Official JVC RS3000/NX9 - JVC RS2000/NX7/N7 - JVC RS1000/NX5/N5 - Owners Thread - Page 829 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #24841 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 04:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woofer View Post
Agree.... 8K E-Shift does add a "little" , more "Enhancment" to the image..BUT it does add noticable noise artifacts to the image...

The NX9 looks much much better with 8K E-Shift OFF when inputing native 4K material...

IMO they should of left out the 8K Gimmick from the NX9 and left the light path as per the Z1/RS4500..
The RS3000/NX9 is not big enough to use the light path of the RS4500. Projector would need to be pretty long, like the 4500.
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post #24842 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by blee0120 View Post
What would be a significant upgrade to the 4500? Seems like the pinnacle of performance anywhere near its price point.


DTM? No?


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post #24843 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 05:00 PM
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Next iteration of the 4500 should fit a RB laser, green is still far off... Plus the upgraded D-ILA chipset and DTM it would be a proper upgrade. A new blue phosphor laser would make little sense in my opinion, although DTM and a bit improved contrast would be nice it’s not a proper ‘next gen’ in my opinion at least...


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post #24844 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 05:03 PM
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Originally Posted by rwestley View Post
Wondering if anyone did a Blind Test to compare 8k-eshift to 4K with a group of people. I just read there was a test true 8k vs 4K and many people in a blind test got it wrong. I am posting the link. If this is not allowed please let me know and I will remove immediately.

https://www.avforums.com/news/8k-det...ys-study.17321
Their is no question some people will not be able to see 8K. Their are some people today who can not see or do not care about 1080P VS 4K either... AKA 540U owners That machine is no joke, one of the best projector's ever made for the price and 1080P.
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post #24845 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 05:06 PM
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Official JVC RS3000/NX9 - JVC RS2000/NX7/N7 - JVC RS1000/NX5/N5 - Owners Thread

Okay with Coronavirus ... I don’t think I will be getting my NX7 calibrated anytime soon.

But can someone help me with expected nits off my for two scenarios in Low Lamp without the filter on.:

1. 126 inch 16:9 ST130 inch

2. 120 inch Scope ST130 (with zoom turned on)

I want to configure two profiles in MadVR depending on the source type.

Any help will be greatly appreciated

P.S. I have a cheap light meters from Amazon but don’t know how to use it to measure off the PJ. Any pointers will be great as well


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Last edited by tommarra; 03-14-2020 at 05:18 PM.
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post #24846 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 05:14 PM
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Low Latency Mode questions on NX7

Had three questions on low latency mode on the NX7 that I can't seem to find information on.
1. Does having low latency mode on affect the picture quality in any way? Or to put it another way, in a mixed movie/tv and gaming theater, is there any reason to ever turn low latency mode off (if one wanted the best picture for movie)?
2. Is anyone aware of any discrete low latency mode on/off IR codes? I have found the IR sheet which lists a single toggle mode. But, *if* indeed having low latency mode on affects picture quality, I'd love to find a way to turn this on or off depending on the input device being selected.
3. My research seems to show low latency mode (or really input lag) being measured at 38-40 ms. Does this sound correct to folks?

Thank you!
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post #24847 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 05:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lygren View Post
Next iteration of the 4500 should fit a RB laser, green is still far off... Plus the upgraded D-ILA chipset and DTM it would be a proper upgrade. A new blue phosphor laser would make little sense in my opinion, although DTM and a bit improved contrast would be nice it’s not a proper ‘next gen’ in my opinion at least...


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Heck blue phosphor with 4,000 lumens, improved, higher contrast panels from the 3000, improved DTM, DCI P3 filter with only slight lumen loss and DCR anamorphic functions added would be a nice improvement.
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post #24848 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 07:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tommarra View Post
I have a cheap light meters from Amazon but don’t know how to use it to measure off the PJ. Any pointers will be great as well
Display a full-screen white pattern and zoom the projector to fill the screen. Measure the lux with the meter placed as close to the centre of the screen as you can, facing the projector lens.

