Official JVC RS3000/NX9 - JVC RS2000/NX7/N7 - JVC RS1000/NX5/N5 - Owners Thread - Page 422 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #12631 of 18048 Old 06-10-2019, 10:46 PM
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N7 owner here, went from firmware v1.19 to 2.01 with no issue and I have no intention to update
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post #12632 of 18048 Old 06-10-2019, 11:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
Use a Custom gamma for HDR and select gamma 2.2 as correction value, then apply your tweaks.
Easy...thanks
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post #12633 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 04:04 AM
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From what I see there is no way this is happening often at all. This thread would be lit up like a Christmas tree if every projector was effected. I have seen maybe 3 or 4 cases in here unless I am not remembering correctly. From our own clients zero.

---I agree even for one guy to have to deal with this is no fun, but it is far from the norm. If you want to see widespread glitches, hop over to the TV section of the forum...
I think I've seen about 10 cases of it in here. This problem has been going on and on for months. There's no way its just 3-4 people. One guy went about 400 hours until it hit.

The normal thing for someone that has this problem to do is to power cycle the projector and if it seems fine, they'd write it off. These projectors have likely not been in the hands of your clients long enough to burn through a couple 400-500 hour test cycles. You most likely would not hear about it unless it happened 2-3 times. I've seen many projector owners not put more than 400 hours on a projector in a whole year. So, while you might think your clients not reporting it means there's no issue, I think it is far more likely that many just haven't encountered it "yet" due to low use and also a few did and just power cycled without informing you.
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post #12634 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 06:17 AM
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Easy...thanks
People would normally tweak the HDR settings in the UB9000/UB820 instead of the gamma 2.2 curve in the projector.
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post #12635 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 06:37 AM
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So, while you might think your clients not reporting it means there's no issue, I think it is far more likely that many just haven't encountered it "yet" due to low use and also a few did and just power cycled without informing you.
On the e-shift models there is a similar problem that was never fixed (as far as I know). The screen would get filled with random lines and disconnecting the source would not fix it. I experienced the problem on a previous unit and thought my current one (an X750/RS500) does not have it, but finally saw it last week after 1000 hours.

Fortunately on the e-shift units turning off CMD would fix it (without having to power cycle the projector), but apparently the same trick does not work on the native 4K models.
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post #12636 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 07:48 AM
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On the e-shift models there is a similar problem that was never fixed (as far as I know). The screen would get filled with random lines and disconnecting the source would not fix it. I experienced the problem on a previous unit and thought my current one (an X750/RS500) does not have it, but finally saw it last week after 1000 hours.

Fortunately on the e-shift units turning off CMD would fix it (without having to power cycle the projector), but apparently the same trick does not work on the native 4K models.
My prior projector was an early model RS500. I experienced this problem in spades when I first installed the projector. I would get the random bars sometimes upon start up but mostly when switching sources. The only way to un freeze the bars was to power cycle. I finally mostly eliminated the problem by trying different HDMI cables until I found cables that worked. The cable that worked for me was Monoprice Certified Premium High Speed HDMI Cable, 4K @ 60Hz, HDR, 18Gbps, 28AWG, YUV 4:4:4, 6ft, Black. Not an expensive cable.

Last month I installed a new JVC NX9 in the system and experienced on occasion the same random vertical bars never on start up but occasionally upon switching. But, on the NX9, I found that power cycling to solve the problem was not required. All I had to do was switch to another source (either active or un active) until I saw a clear screen then switch back to the desired source. I mostly have experienced this with the Roku connection. Since the work around is easy and fast, I have not changed HDMI cables yet but feel that the HDMI handshake is the issue.

On either the RS500 or the NX9, I have never experienced a vertical bar issue while a program is playing. That appears to be a separate issue. I have logged about 50 hours on my NX9 (firmware 2.07) without this particular issue.

