my” Sonys were never that bad, so maybe it could’ve been calibrated it a little better (gamma, etc.).
I will say that in my experience, comparing the RS640 and Sony 385ES (which I posted about almost a year ago) I had both in my room at the exact same time running through a Lumagen Pro and in my viewing I never saw that drastic difference. That was in any combination of iris open/closed, dynamic iris on/off. Yes the 640 is better, and the 385 would have the same native as a 285 and it never looked that bad.
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post #65 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Franin View Post
I agree they have nothing better to do but troll in the forums. Not sure what their problem is but I've never seen it like this reminds of the HDVD vs Blu Ray Days. People cannot enjoy their projectors with other potential members with out having idiots jump in the threads and just ruin it for everyone. They're life must be absolutely boring too stoop down these levels.

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It's tough, but every thread ends up that way, people have to get their word in. I honestly feel bad for anyone who gets a 295/695 this year and posts about it, as it feels like they are looked down on because they didn't go JVC. Any of these new projectors are going to be awesome and provide years of enjoyment.
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post #66 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 10:45 AM
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Can we see some more pictures from the owners?!

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post #67 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 01:06 PM
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Originally Posted by JeffR1 View Post
There are a few 295 owners over at the JVC thread hammering "them" too...
I don't understand why all this is taken so seriously, it's just a forum on projectors, it's quite entertaining actually.
Life's too short to get upset over all of this.
LMAO, I concur. Much of it reeks of why I stopped coaching little league...too many adults acting like kids!


I am anxious to see where the 295 lands in the performance arena. I keep harping on it, but the N5 IS $1000/20% more than the 295, so even if it has superior tone-mapping/improved contrast, it still will come at a premium. Not huge, but considerable nonetheless for guys (like me!) who are already STRETCHING it by even considering $5k on a projector.

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post #68 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 01:17 PM
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Even though I am trying a JVC for the first time this cycle, I really enjoyed my Sony 385 that I just sold. Very sharp picture, very vivid picture, great with motion, low lag for gaming, great detail, and the contrast was the best I ever had in my room. I do have to admit this forum overall is very JVC centric but in my opinion, you can't just isolate contrast and say that which ever projector has the best contrast wins...there is so much more to a good picture. I really loved the reality creation and the motion flow on the Sony projectors. The one thing I will say (and this is my opinion only), the Sony missed on pricing this year. The 295 is priced just fine but the upper models are not inline with the market. A 5K premium for the 695 over the 295...I just don't see it....they are 90% the same machine. The 695 is the one I was personally considering, which is the main reason I switched to JVC this year to try the N7.

Anyways, enjoy your new toys gentlemen. They throw a great picture based on what I saw from the previous generation Sony's.
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post #69 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 02:58 PM
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Just picked up my 295 today. Just have to run some speaker wire and HDMI cable and I should have her up and running tonight. Initial impressions after popping my hw50es off the chief mount:

The 295 is a beast compared to the hw50es. Weighs a lot more and is just a larger projector.

Purchased a new chief plate recommended by my dealer to try out to make it easier to change bulb and clean filter. Honestly it is a full medal plate rather than arms and I heartily recommend it. Feels much sturdier than standard "arm" chief plate for holding this larger projector.

Have not hung it or powered on - waiting for an electrician to show up to help me run some conduit. Have a 20 meter fiber optic HDMI cable and cat 6 to run along with some speaker wire in the ceiling for my new ATMOS speakers. Then it's off to the races.

Have to agree with @Frohlich and @mastermaybe above. I feel the 295 is optimally positioned when compared to other 4k projectors in this range. And the street price allowed me to make other upgrades that I could not have done had I gone a different direction. I have always been a "sound first" guy anyway so upgrading from an Integra DHC 80.3 "9.4" system to a Marantz 8805 and going 9.4.4 Atmos and running 13 speaker channels with 4 subs will be a ball. Can't wait to see what 4k and Atmos do for the gaming and movie experience!
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post #70 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 04:43 PM
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Dang- electrician showed up late. Having to delay until tomorrow evening. Stay tuned.
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post #71 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 04:51 PM
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Dang- electrician showed up late. Having to delay until tomorrow evening. Stay tuned.
Congrats looking forward to your thoughts on the Sony

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post #72 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 05:10 PM
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Debating between the Sony 695es or JVC N7 ... I game alot and value the lower input lag but I also love the idea of HDR tone mapping and great black levels. I currently have the 540rs (790r) so I dont think I can go down in black levels dramatically.

