Official JVC RS3000/NX9 - JVC RS2000/NX7/N7 - JVC RS1000/NX5/N5 - Owners Thread - Page 644 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #19291 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 01:05 AM
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Originally Posted by ShadeRF View Post
Player directly to the Lumagen does work. No sound because I don't have audio out hooked back to the Marantz. Interestingly the lumagen shows the input as 3840x2160p @59.94hz. If the roku is outputting that resolution even with interlaced content I don't understand what the issue is.
If your input to the JVC is anything higher than 4k60 444 8bit, then it will certainly show "Out of Range". Try reducing the color subsampling to 422.

Last edited by neb04; 11-17-2019 at 01:12 AM.
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post #19292 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 02:32 AM
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Originally Posted by neb04 View Post
If your input to the JVC is anything higher than 4k60 444 8bit, then it will certainly show "Out of Range". Try reducing the color subsampling to 422.
I doubt a Roku or older Marantz receiver can output 444:60 at >8 bits as it exceeds HDMI2.0 spec...
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post #19293 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 05:46 AM
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Potential vs actal screen size from rs2000

Heres a weird question. My RS2000, placed just an inch closer to the screen than my rs 400 was - should (according to both online calculators) provide a 97 to 98" screen size in zoom mode. (I am 9' 8" from the screen)


Instead I am getting a 95" image totally zoomed. Which suggests 9' 4" away from the screen. My rs400 was 9' 9" away. The new projector only one inch closer. (No way 5 ")


So - are there ever lens variations in units? Are both screen calculators incorrect? In other words is my rs possibly one that is just lacking in zoom range?


Whew I hope that made sense. Im confused! lol
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post #19294 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 06:04 AM
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Originally Posted by bobof View Post
That might be the case for you, but for many people it wouldn't be. As soon as you've seen one screen that doesn't exhibit them, if you see a screen that exhibit sparkles / shimmer it will be obvious that there is something different about the image if you are sensitive to this sort of issue. I say if - there are folk who are blind to all kinds of image issues. My theory on this is that their brains are wired in such a way that they can't easily look past the content on the screen. My wife is one such person - for almost any issue to do with PQ I can pretty much guarantee that I can't get her to see what I'm talking about.


I feel like my wife is similar.
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post #19295 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 06:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steevo123 View Post
Heres a weird question. My RS2000, placed just an inch closer to the screen than my rs 400 was - should (according to both online calculators) provide a 97 to 98" screen size in zoom mode. (I am 9' 8" from the screen)


Instead I am getting a 95" image totally zoomed. Which suggests 9' 4" away from the screen. My rs400 was 9' 9" away. The new projector only one inch closer. (No way 5 ")


So - are there ever lens variations in units? Are both screen calculators incorrect? In other words is my rs possibly one that is just lacking in zoom range?


Whew I hope that made sense. Im confused! lol
You have a 16:9 screen. You need to set the aspect ratio in the calculator to 16:9. You have it on full panel width of 1.9:1. Once set to correct aspect ratio, It gives a required throw of 9'-10" for a 95" diagonal image. Lucky for you that you are able to get a 95" image. Means your projector exceeds specs.
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post #19296 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 06:54 AM
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Originally Posted by bobof View Post
That might be the case for you, but for many people it wouldn't be. As soon as you've seen one screen that doesn't exhibit them, if you see a screen that exhibit sparkles / shimmer it will be obvious that there is something different about the image if you are sensitive to this sort of issue. I say if - there are folk who are blind to all kinds of image issues. My theory on this is that their brains are wired in such a way that they can't easily look past the content on the screen. My wife is one such person - for almost any issue to do with PQ I can pretty much guarantee that I can't get her to see what I'm talking about.
Interesting, I spend a lot of free time looking at video especially testing new builds of MadVR and maybe it is my setup but I do not see sparkles. Maybe once in 40 hours of viewing I will see something but I will take that with the advantage of brightness for HDR etc and Experiencing the movie vs worrying if it is too dark etc. I have had a lot of screens and see a lot of video from other projectors and my ST130 is the best I have had. But too each their own, that is why they make so many. Everyone should test them out instead of hear-say.
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post #19297 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 07:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
The projector will accept 480P, but will not accept 480i.
I mis-stated the dvd rips at 480p as Emby shows them as such, but they are in fact 480i. However, further discovery lead me to realize this problem is happening for ALL interlaced content including 1080i.