Then use the following calculator created by a forum member:
https://webprojectorcalculator.com/

Click on the Convert tab, enter the dimensions etc, and calculate the nits.
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post #24849 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 08:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post
Higher native panel contrast (it is a third of the NX series), wide color filter that doesn't rob 40% of the light output (the NX series is nearly a third of this), faster HDMI synching, a dynamic dimming mode that wasn't as aggressive near black as Mode 2 but was more aggressive than Mode 1, a dual aperture system for increases in native contrast.



Just off the top of my head


You would think JVC would add another intermediate dynamic dimming mode with a firmware update.
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post #24850 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 08:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avrignaud View Post
Had three questions on low latency mode on the NX7 that I can't seem to find information on.
1. Does having low latency mode on affect the picture quality in any way? Or to put it another way, in a mixed movie/tv and gaming theater, is there any reason to ever turn low latency mode off (if one wanted the best picture for movie)?
2. Is anyone aware of any discrete low latency mode on/off IR codes? I have found the IR sheet which lists a single toggle mode. But, *if* indeed having low latency mode on affects picture quality, I'd love to find a way to turn this on or off depending on the input device being selected.
3. My research seems to show low latency mode (or really input lag) being measured at 38-40 ms. Does this sound correct to folks?

Thank you!


I think Arrows review of the NX series showed low latency mode did nothing if I remember correctly ? Same measured latency on or off. Which is strange.
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post #24851 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 08:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
Display a full-screen white pattern and zoom the projector to fill the screen. Measure the lux with the meter placed as close to the centre of the screen as you can, facing the projector lens.



Then use the following calculator created by a forum member:

https://webprojectorcalculator.com/



Click on the Convert tab, enter the dimensions etc, and calculate the nits.


Is there a “cheap amazon” meter that can read lux off the screen somewhat accurately ?
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post #24852 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 09:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blake View Post
I think Arrows review of the NX series showed low latency mode did nothing if I remember correctly ? Same measured latency on or off. Which is strange.

I know, right!? I may be remembering that review. To be honest, that just doesn't sound right. I'd assume JVC would simply enable by default if there was no compromise to be had.


Is there anyone on this forum who could ask JVC direct for what the (presumable) trade-off is when running in low latency mode on this line of projectors?
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post #24853 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by blake View Post
Is there a “cheap amazon” meter that can read lux off the screen somewhat accurately ?
Mine is an LX1010BS. The readings are pretty close to my i1Display Pro colorimeter.

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post #24854 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 09:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
Mine is an LX1010BS. The readings are pretty close to my i1Display Pro colorimeter.
So to derive total "lumens" coming off your screen from your projector: point the LX1010BS meter at the middle of the screen while it shows a peak white image, then multiply the "lux" value on the meter by the total screen area (in m2)? Is this correct?
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post #24855 of 28551 Old 03-14-2020, 11:43 PM
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Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by blee0120 View Post
What would be a significant upgrade to the 4500? Seems like the pinnacle of performance anywhere near its price point.
Honestly, I'm not sure what it would take for me to upgrade my RS4500. Perhaps something with about 4x the contrast might do it. I bet I nearly doubled the contrast by moving to a 1.3 gain screen and cranking down the iris, though.
If you move to a 1.3 gain screen and crank down the iris by say... another 30%, you are in the same situation as before, for both Max luminance and black floor. So no real gain in contrast. Am I right?
The only point to go for a high gain screen is to accommodate HDR needs sacrificing some black floor but gaining visual perception, specially if having a mask system.
Can any of the experts confirm my thoughts?

Thanks and be safe.
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post #24856 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 01:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
I think adding DTM and DCR anamorphic functions would be of more value.
Nah. Anyone can get better DTM by a device that's far cheaper than an RS4500-2 upgrade would cost. That feature isn't going to drive an upgrade.

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post #24857 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 01:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alamagar View Post
If you move to a 1.3 gain screen and crank down the iris by say... another 30%, you are in the same situation as before, for both Max luminance and black floor. So no real gain in contrast. Am I right?
The only point to go for a high gain screen is to accommodate HDR needs sacrificing some black floor but gaining visual perception, specially if having a mask system.
Can any of the experts confirm my thoughts?

