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post #61 of 960 Old 01-01-2019, 05:58 PM
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Originally Posted by chhanthony View Post
As a 5 days user of LK990 and a professional calibrator, my comments on this LK990 is:-

1 the user have to lower the contrast from 50 to 30 to get the stable color temp and turns out the lumens have been bring down a lot....but it still have 110 nits in SDR and 200 nit in HDR in a 100" screen, the simple word is the maximum brightness is unusable ;
2. there is no gamma adjustment in HDR mode, the user only can adjust the HDR brightness "HDR -1 -2 0 +1 +2";
3 the color in cinema mode is quite under saturation
4. the picture is dim and flat in HDR mode, I have to adjust the HDR Brightness to "+2" to get an acceptable image brightness, when I turned off the HDR in UB900 the color depth and dynamic is much better in HDR mode.
5. SmartEco can project a true black screen and it works like DC1 on UHZ65
6. the color accuracy is disappointed me especially in HDR mode, the color's brightness is too high and no way to bring it down and the saturation is too under, the color hue also act weird, in playing the Greatest Showman Hugh Jackman's suite should be red but LK990 made it a little bit pink look, the 100% cyan in REC709 is go to green side when 75% cyan is go to blue side. Just like all DLP HDR projector with 25% 50% are under saturation but the 75% is way over.....
Compare to my 3 years old HT1075 entry level 1080P, HT1075 I can get <2 dE in grey scale and most color <1 dE in color checker.........
7. THE MOST WEIRD THING is there has a light border surrounding the image like 0.47 DMD and there have some serious banding in the lower light and high light screen, I took some picture and sent to BenQ and I returned the LK990 to BenQ last Friday as their requested.

I am trying to ask them for return. As I think LK990 is a pre-mature product.
Thanks for the insight Anthony. The list of things that were an issue with the 9050 I reviewed was pretty long as well and made the projector feel like it was not ready for primetime either. I had a nice long talk with their head engineer and the product manager and offered to help them going forward on getting it up to speed, or working on the follow up and they seemed enthuasistic about it. Then it was complete radio silence. Now I see another BenQ that looks like it is having a lot of the same issues. The DPI Enlightener 4K I did a calibration on at Harman was also REALLY bad. I don't understand how what seem like the most basic fundamentals of image science are being completely botched. I can completely understand issues with HDR because of all the hoops you have to jump through to make it work in the projection world, but fundamental playback of other non HDR sources should be a walk in the park now.

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post #62 of 960 Old 01-01-2019, 06:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post
But that leads me right back to the last post, this projector IS SPEC'ED FOR HDR AND IT IS ONE OF THE FIRST THINGS LISTED ON THE WEBPAGE FOR THE PRODUCT! Here is a cut and paste of the FIRST THINGS IT SAYS ON THE PRODUCT PAGE:

"4K HDR Installation Laser Projector with 6000 Lumens | LK990
Ultra-Accurate 4K HDR BlueCore Laser Projection for Enjoying Superb Entertainment Content "

So how is that not spec'ed for HDR or "doesn't do" HDR?? What does "Ultra-Accurate" mean if it doesn't actually use anything resembling ST2084 or something along the lines of BT2390 or some kind of home brewed tone map? How is it ultra accurate if it can't even do 709 color let alone P3 within 2020? If you have to trick it with a HD Fury to even do HDR, the consumer is being LIED to, plain and simple.

It seems there is a little bit of a difference in how we perceive the job of calibration. My job isn't to season a person's display to my tastes, it is to calibrate the image so that it is accurate and faithful to the intended image. From there I can educate a user on options for their own seasoning, or try to inform them of the pros and cons of using different adjustments to get the display to their liking, but it defeats the point of CALIBRATION to take artistic license unless the client specifically says they are looking for something else. I have been calibrating displays for YEARS and I've never heard anyone complain about the images that result. Never comments like dark, dull, washed out, or anything else. If they just want something bright and punchy, there are preset picture modes that can provide that all day long and they can save their money on a calibration. Calibrating images is not only about getting the image the way it is intended, but also educating the consumer on why we do it in the first place.