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Originally Posted by neb04 View Post
If your input to the JVC is anything higher than 4k60 444 8bit, then it will certainly show "Out of Range". Try reducing the color subsampling to 422.
Roku directly into the Lumagen shows 422 input already. Lumagen has always been set to 422 output so it should not have been an issue. It seems the problem lies with the Marantz somehow. I wish there was some way to see what input the Lumagen is receiving from it when the issue occurs, but as everything is blacked out I'm not able to pull up the menus to find out.

Theater Equipment list:
JVC RS3000, Panamorph Paladin DCR, 138", Lumagen Pro, Stewart 138" 2:35:1 Screen, Oppo UDP-203, DirecTV Genie, Marantz SR-6011, Emotiva XPA-5 Mains: Paradigm Prestige 85F, Center: Paradigm Prestige 55C, Sides: Paradigm Prestige 15B, Rears: Paradigm Atom V6 Atmos: Paradigm P65-R Sub: Rhythmik FV18, GIK Acoustic Room Treatments
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post #19298 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 07:49 AM
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Originally Posted by ScottieBoysName View Post
I feel like my wife is similar.

Mine too. Every time I buy something new, it's hard to get her to see what the fuss was all about.
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post #19299 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 07:54 AM
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Originally Posted by ShadeRF View Post
I mis-stated the dvd rips at 480p as Emby shows them as such, but they are in fact 480i. However, further discovery lead me to realize this problem is happening for ALL interlaced content including 1080i.



Roku directly into the Lumagen shows 422 input already. Lumagen has always been set to 422 output so it should not have been an issue. It seems the problem lies with the Marantz somehow. I wish there was some way to see what input the Lumagen is receiving from it when the issue occurs, but as everything is blacked out I'm not able to pull up the menus to find out.
Is your lumagen set to upscale all content to 4K? Is your marantz set to just pass through video? What happens if you set your player to deinterlace and upscale? You have several opportunities to avoid sending 480i to the projector:
1) the player
2) The receiver
3) The lumagen <-- preferred location to upscale.

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post #19300 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 07:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
You have a 16:9 screen. You need to set the aspect ratio in the calculator to 16:9. You have it on full panel width of 1.9:1. Once set to correct aspect ratio, It gives a required throw of 9'-10" for a 95" diagonal image. Lucky for you that you are able to get a 95" image. Means your projector exceeds specs.



Thanks for the reply. When i choose the native aspect ratio - i get a 92" 16 x 9 screen. Which is correct in the calculators. (from 9".7")



I guess I thought the 1.9:1 choice was for the "zoom function" in the aspect section. When I choose that option - with my throw - it says i would get a 97", Instead getting 95. Just checking.

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post #19301 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 07:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Jive Turkey View Post
Mine too. Every time I buy something new, it's hard to get her to see what the fuss was all about.
My wife is like this, too. But last time we watched a movie on the RS4500 she actually commented that the picture was the sharpest brightest picture she's ever seen in here.
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post #19302 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 07:59 AM
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Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
My wife is like this, too. But last time we watched a movie on the RS4500 she actually commented that the picture was the sharpest brightest picture she's ever seen in here.

I think mine just does it to dig at me about the cost. She knows me well.
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post #19303 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 08:11 AM
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Is your lumagen set to upscale all content to 4K? Is your marantz set to just pass through video? What happens if you set your player to deinterlace and upscale? You have several opportunities to avoid sending 480i to the projector:
1) the player
2) The receiver
3) The lumagen <-- preferred location to upscale.
This is exactly why I don't understand the problem. The Lumagen IS set to upscale all content to frame rate matched 4096x2160.

