Official JVC RS3000/NX9 - JVC RS2000/NX7/N7 - JVC RS1000/NX5/N5 - Owners Thread - Page 156 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #4651 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by griffindodd View Post
Can anyone recommend some links that help a layman understand these gamut charts, tracking of color spaces/profiles and the way that primaries and secondaries come into play. I'm managing to fumble my way through the basics of these conversations but feel like a Calbration for Dummies course would certainly be helpful as Nigel, Manni, Wookie and others are talking in tongues

I understand the basics of calibration, why you want a delta below 3 widgets, why colors need to track well through all levels of saturation etc etc. But when we start getting into tracking P3 within 2020 containers I start glazing over with confusion.
I'm in the same boat, and here's a few pages that I found educational. I'm not sure if they go into the detail that you want or not, but maybe they will help, or will have some other links that will help:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...-enhanced.html

http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=35322

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...l#post26418746
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post #4652 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tommarra View Post
Question: Does JVC Autocal does a good enough job of 'calibrating' the projector? I mean if you compare that to a professional calibration does it get you 80% close enough?

Also how much does professional calibration cost? Thousands of dollars?
Definitive not. You need to do calibrating.

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post #4653 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Dj Dee View Post
Definitive not. You need to do calibrating.

I know .. but how big of a not is it ... 20%, 30%, 40%. Imagine a professionally calibrated PJ to be one end, and out of the box being another end - how much in between (or outside) is JVC autocal?

Also how much of a difference can one expect between out-of-box and calibrated (pictures would definitely help here :-) )

Quote:
Originally Posted by ddgdl View Post
Obviously varies from calibrator to calibrator, but I would expect to spend more like $400-500
Thank you. That makes a professional calibration viable in the not so far future!

Gear: Fronts: B&W 803D3 | Center: B&W HTM2D3 | Surrounds: B&W 705S2 | Backs: B&W DM601S3 | Heights: Definitive Techonlogy ProCinema 1000 | Receiver & Amps: Anthem MRX 720 + Emotiva BasX-5 | Projector: JVC NX7 | Source: HTPC with Nvidia 2070, Kodi + External Player: MPC-HC with MadVR (for Blu-ray rips), Nvidia Shield (for streaming content)

Last edited by tommarra; 02-05-2019 at 01:25 PM.
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post #4654 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by smitty View Post
I'm in the same boat, and here's a few pages that I found educational. I'm not sure if they go into the detail that you want or not, but maybe they will help, or will have some other links that will help:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...-enhanced.html

http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=35322

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...l#post26418746
Thanks for these links, the CurtPalme link was the first one I used in the past which was a wonderful resource for getting off the ground with the basics and enabled me to do my first ever 'nooby' calibration with an X-Rite i1 to create a 3D Lut for my HTPC to use.

The two things that I am having trouble bending my brain around are...

- Calibration for HDR vs SDR. My current projector doesn't have an Iris to clamp down my brightness for moving between SDR and HDR, I do however run all of my content through a HTPC and use MadVR for my tone mapping. So am I stuck with just setting up a picture profile on my projector and then turning my lamp to Low for SDR, high for HDR - or can I leave my projector in high lamp mode (HDR setup around 70 nits) and have my HTPC use a different LUT for SDR to stop everything being too bright?

- Color tracking. I see people talking about outputting in P3 vs 709 vs BT2020 and how 'colors wont track properly' if you use the wrong color space in the wrong situation. It seems that nearly all consumer devices only deal with BT2020 and Rec.709 color spaces, so why would someone even want to try and use P3?

I know none of this has anything to do with JVC NX5/7/9 projectors, other than the fact I intend to buy and NX-7 in the future and would like to be able to fully appreciate it's capabilities and make full use of it's options to calibrate it to the best of my beginner abilities.
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post #4655 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denon a1xva View Post
According to what I've heard there is no double iris. And this source is directly from JVC. Body weight differences between the DLA- X5*** and X7*** and now the N5-N7 have always been 0,2kg sinds the introduction of the X5000 and X7000 series.

In the X7900 there is definitely no double iris as well. I am very curious where this info is all coming from. Until now there isn't any documented proof just speculations appearing on fora. If I am wrong I am all ears.

The 5 series does not have a 2nd iris. the 7 and 9 series has always had one, its a major factor in the drastically increased contrast when you move from the low range to the mid range models.
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post #4656 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 02:34 PM
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I’ve joined the gang waiting for a new projector. HT room has been finished, painted dark, new Atmos setup, new amp, no projector.