Thanks and be safe.
On the RS4500, lowering the iris increases the contrast (I think due to eliminating some internal reflections). Same with the NX line. So if you increase the gain of the screen and crank down the iris, you get the same light output as before (at the center of the screen) with much greater contrast.

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post #24858 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 02:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blake View Post
So to derive total "lumens" coming off your screen from your projector: point the LX1010BS meter at the middle of the screen while it shows a peak white image, then multiply the "lux" value on the meter by the total screen area (in m2)? Is this correct?
The calculator includes the lumens calculation.

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post #24859 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 03:11 AM
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Hi

Some one who can help me explain a littel about this below here aspect:zoom. Found the writing below on the Paladin DCR forum.

Turn it on last night and on 2.39 movies even better than before and also on 16:9 (17:9) it looked better. Or is it just me who is seeing something that are not real?


Here's the basis for the calculations:

1. Movie Theater Resolution for 2.4:1 movies:

4096 x 1707 = 6,999,507 pixels

2. JVC Projector without DCR for 2.4:1 movies:

3840 x 1600 = 6,144,000 pixels

3. JVC Projector with DCR for 2.4:1 movies:

4096 x 2133 = 8,736,768 pixels


Then the answer from forum user @blake wrote this
Regarding #2 - if you turn on “aspect:zoom” on the new JVCs which have a 17:9 native image panels, that actually gives you a full 4096 horizontal pixels for scope content.
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post #24860 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 04:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
On the RS4500, lowering the iris increases the contrast (I think due to eliminating some internal reflections). Same with the NX line. So if you increase the gain of the screen and crank down the iris, you get the same light output as before (at the center of the screen) with much greater contrast.
Are you increasing the black floor as a result of a higher gain screen?

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post #24861 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 04:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Klaus.S View Post
Hi

Some one who can help me explain a littel about this below here aspect:zoom. Found the writing below on the Paladin DCR forum.

Turn it on last night and on 2.39 movies even better than before and also on 16:9 (17:9) it looked better. Or is it just me who is seeing something that are not real?


Here's the basis for the calculations:

1. Movie Theater Resolution for 2.4:1 movies:

4096 x 1707 = 6,999,507 pixels

2. JVC Projector without DCR for 2.4:1 movies:

3840 x 1600 = 6,144,000 pixels

3. JVC Projector with DCR for 2.4:1 movies:

4096 x 2133 = 8,736,768 pixels


Then the answer from forum user @blake wrote this
Regarding #2 - if you turn on “aspect:zoom” on the new JVCs which have a 17:9 native image panels, that actually gives you a full 4096 horizontal pixels for scope content.
I was the author of the "Here's the basis for the calculations" post here.

As stated in those posts, when you turn on Zoom Aspect Ratio with scope content (2.35:1, 2.39:1, etc.), the pixels in use by the projector changes from (3840 x 1600) to (4096 x 1707). That represents an increase of 1.7 million pixels (approximately) being displayed, with a corresponding increase in brightness. That would produce an improvement that is subtle, but likely observable.

Similarly when you do this with 16:9 content, you go from (3840 x 2160) to (4096 x 2160). But you do crop pixels displaying actual content when you do this, from the top and bottom of the image. The reason is that to maintain the same aspect ratio of the content, you would need (4096 x 2304) pixels available. The Projector only has 2160 available, so the top 72 pixel rows, and bottom 72 pixel rows, get cropped off. Whether or not cropping the image like this is acceptable is a personal choice. You do gain a small amount of added pixels and light output.
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post #24862 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 05:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tommarra View Post
Okay with Coronavirus ... I don’t think I will be getting my NX7 calibrated anytime soon.

But can someone help me with expected nits off my for two scenarios in Low Lamp without the filter on.:

1. 126 inch 16:9 ST130 inch

2. 120 inch Scope ST130 (with zoom turned on)

I want to configure two profiles in MadVR depending on the source type.

