Official Sony VPL-VW695ES Owners Thread - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 549 Old 11-14-2018, 10:15 AM
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I am not sure that the 665 actually supports HDR with it's native firmware. I think it was released before HDR10 was standardized and it doesn't really have the features to handle HDR.

There might be a firmware update for the 665 that makes it pseudo HDR compatible. Check with Sony Support page and see if you are running the latest firmware. There might be some 665 users on this board that have experience with the update process.

Possibly the refurbished unit was loaded with the original non-HDR support firmware. Do you have options in the menu for BT 2020 color space and HDR/SDR/Auto option?

If you do then it should work fine with AppleTV 4k HDR content.
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post #32 of 549 Old 11-14-2018, 10:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Archibald1 View Post
Indeed! The better processing has changing the relevant settings so much, that the settings used on the outgoing units cannot really be used for comparison on these new units. Especially in HDR.
Well, this is kind of surprising to me.

I was under the impression everything remained the same except for RC, the HDR reference mode, lower lag input for gaming and ofcourse the 18Gbps capability?

So you're saying the 695ES (and 295ES too for that matter) actually does a better job at (HDR) picture performance than the 385ES (apart from more lumens)?

Anyone else care to elaborate on this? If this is truly the case, then perhaps it would have been worthwile getting the 695ES over the 385ES after all...
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post #33 of 549 Old 11-15-2018, 08:59 AM
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Well, this is kind of surprising to me.

I was under the impression everything remained the same except for RC, the HDR reference mode, lower lag input for gaming and ofcourse the 18Gbps capability?

So you're saying the 695ES (and 295ES too for that matter) actually does a better job at (HDR) picture performance than the 385ES (apart from more lumens)?

Anyone else care to elaborate on this? If this is truly the case, then perhaps it would have been worthwile getting the 695ES over the 385ES after all...
Hi.
If they are anything like the 760 (they apparently share the same mainboards) then the way that HDR is processed and adjusted on screen will be different in so far as to where you set contrast and brightness etc.
I would say that the better processing does improve HDR performance as a result. Though maybe not to the same degree as the dynamic tone mapping used on the new JVC's.
IMO Sony needs to release firmware updates for all current models with a dynamic tone mapping facility to match JVC's. I suspect it will just be added to next years models though as why should anyone get any support for these things. Just buy a new one every year!
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post #34 of 549 Old 11-15-2018, 09:20 AM
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Hi.
If they are anything like the 760 (they apparently share the same mainboards) then the way that HDR is processed and adjusted on screen will be different in so far as to where you set contrast and brightness etc.
I would say that the better processing does improve HDR performance as a result. Though maybe not to the same degree as the dynamic tone mapping used on the new JVC's.
IMO Sony needs to release firmware updates for all current models with a dynamic tone mapping facility to match JVC's. I suspect it will just be added to next years models though as why should anyone get any support for these things. Just buy a new one every year!
I personally doubt whether there is any improvement in HDR performance from last year. My bet is that the 385 properly setup and calibrated will perform identical to the 695 with HDR content other than the differences between additional brightness and the obvious 18Gbps HDMI improvement with improved 4k motion processing.

I know that Sony will never release free firmware adding a tone mapping module to the projector to match JVC. Sony never releases firmware to add features. They might release firmware to fix features, maybe, but never to add features. Heck, they won't even release firmware that could make the 760/885 have a functional dynamic iris or improve on the dynamic dimming in the laser light engine.

Most likely, Sony will just add HDR tone mapping next year to the 695 and above so that they can continue to market those projectors way above the 295.
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post #35 of 549 Old 11-15-2018, 11:03 AM
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No big differences. I would say reality creation seems a bit more detailed. Input lag in 4K has been reduced to 21ms-27ms depending on if you believe JVC or Sony. If you enjoy the picture your 385ES throws then I think you would be more than happy with a 695ES.
It does seem as we get better and better technology, it becomes harder and harder to improve......
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post #36 of 549 Old 11-19-2018, 07:38 AM
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Ordered my Sony 695 today. Had the Sony 385 which I loved but sold it for the new JVC 4k line-up to try something new but those were delayed in to 2019 per an update this morning so looking forward to keeping my Sony relationship going. This will be my 4th Sony projector and excited to receive it...hopefully later this week.
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post #37 of 549 Old 11-19-2018, 09:09 AM
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Ordered my Sony 695 today. Had the Sony 385 which I loved but sold it for the new JVC 4k line-up to try something new but those were delayed in to 2019 per an update this morning so looking forward to keeping my Sony relationship going. This will be my 4th Sony projector and excited to receive it...hopefully later this week.
Looking forward to your impressions. Have had those thoughts myself along with a screen upgrade.

