Official JVC RS3000/NX9 - JVC RS2000/NX7/N7 - JVC RS1000/NX5/N5 - Owners Thread - Page 53 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1561 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 02:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dj Dee View Post
Arrows NX9 look horrific compared to mine if I take the pictures in the loop. Might be different in the same room side by side.
That also adds up concerning the difference in measurements.


But remember that you in no way see this kind of stuff in a movie. I might see some in the roller text at the end of the film but normal JVC like as privies versions just horizontal not vertical. .
could you possibly check the blu-rays of elysium, gravity and interstellar all these have bright white titles on black at some stage in the movie, usually at start. will know whether this is a problem "in movie"

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post #1562 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 02:21 AM
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Originally Posted by alebonau View Post
could you possibly check the blu-rays of elysium, gravity and interstellar all these have bright white titles on black at some stage in the movie, usually at start. will know whether this is a problem "in movie"
@Dj Dee while on the subject of Blu Rays ( 1080P) ......do you have any of the Sc-iFi series "Expanse" ?

If so, could you please have a look at a few "dark scenes" .....there are MANY look at backgrounds ( dark area,s) and observe if ANY of the dark/black area,s have a slight "purple" cast to them.......curious to see what you observe..
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post #1563 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 02:27 AM
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Originally Posted by alebonau View Post
could you possibly check the blu-rays of elysium, gravity and interstellar all these have bright white titles on black at some stage in the movie, usually at start. will know whether this is a problem "in movie"

All that is done, also Prometheus in the scene where there only is a flashlight. I what so ever don't see anything that even indicates any errors.

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post #1564 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 02:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woofer View Post
@Dj Dee while on the subject of Blu Rays ( 1080P) ......do you have any of the Sc-iFi series "Expanse" ?

If so, could you please have a look at a few "dark scenes" .....there are MANY look at backgrounds ( dark area,s) and observe if ANY of the dark/black area,s have a slight "purple" cast to them.......curious to see what you observe..
As you might have seen I adore the JVC black, and also have a shutter for 100% fade 2 black to take away the little stray light left..
And can confirm that there are no colors added that not are there. So answer 100% no in this unit.
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post #1565 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 02:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Dj Dee View Post
All that is done, also Prometheus in the scene where there only is a flashlight. I what so ever don't see anything that even indicates any errors.
that has to be fantastic news, as this I know previous gen JVC have struggled with

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post #1566 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 02:39 AM
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But what I see, and need to be corrected is that 1% and 2% measurements in Calman show to bright gamma. when linear at 2,4 or 2,3 the 1% and 2 % are around 2.0
It was at gamma 2.0 but managed to correct it to 2,2 together with the jvc autocal program gama 11 points adjustment. To fix it like I have it now needed to take the bias in the greyscale then the dark end down to -3 in red green and blue. After that correct the 5% down to linear gamma 2,4. Then the 1% and the 2 % went from 2.0 to 2.2. To get this corrected I need to take a full gamma autocal and after that correct it again to get it totally linear down to 1%. I feel that this is the most important thing with all JVC projectors, to get the JVC dynamic range/gamma response perfect.


Tried this with other meters, but Klein K10A is the only meter that manages this correct. Or similar.
Have done a lot of study around this, and finished result is stunning on JVC.
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post #1567 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 02:41 AM
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To any of the owners. Can we have an overexposed image of a black field pattern, just to check about bright corners?
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post #1568 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 02:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loggeo View Post
To any of the owners. Can we have an overexposed image of a black field pattern, just to check about bright corners?

My NX9 have almost nothing, so might have been the best JVC unit I ever had concerning bright corners, and I have had a lot of them. So there am happy.

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post #1569 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 02:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woofer View Post
@Dj Dee your unit is better, BUT it still shows excessive "Blooming" "Haloing"



Cant wait to see the same pattern on an NX7....
Woofer and what about your unit as you have NX9 as well, can you check the same pattern please?

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post #1570 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 03:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dj Dee View Post
There are some reflections /ghosting haloing going on in the lens, might be the e-shift glass.
Good picture that can explain what likely cause this issue.

When you look close to the picture I modify you can see that there is a reflection to the left.

But what is more worry is the 2. reflection to the the right down.
This reflection is half down and half to the right and so far I understand how e shift work this is it.

So I almost sure that bug coming from e shift!

So far I understand this was also there when the e shift is switch off?
If this is the case WOW JVC listen and remove the e shift as soon as possible otherwise a lot of people include me will not buy the X9.
Or bring the 8k e shift to a quality level that not show so much negative things.
But better remove it as soon as possible.