Mt thought is that both stability issues are HDMI related. The first is failure to achieve handshake and the second loss of HDMI connection during play back triggered by something in the image signal. It would appear that some units might be more sensitive to the conditions that trigger loss of signal.
This might be caused by a component on the edge of a speciation limit. This would account for random occurrences as well as some not experiencing the problem at all if component is not at spec edge.
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post #12637 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 08:12 AM
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It happens with PC parts too, it's just not as common because the volume they are dealing in is so much higher volume than things like projectors. The problems are spotted quickly in their initial RMA process and they have to correct them fast because if you are selling $100 to $200 part and getting bombarded with RMA, you're losing a lot of money quickly. If you always order the earliest runs or v1 revisions of motherboards, I've seen similar things happen, like random reboots every 2 weeks from overheating bus controller, or just compatibility issues with firmware, or you get a bad memory chip and you get weird BSOD's.

I've seen the vertical lines issue on 2 projectors and three times on PC's. On the PC, two times it was heat related and once it appeared to be a faulty capacitor. On the projector I saw, it was a resistor and the problem was self-fixable by replacing the resistor, as several people did in the forums. The bad resistor was confirmed by the manufacturer (Mitsubishi) and they even sent out a diagram to repair shops so it would be easy for them to fix the issue. The other projector that had it, I have no idea what the issue was, but it was hardware related as it was sent back to the MFR.

When the Mits hc4000 had the issue, it appeared eerily similar to this, only a select few people were having problems, and it would only show up after hours of usage.
I'm aware of all that. My main point was you don't see a bad DIMM or board capacitor for example be fine for a very long period of time after a simple power cycle. They will generally fail again as soon as they are stressed. Again if it was heat related I would think it would manifest again very quickly since you are resuming the same material that caused the overheat condition with only a brief interruption. Minutes rather than hours. But these are very complex devices so it's really hard to say. I could easily be wrong.

The symptoms just seem more like a corruption in memory somewhere. Cycling power clears volatile memory and it doesn't reoccur until a certain sequence results in corruption again. When it's fixed it will be interesting to know what it was. Hopefully they tell us.

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post #12638 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 08:53 AM
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It doesn't sound like software because of the way people are describing the problem, been in electronics and similar fields since the 1990's. I've seen this problem 5 times and it was never software, including on other projectors. That said, about 1 out of 3 or 4 times, software problems mimmick hardware and vice versa. So there is no way to really know for certain.

It's unusual to be able to run out of memory, it's protected and they'd have to be using some RTOS which probably have a sort of global error handler and garbage collector. The individual processing is outsourced I'm sure to companies that specialize in it, or a joint venture. With modern hardware, there is usually an overkill on firmware memory these days because it is so cheap. The HDMI decoders are pretty much standardized at this point, though some bugs do exist, they are usually just chroma bugs or conversion issues. Sounds like digital decoding failure of the HDMI signal from an out of phase electrical signal, they can fix it by implementing a more sensitive validity check on the signal before trying to decode it, but the reason these types of issues likely exist is because of video timing requirements and the real time OS requirement limits what can be done as far as how thorough the signals can be tested for validity without introducing extra lag.

You could say it is 'software' in the sense of not enough protection code to prevent the invalid decoding. However, for software, the error handler would likely just cause an HDMI resynch / blackout as it would default to trying to rehandshake. The fact that it hard locks and then shows lines, sounds like kernel panic, and the only thing that really causes kernel panics in RTOS is usually hardware failure or electrical signal problem (invalid signal). When the current is wrong or out of phase, the decoder itself fails and cannot read the signal, because it wasn't designed to decode that higher range. Eventually could damage the decoder chip or other chips, but unlikely it would because they generally can take a bit of a beating, it's just they can take more of a beating than they can actually 'read'.

Many projectors will lock up if you plug or unplug the HDMI cable in at exactly the wrong time, it's because sort of like how a 'spark' happens, you're basically sending a bad signal due to a split-second faulty connection as you were plugging it in. I think this is basically the same problem, except it's happening on a live signal. That's why they recommend not to hot plug HDMI cables (that and static discharge), though actually causing damage is very rare, but more commonly you can hard lock devices.

