Official JVC RS3000/NX9 - JVC RS2000/NX7/N7 - JVC RS1000/NX5/N5 - Owners Thread - Page 784 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #23491 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 08:19 AM
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Last was 3.10 from Oct. 9 last year.
Curious are the machines purchased lately shipping with the current firm ware?

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post #23492 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by BobearQSI View Post
There's some images here of the NX7 upscaling artifacts. Better than some other projectors, but not as good as it could be: https://www.tvspecialists.com/jvc-dl...o-z65-part-ii/
Thanks for this article! I thought for sure people would say the more expensive NX7 scales better than the less expensive Panasonic 9000, but this is why I asked.
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post #23493 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 08:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Archibald1 View Post
As has been said, the Panny's don't have a source direct mode (much as I have pestered them for one). Trademarked? Pioneers have a Source Direct mode as well and I think my old Denon Bluray player had that facility. Also Sony Players have this feature too I believe......
Thanks for the information!
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post #23494 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 08:25 AM
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Originally Posted by alebonau View Post
Goodness knows what doing with n7 there, in all months owned n7 I have not seen anything like scaling artefacts there. In fact not seen scaling artefacts period. No matter source DVD, Blu-ray, tv uhd or streaming
Great to know, thank you!
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post #23495 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 08:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeffg8 View Post
Curious are the machines purchased lately shipping with the current firm ware?
As long as a dealer is not sitting on old inventory........
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post #23496 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by docrog View Post
Sony UHD players (such as the X700) have the option to turn off upscaling to from 1080p to UHD, but they will upscale any lower rez to 1080p. Therefore, not truly "source direct". Oppo has true source direct.
Great to know. I have the Sony X800 in addition to the Panny 9000. Thanks!
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post #23497 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 08:41 AM
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Originally Posted by louc6569 View Post
I want to calibrate my nx7 using autocal from jvc software what meters do I need to perform this I want both colors and gamma correction.
Thanks
Here is the problem with that plan. If you do not know the error of the meter, you could be hurting the color calibration, more than helping. Without being able to profile your Spyder meter against a calibrated meter, I would only use it for gamma correction.
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post #23498 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
Here is the problem with that plan. If you do not know the error of the meter, you could be hurting the color calibration, more than helping. Without being able to profile your Spyder meter against a calibrated meter, I would only use it for gamma correction.
Unfortunately with JVC Autocal there's no way to handle a spyder correction matrix, reason why I bought an I1 Pro2.
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post #23499 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by jj-34 View Post
Unfortunately with JVC Autocal there's no way to handle a spyder correction matrix, reason why I bought an I1 Pro2.
I believe ChadB posted a method a while back which approximately corrected by creating custom colourspaces with slightly modified x,y values to deal with the meter offset.
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post #23500 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 08:59 AM
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...I was expecting to notice the contrast difference with the 7. I don’t.

I wasn’t expecting the 7 to be brighter, it isn’t.

With the color filter in place I feel the NX7 image is improved over the 5 when watching a disc...
This quote from TVSpecialists.com seems to confirm most of what you observed: "JVC understands the value of deep, rich, wide color and is really the main difference between the NX5 and the NX7. There is also a difference in 100 lumens of light output (almost undetectable) and contrast ratio but that is minor compared to the color differences." https://www.tvspecialists.com/jvc-dl...o-z65-part-ii/ Thanks to BobearQSI for discovering this article.
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post #23501 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by jj-34 View Post
Unfortunately with JVC Autocal there's no way to handle a spyder correction matrix, reason why I bought an I1 Pro2.


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Originally Posted by bobof View Post
I believe ChadB posted a method a while back which approximately corrected by creating custom colourspaces with slightly modified x,y values to deal with the meter offset.
True enough, but one still needs an i1Pro2 to generate the modified x,y values.

Hows that for a sales pitch?
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post #23502 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 09:19 AM
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I've decided to post my early personal experience with the Lumagen Radiance Pro & NX7 as relates to my 110", 16x9 , 1.3 gain Stewart screen; the NX7 is positioned approximately 14' from the NX7. My curiosity regarding the Radiance Pro was stimulated by several well regarded forum members who claimed that utilizing the Lumagen with the current line of JVC projectors was in a "different league".