I completely understand your comments on having to fool around with the settings to get them to work, but you can still apply the same standards in measurements to see if the tweaks you are doing are actually going in the right or wrong direction. That way you can make a more informed decision on whether you're going in the right or wrong direction and what the compromises are in doing so. If you are just shooting in the dark and looking at content to do it, your settings mainly apply only to the content you are watching. Sure that may look good with a good number of items, but it can look equally awful with others. This is why the idea of a single tone map that works across all titles is so ludicrous. But if you are adjusting to a standard that material is actually mastered to (which ALL consumer video is), you have a better chance of making sure that the vast majority of the content looks the way it was intended or close to it. This puts the onus on the material to be right, not the display, and thankfully that is the case more often than not.

Please don't take any of this as an attack. I would LOVE to see your "Harpervision" setup with a bunch of projectors as I've mentioned before. Just because our methodology doesn't necessarily jive doesn't mean that I hold any ill will or don't think you can't enjoy your settings. It is just a difference in approach.
Hi Kris,

This is my LK990 measurement took by CalMAN Video Pro, i1 Pro2 K-10A and ACCuPel DGA6000 Ultra

HDR










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post #63 of 960 Old 01-01-2019, 06:02 PM
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Originally Posted by kris deering View Post
thanks for the insight anthony. The list of things that were an issue with the 9050 i reviewed was pretty long as well and made the projector feel like it was not ready for primetime either. I had a nice long talk with their head engineer and the product manager and offered to help them going forward on getting it up to speed, or working on the follow up and they seemed enthuasistic about it. Then it was complete radio silence. Now i see another benq that looks like it is having a lot of the same issues. The dpi enlightener 4k i did a calibration on at harman was also really bad. I don't understand how what seem like the most basic fundamentals of image science are being completely botched. I can completely understand issues with hdr because of all the hoops you have to jump through to make it work in the projection world, but fundamental playback of other non hdr sources should be a walk in the park now.
sdr
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Anthony Chan
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post #64 of 960 Old 01-01-2019, 06:06 PM
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Thanks Anthony. I don't know if I would have tried to calibrate strictly to PQ though, projectors are designed to be perfect PQ. Have you tried the BT2390 workflow? Might get better results.

Also, since this projector even advertises that it can't even reach 709 fully, I wouldn't have expected much from 2020. I almost feel like with a display like this (despite the light output), converting to SDR709 might be the better approach. Most UHD players will allow this. Then you can calibrate to the appropriate base gamma (typically 2.4), 709 color (which I would hope would have better tracking) and still get the benefits of 10 bit and 4K.

After spending a few hours on the DPI I mentioned before, that is what I ended up doing and the results looked MUCH better to EVERYONE that looked at it. Funny thing is, almost everyone that came in afterwards was talking about how it was the best looking HDR they'd seen on a projector and how the colors looked amazing only to have to hear me say that it was actually converted to SDR and that the gamut was still only 709. I definitely don't think it was anywhere near the best projection of HDR I've seen, but it looked WAY better than it did when I showed up.
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post #65 of 960 Old 01-01-2019, 07:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post
Thanks Anthony. I don't know if I would have tried to calibrate strictly to PQ though, projectors are designed to be perfect PQ. Have you tried the BT2390 workflow? Might get better results.

Also, since this projector even advertises that it can't even reach 709 fully, I wouldn't have expected much from 2020. I almost feel like with a display like this (despite the light output), converting to SDR709 might be the better approach. Most UHD players will allow this. Then you can calibrate to the appropriate base gamma (typically 2.4), 709 color (which I would hope would have better tracking) and still get the benefits of 10 bit and 4K.

After spending a few hours on the DPI I mentioned before, that is what I ended up doing and the results looked MUCH better to EVERYONE that looked at it. Funny thing is, almost everyone that came in afterwards was talking about how it was the best looking HDR they'd seen on a projector and how the colors looked amazing only to have to hear me say that it was actually converted to SDR and that the gamut was still only 709. I definitely don't think it was anywhere near the best projection of HDR I've seen, but it looked WAY better than it did when I showed up.
I haven't try 2390 yet....I use 2084 PQ only

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post #66 of 960 Old 01-01-2019, 07:19 PM
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Goodness...that would be some intense thinking out of the box...but also presumably would be intensely expensive. While we're thinking out of the box, it might be easier to come up with a two layer screen ...a photo reactive translucent layer over a black velvet layer for OLED-like blacks. Uh oh...did I just give away a novel idea???
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Or something like a 3 chip DLP + a 3 chip LCD combination. The DLP chip is a perfect down to pixel dimming machine, whereas the LCD would take care of the rest.
I am sure if they hire the right engineers they'll get the job done, whichever method. There's nothing that can't be solved.