Enjoying reading that people are getting theirs and their subjective and objective feedback on performance.


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post #4657 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 02:55 PM
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I’ve joined the gang waiting for a new projector. HT room has been finished, painted dark, new Atmos setup, new amp, no projector.
Black levels must be great!
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post #4658 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 03:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manni01 View Post
It would be silly indeed to lose 20% of light for 1% gamut cover. But some users can only reach as little as 90% of rec-709 without the filter. Those don't have a choice. They need the filter if they want to reach reference. PM/email me if you want more info on this, as it does't look like you've experienced this yourself, which would suggest it's not frequent indeed.

The *main* downside of using a custom profile without the filter for rec-709 is that you can't run a gamma autocal in a straightforward way, because there is no factory profile that targets rec-709 using the filter and the gamma autocal only works with factory profiles (unless this has changed with V11, I'll confirm when I have a chance to look at it).

I hope that JVC listens and will offer factory profiles for all combinations: BT2020 with/without the filter (we already have this), DCI-P3 with/without the filter (I think we only have with), Rec-709 with/without the filter (I think we only have without). We need this flexibility to be able to use the JVC Autocal to handle most situations in the best possible way. Otherwise it's possible but it's quite convoluted and sub-optimal. If you could use your influence to ask them to implement this in the future, it would be great.

The other thing we need is a profile off mode (CMS disabled, max brightness, to select the native, unprocessed gamut) *with* the filter enabled. They are still only offering profile off without the filter, which means that you can't get the cleanest path (best RGB separation) for a 3D LUT *and* get the widest possible native gamut, which is simply crazy. I know that @bobof understands this, but it would be great if more people with JVC's ear (you!) could advocate for this. It would significantly improve 3D LUT calibrations in some cases.

THX is a bad idea for the reasons you mentioned, I was hoping that someone else would mention this.
I'm not sure how much of a difference the chosen colour profile really makes to the gamma only calibration. Have you spent much time looking at what test stimulus is actually used when you change profile? Do they use the adjusted RGB primaries per the selected colour profile, or the pure panel RGB? I'm not sure that the ability to select a profile for gamma calibration isn't just an artifact from the same screens being used for gamma and gamma + colour calibration. Seeing as how the colour calibration steps happen after the gamma steps it seems most likely the raw panel primaries are used.

I'm considering when my warranty is up on the X7900 looking at what would be involved in changing the filter position so that you could select profile off and flip the filter in.

The other thing I think is a bit of a shame is that there isn't an option to fix up the panel gamma in profile off mode.

Still, mustn't grumble, we've got much better calibration controls and facilities available than any other brand, I guess we should be grateful...!
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post #4659 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 03:25 PM
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Close, but no cigar (yet)

After a what felt like a very long wait, I heard today from my local dealer that my RS1000 has finally arrived!

Ironically, I am traveling for the next two weeks, but its installation is definitely something exciting to look forward to upon my return...
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post #4660 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 04:09 PM
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On my way home with my NX9!!!! Feeling like a kid on Christmas

JVC DLA-NX9 | Paladin Anamorphic Lens | Panasonic UB820 | Denon AVR-X6400H | Rotel RB 993 Amp | 135" 2:35:1 Elunevision Aurora NanoEdge Ambient Light Blocking Screen | Paradigm Monitor 11 v7, Monitor Center 3 v7, Monitor Surround 3 v7, CI Pro P65-R |
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post #4661 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 06:32 PM
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Just got notification that my card got charged for the RX1000 preorder with tracking number to follow. Getting closer!
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post #4662 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 06:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobof View Post
I'm not sure how much of a difference the chosen colour profile really makes to the gamma only calibration. Have you spent much time looking at what test stimulus is actually used when you change profile? Do they use the adjusted RGB primaries per the selected colour profile, or the pure panel RGB?
My experience with the eshift models seems to be consistent with the autocal instructions, i.e., each gamma autocal applies to all Picture Modes that share the same filter position, CMD on/off, and lamp power. I will double-check that next time I run autocal.
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post #4663 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 07:30 PM
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On my way home with my NX9!!!! Feeling like a kid on Christmas
keep your eyes on the road!
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post #4664 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 09:04 PM
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Originally Posted by tommarra View Post
Question: Does JVC Autocal does a good enough job of 'calibrating' the projector? I mean if you compare that to a professional calibration does it get you 80% close enough?

Also how much does professional calibration cost? Thousands of dollars?
If you are interested in calibration, here are the best guys.....