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post #38 of 549 Old 11-19-2018, 09:14 AM
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Looking forward to your impressions. Have had those thoughts myself along with a screen upgrade.

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I did have a follow up discussion with my dealer and told me to hold off one more day until the JVC news is confirmed. So my order isn't official yet for the Sony but I know where this is going with JVC. Europe found out first last time about the delay and it looks like they likely found out first again this time. So unless JVC comes back and officially says no delay, I am going with the Sony 695

BTW, I noticed you were in Lexington. I am in Cincinnati but my daughter goes to UK for Engineering
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post #39 of 549 Old 11-19-2018, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Frohlich View Post
Ordered my Sony 695 today. Had the Sony 385 which I loved but sold it for the new JVC 4k line-up to try something new but those were delayed in to 2019 per an update this morning so looking forward to keeping my Sony relationship going. This will be my 4th Sony projector and excited to receive it...hopefully later this week.
Nice!

Looking forward in reading your observations.

Since you were a 385 owner (which I currently still am), I am especially interested in how you will experience the differences between them, since I almost wanted to sell my 385 in favor of the 695.
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post #40 of 549 Old 11-19-2018, 10:29 AM
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I did have a follow up discussion with my dealer and told me to hold off one more day until the JVC news is confirmed. So my order isn't official yet for the Sony but I know where this is going with JVC. Europe found out first last time about the delay and it looks like they likely found out first again this time. So unless JVC comes back and officially says no delay, I am going with the Sony 695

BTW, I noticed you were in Lexington. I am in Cincinnati but my daughter goes to UK for Engineering
I noticed you were in cinci. My daughter just graduated Uk in May and will start PA school in January. I have a local dealer here that is stronger with Sony than Jvc. I have the 385es and was finally able to get Chad to calibrate it.

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post #41 of 549 Old 11-19-2018, 12:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Frohlich View Post
Ordered my Sony 695 today. Had the Sony 385 which I loved but sold it for the new JVC 4k line-up to try something new but those were delayed in to 2019 per an update this morning so looking forward to keeping my Sony relationship going. This will be my 4th Sony projector and excited to receive it...hopefully later this week.
I figured I was going to be the only 695 owner on the forums.

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post #42 of 549 Old 11-19-2018, 01:05 PM
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I did have a follow up discussion with my dealer and told me to hold off one more day until the JVC news is confirmed. So my order isn't official yet for the Sony but I know where this is going with JVC. Europe found out first last time about the delay and it looks like they likely found out first again this time. So unless JVC comes back and officially says no delay, I am going with the Sony 695

BTW, I noticed you were in Lexington. I am in Cincinnati but my daughter goes to UK for Engineering
I can't believe you are considering the 695. This has to be the most overpriced product in Sony's line about on par with the 885. I can see moving from 385 to the new JVC NX7 but not for the 695. Are you sure you can't just gut the wait out? We don't know for sure what the wait will be but my guess is that it will only be a couple of weeks or so.
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post #43 of 549 Old 11-19-2018, 01:09 PM
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I figured I was going to be the only 695 owner on the forums.
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I can't believe you are considering the 695. This has to be the most overpriced product in Sony's line about on par with the 885. I can see moving from 385 to the new JVC NX7 but not for the 695. Are you sure you can't just gut the wait out? We don't know for sure what the wait will be but my guess is that it will only be a couple of weeks or so.
I don't know if you saw my second post but I am waiting one more day so my order for the 695 is on hold for one more day. Looking for an official update from JVC on timing to U.S. which it looks like we will get tomorrow. If they are delayed into 2019, I need to do something. My prime HT viewing is done over the winter as during the summer I spend a lot of time outside and am a golfaholic (my other hobby). I can't miss the whole "season" waiting on JVC. The only reason I would get the Sony is because my friend is a dealer and I get very friendly pricing. I would not buy it anywhere near retail
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post #44 of 549 Old 11-19-2018, 01:10 PM - Thread Starter
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I don't know if you saw my second post but I am waiting one more day so my order for the 695 is on hold for one more day. Looking for an official update from JVC on timing to U.S. which it looks like we will get tomorrow. If they are delayed into 2019, I need to do something. My prime HT viewing is done over the winter as during the summer I spend a lot of time outside and am a golfaholic (my other hobby). I can't miss the whole "season" waiting on JVC. The only reason I would get the Sony is because my friend is a dealer and I get very friendly pricing. I would not buy it anywhere near retail
I am with you on the pricing for sure.