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post #12639 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Roger Mathus View Post
Mt thought is that both stability issues are HDMI related. The first is failure to achieve handshake and the second loss of HDMI connection during play back triggered by something in the image signal. It would appear that some units might be more sensitive to the conditions that trigger loss of signal.
This might be caused by a component on the edge of a speciation limit. This would account for random occurrences as well as some not experiencing the problem at all if component is not at spec edge.
I agree it is most likely an HDMI signal problem, but the real question is whether it is software or an actual hardware issue. Given the frequency people had the issue, then the lack of the issue after swapping units, that's why I agree with you and don't think it's purely a software issue. There may very well be a software workaround though.

Switching sources can spike the signal and cause a similar issue, but more likely that only happens if you have a bad HDMI cable (or just a cable that cannot handle the spikes). With a good HDMI cable, the only way to usually cause it is by hot plugging / unplugging HDMI cables live. However, it sounds like people swapped cables I'm sure and were still having the same problem. This sounds a bit worse than the problem you were describing, as the NX series really shouldn't fail to decode the signal in the middle like that (without a source switch or hot plug), unless there was a bad cable (but then again people would have tried different cables).

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post #12640 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 10:43 AM
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I personally do not like the limited Foot Print of the Chief "X" plate.


The Peerless ACC570 Round Plate is structurally more sound, and the base's larger 8"+ in circumference rim offers much better sideways "sheer" support for a 48 lb Projector.



https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/447994-REG/Peerless_Industries_ACC570_Round_Ceiling_Plate.htm l


There are actually 4 Mounting Holes around the Rim.......................
...






https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...geID/accessory



Thanks
[/QUOTE]




Nothing wrong with the Chief CMA101 4 " armed " plate, but they also have one like the Peerless - https://www.legrandav.com/products/c.../plates/cms115

And a whole lot of other ones too - https://www.legrandav.com/products/c...uctural/plates

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post #12641 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 11:33 AM
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I think I've seen about 10 cases of it in here. This problem has been going on and on for months. There's no way its just 3-4 people. One guy went about 400 hours until it hit.



The normal thing for someone that has this problem to do is to power cycle the projector and if it seems fine, they'd write it off. These projectors have likely not been in the hands of your clients long enough to burn through a couple 400-500 hour test cycles. You most likely would not hear about it unless it happened 2-3 times. I've seen many projector owners not put more than 400 hours on a projector in a whole year. So, while you might think your clients not reporting it means there's no issue, I think it is far more likely that many just haven't encountered it "yet" due to low use and also a few did and just power cycled without informing you.


I’ve counted 10 cases as well


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post #12642 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 11:41 AM
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Nothing wrong with the Chief CMA101 4 " armed " plate, but they also have one like the Peerless - https://www.legrandav.com/products/c.../plates/cms115

And a whole lot of other ones too - https://www.legrandav.com/products/c...uctural/plates[/QUOTE]

Look at the difference in thickness between the two. The Peerless looks like a toy compared to the Chief.
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post #12643 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 12:30 PM
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I just got my replacement projector installed yesterday from the lines issue and haven't had time to test out where I've had problems in the past. To me it feels like some sort of HDMI handshake issue. I believe I've only seen it on the transitions between the FBI warnings. Which often results in the projector losing synch with the video source. Then it flips out and shoots out lines. The project either thinks its getting a continuous stream of lines or the output from the chip processing the HDMI signal is sending out a bunch of lines. The OSD doesn't show the lines over it so this shows that the projector thinks it should be displaying the lines. My issue could be when the projector just came on or when it had been on. It wasn't a heat issue.
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post #12644 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 01:31 PM
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I just got my replacement projector installed yesterday from the lines issue and haven't had time to test out where I've had problems in the past. To me it feels like some sort of HDMI handshake issue. I believe I've only seen it on the transitions between the FBI warnings. Which often results in the projector losing synch with the video source. Then it flips out and shoots out lines. The project either thinks its getting a continuous stream of lines or the output from the chip processing the HDMI signal is sending out a bunch of lines. The OSD doesn't show the lines over it so this shows that the projector thinks it should be displaying the lines. My issue could be when the projector just came on or when it had been on. It wasn't a heat issue.
It would be interesting to know if all those (10) who have had issues use a number of different sources?
I too believe it’s an HDMI issue when the projector is trying to sync, I wonder if this is why JVC had a very long sync on all the earlier models.
The NX series has a faster sync than the old models and could this be part of the problem, who knows…..