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Christie is using a similar idea i think for their super high end projector, their is a thread about it in the $20 000+ projectors forum, it has 30 000 lumens with 20million:1 native contrast so practically a giant OLED, arguably the perfect projector but would cost like half a million dollars hahhahahahah, maybe in 20 years it ll be less than 30k and we can afford it &#x1f61b;
Yes, this was what I was referring to... i don't think you can patent something as simple as using local dimming (as it's available in almost all TVs)... and i don't think it's hard to implement or expensive. They just don't have the competition yet.

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Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post
I looked at the specs on these and I'm surprised. Low 90% for 709 coverage is pretty sad, especially when right in the sales stuff below on their webpage they are showing a scene that supposedly shows their tech vs other HDR projectors and it shows more saturated color. That would definitely NOT be the case if they can't even achieve 709 where most HDR projectors are around 90% or more of P3. Luminance will only get you so far here.

I also don't think that shadow detail is the right word. The reason most people think shadow detail is better on a DLP is because those areas are lifted due to the higher black floor. It takes HIGHER contrast to get better true shadow detail. Most DLPs need to be run at a higher gamma due to the black floor so they don't clip, so they come out of black FASTER. If you setup a higher contrast projector with the same gamma, it would look the same or better more often than not.

I loved the optics on the 9050, it was a great lens. Its big issue at its price point in regards to optics was the lack of motorized control, which is a glaring omission at that price and in the world of scope screens or even trying to dial in focus perfectly at the screen.

I was going to look at one of these for a possible review but I think I will wait for the 9060 as they seem more suited for home theater. After my sit-down with BenQ's engineers after the 9050 review, I have mixed feelings about how many issues will truly be resolved going forward in their designs, but they have the potential to be fantastic.
That's the LK990... Benq has announced they will launch another one with 100% DCI-P3 called the L6000 which will be the cousin of this but marketed to home theater use. It's prob the exact same projector but designed for better colors losing some lumens.. total lumens is 4200 instead of 6000.
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post #67 of 960 Old 01-01-2019, 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post

I also don't think that shadow detail is the right word. The reason most people think shadow detail is better on a DLP is because those areas are lifted due to the higher black floor.
Now that part is a head scratch'er. The machines I've seen with poor contrast show a murky gray mass in low APL scenes, having wholly insufficient contrast to reveal gradations; if that's "better" shadow detail, then that's news to me. It's pellucid here that this is not what was being discussed as shadow detail. And I would be shocked if these seasoned enthusiasts/calibrators in this thread mistook poor contrast for good shadow detail.

I've seen the split personalities of less than optimal shadow detail, meaning it can appear in both lower and higher contrast machines. The first type is what I mentioned above. The second type I can relay from my own ownership experiences with the e-shifter JVCs I've had; they all had issues resolving digital 17 (a well-known concern) and had black crush and non-optimal shadow detail even after calibration. If I attempted to remedy by bringing up the brightness, I would significantly compromise the black floor. Perhaps you did not find this to be the case...because I don't recall you discussing that point in your reviews of the JVCs, at least re: the X7xx series. (If I am not recalling properly, please correct me.)

Anyway, it's nice to see you posting in this thread and please let me know which price-comparable projectors that you've seen have the better shadow detail in your opinion.

EDIT: My post relates to both the LK970 and the LK990.

