Official JVC RS3000/NX9 - JVC RS2000/NX7/N7 - JVC RS1000/NX5/N5 - Owners Thread - Page 174 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #5191 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by ShadeRF View Post
I was provided the firmware by my dealer so I'm not sure if we're allowed to share.

I'm happy to report however that after a call from JVC and a tip from Mike my projector is once again back in business and running v1.20

So, here's a rundown of events:

I initially ran the update from the projector menu and the projector ran through the update (lights move continuously and sequentially on the front of the projector until all lights and the projector turn off). I then turned on the projector and after 2-3 minutes the projector did not come on as described in the update manual and instead the orange and red warning lights began flashing alternately. The projector was not responsive and I eventually pulled the power. Now apparently what I should have done is just waited 5 more minutes because after reloading 1.20 (using a trick from the JVC rep for direct loading from USB on boot) I once again came to the alternating lights on boot. This time however, per a tip from Mike, I left it alone and after nearly 15 minutes (30 minutes from update start) on the nose the projector returned to life.

I don't know if this is the standard procedure now for these new units, but if so I would hope that JVC updates the firmware update documentation to make this second part of the update process more clear.

Finally, I can't thank Mike enough for not only being responsive himself on a Saturday night but getting a JVC rep to reach out to me as well and getting this resolved. I'm a customer for life.
I was the one Mike mentioned where I left it alone, with the blinking lights as you described. I came back later and it was running. However, every time I turn it on now it appears dead for 5 minutes before it boots on "D-ILA" screen. Does yours boot normally since?
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post #5192 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by talon95 View Post
Would be nice to put a link to ChadB's review at the beginning of this thread. Just gets lost in all the pages and it's a great unbiased assessment from what I can tell.
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-di...l#post57577540
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post #5193 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 02:32 PM
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How far from Colorado Springs is this? I’m considering a DCR for my new JVC and it would be fun to see this in action.
Go to the Denver forum but it is about 1 and 1/2 hours depending how fast you drive Google it but I25 and Hwy 7 approx. I am going to Great WolF Lodge down there this weekend.

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post #5194 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Darslid View Post
I was the one Mike mentioned where I left it alone, with the blinking lights as you described. I came back later and it was running. However, every time I turn it on now it appears dead for 5 minutes before it boots on "D-ILA" screen. Does yours boot normally since?
I've only powered it on twice since but each time has been a normal, relatively quick boot up.

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post #5195 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by ShadeRF View Post
I've only powered it on twice since but each time has been a normal, relatively quick boot up.
Apart from faster boot-up...did you notice anything of significance in terms of improvement to say the overall PQ or 3D perhaps?
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post #5196 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 03:13 PM
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I guess we'll have to wait until Zoombie can get his hands on one of JVC's 4K models to find out how it measures up with 3D. I own two different 2016 models and the quality of 3D playback differs substantially from one model to the other, so I don't think we can generalize about 3D.

I also have Da-lite 119" High Power 2.8 gain screen and it helps a lot wth 3D playback. Also, anyone into 3D should not hesitate to pick up some relatively cheap Samsung 3D glasses . -- they work with every projector I throw at them . -- Epson LS10000, the two JVCs and a Sony T.V.!
Hi, can I check what is the model of the Samsung 3D glasses that you are using presently? In the market, there are quite a few 3D active glasses from Samsung. E.g. Samsung SSG-5150GB, SSG-3050GB etc...
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post #5197 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by desray2k View Post
Apart from faster boot-up...did you notice anything of significance in terms of improvement to say the overall PQ or 3D perhaps?
Nothing has jumped out at me PQ wise. I haven't tried any 3D since the update.
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post #5198 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by desray2k View Post
Apart from faster boot-up...did you notice anything of significance in terms of improvement to say the overall PQ or 3D perhaps?


No improvement in PQ for me after 1.20 update.