I only use an HTPC (one source) and all my 1500+ discs are ripped to the Nas, I have never seen these issues on my NX9 and I was one of the early adopters January 2019.
Since I only have one source there is only ever one handshake/sync at start-up, I don’t have the FBI warnings etc etc so there are no more syncs taking place once the projector is first fired up.

Food for thought…
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post #12645 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 03:31 PM
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It would be interesting to know if all those (10) who have had issues use a number of different sources?
Everything runs through my Lumagen to the JVC. I hadn't seen it on 1.17 or 2.01 in the 120 hours on my first RS3000 (December build received mid-Jan), but saw it after just 5 hours on my replacement (different issue) that came with 2.04 a couple of weeks ago. The first time I was out of the room and came back to it like that, but the second time it just happened while I was watching. No glitches in picture or audio, just the bars suddenly appearing. Both times I was watching TV from my DirecTV box with the Lumagen outputting 4096x2160 60p 4:2:2 12-bit. CMD etc off.

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post #12646 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 04:15 PM
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No issues with blue bars (or green) here after at least a couple hundred hours, and while I don't switch sources, I do switch apps and use all sorts of various media. The projector regularly changes between SDR and HDR, which switches lamp power, fan speed, color modes, and even engages the color filter. It also regularly changes frame rates, which also requires a new handshake. Finally, I switch back and forth between different anamorphic modes regularly. Netflix, Amazon, PSVue, and Plex (both TV and movies) and no bars. I watch between 2 and 5 hours at a sitting, seldom less or more. I haven't changed firmware from the 2.04 it came with.

I remember in the first couple hours it did something that required a hard power cycle, but I don't recall what it was specifically. I have had two cases where the shield had to be reset, but I thought it was the projector causing the problem because I figured I would see the Marantz logo if the shield dropped out, but instead I got the blue "no signal" screen. A shield reset fixed it.

I certainly hope I don't have any issues like others are reporting, but to be honest, it doesn't sound like something that makes it "inoperable". It sounds like an annoyance that certainly would warrant action on JVC's part if it continued, but something that will either eventually go away after a firmware update, or after a few dozen units get replaced. I'm not downplaying the significance of the reported issues, just not playing it up either.

The honest truth is that if it weren't for this thread, the ONLY issue I would be aware of with this projector is the bright corners, which stand out clear as day every time the projector goes to full black. And the fact is, I am in AWE at the picture quality every time I watch. Of all the money I have spent on various luxuries in my life, only a few have truly felt worth it after the first few uses. This projector is definitely one of them.

I can't help but feel there are some people posting on this thread that are doing their best to find a reason to hate these new projectors. The only time I see this much dedication toward blowing issues out of proportion is in politics. I can understand it in owners who have spent a lot of time and money and been shafted over and over with bugs and freight damage issues, but I'm not sure why a few non-owners are on that bandwagon too...?

Sorry, but a noisy DI and some blue bars every 100 hours that can be fixed with a reboot are NOT things that make this projector "inoperable". Annoying? Yes, without question. Disappointing? Of course. Would I be upset if I had the problems? Without a doubt. Would I return the projector and either go without anything or use something that wouldn't feel like it is worth the cost? Probably not. It would be different if the Sony was comparable in price and performance, or if the DLP's had the contrast and feature set, or if Epson had a true 4k panel and could still wipe the floor with their price point making their performance issues worth the savings, but the fact is, if you want solid native 4k performance at this caliber in the $10k range, there isn't a competitor.
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post #12647 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 05:35 PM
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No issues with blue bars (or green) here after at least a couple hundred hours, and while I don't switch sources, I do switch apps and use all sorts of various media. The projector regularly changes between SDR and HDR, which switches lamp power, fan speed, color modes, and even engages the color filter. It also regularly changes frame rates, which also requires a new handshake. Finally, I switch back and forth between different anamorphic modes regularly. Netflix, Amazon, PSVue, and Plex (both TV and movies) and no bars. I watch between 2 and 5 hours at a sitting, seldom less or more. I haven't changed firmware from the 2.04 it came with.