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post #45 of 549 Old 11-26-2018, 09:30 AM
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I personally doubt whether there is any improvement in HDR performance from last year. My bet is that the 385 properly setup and calibrated will perform identical to the 695 with HDR content other than the differences between additional brightness and the obvious 18Gbps HDMI improvement with improved 4k motion processing.

I know that Sony will never release free firmware adding a tone mapping module to the projector to match JVC. Sony never releases firmware to add features. They might release firmware to fix features, maybe, but never to add features. Heck, they won't even release firmware that could make the 760/885 have a functional dynamic iris or improve on the dynamic dimming in the laser light engine.

Most likely, Sony will just add HDR tone mapping next year to the 695 and above so that they can continue to market those projectors way above the 295.
Isnt the 695 more of a successor to the 675 than the 385? The 675/695 have the same dynamic contrast levels and same lumens.

Are there any more reviews of this thing in the wild or video of its performance? I'm strongly considering going with the 695es, RS2000 or (if I manage to magically come into money) RS3000
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post #46 of 549 Old 11-26-2018, 09:49 AM
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I talked with the Sony engineers about this before CEDIA. The issue they have (and pretty much all the other PJ manufacturers) is that they setup the contrast adjustment to center around what nit value you are trying to tone map to. So 1000 nits, 2000 nits, 4000 nits, etc. But they don't have anything that provides an input to the projector on what your actual peak brightness level is with your setup. So these tone maps are all generica to a peak white value that we don't know and probably isn't anywhere near yours. From what I've been told, Sony sets their tone map by zooming the image to the size of their flat panel (which thereby creates a VERY high peak brightness level) and then adjusts their tone map to PQ and then assumes that it will stay linear for larger screens. That does not work. They need to have a tone map adjustment that centers on a peak value and then an adjustment for telling the projector how bright it is for that tone map. This is what you see with the Panasonic UB820 and the Radiance Pro and so far it looks like the new JVC models will do something similar.

I'm hoping I got through to the Sony engineers on this, but it is hard to say. If I do a review of one of the new projectors I will definitely bring it up in hopes that it can be added later or in future models.
Hi Kris,

I've been interested in going with a Sony this time around (currently have JVC x790R). I was told by another poster that you have been using the 885ES for some time. Could you give me a little bit of your opinions on it? Specifically related to HDR performance and black levels vs JVC and cheaper Sony models (specifically 385/675/695ES)?

I've heard the lens isnt as good as the 45000 but since I cant afford that one anyway I'm curious to know how it performs overall. Any info would most helpful!
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post #47 of 549 Old 11-26-2018, 09:52 AM
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Isnt the 695 more of a successor to the 675 than the 385? The 675/695 have the same dynamic contrast levels and same lumens.

Are there any more reviews of this thing in the wild or video of its performance? I'm strongly considering going with the 695es, RS2000 or (if I manage to magically come into money) RS3000
Yes, the 695 is a successor to both the 385 and 675. It is more like the 675 in terms of brightness level and dynamic contrast. However it now has the updated motherboard and chipset so that it supports 18 Gbps HDMI and improved 4k motion processing. Since the cheaper 385 which was at the price sweetspot for Sony 4k projectors with a working iris, has been discontinued now US buyers are forced to pay the marked up 675/695. This projector is marked up in the US $3000 over European pricing.

For some reason Sony is marking up US pricing for the 695, 885, and 995 compared to the rest of the world. They have been doing it for several years with the 675 and then later added the 885 and 995.

Previously the only difference between the 675 and the 385 besides $7000, was about 300 lumens of light output and a slightly more optimistic Dynamic Iris. Native contrast, lens system, chasis, and chipset was all identical.
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post #48 of 549 Old 11-26-2018, 10:27 AM
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Hi Kris,

I've been interested in going with a Sony this time around (currently have JVC x790R). I was told by another poster that you have been using the 885ES for some time. Could you give me a little bit of your opinions on it? Specifically related to HDR performance and black levels vs JVC and cheaper Sony models (specifically 385/675/695ES)?

I've heard the lens isnt as good as the 45000 but since I cant afford that one anyway I'm curious to know how it performs overall. Any info would most helpful!
The HDR performance on the 885 is pretty typical of what projectors from last year offer. It gets the job done, but leaves a lot to be desired. Mainly on the low end, where the image is too dark. Some movies look fine, others way too dim. And the settings in the projector don't give you any real ability to bump up the overall picture level. So if you go with the 885 I HIGHLY recommend something like the UB820 4K player so that you can get better tone mapping.