As I had post already it creates only problems not any single advantage!
The more people will tell JVC that we do not like it the better it is.
But in the end only less sale will convince them.
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post #1571 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 04:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Cutter View Post
I was thinking the same thing. I'm new to the whole 4K HDR world. I already have my UB820 but I'm very confused as to what settings will be the best when I'm watching standard Blu-ray movies and 4K HDR Blu-ray movies. Not sure if I have to change things on the UB820, the RS2000 or both.
Dont worry u will figure it out like I did. Let the info flow..
If this is your first projector or jvc your in for a treat..

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post #1572 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 05:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ARROW-AV View Post
UPDATE:

OK so the contrast performance of this particular unit that I have here is not even close to the performance of @Dj Dee 's unit.

This is because this unit has a lot of light scatter and internal reflections going on; something which I do not believe that @Dj Dee 's unit is experiencing to anything like the same degree.

The good news is that given @Dj Dee 's unit is NOT doing this, then this could mean that my unit is not typical and in fact might even be a defective unit.

What is concerning me the most is that this unit is measuring circa 20% below JVC's factory specification with respect to native ON/OFF contrast, as well as at least 30% below JVC's pre-existing typical factory specification for ANSI as well.

Therefore, please do NOT consider this to be what is expected to be the typical performance of the JVC RS3000/NX9

The fact of the matter is that I need to and will be evaluating a further FOUR units. Only once we have more data points can conclusions be drawn.

LOW LAMP MODE:

IRIS 0 = 25,400:1
IRIS -7 = 43,064:1
IRIS -15 = 73,045:1
ANSI = 175:1

(...)

Wow, these are really very close to the PrePro results, we published. So right now we have 3 measured NX9 with close results (one final series / two PrePro) and one final Series machine with better results (DJ Dee). It really gets thrilling, what the final series average will be. Probably inbetween somewhere.

Cant wait to start measuring :-)

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post #1573 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 05:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
First we need to measure one that does not have such bad blooming. Then we need the same person to measure a VW995 and or VW885. Rather than try to base everything off of one unit, a unit that looks pretty bad, with blooming. I have seen the RS3000, it is going to be a really good projector.
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Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
I think if you got the projector Arrow got, put FW v1.17 on it and just watched it you'd be pretty happy.
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Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post
No different with any projector - from any brand. You either measure it or have a pro calibrator measure it or you eyeball it and wing it. Been that way for at least 16 years. How do you know that $5K flat panel 4K TV you bought meets advertised specs ? You would need to measure it. Or just take it on faith and go with it.
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Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post
Get your projector calibrated and you'll know that not only is it close to spec., it will be dialed in as close to perfect as possible.
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
How do you know that about any complicated product, unless you measure or test. You would be shocked at how crappy many TV's measure and yet most don't know about the issues.
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Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
A "regular" consumer will buy the projector, fire it up, and if they like the way that it looks they'll probably not even so much as tweak the settings. No one "has to purchase" a colorimeter or hire a calibrator. I've never done either.

Arrow has also stated several times that his NX9 "looks very sharp". I bet anyone that bought it and just used it would have been plenty stoked and not complaining - well short of the issues on v1.16 firmware.
I'm trying to be fair and reasonable here, to both JVC and potential JVC customer.

The fact that Arrow-AV has what appears to be a somewhat 'defective' unit, which is *not* measuring up to spec, which "looks pretty bad, with blooming," is quite worrisome to me. And I think we all understood this was a genuine 'Production' level unit, but now that problems have been identified, we're speculating that maybe it's not *really* Production series, but a pre-production holdover?

I understand that no TV or Projector manufacturer will produce completely identical displays, and that there will be some unit-to-unit variation. But it is the *degree* of difference that is worrisome.

Saying just fire it up, watch it, or hire a calibrator (which wouldn't correct Arrow-AV's 'bad blooming,' would it?), and don't worry about it, frankly doesn't cut it if I'm going to be spending 5 figures on a Projector. Surely, ignorance is not bliss in this context. I need to be able to trust that JVC will deliver on what they're claiming and advertising.

The fact they quickly corrected the DI bug is certainly reassuring, but the disappointingly poor contrast measurements, the 'bad blooming,' etc. suggest the possibility of a hardware problem, which is not so easily fixed.

As someone who has been anticipating getting an NX9 for many months now, my enthusiasm has been tempered by what I've been reading since the first units have been delivered. I had no problem whatsoever with JVC's delay, with the assumption being that when they finally shipped units, they would not have the types of problems that have been identified here.

I'm sure that if I bought one, I'd be "happy" with what I'd see, but given the unit quality 'lottery' that is being suggested here, the uncertainty that JVC is giving me what they've promised me, I'm much less confident about laying down that money. I don't think I'm being unreasonable about my wants and expectations.

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post #1574 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 05:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W.Mayer View Post
Good picture that can explain what likely cause this issue.

