JVC and Sony 4K Projector Expo / Shootout Thread, April 26 -28 2019 Colorado Springs - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 409 Old 04-08-2019, 05:37 PM - Thread Starter
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JVC and Sony 4K Projector Expo / Shootout Thread, April 26 -28 2019 Colorado Springs

Hey everyone - we have finalized the details for the event! You can get the schedule and free registration at projectorexpo.com.

I am happy to report we have all the following projectors for the shootout / expo, and that special guest Kris Deering will be on hand to calibrate and answer questions.

Sony VPL-VW995ES - Sony's laser projector with the ARC-F lens, MSRP $34999
Sony VPL-VW695ES - Sony's most popular 4K model on the AVS Forum, MSRP $9999
JVC DLA-RS3000 - JVC's top of the line bulb based projector with premium lens and 8K upconversion, MSRP $17999
JVC DLA-RS2000 - JVC's middle of the line 4K projector and most popular on the AVS Forum, MSRP $7999

WHAT: A chance to compare the top 4K projectors in the industry under controlled conditions, with Special Guests:

Kris Deering (Deep Dive AV, Sound and Vision)
Chris Deutsch (JVC)
Russell Warnhoff (Kaleidescape)
Shawn Kelly (Panamorph - tentative)
Craig Rounds (CIR Engineering)

All projectors will be calibrated by Kris Deering, with possible assistance from Craig. While the AVS Forum has given me permission to post about the event, this is NOT an AVS Forum sponsored event. This is an educational event only, NOT a sales event, and everyone is welcome.

WHEN: April 27th and 28th, 2019, 1-6 pm, with a tentative "pre-party" and get-together the evening of Friday, April 26 6-9 pm probably at my house. Friday night would be an opportunity to hear a JBL Synthesis Immersive Surround System, plus our Speaker Shootout Winner the Revel Salon2, plus see the JVC DLA-RS3000 in action.

As mentioned, Sound and Vision technical editor and calibrator extraordinaire Kris Deering will be in town to properly set up all the projectors for the event. Depending on his schedule, he may also be available to calibrate your own personal display during his stay.

The details, broken out:

DATES:

Pre-Event Party and Get-Together:

Friday night, April 26, 6-9 pm
Location: My house (address is provided if you register for free at projectorexpo.com)

Projector Expo / Shootout:

Session 1: Saturday, April 27, 1-6 pm
Session 2: Sunday, April 28, 1-6 pm

LOCATION:

525 N. Cascade Ave, Colorado Springs CO 80903

We will be using a Stewart StudioTek130 screen in a light controlled room.

WE ARE EXPECTING A LARGE NUMBER OF ATTENDEES. PLEASE LET US KNOW ASAP if you want to attend. You can RSVP by PM'ing me here at the AVS Forum, or simply by visiting projectorexpo.com.

ABOUT KRIS DEERING, SPECIAL GUEST AND CALIBRATOR

Kris Deering has been involved in the Home Theater industry in many capacities. He is currently a writer/technical editor for Sound and Vision magazine and a calibrator and consultant through his own company, Deep Dive AV. He has also been a writer and editor for various other publications, both in print and online, including Home Theater magazine and Secrets of Home Theater and High Fidelity. Kris has done work for some of the biggest names in the AV industry, offering a wide range of services including calibration, product development, product testing and training. Many of you know of him already thanks to his major contributions to this forum.

Thanks all and see you soon!

John Schuermann
The Screening Room Home Theater Sales and Design
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Last edited by John Schuermann; 04-24-2019 at 11:30 AM.
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post #2 of 409 Old 04-08-2019, 05:47 PM
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No Benq 990?
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post #3 of 409 Old 04-08-2019, 06:48 PM
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No Benq 990?
Ha Ha, you just want this thread to explode in verbal combat, don't you?
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post #4 of 409 Old 04-08-2019, 07:11 PM
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Ha Ha, you just want this thread to explode in verbal combat, don't you?
I abstained so as to not derail the thread...