Chad B : [email protected]
D-Nice : [email protected]

If all else fails master list :

<<< Click Here >>>
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post #4665 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 09:20 PM
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+1 for the RS2000.. thanks Mike!
Really looking forward to your impressions.
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post #4666 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 09:20 PM
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RS2000 First impressions

Just received today, moving from the Sony 600ES and I must say I’m pretty impressed. Great color and sharpness. Convergence was right on target no shift needed and it came preloaded with firmware 1.20. Haven’t had time to play with it enough but netflix and amazon HDR video, played from a firestick, looked great. Haven’t tested DI yet for noise but will report later if there are any issues. Low lamp noise is very quiet and a nice SDR picture, high lamp mode is very loud (way louder than 600ES). High lamp mode is very bright (pure white SI screen) but the color filter does dim the image considerably. I’m sorry for not giving numbers as I haven’t had a chance to take out the meters and take some measurements, just first impressions and reporting on firmware. Overall for now, very happy
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post #4667 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 09:51 PM
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RS2000 First impressions

Just received today, moving from the Sony 600ES and I must say I’m pretty impressed. Great color and sharpness. Convergence was right on target no shift needed and it came preloaded with firmware 1.20. Haven’t had time to play with it enough but netflix and amazon HDR video, played from a firestick, looked great. Haven’t tested DI yet for noise but will report later if there are any issues. Low lamp noise is very quiet and a nice SDR picture, high lamp mode is very loud (way louder than 600ES). High lamp mode is very bright (pure white SI screen) but the color filter does dim the image considerably. I’m sorry for not giving numbers as I haven’t had a chance to take out the meters and take some measurements, just first impressions and reporting on firmware. Overall for now, very happy
Did you enable the dynamic iris in the picture menu? I think it defaults to OFF on the new models.

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post #4668 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 11:50 PM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post
looking at the negative reviews of that cable, there's a dozen or so complaints about the cable not passing dolby vision. That shouldn't be an issue for any real certified premium cable, so maybe there are other issues with them causing longer than necessary handshakes.

https://www.amazon.com/Tera-Grand-Ce...l&pageNumber=1


It might be worth picking up a pair of the monoprice cable to be certain, these are guaranteed to work well with the JVC's. I have almost 50 feet (source->Denon 7200->Vertex->Projector) and no sync issues up to 4K/60.

https://www.amazon.com/Monoprice-115...dp/B01GCGKFBY/

Installed the Monoprice cable and outside of the initial sync issues when inserting a disc, the other sync issues have disappeared.

So, the original cable seems to have been the issue.

Thanks for the recommendation on the Monoprice. It is an excellent cable and at a great price.


Now another issue...





What is this?

This is from tonight's viewing of WIDOWS in 4k.

See the shadow on the edge of the woman's face?

I am hoping it is an anomaly in the transfer. I have never seen this problem anywhere else in the film or anywhere else.

The scene is about 10-15 minutes into the film.
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post #4669 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 11:51 PM
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laggs- V1.20 a new firmware version. Are you in the US?
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post #4670 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 11:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Ronald Epstein View Post
Installed the Monoprice cable and outside of the initial sync issues when inserting a disc, the other sync issues have disappeared.

So, the original cable seems to have been the issue.

Thanks for the recommendation on the Monoprice. It is an excellent cable and at a great price.


Now another issue...


Spoiler!



What is this?

This is from tonight's viewing of WIDOWS in 4k.

See the shadow on the edge of the woman's face?

I am hoping it is an anomaly in the transfer. I have never seen this problem anywhere else in the film or anywhere else.

The scene is about 10-15 minutes into the film.
Do you have the clear motion drive on? I'd try running that same time index with low latency mode set to "ON" and see if it still reproduces. If so, and its only that scene, I doubt it's the projector. What time index is that?

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post #4671 of 19231 Old 02-05-2019, 11:57 PM
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Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
Do you have the clear motion drive on? I'd try running that same time index with low latency mode set to "ON" and see if it still reproduces. If so, and its only that scene, I doubt it's the projector. What time index is that?
Mark,

I am guessing you own this title? I will get you the time stamp in the next few minutes.

Where are the specific controls that you want me to turn on/off? Only off the top of your head. Otherwise, I will search for it.

EDIT: Time Stamp: 9min 37 seconds

Last edited by Ronald Epstein; 02-06-2019 at 12:03 AM.
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post #4672 of 19231 Old 02-06-2019, 12:10 AM
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Mark,

I am guessing you own this title? I will get you the time stamp in the next few minutes.