When you look close to the picture I modify you can see that there is a reflection to the left.

But what is more worry is the 2. reflection to the the right down.
This reflection is half down and half to the right and so far I understand how e shift work this is it.

So I almost sure that bug coming from e shift!

So far I understand this was also there when the e shift is switch off?
If this is the case WOW JVC listen and remove the e shift as soon as possible otherwise a lot of people include me will not buy the X9.
Or bring the 8k e shift to a quality level that not show so much negative things.
But better remove it as soon as possible.

As I had post already it creates only problems not any single advantage!
The more people will tell JVC that we do not like it the better it is.
But in the end only less sale will convince them.


Can you please post RAW or uncompressed PNG file. Maybe it's just my phone but I can't make out the shadow


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post #1575 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 05:26 AM
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Have there been any changes to JVC's Autocal program (software previously used for my RS500) for the Spyder 5 since the update of 5/2016? Is that the version to be used for the NX5/7/9 series or is there another version that I'm unable to find by Google? If so, a link would greatly be appreciated. Thanks!

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post #1576 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 05:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by docrog View Post
Have there been any changes to JVC's Autocal program (software previously used for my RS500) for the Spyder 5 since the update of 5/2016? Is that the version to be used for the NX5/7/9 series or is there another version that I'm unable to find by Google? If so, a link would greatly be appreciated. Thanks!
Tested this yesterday, and looks to me just the same.

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post #1577 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 05:41 AM
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Can anyone say how their NX7 is on the bloom?
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post #1578 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 05:45 AM
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Originally Posted by theblackangus View Post
Can anyone say how their NX7 is on the bloom?

I will have a look on a N7 soon.
Let you guys know instantly.
If am lucky, I might take some measurements of the same taken on the NX9.
But I am still sick and going on antibiotic, so if anyone else can do this quick do so


If anyone need the patterns they are all here (I just uploaded the full pattern pack from projection dreams.)
The ansicontrast pattern is not the one Arrow uses or me, so deleted them.


















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post #1579 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 05:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alebonau View Post
projectors neither have a TV tuner or streaming apps so it makes ABSOLUTELY no sense for a projector like the JVC to have ARC. I think most makers like jvc are expecting if you are spending the kind of money you are on a projector you are likely in the last decade with rest of your equipment wiht some hdmi capability.

IF you have an AVR with no HDMI Capability it is The no 1 reason player makers provide dual hdmi and also analog outputs. that said both will creat the possibility of audio and picture to be out of synch given both are processed separately. not a problem where you have audio and video both processed together and are kept in sync with each other.

arc is anyways an abomination released. I have not myself found one instance of it working properly in times when I have helped family to get going. SO many more easier simpler ways to get audio video happening
Most projectors are long runs and for 4K you need an active HDMI cable. Those are all directional. I'm not sure if ARC is even possible over a directional cable. Anyways, there's absolutely no reason a projector needs to provide ARC. The purpose of ARC is so that the stuff on the TV such as the TV apps or the TV tuner can send the sound externally. Projectors have none of those things.
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post #1580 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 05:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KarlKlammer View Post
@Dj Dee
Thanks for sharing those pictures and your impressions.


By the way: I still find your 'fade to black device' really fascinating.
What's this fade to black device?

Quote:
Originally Posted by woofer View Post
@Dj Dee while on the subject of Blu Rays ( 1080P) ......do you have any of the Sc-iFi series "Expanse" ?

If so, could you please have a look at a few "dark scenes" .....there are MANY look at backgrounds ( dark area,s) and observe if ANY of the dark/black area,s have a slight "purple" cast to them.......curious to see what you observe..
Expanse is a perfect test for these projectors. Watch any of them with the "previously on" followed by the actually beginning credit show and song which always ends in the black letters "THE EXPANSE".

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post #1581 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 05:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W.Mayer View Post
Good picture that can explain what likely cause this issue.

When you look close to the picture I modify you can see that there is a reflection to the left.

But what is more worry is the 2. reflection to the the right down.
This reflection is half down and half to the right and so far I understand how e shift work this is it.

So I almost sure that bug coming from e shift!.
eShift shifts one half pixel. I thought that image is a crop of a whole patch in a test image - it is much bigger than a single pixel.
That's not to say it isn't related to eShift element being in light path (could be) but it's not because of half down half right...
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post #1582 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 05:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
What's this fade to black device?



Expanse is a perfect test for these projectors. Watch any of them with the "previously on" followed by the actually beginning credit show and song which always ends in the black letters "THE EXPANSE".
This is the start, a lot of modifikasjons after this.