I hope to see John and/or Joel when I pick up my new RS2000 this week, but I don't think I'll be able to make the shootout with my son's baseball schedule.
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post #5 of 409 Old 04-08-2019, 10:10 PM
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Bummed

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So bummed I'll miss this, it's literally 15 minutes from my home. I wont be back in the spring in early May. Stink!
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post #6 of 409 Old 04-08-2019, 11:17 PM
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I'm looking forward to it John. It will be good to see you and Kris again so soon... and also the projectors

EDIT: Oh yeah, I'm flying in Friday night, but leaving at 6:30 AM Sunday morning so it will be a quick trip for me with no Sunday time.

Kind regards,
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post #7 of 409 Old 04-09-2019, 04:04 PM - Thread Starter
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@John Schuermann
So bummed I'll miss this, it's literally 15 minutes from my home. I wont be back in the spring in early May. Stink!
Wow, that's too bad - just missed it! We plan on keeping most of these projectors around for a while, so you would be welcome to swing by in May The one exception is the Sony VW995ES, which appears to be spoken for as soon as the show is over.

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post #8 of 409 Old 04-09-2019, 04:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by CIR-Engineering View Post
I'm looking forward to it John. It will be good to see you and Kris again so soon... and also the projectors

EDIT: Oh yeah, I'm flying in Friday night, but leaving at 6:30 AM Sunday morning so it will be a quick trip for me with no Sunday time.

Kind regards,
craigr
Wow, that's an early flight - don't drink too heavy Saturday night

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post #9 of 409 Old 04-10-2019, 03:26 AM
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No Benq 990?
Of course not. It would take away too many JVC sales. Which reminds me will the Sonys be set up correctly this time or purposely handicapped like last round?

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post #10 of 409 Old 04-10-2019, 06:57 AM
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Which reminds me will the Sonys be set up correctly this time or purposely handicapped like last round?

They have Kris Deering attending. He recently calibrated my 885 and Lumagen Pro and frankly it never has looked better! He knows quite a bit about both the 885 and 995. SJ
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post #11 of 409 Old 04-10-2019, 03:45 PM
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They have Kris Deering attending. He recently calibrated my 885 and Lumagen Pro and frankly it never has looked better! He knows quite a bit about both the 885 and 995. SJ
That's good to hear. I just scheduled Kris to calibrate my new JVC RS2000 during his trip...can't wait.
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post #12 of 409 Old 04-10-2019, 03:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Of course not. It would take away too many JVC sales. Which reminds me will the Sonys be set up correctly this time or purposely handicapped like last round?

Wow, that's quite an allegation. Are you genuinely suggesting that we "purposely handicapped" the Sonys? Question - why would I want to "purposely handicap" a Sony (or BenQ) projector? Wouldn't that take away Sony and BenQ sales? Makes no sense.

Last year we had Gregg Loewen of THX calibrate all the projectors, this year we have Kris Deering calibrating the projectors. In addition, calibrator Craig Rounds from CIR Engineering will be here keeping an eye on things. On top of that our regional Sony rep Adam Fleckles will also be attending.

Tell you what - please come on out and join us and you can observe for yourself. Seriously - you are more than welcome! Honest, we'd love to have you. Same is true of anyone else who is skeptical of our objectivity / honesty - the red carpet is officially, and sincerely, rolled out
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post #13 of 409 Old 04-10-2019, 04:05 PM
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Which reminds me will the Sonys be set up correctly this time or purposely handicapped like last round?