I remember in the first couple hours it did something that required a hard power cycle, but I don't recall what it was specifically. I have had two cases where the shield had to be reset, but I thought it was the projector causing the problem because I figured I would see the Marantz logo if the shield dropped out, but instead I got the blue "no signal" screen. A shield reset fixed it.



I certainly hope I don't have any issues like others are reporting, but to be honest, it doesn't sound like something that makes it "inoperable". It sounds like an annoyance that certainly would warrant action on JVC's part if it continued, but something that will either eventually go away after a firmware update, or after a few dozen units get replaced. I'm not downplaying the significance of the reported issues, just not playing it up either.



The honest truth is that if it weren't for this thread, the ONLY issue I would be aware of with this projector is the bright corners, which stand out clear as day every time the projector goes to full black. And the fact is, I am in AWE at the picture quality every time I watch. Of all the money I have spent on various luxuries in my life, only a few have truly felt worth it after the first few uses. This projector is definitely one of them.



I can't help but feel there are some people posting on this thread that are doing their best to find a reason to hate these new projectors. The only time I see this much dedication toward blowing issues out of proportion is in politics. I can understand it in owners who have spent a lot of time and money and been shafted over and over with bugs and freight damage issues, but I'm not sure why a few non-owners are on that bandwagon too...?



Sorry, but a noisy DI and some blue bars every 100 hours that can be fixed with a reboot are NOT things that make this projector "inoperable". Annoying? Yes, without question. Disappointing? Of course. Would I be upset if I had the problems? Without a doubt. Would I return the projector and either go without anything or use something that wouldn't feel like it is worth the cost? Probably not. It would be different if the Sony was comparable in price and performance, or if the DLP's had the contrast and feature set, or if Epson had a true 4k panel and could still wipe the floor with their price point making their performance issues worth the savings, but the fact is, if you want solid native 4k performance at this caliber in the $10k range, there isn't a competitor.


Great post. Mirrors my thoughts as an owner too.


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post #12648 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 05:52 PM
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Everything runs through my Lumagen to the JVC. I hadn't seen it on 1.17 or 2.01 in the 120 hours on my first RS3000 (December build received mid-Jan), but saw it after just 5 hours on my replacement (different issue) that came with 2.04 a couple of weeks ago. The first time I was out of the room and came back to it like that, but the second time it just happened while I was watching. No glitches in picture or audio, just the bars suddenly appearing. Both times I was watching TV from my DirecTV box with the Lumagen outputting 4096x2160 60p 4:2:2 12-bit. CMD etc off.
I don't use a Lumagen, but that sounds like how I experienced it the first couple of times. I was out of the room for about 45 minutes and when i came back the bars were present. That was around the 100 hour mark and I had the issue every 10 to 15 hours from then on (2.04 as well).

I'm now about 35 hours into 2.07 and haven't seen the issue yet, but who knows.
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post #12649 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 06:32 PM
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No issues with blue bars (or green) here after at least a couple hundred hours, and while I don't switch sources, I do switch apps and use all sorts of various media. The projector regularly changes between SDR and HDR, which switches lamp power, fan speed, color modes, and even engages the color filter. It also regularly changes frame rates, which also requires a new handshake. Finally, I switch back and forth between different anamorphic modes regularly. Netflix, Amazon, PSVue, and Plex (both TV and movies) and no bars. I watch between 2 and 5 hours at a sitting, seldom less or more. I haven't changed firmware from the 2.04 it came with.

I remember in the first couple hours it did something that required a hard power cycle, but I don't recall what it was specifically. I have had two cases where the shield had to be reset, but I thought it was the projector causing the problem because I figured I would see the Marantz logo if the shield dropped out, but instead I got the blue "no signal" screen. A shield reset fixed it.