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post #1583 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 05:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dj Dee View Post
This is the start, many modifications after this.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p71N71adOUg
So how does this work? It taps into the HDMI or has some camera on the screen? Did you create this yourself hardware and software? Perhaps you should start a thread on it I'd love to discuss it more
Edit: found your thread. Moving this there.
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-di...pro-1-0-a.html

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post #1584 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 06:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tommarra View Post
Can you please post RAW or uncompressed PNG file. Maybe it's just my phone but I can't make out the shadow


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RAW or any other PNG will be not made any difference you need to see a monitor where you can adjust brightness.
A phone is not the right display for it.
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post #1585 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 06:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobof View Post
eShift shifts one half pixel. I thought that image is a crop of a whole patch in a test image - it is much bigger than a single pixel.
That's not to say it isn't related to eShift element being in light path (could be) but it's not because of half down half right...

Thats why I say " I am "almost" sure...…"


I still think it is coming from e shift but yes may there is a other reason for this blooming.


I had some Sony 4K Pr. in the past like the 5000 the 520 and the 760 and I can not remember that I saw there this bug.
Lets hope that this was something JVC can solve as I really hope the X9 will be good and a reason to replace my Sony 760.


Also possible that the X7 will tell us if e shift is the reason but the optic in the X5 and 7 is a lot different.
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post #1586 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 06:17 AM
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Official JVC RS3000/NX9 - JVC RS2000/NX7/N7 - JVC RS1000/NX5/N5 - Owners Thread

Does anyone know what is the lumen output difference between NX7 Low and High lamp modes?


Also how does one get 3D on these projector ... What additional equipment is needed to make 3D work?




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post #1587 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 06:24 AM
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Originally Posted by DennisLJacob View Post
I'm not sure I agree with your statement re: making sure we have a good sample or a lemon. For the money we're paying it would seem to me that JVC shouldn't be shipping lemons - period!
The problem is, there are not enough units out there to know if we have a lemon, or lemon's.........
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post #1588 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 06:25 AM
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Originally Posted by tommarra View Post
Does anyone know what is the lumen output difference between NX7 Low and High lamp modes?
I've tested multiple JVC projectors and low lamp is always about 72% of high lamp on JVC. The N7 uses the same bulb as the prev generation with same lumen rating so I think its a safe bet it'll be the same. Every new bulb has variance so you'll probably get somewhere around 1300 lumens low and 1800 high. I had a new bulb as good as 1427 lumens low and 1899 lumens high and a new bulb as bad as 1156 lumens low 1608 lumens high.

This is one area where JVC lamp projectors benefit over Sony lamp projectors. Sony runs low lamp around 55% of high lamp making its low lamp in some cases unusable. My 675ES with brand new bulb #2 measured at 879 lumens low, 1548 lumens high. Bulb #1 on that was 1045 lumens low, 1708 lumens high. (Projector rated at 1800 lumens).

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post #1589 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 06:27 AM
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Does anyone enjoy watching movies on the projectors any more?

JVC has had this blooming for years and years.

Take your currently JVC shrink the image down to 50” or so and you see all the light engine problems. But blow it up to real sizes and with real content, you wont see a thing other that the beautiful picture the projectors throw!

Just an FYi

Im still waiting for my JVC NX7 but I for sure wont be worked up over the issues JVC has had for many generations.

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post #1590 of 12892 Old 01-13-2019, 06:30 AM
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Official JVC RS3000/NX9 - JVC RS2000/NX7/N7 - JVC RS1000/NX5/N5 - Owners Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
I've tested multiple JVC projectors and low lamp is always about 72% of high lamp on JVC. The N7 uses the same bulb as the prev generation with same lumen rating so I think its a safe bet it'll be the same. Every new bulb has variance so you'll probably get somewhere around 1300 lumens low and 1800 high. I had a new bulb as good as 1427 lumens low and 1899 lumens high and a new bulb as bad as 1156 lumens low 1608 lumens high.



This is one area where JVC lamp projectors benefit over Sony lamp projectors. Sony runs low lamp around 55% of high lamp making its low lamp in some cases unusable. My 675ES with brand new bulb #2 measured at 879 lumens low, 1548 lumens high. Bulb #1 on that was 1045 lumens low, 1708 lumens high. (Projector rated at 1800 lumens).


Thank you. The problem I am trying to solve is that I would like to watch HDR in low lamp mode to minimize the fan noise. My screen currently is only 106 inch 16:9 with approx 1 gain (Elitescreen Cinegrey 5D so the gain it suspect as it is specified to be 1.5 but we know that is simply inaccurate)

So I was hoping to mount the projector as close to screen as possible and still get >30 FL in low lamp.
Is there a calculator somewhere that would let me calculate how close / far I shouldn't the projector?

The one at projector Central does not let you select lamp mode does it?


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