Any reviews or previews for the 695es?

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post #73 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Domcorleone View Post
Debating between the Sony 695es or JVC N7 ... I game alot and value the lower input lag but I also love the idea of HDR tone mapping and great black levels. I currently have the 540rs (790r) so I dont think I can go down in black levels dramatically.

Any reviews or previews for the 695es?
For the money the N7 is much better than the Sony 695. It has much better native contrast, a better lens, automatic tone mapping, larger color space, and better black levels.

The Sony input lag is around 27 ms. The JVC input lag hasn't been confirmed with measurements yet but low lag mode is probably around 35 ms. I doubt you would feel know the difference.

Having said that, both projectors are a good buy. I just think Sony over priced the 695 compared to the competition.
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post #74 of 675 Old 10-23-2018, 10:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Frohlich View Post
........ I do have to admit this forum overall is very JVC centric but in my opinion, you can't just isolate contrast and say that which ever projector has the best contrast wins...there is so much more to a good picture. ........

Exactly why I decided to choose the BenQ LK970. Overall I felt it beat every other option in its price range, for what “I” wanted and needed.



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Lol now I’m not sure if you’re serious or just giving me a hard time here. Think about it. It’s a photo of what was on the screen at the time. Therefore the left side will photo darker than the right and the resultant photo will have raised blacks compared to the left. You can’t expect the right side to look anything how it looks in real life on the 285es. In fact, if you display the left side on your Sony, the result of that is what the photo of the right side is on a display that can display absolute black.



The only thing you can take from the photo is the relationship between the two projectors not the actual colors as displayed in the photo on your monitor / projector.

Yes I know. Giving the “post” a hard time, not you personally. I’m just wondering why you waited until now to mention this nugget of info. You seemed to leave the original out there hanging for anyone to think that’s what it really is in real life. Without my pushing it, it would’ve been left to be misinterpreted without that caveat.
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post #75 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 12:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Dave Harper View Post
Yes I know. Giving the “post” a hard time, not you personally. I’m just wondering why you waited until now to mention this nugget of info. You seemed to leave the original out there hanging for anyone to think that’s what it really is in real life. Without my pushing it, it would’ve been left to be misinterpreted without that caveat.
Dude there's no caveat. That *is* how it looks in real life as a comparison. You have not served to clear up some big misnomer. It's exactly as I said. If you put the JVC and the Sony 285ES side-by-side and display a single black starfield image with the left half of the sony lens covered and the right half of the jvc lens covered (I used a cereal box), your eye will see what my photo showed. Just as my camera saw it. The original image was pure black and stars. The left side looked pretty close to pure black with stars. The right side looked pretty close to dark grey with stars just as the photo shows.

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post #76 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 12:37 AM
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Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post

When I had my 285ES next to my JVC RS500, here is how they looked together on say a star field scene.
You probably should not post that picture without making it VERY clear that its not a real photo and its your interpretation on the differences.

We dont want to reduce the integrity of photographic comparisons if we can help it, especially since I post a ton myself, and have never doctored any of them. I want people on the forum to believe if we post a picture its real. This is not real.

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post #77 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 12:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Domcorleone View Post
Debating between the Sony 695es or JVC N7 ... I game alot and value the lower input lag but I also love the idea of HDR tone mapping and great black levels. I currently have the 540rs (790r) so I dont think I can go down in black levels dramatically.

Any reviews or previews for the 695es?
So after not being able to tolerate the lack of blacks on the 285ES, I went and traded it for a 675ES. The 675ES is extremely similar to the 695ES you're considering. In area of contrast, lumens, and blacks, it's going to be about the same. The 675ES (and by extension the 695ES) is a lot better on blacks due to the iris, and the added 300 lumens is extremely noticeable over the 285/295ES.

However, the blacks still didnt cut it for me so I got an RS640. My RS640 and your RS540 are nearly equal performers. So for a while I had both the 675ES and RS640 in my room on a dual mount. The black performance on the RS640 was so much better I just couldn't handle the 675ES anymore for any sort of TV that had blacks. (I was marathon watching The Expanse and watch a lot of SciFi).

I ended up using the 675ES only for games as native 4K and Sony's reality creation was a great setup for games. The RS640 I use for all TV and movies as the native 4K is not as noticeable on video content.

If you value the blacks and don't want to go down in black levels dramatically, you'll have to stick with an N7 or NX9. The N5 is probably going to be a little too much of a drop in blacks. And unfortunately, there's nothing in the Sony lineup that will come close in blacks. As other's have stated, there's more to picture quality than blacks. But if blacks are important to you (as they are for me), the 695ES won't cut it for you.

