Projector performance for say... a Super Bowl party - Page 5 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #121 of 154 Old 02-03-2020, 07:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post
Maybe the most important consideration for watching with some lighting on, is to try and have lighting that won't shine directly on the screen. Recessed can lights and dimmers that shine straight down onto tables really help. And having different zones on separate dimmers, so only the lights that need to be on are on. That is my recommendation.

Thanks! Thats exactly how i have it set up. LED Can lights with 5 different zones and dimmers on everything!
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post #122 of 154 Old 02-03-2020, 07:07 AM
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Originally Posted by purduesd View Post
So, I got to view an Epson 6050 side by side a Sony 295es with my wife this weekend in Nashville. The setup was in a theater room of a retail store. But there was glass french door behind the projector and 2 rows of Track lighting on the ceiling. We played with the room lighting and could simulate how both the Sony and the Epson look in both controlled and not controlled lighting on a 110" white screen.

I thought the epson was slightly brighter over all. To me, this was not as noticeable as i anticipated. After the fact, my wife said she didn't notice a big difference in brightness. The 295es got a slight edge for contrast when watching a Transformers 1080 blue ray. In dim lighting the Sony looked amazing for the movie. In hind sight, i wished i would have spent more time comparing dark room performance of the Epson. Both performed fine for sports (soccer). So i don't see motion as a problem with either one.

I didn't really get to dig in on the settings because the cheesy salesman was selling sony hard. It wasn't a direct comparison, we took the 6050 off a shelf and fired it up for its first hours on a cart. The sony was hanging on the ceiling. Supposedly it was on low lamp, and i assume the 6050 boots up initially in low lamp but... who really knows.

We both did notice you loose a little bit of the clarity and vibrance coming from a TV. But the size jump experience seems to more than make up for it.


The great news is our concerns about whether projection is right for us is totally answered. We are going PJ.

My understanding is the Sony 295es is comparable to the JVC NX5.

So i guess it comes down to the trade off... little bit of brightness or little bit of picture contrast. The Epson 6050 is probably the cheapest option but i haven't really dug into pricing. I'll also need to consider screen options- ALR vs white.
The JVC RS1000/NX5 is more comparable to the VW695 than it is to the 295.

RS1000/NX5 vs 295
JVC has more lumens
JVC has better native contrast
JVC has dynamic iris
JVC has slightly sharper lens
JVC has lens memory
JVC has dynamic tone mapping

There will be a shootout in Colorado next month between the RS1000/NX5 and the VW695.
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post #123 of 154 Old 02-03-2020, 08:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
The JVC RS1000/NX5 is more comparable to the VW695 than it is to the 295.

RS1000/NX5 vs 295
JVC has more lumens
JVC has better native contrast
JVC has dynamic iris
JVC has slightly sharper lens
JVC has lens memory
JVC has dynamic tone mapping

There will be a shootout in Colorado next month between the RS1000/NX5 and the VW695.
Thanks! Im kinda leaning towards the NX5... at worst i have to add another cheap laser projector down the road for parties and daytime... It's only money right?
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post #124 of 154 Old 02-03-2020, 09:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
The JVC RS1000/NX5 is more comparable to the VW695 than it is to the 295.



RS1000/NX5 vs 295

JVC has more lumens

JVC has better native contrast

JVC has dynamic iris

JVC has slightly sharper lens

JVC has lens memory

JVC has dynamic tone mapping



There will be a shootout in Colorado next month between the RS1000/NX5 and the VW695.

I’d be interested in seeing this. Has a location been determined?


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post #125 of 154 Old 02-03-2020, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Todd G. View Post
I’d be interested in seeing this. Has a location been determined?


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I started a thread here.
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-di...ter-event.html
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post #126 of 154 Old 02-03-2020, 10:59 AM
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Thank you Mike.


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post #127 of 154 Old 02-04-2020, 01:33 PM
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post #128 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 06:31 AM - Thread Starter
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There are some impressive pictures in that thread... im gonna have to take a closer look. Thanks!
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post #129 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 06:33 AM - Thread Starter
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I'm liking this...
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post #130 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by DunMunro View Post
The TK800M has a minimum throw ratio of 1.5x with an 110% offset. The JVC will be at ~1.72x. The beam from the JVC might hit the TK800M. It's also not black.
I noted the compatible models in post 116.
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post #131 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by noob00224 View Post
The TK800M has a minimum throw ratio of 1.5x with an 110% offset. The JVC will be at ~1.72x. The beam from the JVC might hit the TK800M. It's also not black.
I noted the compatible models in post 116.
The use of 4K/HLG for sports broadcasts was the primary point of interest. The UHD52ALV has more placement options as does the TK850.

Last edited by DunMunro; 02-06-2020 at 08:59 AM.
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post #132 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 09:03 AM
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Originally Posted by DunMunro View Post
The use of 4K/HLG for sports broadcasts was the primary point of interest. The UHD52ALV has more placement options as does the TK850.
What is the point of it if that model does not fit in the setup? The projector would also need to have a black case. As I mentioned in post 116, the UHD51ALV is the only 4K projector that can do that.
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post #133 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 09:12 AM
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I'm liking this...
That's a very small screen for such a large room.
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post #134 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 09:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by noob00224 View Post
The TK800M has a minimum throw ratio of 1.5x with an 110% offset. The JVC will be at ~1.72x. The beam from the JVC might hit the TK800M. It's also not black.
I noted the compatible models in post 116.
Hey thanks, yeah i was just running the numbers myself. Thanks!
And I'm not sure why they chose to make the TK800M look like the original iMac...hah!