What exactly are you talking about?? As someone who attended this shootout, what your saying couldn't be any further from the truth. The Sonys and JVCs both looked fantastic.
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post #14 of 409 Old 04-10-2019, 04:58 PM
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What exactly are you talking about?? As someone who attended this shootout, what your saying couldn't be any further from the truth. The Sonys and JVCs both looked fantastic.
And going back through John's summary (I read it more than a year ago, too) I can't find anything that would lead anyone to believe any of the projectors were "handicapped". There were specific scenes where features were engaged/disengaged to see how a particular projector would display those scenes, but I didn't read that it was an intentional effort to make a projector perform poorly over the duration of the shootout. The opinions of others may vary.
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post #15 of 409 Old 04-10-2019, 05:23 PM
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And going back through John's summary (I read it more than a year ago, too) I can't find anything that would lead anyone to believe any of the projectors were "handicapped". There were specific scenes where features were engaged/disengaged to see how a particular projector would display those scenes, but I didn't read that it was an intentional effort to make a projector perform poorly over the duration of the shootout. The opinions of others may vary.
The Sony threads in the 20k+ forum were having aneurysms and suggesting that Greg Loewen should be stripped of his calibration licence. All because on one day they looked at the Sony with RC off, and also because they had the HDR slider on a value they disagreed with...

Joerod here was one of the loudest perpetrators of that opinion at the time...

It was nothing but slander honestly.

They are likely going to say exactly the same thing about Kris Deering, they have already shoehorned him as a JVC Biased person years ago, despite his pretty public positivity towards the more recent Sony's. In my opinion, Kris is about one of the straightest shooters on this forum.
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post #16 of 409 Old 04-10-2019, 05:27 PM
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What exactly are you talking about?? As someone who attended this shootout, what your saying couldn't be any further from the truth. The Sonys and JVCs both looked fantastic.


I was there with Toe on Sunday and we were both allowed to make any suggestion we wanted. If we wanted more RC on the 885 we could turn it up. We asked to refocus a projector as we felt it wasn’t quite dialed in, turns out it was dialed in just was a bit soft in a corner. We could ask for any movie scenes to be played or replayed or paused.

It really boiled down to people not accepting that those of us that attended felt the RS4500 outperformed the 885ES. My thoughts that were posted after the shootout were that it was due to the excellent lens on the 4500.

People have to remember we were nitpicking at times. Focusing on lots of little things. It’s not like one was just worlds better but again IMO the lens on the 4500 really allowed it to produce a better picture than the 885.

I have zero skin in the game and if I thought something was off I would have posted it. I would have been happy to put someone on blast for setting up a biased event but it was just not the case.

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post #17 of 409 Old 04-10-2019, 05:31 PM
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The Sony threads in the 20k+ forum were having aneurysms and suggesting that Greg Loewen should be stripped of his calibration licence. All because on one day they looked at the Sony with RC off, and also because they had the HDR slider on a value they disagreed with...

Joerod here was one of the loudest perpetrators of that opinion at the time...

It was nothing but slander honestly.

They are likely going to say exactly the same thing about Kris Deering, they have already shoehorned him as a JVC Biased person years ago, despite his pretty public positivity towards the more recent Sony's. In my opinion, Kris is about one of the straightest shooters on this forum.
To clarify, my comments specifically speak to the Sony 385ES vs. JVC RS640 comparisons. But I do remember going through the higher-end shootout as well as follow-up comments and reading the detail you refer to. Nobody's perfect...I think John showed the appropriate measure of integrity by publishing (for all to read) the miscue.

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post #18 of 409 Old 04-10-2019, 05:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the comments. Yes, on Saturday we had the HDR slider at Sony's suggested value, and it blew out the whites on a scene from SULLY. We contacted Sony, got feedback, and adjusted the slider to bring back the blown out picture detail. However, doing that also "flattened out" the picture. We also turned RC back on at Sony's request for the Sunday session. It did add artifacts, but at the same time sharpened up the picture.

Looking forward to comparing the new pieces, as I know tone-mapping as been re-addressed by both companies in the intervening year. On the JVC side, we also had some complaints that JVC's default tone-mapping crushed deep blacks, which I talked about in my write-up.