If you'd like a good comparison that you can test now. Put your RS540 into low lamp. Put the iris to -3 and set it to manual. Now go play some stuff that tests black performance. This is extremely close to where you'll find the 695ES with its full iris running if dynamic iris is enabled and it's set to around 40 (favoring dark performance). The fade-to-black with the sony running its iris will be about right on with the fade to black on the RS540 running manual iris -3 low lamp. Of course on a star field, while the RS540 at -3 manual might simulate the 695ES blacks, the stars will be significantly brighter. On the sony star field scenes, the stars sort of disappear as the projector dims the light.

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post #78 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 12:46 AM
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and yet he’s never seen a 295ES, a 695ES, or any of the native 4K JVCs.

So how about you troll the 285ES or 675ES thread? This is the 295ES thread.
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post #79 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 06:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaotikr1 View Post
It's tough, but every thread ends up that way, people have to get their word in. I honestly feel bad for anyone who gets a 295/695 this year and posts about it, as it feels like they are looked down on because they didn't go JVC. Any of these new projectors are going to be awesome and provide years of enjoyment.

The new JVC's are viciously outpacing the Sony's in one category right now: HYPE
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post #80 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 06:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Domcorleone View Post
Debating between the Sony 695es or JVC N7 ... I game alot and value the lower input lag but I also love the idea of HDR tone mapping and great black levels. I currently have the 540rs (790r) so I dont think I can go down in black levels dramatically.

Any reviews or previews for the 695es?
I am expecting to see a VW695ES in the next week or so but here are some reviews I have seen.

http://cine4home.de/sony-vpl-vw270-v...serienschnitt/

http://www.passionhomecinema.fr/blog...is-de-gregory/
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post #81 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 06:51 AM
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reality creation
What is this, really? I see press releases back to 1997, it seems they keep redefining it depending on the product. What is it for these projectors?
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post #82 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 09:24 AM
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Well I just received my projector (a 295) this weekend. Only got to watch a few clips from a couple of movies in 4K from my Oppo player and I thought it was fantastic. Haven’t tweaked anything yet but thought out of box it was pretty good. I also tested out a Epson 4010 the week before and thought it was pretty good but the projector had a power issue and kept turning itself off over and over, so sent it back. I am replacing a JVC RS-420 but can’t stand it. I absolutely hate that it takes about 20+ seconds to HDMI handshake between resolution changes....completely unacceptable. (This was my second JVC projector and both were irritating in this regard). It also could not play HDR movies correctly. Now I will need to sell it and take a loss, but I’m happy with the new projector and don’t mind the money I paid since it will be great for years to come. Glad that JVC people love their projectors, but I for one don’t like them (this is personal preference).
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post #83 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by fedxing View Post
and yet he’s never seen a 295ES, a 695ES, or any of the native 4K JVCs.

So how about you troll the 285ES or 675ES thread? This is the 295ES thread.
To be fair there are no real differences between last year's 285 and this year's 295 other than 18 Gbps HDMI ports and better video processing to support 4k @60hz HDR10. Other than that the 4k panels are the same, the light output is the same, the chasis and design is the same, it's the exact same projector. The same holds true for the 695 and last year's 675.

Also the comparison he is showing is between a 640 and a 285. Of course the black levels will be better on the JVC, it has both a manual and dynamic iris. That star field is where the difference will show up the most. You won't see that big of difference on a bright scene with blacks as it takes the DI out of the picture.
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post #84 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by seijai2008 View Post
Well I just received my projector (a 295) this weekend. Only got to watch a few clips from a couple of movies in 4K from my Oppo player and I thought it was fantastic. Haven’t tweaked anything yet but thought out of box it was pretty good. I also tested out a Epson 4010 the week before and thought it was pretty good but the projector had a power issue and kept turning itself off over and over, so sent it back. I am replacing a JVC RS-420 but can’t stand it. I absolutely hate that it takes about 20+ seconds to HDMI handshake between resolution changes....completely unacceptable. (This was my second JVC projector and both were irritating in this regard). It also could not play HDR movies correctly. Now I will need to sell it and take a loss, but I’m happy with the new projector and don’t mind the money I paid since it will be great for years to come. Glad that JVC people love their projectors, but I for one don’t like them (this is personal preference).
I felt the same way about the RS420 I had. I eventually bought the RS540 and it is literally a night and day difference in all respects The handshaking is dramatically reduced (about 10 sec now) and the black levels, HDR, light output just blow the 420 away. However, given the size of my living room and the fact that I will be using a shelf I am leaning towards the 695es due to the lighter build and low input lag. It really depends how much of a drop I will get in blacks and how the HDR performs on the Sony.
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post #85 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 09:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaotikr1 View Post
I am expecting to see a VW695ES in the next week or so but here are some reviews I have seen.