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post #5199 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 03:20 PM
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Originally Posted by ShadeRF View Post
Nothing has jumped out at me PQ wise. I haven't tried any 3D since the update.
Thanks for the update
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post #5200 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 03:20 PM
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No improvement in PQ for me after 1.20 update.


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Thanks for the update
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post #5201 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 03:42 PM
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Anyone have good HDR picture with their NX9 or NX7 when watching Netflix 4K or iTunes Movies in 4K? It’s pretty bad. The pseudo MaxCLL and MaxFALL metadata provisioned only makes things worse.

I also find that the HDR content is not as vibrant. I believed Chad B also describe his general take on the HDR picture mode of the NX9 is leaned towards the “pale” side.



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I don't have one yet to test but this is probably because a good majority of the content on ATV via Netflix or iTunes is in Dolby Vision. When converted to HDR10, it fills in the metadata with 4000 across the board. If the JVC is using auto tone mapping for this, it is going to look very dull. What I would do is play a movie from a disc with 1000 nits for the metadata (any Disney or Universal disc should do). Look at the settings that the JVC uses for this metadata. Then play Netflix and turn auto tone mapping OFF and use the settings they did for the sliders in gamma. See how that looks, might be a better starting point.
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post #5202 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 03:48 PM
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I don't have one yet to test but this is probably because a good majority of the content on ATV via Netflix or iTunes is in Dolby Vision. When converted to HDR10, it fills in the metadata with 4000 across the board. If the JVC is using auto tone mapping for this, it is going to look very dull. What I would do is play a movie from a disc with 1000 nits for the metadata (any Disney or Universal disc should do). Look at the settings that the JVC uses for this metadata. Then play Netflix and turn auto tone mapping OFF and use the settings they did for the sliders in gamma. See how that looks, might be a better starting point.
Thanks for the advice Kris. But Disney UHD titles are notoriously known for omitting the MaxCLL and MaxFALL metadata...I will try Warner Bros Justice League which I know have metadata.
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post #5203 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 04:11 PM
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Thanks for the advice Kris. But Disney UHD titles are notoriously known for omitting the MaxCLL and MaxFALL metadata...I will try Warner Bros Justice League which I know have metadata.
JL is a good one. It is 1016 for MaxCLL and 342 for MaxFall. Lucy would be a good one too.

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post #5204 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 04:12 PM
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What I would do is play a movie from a disc with 1000 nits for the metadata (any Disney or Universal disc should do). Look at the settings that the JVC uses for this metadata. Then play Netflix and turn auto tone mapping OFF and use the settings they did for the sliders in gamma. See how that looks, might be a better starting point.
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I will try Warner Bros Justice League which I know have metadata.

If this works, is this something that could be posted for other users, i.e., the settings that JVC uses for that metadata?
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post #5205 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 04:12 PM
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I had the same issue with the NX9 sample i had... For those with an NX9 put up a white screen and toggle E-Shift ON/OFF , it will go from White to a dull yellow/white.
This is what my NX9 does too, e-shift off = white screen, e-shift on = yellow screen, what is wrong here?

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post #5206 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 04:12 PM
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JL is a good one. It is 1016 for MaxCLL and 342 for MaxFall. Lucy would be a good one too.

Yep. That’s the exact MaxCLL and MaxFALL metadata figures I got as well. Thks Kris.


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post #5207 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 04:14 PM
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Remember, this just gives you something that may work okay for some titles. Every movie/show is different, so for tone mapping it is far from one size fits all. But it gives you a decent starting point to work from.

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post #5208 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 04:32 PM
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There's really only one good answer which is to lobby for correct metadata. Though I did find somewhere a reference (will have to dig it out) that actually missing metadata shouldn't per se be seen as a problem, and content with missing metadata should just be treated in a particular way. The big problem is metadata which is blatantly incorrect or doing something strange (like changing every 30s) which has unintended consequences.

IF we really think we'll never get there (SHAME writ large on your heads, Hollywood - how about you work for your money?!) then the next best answer is that displays have to evolve to disregard all metadata, and just do image based dynamic tone mapping in the case where they don't have 10,000 nits on tap...