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post #68 of 960 Old 01-01-2019, 08:24 PM
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You can start with a baseline to get the numbers where they should be, but then I believe any calibrator worth his salt will then use his/her knowledge and experience as an artistic final stage to make the image so incredibly pleasing that it makes the viewer walk away feeling happy, excited and smiling after the experience.
You wouldn't happen to know when the L6000 will be released in the U.S. by any chance?
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post #69 of 960 Old 01-01-2019, 08:42 PM
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Originally Posted by coolgeek View Post
Benq has announced they will launch another one with 100% DCI-P3 called the L6000 which will be the cousin of this but marketed to home theater use. It's prob the exact same projector but designed for better colors losing some lumens.. total lumens is 4200 instead of 6000.
...just curious, will that one be available in the U.S. in the spring?
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post #70 of 960 Old 01-02-2019, 10:09 AM
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The second type I can relay from my own ownership experiences with the e-shifter JVCs I've had; they all had issues resolving digital 17 (a well-known concern) and had black crush and non-optimal shadow detail even after calibration.
I've seen you post this before, but have to disagree. The e-shift projectors have very good shadow detail and 17 can be faintly seen (if I recall), but it also takes very precise calibration and appropriate methodology that some people miss. It might take a calibrator of skill and good tools such as Kris or Chad B, for example.
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I've seen you post this before, but have to disagree. The e-shift projectors have very good shadow detail and 17 can be faintly seen (if I recall), but it also takes very precise calibration and appropriate methodology that some people miss. It might take a calibrator of skill and good tools such as Kris or Chad B, for example.
Chad definitely took my X990 to the next level. And I thought I did a pretty good job before him.
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I've seen you post this before, but have to disagree. The e-shift projectors have very good shadow detail and 17 can be faintly seen (if I recall), but it also takes very precise calibration and appropriate methodology that some people miss. It might take a calibrator of skill and good tools such as Kris or Chad B, for example.
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Chad definitely took my X990 to the next level. And I thought I did a pretty good job before him.
David is correct that when I had the X990, I complained I couldn't get all the shadow detail and felt like I was missing out on some of the content displayed. But I was fair in its assessment as I also pointed out that the lens and convergence on that thing were uncanny. ...I remember pulling up a white grid pattern through the X990 and thinking it looked cleaner than the one shown through my DLP projector (which did have a little CA BTW). Funny thing, I still remember getting a text from the guy who bought it, after he received it, telling me how happy!!! he was. He seemed over the moon and probably thought I was nuts for selling it --and so cheap. Lol..

And yet here I am excited about the LK990 with its brightness and laser; even if toned down for more color accuracy, projecting around 4000 lumens will still be plenty bright. Or, maybe "990" is just an attractive number to me.
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David is correct that when I had the X990, I complained I couldn't get all the shadow detail and felt like I was missing out on some of the content displayed. But I was fair in its assessment as I also pointed out that the lens and convergence on that thing were uncanny. ...I remember pulling up a white grid pattern through the X990 and thinking it looked cleaner than the one shown through my DLP projector (which did have a little CA BTW). Funny thing, I still remember getting a text from the guy who bought it, after he received it, telling me how happy!!! he was. He seemed over the moon and probably thought I was nuts for selling it --and so cheap. Lol..

And yet here I am excited about the LK990 with its brightness and laser; even if toned down for more color accuracy, projecting around 4000 lumens will still be plenty bright. Or, maybe "990" is just an attractive number to me.
There is defintely a grass is greener thing that can happen, and hangin around this place with its smooth talking tempters, doesnt make things any easier.

The shadow detail for me was solved i think by ... calibration of the base gamma which allowed for a little more elevation of the master brightness and black tone level settings, with out the gamma droop making things even worse (more washed out).

I watched Wonder Woman this afternoon via ub820 SDR2020 with x990 set to the stock B gamma. Beautiful. B gamma is very close to 2.4, but with some reshaping of the mid tones, for a more dramatic contrast affect.

Im sure you sometimes feel like you made an error selling your x990. Dont sweat it. You're on a new path so enjoy the journey.
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Originally Posted by coolgeek View Post
You need first and foremost the LUMENS to get you to at least 70 foot lamberts or beyond (to properly do HDR), and maybe even higher to do 3D... i suggest even in a bat cave, you need 40 lumens and above for SDR to start seeing the true pop of an image... once you see what true pop looks like you'll never go back... you can forgive a lot of things like 'black foor', 'shimering from higher gain screens', etc, etc... because the image improvments is really night and day...
So where are you getting this 70 fL number? I checked with my dealer and I'm told 30 fL is perfect for HDR in a blacked out room and lower than that is still good. 70 would be necessary only in a room with very high ambient light.

Thankfully I can reach 70+ fL after calibration on an NX7 if I use a smaller screen size. I'll put your theory to the test for sure.
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So where are you getting this 70 fL number? I checked with my dealer and I'm told 30 fL is perfect for HDR in a blacked out room and lower than that is still good. 70 would be necessary only in a room with very high ambient light.