I certainly hope I don't have any issues like others are reporting, but to be honest, it doesn't sound like something that makes it "inoperable". It sounds like an annoyance that certainly would warrant action on JVC's part if it continued, but something that will either eventually go away after a firmware update, or after a few dozen units get replaced. I'm not downplaying the significance of the reported issues, just not playing it up either.

The honest truth is that if it weren't for this thread, the ONLY issue I would be aware of with this projector is the bright corners, which stand out clear as day every time the projector goes to full black. And the fact is, I am in AWE at the picture quality every time I watch. Of all the money I have spent on various luxuries in my life, only a few have truly felt worth it after the first few uses. This projector is definitely one of them.

I can't help but feel there are some people posting on this thread that are doing their best to find a reason to hate these new projectors. The only time I see this much dedication toward blowing issues out of proportion is in politics. I can understand it in owners who have spent a lot of time and money and been shafted over and over with bugs and freight damage issues, but I'm not sure why a few non-owners are on that bandwagon too...?

Sorry, but a noisy DI and some blue bars every 100 hours that can be fixed with a reboot are NOT things that make this projector "inoperable". Annoying? Yes, without question. Disappointing? Of course. Would I be upset if I had the problems? Without a doubt. Would I return the projector and either go without anything or use something that wouldn't feel like it is worth the cost? Probably not. It would be different if the Sony was comparable in price and performance, or if the DLP's had the contrast and feature set, or if Epson had a true 4k panel and could still wipe the floor with their price point making their performance issues worth the savings, but the fact is, if you want solid native 4k performance at this caliber in the $10k range, there isn't a competitor.

We should probably ban any conversation related to shortcomings in the projectors. It really isn’t worth trying to get bugs fixed. 😄
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post #12650 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by cmatthes1 View Post
We should probably ban any conversation related to shortcomings in the projectors. It really isn’t worth trying to get bugs fixed. 😄
Nah this is not the 9060 or 970 DLP thread where you can't talk about the shortcomings. We can take it.

It is something that JVC needs to fix. I have 200 hours on mine and do not have that issue so far. Hope they get it done soon.
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Originally Posted by dkersten View Post
Sorry, but a noisy DI and some blue bars every 100 hours that can be fixed with a reboot are NOT things that make this projector "inoperable". Annoying? Yes, without question. Disappointing? Of course. Would I be upset if I had the problems? Without a doubt. Would I return the projector and either go without anything or use something that wouldn't feel like it is worth the cost? Probably not. It would be different if the Sony was comparable in price and performance, or if the DLP's had the contrast and feature set, or if Epson had a true 4k panel and could still wipe the floor with their price point making their performance issues worth the savings, but the fact is, if you want solid native 4k performance at this caliber in the $10k range, there isn't a competitor.
I agree, it's far from inoperable, but it's also worse than an inconvenience as it could affect the value of the projector in the used market, once next year's model is released if that year does not have the issue. I see your point, I don't think most of us are saying NOT to buy this projector. As you noted, JVC doesn't have any competition really. Some people had it occurring a lot more than every 100 hours.

Since people have warranties, nothing to get all that worried about I suppose. However, these are not cheap units, I would be a bit upset personally if I were experiencing the issue. That doesn't mean you cannot enjoy your projector. I also think 'how upset' someone is will partly relate to how much they care about the money they spend on these things, I mean for people upgrading in a couple years or for those that have a lot of cash to burn, they might not care anyhow.
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post #12652 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by cmatthes1 View Post
We should probably ban any conversation related to shortcomings in the projectors. It really isn’t worth trying to get bugs fixed. 😄
Nothing wrong with talking about problems, they need to be brought to light. That is one of the things I have liked about the JVC threads, but sometimes people take issues and blow them out of proportion. I think that is what some people are objecting to.
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post #12653 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 06:57 PM
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Originally Posted by cmatthes1 View Post
We should probably ban any conversation related to shortcomings in the projectors. It really isn’t worth trying to get bugs fixed. 😄
if you have a bug or issue, contact your authorized JVC dealer. JVC has been better than good about getting photos of the problems so they can get them corrected. That said, very few folks I've dealt with have had an issues with their new JVC projectors. I'd know - Mike and I are on the " front line ".