Any help will be greatly appreciated

P.S. I have a cheap light meters from Amazon but don’t know how to use it to measure off the PJ. Any pointers will be great as well


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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
Display a full-screen white pattern and zoom the projector to fill the screen. Measure the lux with the meter placed as close to the centre of the screen as you can, facing the projector lens.

Then use the following calculator created by a forum member:
https://webprojectorcalculator.com/

Click on the Convert tab, enter the dimensions etc, and calculate the nits.
or similarly do above, but instead set light meter on Fc (foot candle) reading again with full white pattern and placed at centre pointing back at projector lens. once have a reading multiply that by screen gain which in your case I think is 1.3 this gives you a reading in FL or foot lambert.

use the converter below to convert your FL reading to Nits...
http://www.unitconversion.org/lumina...onversion.html

remembering for SDR you want around 12-16FL ie 14 FL nominal
For HDR as close as 30Fl or 100Nits.... is great to have, i have found DTM working great on auto if can have that sort of luminance

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post #24863 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 05:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DLCPhoto View Post
I was the author of the "Here's the basis for the calculations" post here.

As stated in those posts, when you turn on Zoom Aspect Ratio with scope content (2.35:1, 2.39:1, etc.), the pixels in use by the projector changes from (3840 x 1600) to (4096 x 1707). That represents an increase of 1.7 million pixels (approximately) being displayed, with a corresponding increase in brightness. That would produce an improvement that is subtle, but likely observable.

Similarly when you do this with 16:9 content, you go from (3840 x 2160) to (4096 x 2160). But you do crop pixels displaying actual content when you do this, from the top and bottom of the image. The reason is that to maintain the same aspect ratio of the content, you would need (4096 x 2304) pixels available. The Projector only has 2160 available, so the top 72 pixel rows, and bottom 72 pixel rows, get cropped off. Whether or not cropping the image like this is acceptable is a personal choice. You do gain a small amount of added pixels and light output.
So DCLPhoto, you utilize Zoom AR even with the DCR lens in place to provide full 4K?

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post #24864 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 06:03 AM
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Originally Posted by asharma View Post
Are you increasing the black floor as a result of a higher gain screen?
Not after closing the iris down. Id say the black floor is lower than it use to be. Lets say my RS4500 open iris has a contrast around 15000:1. But at -8 iris its around 35000:1. If my -8 iris is equal in brightness to my old 1.0 gain screen at 0 iris, I have equal whites at -8 on the new screen but lower black floor.

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post #24865 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 06:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Azekecse View Post
So DCLPhoto, you utilize Zoom AR even with the DCR lens in place to provide full 4K?

Peace and blessings,

Azeke
When using the DCR Lens, you do so while using the JVC's Anamorphic Modes, which by themselves take care of the scaling to the full 4096 pixel width of the chip. So the Aspect Ratio setting is not applicable in this situation, since the Anamorphic mode is handling it.

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post #24866 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 06:12 AM
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Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
Not after closing the iris down. Id say the black floor is lower than it use to be. Lets say my RS4500 open iris has a contrast around 15000:1. But at -8 iris its around 35000:1. If my -8 iris is equal in brightness to my old 1.0 gain screen at 0 iris, I have equal whites at -8 on the new screen but lower black floor.
Thanks, I’m totally confused...it seems if I ask 5 people I get 5 different answers...I “thought” with gain, there was no free lunch in regards to increased brightness and raised black floor...Does the iris adjustment totally negate the gain implications (artifacts aside)?

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post #24867 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 06:21 AM
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Thanks, I’m totally confused...it seems if I ask 5 people I get 5 different answers...I “thought” with gain, there was no free lunch in regards to increased brightness and raised black floor...Does the iris adjustment totally negate the gain implications (artifacts aside)?
Gain does not increase contrast. Its like a window it just moves it. Added gain increases black and white equally while leaving contrast flat.

However, the iris on the JVC does increase contrast. The more you close it, the higher the contrast. So if you can get more gain and close the iris in order to match the light level of a 1.0 gain, you can increase your contrast. It's one of the benefits if JVC. Not all projectors have such a contrast increase when the iris clamps.
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post #24868 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 06:32 AM
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Gain does not increase contrast. Its like a window it just moves it. Added gain increases black and white equally while leaving contrast flat.