To recap:

Roku - > Marantz - > Lumagen - > JVC - with i/p scaling in the Marantz turned off gives me Input out of Range message when playing interlaced content
Roku - > Marantz - > JVC - No input with i/p scaling in the Marantz turned off. Turning ON i/p scaling gives me a picture as expected.
Roku - > Lumagen -> JVC - Works as expected. Lumagen shows input of [email protected] 4:2:2 and output at [email protected] 4:2:2
Roku - > Marantz - > Lumagen - > JVC - with i/p scaling turned ON gives me No Input message

Theater Equipment list:
JVC RS3000, Panamorph Paladin DCR, 138", Lumagen Pro, Stewart 138" 2:35:1 Screen, Oppo UDP-203, DirecTV Genie, Marantz SR-6011, Emotiva XPA-5 Mains: Paradigm Prestige 85F, Center: Paradigm Prestige 55C, Sides: Paradigm Prestige 15B, Rears: Paradigm Atom V6 Atmos: Paradigm P65-R Sub: Rhythmik FV18, GIK Acoustic Room Treatments
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post #19304 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 08:17 AM
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Just don't think you have 3 years of advanced replacement, because you do not. You only get that when they feel like doing it. They have the option to decide to handle your claim as a repair instead. They also don't publish that bit of info on the web as far as I can tell. All they advertise is "Advanced replacement", but the warranty info that comes with the unit will have some weasel words that get them out of honoring what they advertise.
You do have to consider there is a lot of user error that goes on and no one wants to swap something for nothing. If a unit does not power on, a HDMI input is dead, and things like that, I am sure there would be no fight on advanced exchange.
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post #19305 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by bobof View Post
That might be the case for you, but for many people it wouldn't be. As soon as you've seen one screen that doesn't exhibit them, if you see a screen that exhibit sparkles / shimmer it will be obvious that there is something different about the image if you are sensitive to this sort of issue. I say if - there are folk who are blind to all kinds of image issues. My theory on this is that their brains are wired in such a way that they can't easily look past the content on the screen. My wife is one such person - for almost any issue to do with PQ I can pretty much guarantee that I can't get her to see what I'm talking about.
When I first went FP, I went with a Da-Lite HD Pro 1.1. The first movie I watched was Iron Man on BD once everything was set-up I distinctively remember thinking, what is this 'sparkly-like stuff' I'm seeing especially in clear or brighter scenes? Weird it seemed to me. I was using a JVC RS4810. I thought maybe it was just the projector, but then realized it was the screen. I posted it in the HD pro screen thread and I was one of the very few that noticed it in the material.
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post #19306 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post
You do have to consider there is a lot of user error that goes on and no one wants to swap something for nothing. If a unit does not power on, a HDMI input is dead, and things like that, I am sure there would be no fight on advanced exchange.
But that's the whole advantage of replacement warranties. The auto iris on my unit starts losing its position, but only after quite a while of viewing (like an hour) and I doubt all material even causes it.

So you are just supporting my feeling that sending it in will result in nothing but shipping it back and forth and risking damage. They'll test it for 5 minutes, declare nothing is wrong with it, and send it back. They've already proven to me that they can't be trusted in regards to their warranty policies.

It's advanced replacement when convenient for JVC.
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post #19307 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 10:29 AM
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Originally Posted by ShadeRF View Post
…. Roku directly into the Lumagen shows 422 input already. Lumagen has always been set to 422 output so it should not have been an issue. It seems the problem lies with the Marantz somehow. I wish there was some way to see what input the Lumagen is receiving from it when the issue occurs, but as everything is blacked out I'm not able to pull up the menus to find out.
Well, one easy way that comes to mind is a HDFury device like the Vertex or Integral2. If connected between your Marantz and the Lumagen, it will display the input from the Marantz and the output transmitted to the Lumagen.

Last edited by neb04; 11-17-2019 at 10:35 AM.
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post #19308 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by BondDonBond View Post
Interesting, I spend a lot of free time looking at video especially testing new builds of MadVR and maybe it is my setup but I do not see sparkles. Maybe once in 40 hours of viewing I will see something but I will take that with the advantage of brightness for HDR etc and Experiencing the movie vs worrying if it is too dark etc. I have had a lot of screens and see a lot of video from other projectors and my ST130 is the best I have had. But too each their own, that is why they make so many. Everyone should test them out instead of hear-say.
I also have the ST130 and wouldn't trade it for anything else. Love the screen and barely ever see a sparkle come from it.
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post #19309 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by ShadeRF View Post
This is exactly why I don't understand the problem. The Lumagen IS set to upscale all content to frame rate matched 4096x2160.