It is a shame though as there are scenes that will always trip up such dynamic systems, and in order to work reasonably well they will have to add significant latency to have deep buffers to get tripped up less.
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post #5209 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 04:40 PM
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My only complaint with the ATV 4K is the gradient banding. It’s most distracting in shows like grand tour or a series of unfortunate events. White areas you get a red/green blotchyness. Very minor as no one else noticed these in my family... but i’m looking for defects . This isn’t a projector issue but more of a format/encoding one? I’ve been running my rs2000 for 27hrs so far and i’ve dialed it in — very impressive!
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post #5210 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 04:41 PM
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There's really only one good answer which is to lobby for correct metadata. Though I did find somewhere a reference (will have to dig it out) that actually missing metadata shouldn't per se be seen as a problem, and content with missing metadata should just be treated in a particular way. The big problem is metadata which is blatantly incorrect or doing something strange (like changing every 30s) which has unintended consequences.

IF we really think we'll never get there (SHAME writ large on your heads, Hollywood - how about you work for your money?!) then the next best answer is that displays have to evolve to disregard all metadata, and just do image based dynamic tone mapping in the case where they don't have 10,000 nits on tap...

It is a shame though as there are scenes that will always trip up such dynamic systems, and in order to work reasonably well they will have to add significant latency to have deep buffers to get tripped up less.
I don't think deep buffers will do it. You'd need to scan ahead several seconds or even minutes to really get a feel for what's going on - not just a couple frames. It would be impossible to keep audio sync etc even if a viewer was willing to wait 60 seconds for a movie to start playing.

The streaming services could always scan the video and inject the correct HDR meta into the stream - if they wanted. A player could do something similar by scanning parts of a movie, grabbing frames in random positions, and calculating some meta values. Perhaps 30 secs before playback and then it plays using that tone mapping data.
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post #5211 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 05:05 PM
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Eshift has Zero effect on my yellowish whites, on or off....

Also, i reloaded the factory calibration back into my rs3000 after upgrading to 1.20 and then ran autocal in log only mode. My gamma line was straight diagonal. So I don’t think it’s a grayscale calibration thing. Or perhaps my spyder5 sample is caca. Either way, i ran a gamma only calibration afterwards. No effect at all.



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post #5212 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 05:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Colozeus View Post
Eshift has Zero effect on my yellowish whites, on or off....

Also, i reloaded the factory calibration back into my rs3000 after upgrading to 1.20 and then ran autocal in log only mode. My gamma line was straight diagonal. So I don’t think it’s a grayscale calibration thing. Or perhaps my spyder5 sample is caca. Either way, i ran a gamma only calibration afterwards. No effect at all.



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So it's not just a NX7 problem but maybe for the entire line?

My Gamma was also a straight diagonal line - but something weird is going on with the dynamic iris.

We need a few more people to test their units to see if this is endemic or a few isolated cases.

While watching a movie it's only really apparant when there is a high contrast white on black scene and if the white is much smaller than black. But the yellow tint is quite noticeable.



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post #5213 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 05:15 PM
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I have searched through this thread and can't find (or missed) the part number for the mounting plate that attaches the new JVC chassis to the Chief RPM or RPMA? Would someone please aim me in the right direction?

Found it, I think. SLM281?

Thanks!

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post #5214 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 05:26 PM
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So it's not just a NX7 problem but maybe for the entire line?

My Gamma was also a straight diagonal line - but something weird is going on with the dynamic iris.

We need a few more people to test their units to see if this is endemic or a few isolated cases.

While watching a movie it's only really apparant when there is a high contrast white on black scene and if the white is much smaller than black. But the yellow tint is quite noticeable.