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My personal limits for if I'd send the projector back or not, would be if it happens more than 3 times on a regular signal when I'm not changing sources over the first year. If I were messing around with the HDMI cables and it caused it, I wouldn't be as picky. I've caused my older JVC to lock up a few times when being naughty and hot plugging cables, but if it were to lock up while I was just watching a regular signal, that's a bit more concerning.

Everyone should be very careful about their HDMI cable runs, especially with this projector...

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post #12655 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 07:46 PM
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Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

I agree, it's far from inoperable, but it's also worse than an inconvenience as it could significantly reduce the value of the projector in the used market, once next year's model is released if that year does not have the issue.
You are assuming the issue won't be resolved in this model. I don't believe that. If you have a faulty unit now and go to sell it, then yes, the value is diminished. Not by much since it could still be warrantied by the buyer, and more importantly, the fact that it is still the best looking projector in the $5-20k range, which is a sweet spot for budget high end projectors.

But you make a point, some people buy cars for the value retention, some people buy cars for the enjoyment of driving them. I can't knock someone being upset that their car lost more value in the first year than it should have. 🙂 for some, the stigma of issues even after they are fixed, is there. I imagine a lot of people who haven't been able to enjoy the image these projectors throw will google a used one, find this thread, and assume they are piles of junk before reading about the firmware fixes that will come out that fix it all and end up missing out on a fantastic projector. Kind of like the rs4500, which people still believe has worse contrast than the Sony's.

[quote] We really don't know the frequency of the issue or how many people have it, it's too intermittent for some people to know. It sounded like some people had it occurring a lot more than every 100 hours.[quote]
Exactly, we DON'T know. And we probably won't long before it is 100% fixed by a firmware update.

This projector has been available to buy for regular consumers (non early adopter preorderer)for all of about a month, and the majority of early buyers haven't had theirs for more than 3 months. Sure, it was supposed to be widely available 6 months ago, but the fact is it is still just getting out to the masses, and JVC is still in the early stages of fixing issues. We all know there will be many more firmware releases, and there is no word of them giving up on fixing anything. If we were already at Cedia 2019 with no acknowledgement of an issue, that would be one thing, but there have been 3 firmware versions specifically trying to fix the blue lines in the last 7 weeks, and recent word of progress on the yellow issue. Not one person here can definitively say this product is a dud and will be avoided in the used market. Not one person here can say this is a widespread issue or a 2% bad sample. Crying wolf and running for cover at this stage is hardly warranted.

I think the problem is some people are taking an issue with a third party part that caused a delay in production, a bunch of freight damage issues, an early issue with DI that was resolved before more than a handful of units hit the street, a minor problem with yellowing of whites when the DI clamps all the way down that most can't see unless they look hard for, and a dozen people with a problem where blue or green lines appear that requires a reset, and they are lumping it all together as the same problem and calling it a failed product despite the fact that MOST users have seen none of this and think this is the best sub $20k projector ever to come out.

Quote:
Since people have warranties, nothing to get all that worried about I suppose. However, these are not cheap units, I would be a bit upset personally if I were experiencing the issue. That doesn't mean you cannot enjoy your projector. I also think 'how upset' someone is will partly relate to how much they care about the money they spend on these things, I mean for people upgrading in a couple years or for those that have a lot of cash to burn, they might not care anyhow.
I would be upset too, but like 98% of the customers my dealer has, I don't have any issues. The sky isn't falling And this projector is not a dud, it's amazing, and I can't ever see an upgrade in the next 5-10 years that could justify the price. And if I do get the issues a few are having, I not only trust JVC will stand behind their product, but I trust my dealer will take care of me. At least they better

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post #12656 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 07:55 PM
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I agree, the issue is not yet widespread enough to yet warrant that people should avoid this projector. I am still recommending this projector in the forums. I don't even mention this issue, I am only posting about in here out of curiosity.