Thankfully I can reach 70+ fL after calibration on an NX7 if I use a smaller screen size. I'll put your theory to the test for sure.
More light is better for HDR as it means fewer compromises have to be made from a tone mapping perspective. And more light is not necessarily to get some kind of eye blowing bright image experience as many mistaken, but simply to retain a satisfactory APL while displaying more highlight information and color volume. I get 32 ftL for HDR in my blackpit room and it's satisfactory to be sure, but if I were able to get significantly more light it would help for reasons stated.
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BenQ LK990

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Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post
But that leads me right back to the last post, this projector IS SPEC'ED FOR HDR AND IT IS ONE OF THE FIRST THINGS LISTED ON THE WEBPAGE FOR THE PRODUCT! Here is a cut and paste of the FIRST THINGS IT SAYS ON THE PRODUCT PAGE:



"4K HDR Installation Laser Projector with 6000 Lumens | LK990

Ultra-Accurate 4K HDR BlueCore Laser Projection for Enjoying Superb Entertainment Content "



So how is that not spec'ed for HDR or "doesn't do" HDR?? What does "Ultra-Accurate" mean if it doesn't actually use anything resembling ST2084 or something along the lines of BT2390 or some kind of home brewed tone map? How is it ultra accurate if it can't even do 709 color let alone P3 within 2020? If you have to trick it with a HD Fury to even do HDR, the consumer is being LIED to, plain and simple.



It seems there is a little bit of a difference in how we perceive the job of calibration. My job isn't to season a person's display to my tastes, it is to calibrate the image so that it is accurate and faithful to the intended image. From there I can educate a user on options for their own seasoning, or try to inform them of the pros and cons of using different adjustments to get the display to their liking, but it defeats the point of CALIBRATION to take artistic license unless the client specifically says they are looking for something else. I have been calibrating displays for YEARS and I've never heard anyone complain about the images that result. Never comments like dark, dull, washed out, or anything else. If they just want something bright and punchy, there are preset picture modes that can provide that all day long and they can save their money on a calibration. Calibrating images is not only about getting the image the way it is intended, but also educating the consumer on why we do it in the first place.



I completely understand your comments on having to fool around with the settings to get them to work, but you can still apply the same standards in measurements to see if the tweaks you are doing are actually going in the right or wrong direction. That way you can make a more informed decision on whether you're going in the right or wrong direction and what the compromises are in doing so. If you are just shooting in the dark and looking at content to do it, your settings mainly apply only to the content you are watching. Sure that may look good with a good number of items, but it can look equally awful with others. This is why the idea of a single tone map that works across all titles is so ludicrous. But if you are adjusting to a standard that material is actually mastered to (which ALL consumer video is), you have a better chance of making sure that the vast majority of the content looks the way it was intended or close to it. This puts the onus on the material to be right, not the display, and thankfully that is the case more often than not.



Please don't take any of this as an attack. I would LOVE to see your "Harpervision" setup with a bunch of projectors as I've mentioned before. Just because our methodology doesn't necessarily jive doesn't mean that I hold any ill will or don't think you can't enjoy your settings. It is just a difference in approach.
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Originally Posted by tnaik4 View Post
Kris , dave was talking about the LK970 which is not native HDR and needs the HDfury.
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Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post
Doh! Sorry, I thought all the talk was about the LK990 that is in the thread title. Sorry Dave!

Yes sorry I wasn’t clear Kris. I was speaking of what I do with the LK970. The LK990 isn’t even released yet so I have no way of being able to do any HarperVision fun on it.......yet. I’m not even sure I’ll have to since that model and the L6000 does do HDR natively.

Based on chhanthony’s assessment though, it does appear it needs some tender loving jerking around of the settings, haha!

As far as the calibration info, of course on “normal” displays and projectors that can do full HDR BT2020/DCI I do and will perform a normal calibration. That’s all up to the client and what they want. Sometimes what I’ll do is setup one memory with some tweaks that I may find for a certain model I’ve messed with and then another regular calibration on another memory and then they can choose which to use and when.

I don’t think you’re totally understanding what I’m doing here. This isn’t how I do calibrations all the time. This is just a fun thing I do for certain models. My HarperVision stuff is only for certain model’s for certain reasons, like the Epson 5040UBs and LS10500 models that may complained were too dim with HDR, before this tone mapping craze really hit, especially with the manufacturers like Panasonic on the 820 IHD Blu-ray, etc. Its also been created for models that don’t natively do “HDR” and/or BT2020/DCI-P3 like the LS10000 and now the LK970.

I tried it on the Vivitek DK8500Z and it didn’t work as well though. That may be what your DPI you mentioned was based on. Definitely not as good as the BenQ LK970 for this!

PS - The forum blew out my replies to the other quotes I had, sorry. If anyone has my replies in your email update from AVS about this post, send them to me please or post here. I have to run and don’t have time to rewrite it all!