http://cine4home.de/sony-vpl-vw270-v...serienschnitt/

http://www.passionhomecinema.fr/blog...is-de-gregory/
Thank you for this. I'm hoping google translate comes through for me! lol
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post #86 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 10:03 AM
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Originally Posted by GregCh View Post
To be fair there are no real differences between last year's 285 and this year's 295 other than 18 Gbps HDMI ports and better video processing to support 4k @60hz HDR10. Other than that the 4k panels are the same, the light output is the same, the chasis and design is the same, it's the exact same projector. The same holds true for the 695 and last year's 675.

Also the comparison he is showing is between a 640 and a 285. Of course the black levels will be better on the JVC, it has both a manual and dynamic iris. That star field is where the difference will show up the most. You won't see that big of difference on a bright scene with blacks as it takes the DI out of the picture.
Not quite, the 295 does frame interpolation at 4K, that's a huge feature improvement for someone like me who uses that.
I also read that lenses were improved as well.

And to nit-pick, the chassis is a CM higher in the base to make room for the new circuit board.

Honestly too, my 300es still looks pretty good when viewing reference material like "Ant-Man And The Wasp", I would expect that the 295es would look much better still.

Last edited by JeffR1; 10-24-2018 at 10:06 AM.
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post #87 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffR1 View Post
Not quite, the 295 does frame interpolation at 4K, that's a huge feature improvement for someone like me who uses that.
I also read that lenses were improved as well.

And to nit-pick, the chassis is a CM higher in the base to make room for the new circuit board.

Honestly too, my 300es still looks pretty good when viewing reference material like "Ant-Man And The Wasp", I would expect that the 295es would look much better still.
I did mention that the video processors were updated. That is the reason for the 4k frame interpolation.

The lens system is the same. There had been some mention of improved lens but then Ekki measured it as being the same but that video processing was improved which helped the image. Focus operation was also improved with the new video processors.

However, my point was that MarkMon1's comparison is still a valid one as the contrast level of the 295 has not changed from the 285. Again remember that this is comparing a 640 with a manual and Dynamic Iris, higher light output, and much higher retail price to a 285, using a star field which is probably the best case scenario for DI improvement over non-DI. Most content won't show the same level of contrast difference.
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post #88 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregCh View Post
I did mention that the video processors were updated. That is the reason for the 4k frame interpolation.

The lens system is the same. There had been some mention of improved lens but then Ekki measured it as being the same but that video processing was improved which helped the image. Focus operation was also improved with the new video processors.

However, my point was that MarkMon1's comparison is still a valid one as the contrast level of the 295 has not changed from the 285. Again remember that this is comparing a 640 with a manual and Dynamic Iris, higher light output, and much higher retail price to a 285, using a star field which is probably the best case scenario for DI improvement over non-DI. Most content won't show the same level of contrast difference.
Right now with the language barrier and some-what poor translation, I'm not putting a whole lot of stock in what Ekki is saying right now.
I, like others, will wait patiently until Nigel, Javs etc. do some comparison testing.

Don't get me wrong here, I'm sure that Ekki is more then capable, but he's just one reviewer, I wish he would comment here "in English" _ where did he go again ?
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post #89 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 10:41 AM
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I see that this projector have only 1500 lumens. So I guess it can't be watched in moderate or low ambient light?
I have an Optoma UHD550X which has 2800 lumens so I can watch it with moderate or low ambient light. But I am wondering to sell it because of the rainbow effects.
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post #90 of 675 Old 10-24-2018, 03:34 PM
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So I received my 295es today, yay!! I'm finally in the club. As I said before my theater isn't finished yet so this bad boy was only pulled out to test before going very carefully back into the box. I plugged it in and hooked up my xbox one s to see that it was working. Can't display 4k with this xbox so it will need to wait until the room is finished and I can get my pc and audio equipment hooked up. Super excited though!

Test image is only 7 ft from the wall and I adjusted absolutely nothing. Going from a 10 year old projector meant for presentations to this bad boy, the brightness and clarity is astounding to me. Can't wait to see some real reviews from the rest of the club.
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