After having experienced the Radiance Pro for 2 weeks I'd have to say that, if the $5-6K cost was an issue, I'd probably would have been perfectly satisfied to continue without it. Is it a staggering improvement in comparison to what I'd been experiencing with my NX7 since the JVC adaptive DTM firmware update? Not really. Additionally, what makes doing A/B comparisons with the JVC adaptive DTM difficult is that I have to rely on Chad B.'s calibration in March, 2019 which was performed when the bulb had 600 fewer hours on it. I suppose that I could manipulate parameters from that older starting point or pay for another calibration (without the Lumagen) if I wanted to minimize differences, but that's not going to happen.

However, there are definite improvements in several ways. One is that Craig Round's meticulous calibration of my system with with LightSpace has led to the purest color representation I've ever seen for UHD content; Rec709 (with filter) content now appears more pure, but the difference isn't quite as noticeable as BT.2020 with filter. This isn't really markedly evident on all content, but can be observed enough to be aware that there is a definite uptick.

There is surprisingly very little improvement in "native" upscaling of legacy (native 1080p HD Blu-Ray) content between the Lumagen & NX7. Legacy 480i -> 480p SD DVDs do appear better via the Lumagen, irrespective of whether or not Darbee processing is applied. I prefer to apply moderate (35 "Hi Def", not ""Pop) Darbee processing (in the Lumagen) to legacy 2D & 3D content and this DOES make for a difference in what's seen on the NX7 without the Lumagen. If you own a Darblet or an Oppo player with Darbee capability, the Lumagen's Darbee processing might not make a substantial improvement.

As for improving cable, my provider's broadcast is primarily 720p & 1080i. I don't see a significant difference in sending native output to the Lumagen to upscale to 4K versus sending the same content upscaled from my TiVO Bolt to the NX7 for upscaling. The only improvement is probably again related to Darbee application in the Lumagen.

The one quite significant feature that sets the Lumagen apart is that there's no need to choose which JVC level of adaptive DTM to use (low, medium, high); the Lumagen has been "spot on" for all HDR content with Lumagen's current firmware version as Lumagen's frame adaptive DTM presumably has a more vigorous rendering capacity. Is that convenience and the sense of purer color representation and a bit more "pop" (possibly only possible with the LightSpace/Lumagen combo) worth the $$$? I'd have to say, probably not if the purchase price & future calibration costs are factored in. Chris Deering's article about the JVC adaptive DTM in this month's Sound & Vision was accurate regarding how much of an improvement is due to that JVC firmware update. Bottom line is, without question, that I would purchase the Lumagen for any PJ without on-board adaptive DTM, but probably not JVCs with current firmware if the costs (present and future) would be considered to be onerous.