Last edited by Dave Harper; 01-02-2019 at 08:09 PM.
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post #77 of 960 Old 01-03-2019, 12:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Aztar35 View Post
...just curious, will that one be available in the U.S. in the spring?
I have no idea. Hopefully soon so we can see how things progresses with Benq

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Originally Posted by wombats View Post
So where are you getting this 70 fL number? I checked with my dealer and I'm told 30 fL is perfect for HDR in a blacked out room and lower than that is still good. 70 would be necessary only in a room with very high ambient light.

Thankfully I can reach 70+ fL after calibration on an NX7 if I use a smaller screen size. I'll put your theory to the test for sure.
30fL is like the bare minimum. I auditioned the N5 projected onto a 110 inch 1.6 gain screen with 50-70fL and it's a sight to behold. Once you see high lumens, you'll find 30fL very dull... of course you'll be happy with 30fL without seeing higher output...

I actually switched out my 1.0 gain screen for a 1.8 gain screen and i couldn't be happier. I am going to use night and day difference here without exaggeration at all..

I create a thread about the higher gain screen..

Recently I talked about getting a 1.8 silver screen micro perforated to replace my 1.0 AT screen. Here you can see the comparisons and a bunch of photos i took.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/23-sc...en-screen.html

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post #78 of 960 Old 01-03-2019, 02:51 AM
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Recently I talked about getting a 1.8 silver screen micro perforated to replace my 1.0 AT screen. Here you can see the comparisons and a bunch of photos i took.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/23-sc...en-screen.html
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post #79 of 960 Old 01-09-2019, 11:43 PM
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Originally Posted by ailil View Post
Although i have no doubt the Benq LK990 is a great projector, i would wait, and actually i'm waiting for the Benq L6000, which seems to be pretty much the Home Theater version of the LK990 (The user manual is the same for both, same chassis, etc..). A little bit less lumens (4200 vs 6000), but 100% coverage of DCI-P3. I think the L6000 is going to be a hard one to beat:

http://www.av269.com/2018/1226/2663.shtml
I don't think the article mentioned anything about the L6000's P3 coverage - only the W5700.

http://www.av269.com/2018/1226/2663.shtml

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post #80 of 960 Old 01-10-2019, 05:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post
Thanks for the insight Anthony. The list of things that were an issue with the 9050 I reviewed was pretty long as well and made the projector feel like it was not ready for primetime either. I had a nice long talk with their head engineer and the product manager and offered to help them going forward on getting it up to speed, or working on the follow up and they seemed enthuasistic about it. Then it was complete radio silence. Now I see another BenQ that looks like it is having a lot of the same issues. The DPI Enlightener 4K I did a calibration on at Harman was also REALLY bad. I don't understand how what seem like the most basic fundamentals of image science are being completely botched. I can completely understand issues with HDR because of all the hoops you have to jump through to make it work in the projection world, but fundamental playback of other non HDR sources should be a walk in the park now.
Pretty sure the LK990 is designed to be a business aka max brightness projector at the expense of everything else, so those findings are not surprising.

The HT9050 you reviewed actually was a premature product put out to be the first dlp 4k solid state to market. Hopefully they have improved the software on the HT9060 now that theyve had more time.
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post #81 of 960 Old 01-10-2019, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by wiau2007 View Post
I don't think the article mentioned anything about the L6000's P3 coverage - only the W5700.

http://www.av269.com/2018/1226/2663.shtml
It doesn't but is what makes the most sense. The article says Benq is focusing on color for those new projectors. The cheapest one "W2700" they have already stated it covers 94%. In the article they say the W5700 covers 100%, i think assuming their higher end, the L6000 covers 100%, makes the most sense. Also, the manual for the LK990 and the L6000 is shared, but the LK990 produces 6000 Lumens whereas the L6000 only 4200, which seems to be the result of applying some kind of DCI wheel as done in other projectors like the Barco Balder
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Originally Posted by ailil View Post
It doesn't but is what makes the most sense. The article says Benq is focusing on color for those new projectors. The cheapest one "W2700" they have already stated it covers 94%. In the article they say the W5700 covers 100%, i think assuming their higher end, the L6000 covers 100%, makes the most sense. Also, the manual for the LK990 and the L6000 is shared, but the LK990 produces 6000 Lumens whereas the L6000 only 4200, which seems to be the result of applying some kind of DCI wheel as done in other projectors like the Barco Balder
The LK990 also is very color inaccurate out of the box to get to that 6000 lumens. The L6000s 4200 lumens may be with a rec709 accurate out of box calibration, which alone would cause a large lumens drop. I would not be so certain its dcip3, in fact none of the online material supports that the l6000 is dcip3.