To recap:

Roku - > Marantz - > Lumagen - > JVC - with i/p scaling in the Marantz turned off gives me Input out of Range message when playing interlaced content
Roku - > Marantz - > JVC - No input with i/p scaling in the Marantz turned off. Turning ON i/p scaling gives me a picture as expected.
Roku - > Lumagen -> JVC - Works as expected. Lumagen shows input of [email protected] 4:2:2 and output at [email protected] 4:2:2
Roku - > Marantz - > Lumagen - > JVC - with i/p scaling turned ON gives me No Input message
You can always connect up a terminal program to the USB serial port and have the Lumagen output input format changes to the console. That probably wants to move to the Lumagen thread though.
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post #19310 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 11:56 AM
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There is one observation of when HDR Level AUTO makes a choice which invites making an adjustment. Avengers Endgame: JVC DTM AUTO chooses Medium, when High would be a better fit.

Disney does not provide metadata with any of their HDR content. As a result, the Auto setting will always default to Medium. From what I've sampled on Disney+ so far, most Disney content is mastered very dim and needs the High setting.
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post #19311 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 12:04 PM
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I have found that sparkles are distance and lumen dependent. So at my 9 foot viewing distance and blasting HDR with an NX7 I can see sparkles all over a gain screen. Once you see them you can't unsee them and those kinds of picture anomalies just drive me nuts! Like a stuck pixel on an lcd screen. You can't look away!

But at an increased viewing distance it is not much of an issue. From my back row I could not see the sparkles present in my old screen. I sit pretty close so I bet my experience is not the norm. Plus I'm just sensitive about that sort of thing. Before my theater I had a Pioneer Kuro so it makes one kind of picky. Actually I STILL have the Kuro and its STILL awesome haha!
I sit at 9' 8" from a 128" diagonal 2.35:1 ST130. No problem with " sparkles " ( it's more like sheen anyway ) with my RS4500. It's super subtle. Screens with a gain of 1 or less just look dull to me.
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post #19312 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by steevo123 View Post
Thanks for the reply. When i choose the native aspect ratio - i get a 92" 16 x 9 screen. Which is correct in the calculators. (from 9".7")



I guess I thought the 1.9:1 choice was for the "zoom function" in the aspect section. When I choose that option - with my throw - it says i would get a 97", Instead getting 95. Just checking.
You cut off quite a bit of the image, if using a 16:9 screen. If you are using a scope screen you can use the zoom function to get a shorter throw. You still lose some of the image height, but only a small amount.
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post #19313 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 12:21 PM
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I sit at 9' 8" from a 128" diagonal 2.35:1 ST130. No problem with " sparkles " ( it's more like sheen anyway ) with my RS4500. It's super subtle. Screens with a gain of 1 or less just look dull to me.
Yes I know the sheen you are describing and it was present on my old screen. Like a thin gain coating. I think if I had to have a very large screen with 1.3 gain I could put up with it but I would rather have an effect like looking out of a window and no anomalies present if it is possible. At only 110'' wide 2.35 I have plenty of light for HDR. Like someone else said they make lots of screens for different preferences/situations. Interesting that we all have our specific hang ups. I guess we all have what we want in the end. I will look at the ST130 in the future if/when I go bigger.

I have considered moving my front row back just 1 foot since the screen structure/sheen/sparkles almost totally disappear for me there. Only issue is that I have the audio dialed in for the current location. Inevitably things will change with my set up so I will be flexible with gain screens in the future but at the moment I have what I want.
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post #19314 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 12:35 PM
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You cut off quite a bit of the image, if using a 16:9 screen. If you are using a scope screen you can use the zoom function to get a shorter throw. You still lose some of the image height, but only a small amount.



I am using the zoom function. ( But on a 16x9 screen) Increases the size somewhat but still 2 or 3 inches smaller diagonally than what the calculator suggests.