In any case, I was loving my NX7 before the Radiance Pro and I'm now loving it even a bit more!
I think you are experiencing that " law of diminishing returns " in home theater. I don't think there are any " staggering improvements " to be had in home theater gear these days outside of stupendously expensive things like the Christie Eclipse ( $350K ). More like many subtle improvements and refinements. The Lumagen has made many improvements on my RS4500, but I have a scope screen and a DCR lens. And my RS4500 doesn't have DTM. The auto aspect ratio function is great, but only if you have a scope screen. The Lumagen makes having an A lens and scope screen much more convenient. It won't do much for a 16:9 screen user though. The Lumagen's DTM will work better in the difficult scenes and be set and forget, but that may be worth it to some, and not to others. And I do find that at least my U Verse cable looks better, but that's trying to make a silk purse out of a sows ear, as they say. " if the costs (present and future) would be considered to be onerous " - I agree, nobody should be spending beyond their means for this stuff. It's a fun hobby, but just a hobby. The new Envy probably makes for a great picture too, but it's $10K. That's a lot of money. These things are only for folks with the money to squeeze the last 3% improvement out, cost no object. You just need to draw the line somewhere in this hobby. I'm probably never getting a Trinnov or a Kaleidescape either. Too much money.
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post #23503 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by surroundsound99 View Post
This quote from TVSpecialists.com seems to confirm most of what you observed: "JVC understands the value of deep, rich, wide color and is really the main difference between the NX5 and the NX7. There is also a difference in 100 lumens of light output (almost undetectable) and contrast ratio but that is minor compared to the color differences." https://www.tvspecialists.com/jvc-dl...o-z65-part-ii/ Thanks to BobearQSI for discovering this article.
Based on some of the "numbers" and observations they've reported, TVS Pro isn't exactly the best source. I personally don't trust them based on this. With the DI enabled the NX7 is measurably better with regards to contrast vs the NX5.
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post #23504 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 09:38 AM
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I think you are experiencing that " law of diminishing returns " in home theater. I don't think there are any " staggering improvements " to be had in home theater gear these days outside of stupendously expensive things like the Christie Eclipse ( $350K ). More like many subtle improvements and refinements. The Lumagen has made many improvements on my RS4500, but I have a scope screen and a DCR lens. And my RS4500 doesn't have DTM. The auto aspect ratio function is great, but only if you have a scope screen. The Lumagen makes having an A lens and scope screen much more convenient. It won't do much for a 16:9 screen user though. The Lumagen's DTM will work better in the difficult scenes and be set and forget, but that may be worth it to some, and not to others. And I do find that at least my U Verse cable looks better, but that's trying to make a silk purse out of a sows ear, as they say. " if the costs (present and future) would be considered to be onerous " - I agree, nobody should be spending beyond their means for this stuff. It's a fun hobby, but just a hobby. The new Envy probably makes for a great picture too, but it's $10K. That's a lot of money. These things are only for folks with the money to squeeze the last 3% improvement out, cost no object. You just need to draw the line somewhere in this hobby. I'm probably never getting a Trinnov or a Kaleidescape either. Too much money.
I was only passing along this review by Nigel because he's been a frequent & trusted participant of the AFS Forum community, posting on several threads in which you follow & participate. I was "influenced" to recently invest in the Radiance Pro after being told that it would be "in a different league" compared with a well calibrated NX7 updated to JVC adaptive DTM in my NX7 HT. You may have seen my post from last night in the JVC NX5/7/9 owners thread in which I provided my subjective review after 2 weeks of hands on experience. Nigel has basically stated that the new madVR Envy (Base & Pro models?) are "in a different league from the Radiance Pro", its most established competitor. To that end, I felt that followers of this thread should be aware of his real world assessment of a product which has just left beta testing. The entry level Envy is expected to sell quite close in price to the 18 gig 4242 (although with different form factors). That's a reasonable challenge for Lumagen to confront.

Perhaps because of your involvement in the business of AV, you've been able to own top end equipment (RS4500), multiple screens & external renderer that are beyond the price point comfort level of many who participate here. It's interesting that you've (at least for the present) drawn your line short of the Trinnov, considering how often you host film parties in your HT...........

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post #23505 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by surroundsound99 View Post
This quote from TVSpecialists.com seems to confirm most of what you observed: "JVC understands the value of deep, rich, wide color and is really the main difference between the NX5 and the NX7. There is also a difference in 100 lumens of light output (almost undetectable) and contrast ratio but that is minor compared to the color differences." https://www.tvspecialists.com/jvc-dl...o-z65-part-ii/ Thanks to BobearQSI for discovering this article.
TVS's room also has a lot of white walls in it, so that is hurting the image of all the projectors, but hurts the higher contrast projector the most.
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post #23506 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 10:30 AM
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I was only passing along this review by Nigel because he's been a frequent & trusted participant of the AFS Forum community, posting on several threads in which you follow & participate. I was "influenced" to recently invest in the Radiance Pro after being told that it would be "in a different league" compared with a well calibrated NX7 updated to JVC adaptive DTM in my NX7 HT. You may have seen my post from last night in the JVC NX5/7/9 owners thread in which I provided my subjective review after 2 weeks of hands on experience. Nigel has basically stated that the new madVR Envy (Base & Pro models?) are "in a different league from the Radiance Pro", its most established competitor. To that end, I felt that followers of this thread should be aware of his real world assessment of a product which has just left beta testing. The entry level Envy is expected to sell quite close in price to the 18 gig 4242 (although with different form factors). That's a reasonable challenge for Lumagen to confront.