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I've noticed this on my unit, most apparently when the Oppo screensaver is on and the logo bounces off the edges it dims and looks quite yellow for a brief moment.
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post #5215 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 05:32 PM
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My only complaint with the ATV 4K is the gradient banding. It’s most distracting in shows like grand tour or a series of unfortunate events. White areas you get a red/green blotchyness. Very minor as no one else noticed these in my family... but i’m looking for defects . This isn’t a projector issue but more of a format/encoding one? I’ve been running my rs2000 for 27hrs so far and i’ve dialed it in — very impressive!
Very interesting. Looks like is not only Sony that has posterization issues (banding) with their 4K panels. JVC was in the safe zone before because the e-shift models were 1080p panels. Now with 4K panels, posterization could be more evident in gradient backgrounds like skies. My 295ES shows some banding in skies and white degradations backgrounds scenes but it's fixable setting Smooth Gradation in LOW which makes banding almost gone. Also know that streaming content will always show a bit more posterization artifacts than UHD discs due to compression. Also, some movies filmed with 4K and 8K digital cameras could show some banding as well. This is the case for Mission Impossible Fallout during some of the IMAX scenes.

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post #5216 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 05:41 PM
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How far from Colorado Springs is this? I’m considering a DCR for my new JVC and it would be fun to see this in action.
Go to the Denver forum but it is about 1 and 1/2 hours depending how fast you drive [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif[/IMG] Google it but I25 and Hwy 7 approx. I am going to Great WolF Lodge down there this weekend.
That may not be too bad. I live on the far north end of the springs just north of Great Wolf Lodge.
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post #5217 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 05:49 PM
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Very interesting. Looks like is not only Sony that has posterization issues (banding) with their 4K panels. JVC was in the safe zone before because the e-shift models were 1080p panels. Now with 4K panels, posterization could be more evident in gradient backgrounds like skies. My 295ES shows some banding in skies and white degradations backgrounds scenes but it's fixable setting Smooth Gradation in LOW which makes banding almost gone. Also know that streaming content will always show a bit more posterization artifacts than UHD discs due to compression. Also, some movies filmed with 4K and 8K digital cameras could show some banding as well. This is the case for Mission Impossible Fallout during some of the IMAX scenes.
But I see the same issues on my Samsung 4K HDR screen... both Netflix and prime apps and 4K. Seems like encoding... this is the scene from series of unfortunate events S2, ep 8... any of the scenes with the dr lab coats. You’ll see green/red blotches. Blown up to 110" obviously makes things stand out vs 65" panel.
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post #5218 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 05:55 PM
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Originally Posted by mavromatis View Post
But I see the same issues on my Samsung 4K HDR screen... both Netflix and prime apps and 4K. Seems like encoding... this is the scene from series of unfortunate events S2, ep 8... any of the scenes with the dr lab coats. You’ll see green/red blotches. Blown up to 110" obviously makes things stand out vs 65" panel.
If you see banding on your 65" Samsung TV, then on the 110" screen is going to be more evident of course. I found myself sometimes going to check banding on my Sony 65Z9D if I see banding on my 295ES and most of the time, I can see minimal banding with the same content on the Z9D, meaning it's the source and not the display but 4K projectors always have more banding than TV sets. That is a fact.
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post #5219 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 07:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enricoclaudio View Post
If you see banding on your 65" Samsung TV, then on the 110" screen is going to be more evident of course. I found myself sometimes going to check banding on my Sony 65Z9D if I see banding on my 295ES and most of the time, I can see minimal banding with the same content on the Z9D, meaning it's the source and not the display but 4K projectors always have more banding than TV sets. That is a fact.
Just maybe, all of our display devise's have banding flaws, which is probably true
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post #5220 of 15288 Old 02-10-2019, 07:45 PM
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Normally I watch Netflix on my Roku Ultra and haven't seen any significant issues with HDR & auto tone mapping. Tonight I decided to try watching them on my NX7 through my Panasonic UB900 UHD player. Netflix shows that I've watched in HDR with my Roku were all in SDR Rec709. I logged out of Netflix and signed back in, but it still wouldn't display in HDR (although I can search for HDR shows). Can anyone comment on whether or not the Panasonic 900 has always had this Netflix limitation?
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