Black levels are contrast will take a noticeable hit compared to your JVC. The projector is brighter overall, but limited in how you can deal with that light depending on your screen size. Obviously this is a native 4K projector so perception of sharpness on screen could be better depending again on your setup (screen size, viewing distance, room) but the added contrast of the JVC line does a great job of closing that gap depending on the setup. I have a RS600 and the 885 in my room side by side for quite some time and on my screen (10' wide scope screen) I actually preferred the image from the JVC when tone mapping was handled by an external source for both (to optimize HDR playback). The added contrast and wider color gamut of the JVC provided a richer image IMHO. But the 885ES is still in the upper tier of projectors.

The 995 adds the upgraded lens, and the difference is VERY noticeable (I've been using the 885ES exclusively since August, before installing the 995 last week), far more than I was actually expecting. But the 995 has its quirks too. You can read more about the 885ES and my thoughts on it in the review published on Sound and Vision's website.

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post #49 of 549 Old 11-26-2018, 12:34 PM
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Well, just joined the 695 club since the JVC are officially delayed again. Now there are all of two of us kaotikr1 on this thread that are owners on AVS..maybe Aztar35 will join us soon
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post #50 of 549 Old 11-26-2018, 01:54 PM
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The HDR performance on the 885 is pretty typical of what projectors from last year offer. It gets the job done, but leaves a lot to be desired. Mainly on the low end, where the image is too dark. Some movies look fine, others way too dim. And the settings in the projector don't give you any real ability to bump up the overall picture level. So if you go with the 885 I HIGHLY recommend something like the UB820 4K player so that you can get better tone mapping.

Black levels are contrast will take a noticeable hit compared to your JVC. The projector is brighter overall, but limited in how you can deal with that light depending on your screen size. Obviously this is a native 4K projector so perception of sharpness on screen could be better depending again on your setup (screen size, viewing distance, room) but the added contrast of the JVC line does a great job of closing that gap depending on the setup. I have a RS600 and the 885 in my room side by side for quite some time and on my screen (10' wide scope screen) I actually preferred the image from the JVC when tone mapping was handled by an external source for both (to optimize HDR playback). The added contrast and wider color gamut of the JVC provided a richer image IMHO. But the 885ES is still in the upper tier of projectors.

The 995 adds the upgraded lens, and the difference is VERY noticeable (I've been using the 885ES exclusively since August, before installing the 995 last week), far more than I was actually expecting. But the 995 has its quirks too. You can read more about the 885ES and my thoughts on it in the review published on Sound and Vision's website.
Thank you for the info! Most helpful and certainly makes the decision to go Sony much much harder. I might just stick with JVC.
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post #51 of 549 Old 11-26-2018, 03:04 PM
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Are there any more reviews of this thing in the wild or video of its performance? I'm strongly considering going with the 695es, RS2000 or (if I manage to magically come into money) RS3000
I just recently demo'd the 695ES and came away very impressed. The older model, 675, I demo'd in the same room/conditions didn't look quite like that.

I've owned JVCs and like them a lot and my last JVC was the X990/RS640. The X990 offered up a great lens sample too to go along with outstanding blacks. However, after a while, with HDR tone-mapping, even when using the UB820, I came away a bit disappointed. It's spec'd contrast is at 160,000:1 native but for HDR, who would want to use it that way. I'm not clamping down the iris to -15 for HDR images. So, I wasn't that worried about going native 4K panels like the new JVCs whose native contrast ratio for the NX7 and NX9 is spec'd a little lower than the equivalents of the last series. Anyway, in that anticipation thread, someone made a comment about how good the 695's motion was, so I thought I'd see for myself.

In the end, I preferred the images of the 695ES over the X990's.

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Well, just joined the 695 club since the JVC are officially delayed again. Now there are all of two of us kaotikr1 on this thread that are owners on AVS..maybe Aztar35 will join us soon
What I was trying to explain is that when I left the 695 demo, I kept thinking about how good the motion was. Also, I thought about how there was a certain steadiness and clarity to the whole of the image; it's hard to describe...there was nothing raw about the processing that's for sure.
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post #52 of 549 Old 11-26-2018, 03:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, just joined the 695 club since the JVC are officially delayed again. Now there are all of two of us kaotikr1 on this thread that are owners on AVS..maybe Aztar35 will join us soon
Welcome, since you are a previous Sony owner I think you will be satisfied.
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post #53 of 549 Old 11-26-2018, 03:21 PM
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Since I also game quite a bit, the best in class low lag is welcome by me
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post #54 of 549 Old 11-26-2018, 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Domcorleone View Post

Are there any more reviews of this thing in the wild or video of its performance?
Did you see this review in German? You'll have to use the internet/translate.

http://cine4home.de/sony-vpl-vw270-v...serienschnitt/
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post #55 of 549 Old 11-30-2018, 09:10 AM
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Man , this 695 thread is dead ??? anyone with good experience with 695 vs jvc 790R ???
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post #56 of 549 Old 11-30-2018, 09:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Darknightsw View Post
Man , this 695 thread is dead ??? anyone with good experience with 695 vs jvc 790R ???
I came from a JVC 640 to the 695.