Perhaps because of your involvement in the business of AV, you've been able to own top end equipment (RS4500), multiple screens & external renderer that are beyond the price point comfort level of many who participate here. It's interesting that you've (at least for the present) drawn your line short of the Trinnov, considering how often you host film parties in your HT...........
I can't justify the expense, considering my Denon X8500H / Parasound A52+ combo sounds good now. Diminishing returns. Also, no disposable income at the moment. I'd say most folks are 95% there with an RS2000 or ( better yet ) RS3000 and a DCR lens if they have a scope screen. That's the cake. A Lumagen or Envy is great, but it's icing ( expensive icing ).

Now, if you want real diminishing returns, someone here keeps trying to get me to buy a Shunyata Denali AC Power Conditioning System. And then there are those Audio Quest cables.
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post #23507 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 10:48 AM
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TVS's room also has a lot of white walls in it, so that is hurting the image of all the projectors, but hurts the higher contrast projector the most.


I don’t believe TVS reviews a lot. When I was researching projectors last year if I had gone by their reviews an Optoma DLP performed almost as good as Epson 5040 which performs as good as RS440. Thankfully I had the opportunity to see both the 5040 and 440 at a local Best Buy and convinced me that JVc contrast and PQ (and price) is in a different league altogether.




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post #23508 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 12:12 PM
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Now, if you want real diminishing returns, someone here keeps trying to get me to buy a Shunyata Denali AC Power Conditioning System. And then there are those Audio Quest cables.
Geez, I wonder who THAT could be?????????
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post #23509 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 12:25 PM
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I've decided to post my early personal experience with the Lumagen Radiance Pro
Great honest post.....

I have been using madVR for some time and just recentley had the opportunity to do a comparison of the Lumagen ( actually considered purchasing the unit) to my HTPC using madVR combined with my Z1/RS4500.

Long story , short........ for outright "Image Quality"...madVR was noticably better than the Lumagen . Upscaling via madVR is just phenomenal, streets ahead of the Lumagen.... and the HSTM for HDR clearly better than the the Lumagen.

BUT!, as i am only a simple "pleb" on these forums, and not a "Trusted" reviewer.....take my comments with a grain of salt..
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Great honest post.....

I have been using madVR for some time and just recentley had the opportunity to do a comparison of the Lumagen ( actually considered purchasing the unit) to my HTPC using madVR combined with my Z1/RS4500.

Long story , short........ for outright "Image Quality"...madVR was noticably better than the Lumagen . Upscaling via madVR is just phenomenal, streets ahead of the Lumagen.... and the HSTM for HDR clearly better than the the Lumagen.

BUT!, as i am only a simple "pleb" on these forums, and not a "Trusted" reviewer.....take my comments with a grain of salt..
I'm right there with ya! I had to see it with my own eyes to be a true believer.
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post #23511 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 12:34 PM
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Great honest post.....

I have been using madVR for some time and just recentley had the opportunity to do a comparison of the Lumagen ( actually considered purchasing the unit) to my HTPC using madVR combined with my Z1/RS4500.

Long story , short........ for outright "Image Quality"...madVR was noticably better than the Lumagen . Upscaling via madVR is just phenomenal, streets ahead of the Lumagen.... and the HSTM for HDR clearly better than the the Lumagen.

BUT!, as i am only a simple "pleb" on these forums, and not a "Trusted" reviewer.....take my comments with a grain of salt..
Great to see you back here considering all of the recent drama in your neck of the woods, Woofer. I hope that your home wasn't engulfed in the fires and that all of your family is safe! In your opinion, does the Radiance Pro have sufficient on-board computing power to ever come closer to what you (and others) have represented as madVR's strengths?

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post #23512 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post
I think you are experiencing that " law of diminishing returns " in home theater. I don't think there are any " staggering improvements " to be had in home theater gear these days outside of stupendously expensive things like the Christie Eclipse ( $350K ). More like many subtle improvements and refinements. The Lumagen has made many improvements on my RS4500, but I have a scope screen and a DCR lens. And my RS4500 doesn't have DTM. The auto aspect ratio function is great, but only if you have a scope screen. The Lumagen makes having an A lens and scope screen much more convenient. It won't do much for a 16:9 screen user though. The Lumagen's DTM will work better in the difficult scenes and be set and forget, but that may be worth it to some, and not to others. And I do find that at least my U Verse cable looks better, but that's trying to make a silk purse out of a sows ear, as they say. " if the costs (present and future) would be considered to be onerous " - I agree, nobody should be spending beyond their means for this stuff. It's a fun hobby, but just a hobby. The new Envy probably makes for a great picture too, but it's $10K. That's a lot of money. These things are only for folks with the money to squeeze the last 3% improvement out, cost no object. You just need to draw the line somewhere in this hobby. I'm probably never getting a Trinnov or a Kaleidescape either. Too much money.
Wholeheartedly agree! Not to mention as one gets older, priorities change.