The dimmer and cheaper 2019 benq projectors can easily get to 100% dci p3 via hld led light source which is native DCI p3, but that tech is not bright enough to reach 4200 lumens.

Last edited by Ruined; 01-10-2019 at 11:33 AM.
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post #83 of 960 Old 01-11-2019, 01:34 AM
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It doesn't but is what makes the most sense. The article says Benq is focusing on color for those new projectors. The cheapest one "W2700" they have already stated it covers 94%. In the article they say the W5700 covers 100%, i think assuming their higher end, the L6000 covers 100%, makes the most sense. Also, the manual for the LK990 and the L6000 is shared, but the LK990 produces 6000 Lumens whereas the L6000 only 4200, which seems to be the result of applying some kind of DCI wheel as done in other projectors like the Barco Balder
Visited my Hong Kong BenQ dealer today about the L6000. He says that he's asked BenQ who have said that the L6000 is essentially a lower lumens output version of the LK990 which will be available only in Mainland China.

Sorry for dashing your hopes - no claims for DCI P3 coverage

After seeing the VL7860+ in action, I think I'm going to pull my trigger on it - really impressive image and completely blew away the JVC 5900 in terms of brightness, colour, HDR and motion. He also said that the VL7860+ was better than the LK990 in terms of black levels (due to the LK990 being a much higher lumen output projector).

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post #84 of 960 Old 01-11-2019, 10:48 AM
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@wiau2007 Thank you for your feedback!!
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post #85 of 960 Old 01-14-2019, 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Ruined View Post
Pretty sure the LK990 is designed to be a business aka max brightness projector at the expense of everything else, so those findings are not surprising.

The HT9050 you reviewed actually was a premature product put out to be the first dlp 4k solid state to market. Hopefully they have improved the software on the HT9060 now that theyve had more time.
So of the new BenQ lineup the HT9060 is probably the best for reviewing? I'm only going to focus on a projector that does HDR out of the box, and would hope that it has a larger gamut than 709. The 9060 looks to check those boxes. My editor asked about doing another DLP, so I'm open to looking at another BenQ if they've stepped up their game since the 9050.

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post #86 of 960 Old 01-14-2019, 07:40 AM
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So of the new BenQ lineup the HT9060 is probably the best for reviewing? I'm only going to focus on a projector that does HDR out of the box, and would hope that it has a larger gamut than 709. The 9060 looks to check those boxes. My editor asked about doing another DLP, so I'm open to looking at another BenQ if they've stepped up their game since the 9050.
The HT9060 is the *only* one you'd want then, yes. I wouldn't expect anything more than ~4500:1 dynamic contrast (not too far from the HT9050), but hopefully the dynamic dimming was improved for real world content. Also, it would be nice to see how BenQ's "HDR PRO" implementation stacks up which is apparently improved from their typical HDR processing on their cheaper 4K DLPs. I think the hardware is pretty similar to the HT9050 but software should be significantly improved on multiple fronts, and I think this will make it a better deal natively accepting HDR, displaying P3, 3D; for those that don't mind the 4500:1 contrast #, there aren't any really any other options in the solid state under $10k arena for 4K HDR / P3 / 3D except the Epson LS10500 and that one has poor detail levels, ghosting in 3d, & is dimmer w/ p3 content.

I believe you'd seen the DPI CINE LED 1000 - it would be REALLY interesting for people who like the look of that projector to know how the BenQ compares. It also gets only around 4500-5000:1 dynamic (this is the 1000 lumens variant), is also LED, but its dimmer and only 1080p. So it would be a cool contrast / compare to see if the HT9060 is a good move for people who have & like the CINE LED 1000 and want essentially a 4K version of it. I think there is a little niche of people who really like that PJ and its variation.

The LK990 is a business projector (even though some are repurposing it for other uses, that's really what it was meant for) and can't hit 100% DCI-P3, and the HT8060 is HDR but rec709.

Later in the year BenQ is apparently coming out with some HDR 100% DCI P3 / HLD LED consumer projectors using the cheaper / worse performing 0.47" DMD, but no word on exactly when - may be a long time.
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post #87 of 960 Old 01-14-2019, 11:14 AM
 
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The LK990 also is very color inaccurate out of the box to get to that 6000 lumens. The L6000s 4200 lumens may be with a rec709 accurate out of box calibration, which alone would cause a large lumens drop. I would not be so certain its dcip3, in fact none of the online material supports that the l6000 is dcip3.