If someone asks what to buy, I tell them the NX series or the RS-540/640. Those are the best projectors you can get, though 640's are hard to get, and 540's will soon be that way I suppose. Whether someone picks an RS-540 or an NX series really shouldn't be about this issue for MOST people, that is not what I base it on. I'm just following it to see if it gets worse / better or what happens out of interest. I try to keep up with the different projectors as much as I have time to.

I've never seen the NX series yet, but I do know from others it has a cleaner and sharper image than the older e-shift units.
So I tell people the main reason to choose pre-NX series is if you are sitting farther back and don't mind a non-Native 4k projector.

I think most people would rather have Native 4k, as it is better, but there are some tradeoffs between these different JVC's for certain.

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post #12657 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by cmatthes1 View Post
We should probably ban any conversation related to shortcomings in the projectors. It really isn’t worth trying to get bugs fixed.
Lol!, OR we can just throw up our hands, declare the end of JVC, and throw the projectors in the garbage because clearly they are so buggy they have no use or resale value.


Lol, I am not saying there aren't or that they shouldn't be discussed. I'm just wondering why so many non-owners are chiming in on how bad things are. I'm also pointing out that not all of us have had issues, per the request that more owners with no problems post to say the issue isn't as widespread as this thread would lead you to believe.
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post #12658 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 08:00 PM
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People 'personalize' their projectors, but this issue really shouldn't be a deal-breaker for most people. If there were no warranty period, then I'd be a bit more concerned.

Having been in these forums for over 10 years, I can definitely say that 10+ people is enough to signify a real issue. That's actually about the crossover point (5-10 reports), usually. Though Epson and Benq have so much volume on some of their units, it's hard to judge anything from those threads, JVC and Sony have lower volume which makes it simpler.

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post #12659 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 08:06 PM
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I agree, the isue is; not yet widespread enough to yet warrant that people should avoid this projector. I am still recommending this projector in the forums. I don't even mention this isue, I am only posting about in here out of curiosty.
You are one of the few who are actually asking questions, and not just adding it all together and freaking out.

I certainly feel like JVC didn't put their best foot forward on this launch, but like everything else in this world it's getting blown way out of proportion with almost no evidence to back up the reaction. A few enthusiasts are having early isues that are actively being worked on by JVC. Why don't we rely on their history of taking care of customers rather than assume the company will just turn a blind eye and fix it in the next generation. That sounds; like a different projector company, lol.

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post #12660 of 18048 Old 06-11-2019, 08:18 PM
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I'm also watching for my own benefit as I may pick up a B-stock unit if I can get over my own 'hurdle' of not wanting the extra contrast of the older series. At my seating position, the RS-640 vs. NX-5 or NX-7 is a toss up really, as far as what I'd prefer. I've already somewhat worn out my welcome with most dealers in my area, as I go to places and don't buy anything. I know one small dealer that has it and that doesn't mind showing me, but he doesn't have much time and I don't want to waste his time.

I could go to Star Power and see if they have the NX series on display, but their setups are very hit or miss. Some rooms are 'almost passable' and some are a total joke. I really dislike their themed rooms which involve BLING and bright walls, often green or yellow or blue. You can call ahead and ask them for a demo between X and X, but you'll be under high pressure to buy something. Their leathery brown and darker rooms are the best, but they used to mostly put Sonys in those rooms or just giant TV's, but I haven't been to every Star Power showroom, so I don't know. Been a while since I've been. Next time I am a bit closer to one, I'll go check it out and see if they have one. Magnolia always has their stuff off, and usually has a Sony and an Epson or Benq, which are also usually off. I usually have to hunt someone down and they aren't all that willing to help, well it depends, some are nice and some are ridiculous.

I was in Magnolia and I sat down in the HT chair, and one guy said, you know how much that costs right. I said, yah your stuff is overpriced I can get it online for half. I only said that because he was being rude.

Right now trying to hunt down an RS-540 or RS-640 on Craig's list, but the only thing I can find so far is an RS-56 (boo).

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