I won't sugar coat it, the Sony does not have the black level that the JVC does. Everything else is very comparable with the Sony having the edge in detail due to 4K. I got a great lens sample on my 695ES and so far after 100 hours I am happy with the Sony.

All these projectors in the 3000+ group throw amazing pictures. I have people over all the time and nobody so far has said anything positive or negative about the Sony vs the JVC. I would guess that nobody even knows the projector was changed out, they are think its so awesome having a big screen movie type experience.

I wanted something with low input lag for gaming and until I get to test the HDMI of the new JVCs I wanted a Sony to fix the issues I was having with getting a black screen with my chain of devices.

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post #57 of 549 Old 11-30-2018, 10:23 AM
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Originally Posted by kaotikr1 View Post
I came from a JVC 640 to the 695.

I won't sugar coat it, the Sony does not have the black level that the JVC does. Everything else is very comparable with the Sony having the edge in detail due to 4K. I got a great lens sample on my 695ES and so far after 100 hours I am happy with the Sony.

All these projectors in the 3000+ group throw amazing pictures. I have people over all the time and nobody so far has said anything positive or negative about the Sony vs the JVC. I would guess that nobody even knows the projector was changed out, they are think its so awesome having a big screen movie type experience.

I wanted something with low input lag for gaming and until I get to test the HDMI of the new JVCs I wanted a Sony to fix the issues I was having with getting a black screen with my chain of devices.
Hi Kaotik , thanks very much for your anwser .

For everything i have read , i start believing that your jvc 640 had everything to be better then the 695 ... maybe even a 790R have better colors, contrast , white /blacks then the 695 no !?!? .. have you tried the 3d on the sony and in your 640 ? 4k hdr ? i doesnt play games on the projector,,, is only for movies . I have demo a 695 and note very convinced with the blacks .. or the brightness .. but in the demo they dont let me try other settings .. and i dont know if the 695 was good calibration .. ( room was totaly dark ) ..

Big thanks for the help.
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post #58 of 549 Old 11-30-2018, 10:26 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Darknightsw View Post
Hi Kaotik , thanks very much for your anwser .

For everything i have read , i start believing that your jvc 640 had everything to be better then the 695 ... maybe even a 790R have better colors, contrast , white /blacks then the 695 no !?!? .. have you tried the 3d on the sony and in your 640 ? 4k hdr ? i doesnt play games on the projector,,, is only for movies . I have demo a 695 and note very convinced with the blacks .. or the brightness .. but in the demo they dont let me try other settings .. and i dont know if the 695 was good calibration .. ( room was totaly dark ) ..

Big thanks for the help.
The 650 was brighter for sure and had better contrast.

White is white and color is color once calibrated.

With no gaming for you, I would recommend the 790 if that is what you are looking at.

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post #59 of 549 Old 11-30-2018, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by kaotikr1 View Post
The 650 was brighter for sure and had better contrast.

White is white and color is color once calibrated.

With no gaming for you, I would recommend the 790 if that is what you are looking at.

I would like to have the best 4k hdr possible ( with good brightnes , beautifull colors, sharpness and deep blacks ) , best 3d possible . And maximum till 5999$ ... at this range i have thought on the jvc 790R almost half of this price but not true 4k, thx 3d certified .. good 3d ? dont know .. , or the new n5 ( if is available almost for sure was my 1st pick ) ... and near or equal to the n5 some price the 695 .. and cry later when the N5 comes out and blow the 695 away .. ( because i m very anxious and tired of waiting all delays of jvc ) .
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post #60 of 549 Old 11-30-2018, 10:53 AM
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The Sony has its advantages and the JVC has its advantages. Reading the JVC threads you'd think you were comparing a Ferrari and an Accord.....its more like a Ferrari and Porsche. Sony has class leading input lag and motion handling. It handles color beautifully when calibrated (actually comes out of the box pretty darn solid) and throws a very very nice image. Honestly, I have seen many projectors over the years. The JVC has better contrast, lens and auto tone mapping. But if you don't have a bat cave with black velvet, you will lose some of the advantage of the JVC. Also you are buying a first generation design while with the Sony you are getting a proven design.

I would recommend getting a demo of the Sony (or any projector you are considering ) and then see if it meets or doesn't meet your needs.
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