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post #23513 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 12:52 PM
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Wholeheartedly agree! Not to mention as one gets older, priorities change.
As does eyesight
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post #23514 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 12:59 PM
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Great honest post.....

I have been using madVR for some time and just recentley had the opportunity to do a comparison of the Lumagen ( actually considered purchasing the unit) to my HTPC using madVR combined with my Z1/RS4500.

Long story , short........ for outright "Image Quality"...madVR was noticably better than the Lumagen . Upscaling via madVR is just phenomenal, streets ahead of the Lumagen.... and the HSTM for HDR clearly better than the the Lumagen.

BUT!, as i am only a simple "pleb" on these forums, and not a "Trusted" reviewer.....take my comments with a grain of salt..
HA! But you have to build a HTPC - so for some of us, that disqualifies MadVR right off the bat. And @tnaik4 has both - and has said they are closer than he would have thought. Maybe he will chime in again.

" Streets ahead " - not sure what that means. I'd need to see both in the same room. You and I love our RS4500's, but Kris and Mike say the RS3000 is " streets ahead " in many respects. Everybody has a strong opinion these days. I'm looking forward to a controlled comparison / test of the Envy / Lumagen.
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post #23515 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 01:09 PM
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Don, don't forget to factor in Mike Garrett's response regarding the significant benefits for "A" lens & AR controls that the Radiance Pro provides. IMHO, just don't expect the visual leap between the NX7 by adding the Radiance Pro that you experienced when you viewed my (at the time) uncalibrated NX7 in comparison with your RS400.


Can someone elaborate what “auto aspect ratio” function of the Lumagen means? I thought the JVC’s all do this by themselves, with the installation modes/ lens memory etc.


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post #23516 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 01:13 PM
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Official JVC RS3000/NX9 - JVC RS2000/NX7/N7 - JVC RS1000/NX5/N5 - Owners Thread

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I'll need to look into just what this adds, beyond what the NX7's anamorphic modes can do.







Agreed - I read that yesterday as well. In fact, I was going to refer to this in my reply to docrog. I found Nigel's comments to be very encouraging, where he said in terms of the benefit of the Envy vs the Lumagen, that it wasn't even close. I'll be following this with great interest!


Can someone point me to Nigels Envy review ? I believe these units are considerably more expensive than even the Lumagen

Edit : never mind, found it in the envy anticipation thread. Without doing an A/B with a Lumagen on the same source material etc, it’s not really fair to say Lumagen isn’t even close.
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post #23517 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 01:15 PM
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Can someone elaborate what “auto aspect ratio” function of the Lumagen means? I thought the JVC’s all do this by themselves, with the installation modes/ lens memory etc.


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With an anamorphic lens in front of the projector you need to scale each aspect ratio differently for the lenses corrective ratio to work properly. The projector can handle scaling to either 2.35:1 or 1.78:1 but other ratios like 2.00:1 or 2.20:1 that aren't as common get cropped. The Lumagen is able to custom scale these to work with the lens.

Installation modes can work with all of these ARs, but don't get the light output bonus that a lens gives.

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post #23518 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 01:15 PM
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" Streets ahead " - not sure what that means.
If you have to ask, you're streets behind.


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post #23519 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 01:15 PM
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Wholeheartedly agree! Not to mention as one gets older, priorities change.
That's why I'm not bothering to go see the Christie Eclipse - even though it's a short plane trip. $350K is crazy for a display. Besides, with my luck it would break one week out of warranty. I'm also good dying without drinking Chateau Petrus or Cheval Blanc. I stick to $100 / bottle max - which most people think is crazy itself.

Ya, priority now is to maximize the use of my current gear and enjoy it, so my wife can retire sooner than later !
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post #23520 of 28493 Old 02-12-2020, 01:19 PM
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If you have to ask, you're streets behind.
I learn something new every day here.
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