The dimmer and cheaper 2019 benq projectors can easily get to 100% dci p3 via hld led light source which is native DCI p3, but that tech is not bright enough to reach 4200 lumens.


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Visited my Hong Kong BenQ dealer today about the L6000. He says that he's asked BenQ who have said that the L6000 is essentially a lower lumens output version of the LK990 which will be available only in Mainland China.



Sorry for dashing your hopes - no claims for DCI P3 coverage



After seeing the VL7860+ in action, I think I'm going to pull my trigger on it - really impressive image and completely blew away the JVC 5900 in terms of brightness, colour, HDR and motion. He also said that the VL7860+ was better than the LK990 in terms of black levels (due to the LK990 being a much higher lumen output projector).


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The HT9060 is the *only* one you'd want then, yes. I wouldn't expect anything more than ~4500:1 dynamic contrast (not too far from the HT9050), but hopefully the dynamic dimming was improved for real world content. Also, it would be nice to see how BenQ's "HDR PRO" implementation stacks up which is apparently improved from their typical HDR processing on their cheaper 4K DLPs. I think the hardware is pretty similar to the HT9050 but software should be significantly improved on multiple fronts, and I think this will make it a better deal natively accepting HDR, displaying P3, 3D; for those that don't mind the 4500:1 contrast #, there aren't any really any other options in the solid state under $10k arena for 4K HDR / P3 / 3D except the Epson LS10500 and that one has poor detail levels, ghosting in 3d, & is dimmer w/ p3 content.



I believe you'd seen the DPI CINE LED 1000 - it would be REALLY interesting for people who like the look of that projector to know how the BenQ compares. It also gets only around 4500-5000:1 dynamic (this is the 1000 lumens variant), is also LED, but its dimmer and only 1080p. So it would be a cool contrast / compare to see if the HT9060 is a good move for people who have & like the CINE LED 1000 and want essentially a 4K version of it. I think there is a little niche of people who really like that PJ and its variation.



The LK990 is a business projector (even though some are repurposing it for other uses, that's really what it was meant for) and can't hit 100% DCI-P3, and the HT8060 is HDR but rec709.



Later in the year BenQ is apparently coming out with some HDR 100% DCI P3 / HLD LED consumer projectors using the cheaper / worse performing 0.47" DMD, but no word on exactly when - may be a long time.


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It doesn't but is what makes the most sense. The article says Benq is focusing on color for those new projectors. The cheapest one "W2700" they have already stated it covers 94%. In the article they say the W5700 covers 100%, i think assuming their higher end, the L6000 covers 100%, makes the most sense. Also, the manual for the LK990 and the L6000 is shared, but the LK990 produces 6000 Lumens whereas the L6000 only 4200, which seems to be the result of applying some kind of DCI wheel as done in other projectors like the Barco Balder

Nothing a little tweaking and using some filters can’t resolve!
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post #88 of 960 Old 01-18-2019, 02:06 PM
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Nothing a little tweaking and using some filters can’t resolve!
So what's the consensus, should I upgrade my LK970 to the LK990? I have the HDFury attached to it now, and it's a little clunky to have to switch modes everytime an HDR show pops up on netflix.

an additional 1,000 lumens is attractive and native HDR where i'm assuming I just ISF calibrate day and night modes and that's it right?
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So what's the consensus, should I upgrade my LK970 to the LK990? I have the HDFury attached to it now, and it's a little clunky to have to switch modes everytime an HDR show pops up on netflix.



an additional 1,000 lumens is attractive and native HDR where i'm assuming I just ISF calibrate day and night modes and that's it right?

I don’t think there can be a consensus yet. The LK990 hasn’t been released yet and not enough real world info is known yet. On paper yes it does look promising.

I think it’ll be more than just ISF Day/Night Modes being calibrated. Built in HDR Modes on projectors have never been very well implemented and I’d be surprised this will be any different. You’ll most likely still need something like a HarperVision custom/tone mapped setup or use something like a Lumagen or Panasonic UB820 and their excellent tone mapping abilities.
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post #90 of 960 Old 01-20-2019, 10:49 PM
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Oh the 990 isn't out yet? I thought someone here had bought one. I think the extra 1000 lumens for my setup which is a ton of sunlight during thedl day will be worth it.
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