In defense of BOTH companies, HDR was (and is) a bit of a wild wild west, so it's not surprising that both brands struggled with certain titles.
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post #19 of 409 Old 04-10-2019, 11:14 PM
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These are all great projectors that will be showcased. All winners for sure! I personally have found that having an expert tune your system is a significant value as we all have different environments. Sounds like a great event! Kudos to John for including so many experienced industry people attending and helping with the setup. SJ
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post #20 of 409 Old 04-11-2019, 08:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Precisely! We are approaching this event as more of an expo, where people can see some of the top projectors in the industry, side by side and at their best. Not so much as winners and losers, but as a showcase where people can make up their own minds. It's also a unique opportunity to meet these top people and pick their brains.
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post #21 of 409 Old 04-11-2019, 09:02 AM
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Originally Posted by John Schuermann View Post
Precisely! We are approaching this event as more of an expo, where people can see some of the top projectors in the industry, side by side and at their best. Not so much as winners and losers, but as a showcase where people can make up their own minds. It's also a unique opportunity to meet these top people and pick their brains.
That's IMO exactly as it should be.

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post #22 of 409 Old 04-12-2019, 04:18 PM
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I would also like to see the BenQ 9060 in this. I recently had a chance to see one in a friends home theater and it really surprised me. I was looking to get either the RS-2000 or 695ES but I have to say the 9060 is in the mix after seeing it. I think the comparison to the 2 stalwarts would be good.
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post #23 of 409 Old 04-13-2019, 09:10 AM - Thread Starter
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If someone wants to bring one, great. We just need to know right away, since we really starting to finalize our setup. Putting these events together is a major undertaking (venue, food, drink, scheduling numerous guests, dealing with manufacturers, shipping, equipment setup, promotion, etc) so unfortunately it's not exactly easy to take requests. However, as stated, we are open if someone wants to bring one, I just need a commitment soon. It also means more setting aside more time for the calibrator(s) to do their jobs properly.

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post #24 of 409 Old 04-13-2019, 09:17 AM - Thread Starter
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OK, everyone, to make this simpler we created a landing page dedicated to this event where people can register and get a full rundown on the schedule . For those wanting to attend the pre-party / HT Geekout Friday night at my house (where we have an RS3000 and JBL Synthesis / Revel Salon2 HT system to check out), registering gets you access to my home address:

https://projectorexpo.com/

That's it - pretty simple, yes?

See everyone soon!
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post #25 of 409 Old 04-14-2019, 02:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Facebook event now created as well:

https://www.facebook.com/events/369047650618317/

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post #26 of 409 Old 04-16-2019, 09:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Woo hoo! The Sony VPL-VW995ES just showed up for the event! Thanks, Sony!

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post #27 of 409 Old 04-16-2019, 09:34 AM - Thread Starter
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JVC DLA-RS3000 hanging in my home, ready for the pre-event party Friday night the 26th of April. Friday night or Saturday morning we will move it to the expo location at 525 N. Cascade Ave 80903 so @Kris Deering can calibrate it alongside all the other projectors

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post #28 of 409 Old 04-16-2019, 09:50 AM - Thread Starter
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Finally, a pic of the VPL-VW695ES hanging in the actual expo / shootout location, 525 N. Cascade Ave, 80903. NOTE: we are literally going to replace all the white ceiling tiles with black plus paint the frame black as well. In addition, we will black out all windows and doors. Goal, of course, is to have a total blackout environment. Screen is going to be a 150" Scope Stewart StudioTek130, masked down to 16:9 for most of the event.



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post #29 of 409 Old 04-18-2019, 12:01 PM
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I'm really looking forward to being part of this event! I've just returned from New York City for the second time this month and I'm gearing up for this projector expo. My review of the NX-9, which will be featured at the event, just went live over at Sound and Vision and you can find my review of the Sony VPL-995ES there as well, which will also be on hand. Needless to say, I have a lot of experience with both brands and will be doing everything I can to showcase them properly. I will be calibrating all the projectors for the event, and helping answer any questions about the projectors and technology on display. Hope to see some of you guys there and by all means introduce yourself at the event!
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Technical Editor/Writer Sound and Vision Magazine
Deep Dive AV - Calibration, Consulting and Education
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post #30 of 409 Old 04-18-2019, 10:28 PM
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Kris, both excellent reviews as usual. Great projectors for sure. You all need to post some pictures of this event! SJ
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