However, the iris on the JVC does increase contrast. The more you close it, the higher the contrast. So if you can get more gain and close the iris in order to match the light level of a 1.0 gain, you can increase your contrast. It's one of the benefits if JVC. Not all projectors have such a contrast increase when the iris clamps.
Ok, got it...is there ANY benefit to a 1.0 gain screen then, with the JVC NX series? If I read your statement correctly, the higher the gain screen the more contrast (pop) I can have...the ONLY drawback with a higher gain screen is if you are sensitive to artifacts and potential impact of brightness drop off towards the edges which some see and some don’t?

Video:JVC NX7, 125” 2.35 Stewart ST100 Electric, Sony 85” 900F Sony 55” 900F
Audio: Paradigm Prestige 95, 55C, 15b, 25s, Dual SVS SB3000
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post #24869 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 06:57 AM
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Originally Posted by asharma View Post
Ok, got it...is there ANY benefit to a 1.0 gain screen then, with the JVC NX series? If I read your statement correctly, the higher the gain screen the more contrast (pop) I can have...the ONLY drawback with a higher gain screen is if you are sensitive to artifacts and potential impact of brightness drop off towards the edges which some see and some don’t?
Well, for one thing, higher gain is produced by concentrating the reflection from the projector, narrowing the viewing angle, and for another, higher gain screens are more likely to preserve the projector's polarization, making the choice of 3D glasses more critical.

With my painted screen with 0.93 gain, my two sets of 3D glasses, one set of each polarization, work equally well. (Each set is two pairs of glasses.)

It may also be a contributing factor to why I can get away without masking.

I do recall how annoying a grey area around the image can be - my first projector, from the days when progressive-scan DVD was the bees' knees, a Dell 480p portable designed for PowerPoint presentations, actually intentionally framed its entire 4:3 image with a wide 10% grey border, which I suppressed by attaching black artist's matte board to the wall around the image area.

My 16:9 1080p Panasonic PT-AE2000, which I used from the standardization of HD on Blu-ray until demolishing my theater in 2018 to repair the main support beam in my basement (I rebuilt it for 4K this past fall) thankfully didn't add an artificial grey frame. I didn't even bother to frame its image with black cardboard - I used the same screen paint when I set up the Panny.
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post #24870 of 28551 Old 03-15-2020, 07:12 AM
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Well, for one thing, higher gain is produced by concentrating the reflection from the projector, narrowing the viewing angle, and for another, higher gain screens are more likely to preserve the projector's polarization, making the choice of 3D glasses more critical.

With my painted screen with 0.93 gain, my two sets of 3D glasses, one set of each polarization, work equally well. (Each set is two pairs of glasses.)

It may also be a contributing factor to why I can get away without masking.

I do recall how annoying a grey area around the image can be - my first projector, from the days when progressive-scan DVD was the bees' knees, a Dell 480p portable designed for PowerPoint presentations, actually intentionally framed its entire 4:3 image with a wide 10% grey border, which I suppressed by attaching black artist's matte board to the wall around the image area.

My 16:9 1080p Panasonic PT-AE2000, which I used from the standardization of HD on Blu-ray until demolishing my theater in 2018 to repair the main support beam in my basement (I rebuilt it for 4K this past fall) thankfully didn't add an artificial grey frame. I didn't even bother to frame its image with black cardboard - I used the same screen paint when I set up the Panny.
For me, I’m the only one in my theatre 99 percent of the time in the sweet spot so I’m not at all concerned about the narrower viewing angle...

Video:JVC NX7, 125” 2.35 Stewart ST100 Electric, Sony 85” 900F Sony 55” 900F
Audio: Paradigm Prestige 95, 55C, 15b, 25s, Dual SVS SB3000
Receiver/Amp: Anthem 1120, Emotiva XPA-11 Gen 3
Source: Panasonic UB820, Triple black velvet batcave
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