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post #19315 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 12:35 PM
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So - are there ever lens variations in units?
JVC have put out there a couple of times that there can be +/-5% tolerance on the throw numbers in the manuals, and I don't think the calculators take this into account. I don't know why they don't list this detail in the manuals; but it did appear on the scanned in show floor initial N5/N7/NX9 brochure that was posted somewhere, and also the JVC UK originated throw calculator spreadsheet mentioned it. I think those are the only two places I can recall seeing it given an actual number.

The new N5 and N7 units achieve notionally the same screen diagonal width at the same throw as the previous gen, but crucially it is only with a 1.9:1 aspect ratio. This means you can be out of luck if you only just managed your current 16:9 screen size out of a previous gen unit, as the new gen need quite a bit more throw to get the same size 16:9 image on the 16:9 crop of the panels.

The NX9 doesn't have this constraint - even on the cropped panel size I think it achieves slightly bigger 16:9 than the previous gen at the same throw due to the different lens arrangement.

Edit: actually, you can see the +/- 5% note on this attached brochure page for the X700 too.
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Last edited by bobof; 11-17-2019 at 12:56 PM.
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post #19316 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobof View Post
JVC have put out there a couple of times that there can be +/-5% tolerance on the throw numbers in the manuals, and I don't think the calculators take this into account. I don't know why they don't list this detail in the manuals; but it did appear on the scanned in show floor initial N5/N7/NX9 brochure that was posted somewhere, and also the JVC UK originated throw calculator spreadsheet mentioned it. I think those are the only two places I can recall seeing it given an actual number.

The new N5 and N7 units achieve notionally the same screen width at the same throw as the previous gen, but crucially it is only with a 1.9:1 aspect ratio. This means you can be out of luck if you only just managed your current 16:9 screen size out of a previous gen unit, as the new gen need quite a bit more throw to get the same size 16:9 image on the 16:9 crop of the panels.

The NX9 doesn't have this constraint - even on the cropped panel size I think it achieves slightly bigger 16:9 than the previous gen at the same throw due to the different lens arrangement.
RS540 needs 14' of throw for a 120" wide screen. The RS1000/2000 using 1.9:1 only needs 13'-6", so not the same.
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post #19317 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
RS540 needs 14' of throw for a 120" wide screen. The RS1000/2000 using 1.9:1 only needs 13'-6", so not the same.
Sorry, you're right. The correct equivalency is that you get 120" diagonal 17:9 screen at the exact same throw as a 16:9 diagonal 120" screen (and of course they have different widths due to the aspect differences).

I've edited to correct the error. The base point stands though to tread very carefully with an upgrade if you have 16:9 screen and only just made it on a previous gen at your current throw.
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Last edited by bobof; 11-17-2019 at 12:57 PM.
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post #19318 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 01:20 PM
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Does anyone else have their remote just freeze up?
I will be flipping through the menu and all of the sudden, the remote is completely unresponsive. My harmony is the same, the projector just won't do anything. The movie keeps playing but the menu gets stuck on the screen for a while. Sometimes it needs to be shut off and on, sometimes will start working again after 10 mins or so....
Really REALLY, annoying lol
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post #19319 of 20448 Old 11-17-2019, 04:24 PM
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Anyone has been able to setup an NX7 with a new nVidia Shield TV Pro (2019)? I'm having one heck of a time trying to get it to play nice.

Anyone can recommend any basic settings so that the main screen is displayed in SDR and auto switches to the correct color space depending on the content displayed?

TIA


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post #19320 of 20448 Old 11-18-2019, 03:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ERuiz View Post
Anyone has been able to setup an NX7 with a new nVidia Shield TV Pro (2019)? I'm having one heck of a time trying to get it to play nice.

Anyone can recommend any basic settings so that the main screen is displayed in SDR and auto switches to the correct color space depending on the content displayed?

TIA


Sent from my iPhone X
I do not think the Shield can auto switch color spaces. I had mine set at 4K 2020 and left it this way as I was only using it to stream 4K material. When viewing SDR material it would tone map it some what correctly but I would always get a red push on the picture. I own the 2017 model.
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