Where are the specific controls that you want me to turn on/off? Only off the top of your head. Otherwise, I will search for it.

EDIT: Time Stamp: 9min 37 seconds
Low latency was set to ON.

Just to make certain I did not screw up anything (as I was in various menus)...

Under HDR10 Auto Select: HDR10

Is that correct?
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post #4673 of 19231 Old 02-06-2019, 12:12 AM
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Low latency was set to ON.

Just to make certain I did not screw up anything (as I was in various menus)...

Under HDR10 Auto Select: HDR10

Is that correct?
I just wanted to make sure it wasn't a bug in motion processing but if you had low latency set to "ON" that disables the motion processing so it's not an issue there.

Video: JVC RS4500 135" screen in pure black room no light, htpc nvidia 1080ti.
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post #4674 of 19231 Old 02-06-2019, 12:16 AM
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I just wanted to make sure it wasn't a bug in motion processing but if you had low latency set to "ON" that disables the motion processing so it's not an issue there.

Mark,

Thank you as always.

I noted something in red above about the HDR10 settings. Just want to make sure it is where it is supposed to be.

Thanks again
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post #4675 of 19231 Old 02-06-2019, 12:18 AM
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Mark,

Thank you as always.

I noted something in red above about the HDR10 settings. Just want to make sure it is where it is supposed to be.

Thanks again
This is not an issue with your projector, it's actually encoded in the movie that way. I have the bluray but it's the same. Here is a screen capture of playback (not a photo of the way my projector shows it, but an actual screen capture of the image playing at the source).
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Video: JVC RS4500 135" screen in pure black room no light, htpc nvidia 1080ti.
Audio: Anthem mrx720 running 7.1.4, McIntosh MC-303, MC-152, B&W 802d3 LR, B&W HTM1D3 center, B&W 805d3 surround, B&W 702S2 rear, B&W 706s2 x 4 shelf mounted for atmos, 2 sub arrays both infinite baffle: 4x15 fi audio running on behringer ep4000 + 4x12 fi audio running on 2nd ep4000.
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post #4676 of 19231 Old 02-06-2019, 12:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
This is not an issue with your projector, it's actually encoded in the movie that way. I have the bluray but it's the same. Here is a screen capture of playback (not a photo of the way my projector shows it, but an actual screen capture of the image playing at the source).
Well that is good news to see!

Thanks Mark!
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post #4677 of 19231 Old 02-06-2019, 12:31 AM - Thread Starter
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If you are interested in calibration, here are the best guys.....

Chad B : [email protected]
D-Nice : [email protected]

If all else fails master list :

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Last edited by ARROW-AV; 02-06-2019 at 12:38 AM.
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post #4678 of 19231 Old 02-06-2019, 12:33 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Ronald Epstein View Post
Installed the Monoprice cable and outside of the initial sync issues when inserting a disc, the other sync issues have disappeared.

So, the original cable seems to have been the issue.

Thanks for the recommendation on the Monoprice. It is an excellent cable and at a great price.


Now another issue...

Spoiler!



What is this?

This is from tonight's viewing of WIDOWS in 4k.

See the shadow on the edge of the woman's face?

I am hoping it is an anomaly in the transfer. I have never seen this problem anywhere else in the film or anywhere else.

The scene is about 10-15 minutes into the film.
As a rule of thumb if you see a problem but never seen this problem anywhere else in the film or anywhere else, then almost certainly it is actually encoded within the media itself

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post #4679 of 19231 Old 02-06-2019, 12:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Ronald Epstein View Post

Now another issue...

What is this?

This is from tonight's viewing of WIDOWS in 4k.

See the shadow on the edge of the woman's face?

I am hoping it is an anomaly in the transfer. I have never seen this problem anywhere else in the film or anywhere else.

The scene is about 10-15 minutes into the film.

She's being filmed reflected in the mirror! The double image is because of the internal reflections in the glass. Caught my attention too on my NX9; thought it was messed up. Then went and watched it on my PC: same thing. If you watch the positioning, you can determine it is her reflection.
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post #4680 of 19231 Old 02-06-2019, 12:46 AM
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Originally Posted by RamsdenM View Post
She's being filmed reflected in the mirror! The double image is because of the internal reflections in the glass. Caught my attention too on my NX9; thought it was messed up. Then went and watched it on my PC: same thing. If you watch the positioning, you can determine it is her reflection.
Really hard to be sure at first, right?

Doesn't help that it's a brand-new projector and your antennas are wide up looking for initial manufacturing defects and then you watch a scene like this one.
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