Im really kind hoping to avoid the multi projector setup in all honesty. I'm kind hoping that i can deal with the drawbacks of either the JVC or the 6050, whichever i choose.

My taller ceiling is 105" and lower ceiling is 92.5". Assuming a top of screen height of 87.5" (See attached)

The JVC has an 80% vertical offset ( i couldn't find the Epson 6050s vertical offset) So after math, the center of the lens can be 19" above the screen. I will have approximately 17.5" difference from ceiling height to top of screen. It should tuck up there nicely.
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post #135 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 09:17 AM - Thread Starter
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That's a very small screen for such a large room.
Really? 120" is too small? I would be at or slightly behind (12") the THX min viewing distance from the couch.
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post #136 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by purduesd View Post
Hey thanks, yeah i was just running the numbers myself. Thanks!
And I'm not sure why they chose to make the TK800M look like the original iMac...hah!

Im really kind hoping to avoid the multi projector setup in all honesty. I'm kind hoping that i can deal with the drawbacks of either the JVC or the 6050, whichever i choose.

My taller ceiling is 105" and lower ceiling is 92.5". Assuming a top of screen height of 87.5" (See attached)

The JVC has an 80% vertical offset ( i couldn't find the Epson 6050s vertical offset) So after math, the center of the lens can be 19" above the screen. I will have approximately 17.5" difference from ceiling height to top of screen. It should tuck up there nicely.
You mean 80% lens shift range. Offset is a fixed amount. You really do not want to be using all of the lens shift on any of these projectors. Also if you use any horizontal lens shift, it subtracts from the available vertical lens shift. Same for vertical subtracting from horizontal. Think of it like a circle with a dot in the center. The dot represents the lens of the projector and the circle is the limits of the lens shift. If you move the dot horizontally until it touches the circle, using all of the horizontal lens shift, the dot has zero vertical movement available.
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post #137 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 09:50 AM
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Really? 120" is too small? I would be at or slightly behind (12") the THX min viewing distance from the couch.
Many members of the forum view larger screens from the same or closer distance. THX is a just a recommendation.

This chart shows that you won't be getting full benefit of 4K at that size:

http://s3.carltonbale.com/resolution_chart.html

but the main thing is that the room itself is very large and you want to have lots of people viewing the image, and so it should be as large as possible. I'm viewing a ~145in screen at the same distance. Early in the thread I showed a UHD52ALV projecting onto a ~200in screen, now that might be overkill, but the image itself looked great.
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post #138 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 09:51 AM
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Hey thanks, yeah i was just running the numbers myself. Thanks!
And I'm not sure why they chose to make the TK800M look like the original iMac...hah!

Im really kind hoping to avoid the multi projector setup in all honesty. I'm kind hoping that i can deal with the drawbacks of either the JVC or the 6050, whichever i choose.

My taller ceiling is 105" and lower ceiling is 92.5". Assuming a top of screen height of 87.5" (See attached)

The JVC has an 80% vertical offset ( i couldn't find the Epson 6050s vertical offset) So after math, the center of the lens can be 19" above the screen. I will have approximately 17.5" difference from ceiling height to top of screen. It should tuck up there nicely.
The JVC has 80% vertical lens shift and Epson 5050/6050UB 96%. This is calculated from the center of the screen, and the percentage is taken from the height of the screen. These projectors don't really have offset the same way DLP projectors with limited lens shift have.

I've done the numbers on previous pages.

The reason a dual projector setup might be required is once you get to see how nice a large image looks like, the projector will be used all the time. JVC lamps are expensive (~$500 roughly), with Epson's about half.

A cheap 1080p lamp based DLP projector are priced just over the cost of a JVC lamp. A used one is half, but you might not find one with a black case. A 4K DLP are more expensive, lasers more, etc.
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post #139 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 12:30 PM - Thread Starter
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The JVC has 80% vertical lens shift and Epson 5050/6050UB 96%. This is calculated from the center of the screen, and the percentage is taken from the height of the screen. These projectors don't really have offset the same way DLP projectors with limited lens shift have.

I've done the numbers on previous pages.

The reason a dual projector setup might be required is once you get to see how nice a large image looks like, the projector will be used all the time. JVC lamps are expensive (~$500 roughly), with Epson's about half.

A cheap 1080p lamp based DLP projector are priced just over the cost of a JVC lamp. A used one is half, but you might not find one with a black case. A 4K DLP are more expensive, lasers more, etc.
Can you give me the short answer about what height ideally i would need to mount the NX5 or 6050. Top of my screen will be roughly 87.5" Like in a perfect scenario the lens is at the top of the screen.... etc.

Does lens shift have any drawbacks like keystone correction does?

I see your point about bulb life. 1000 hours on a bulb equates to a new bulb / year at ~20 hours/week. I don't see myself down there that often but i wouldn't be shocked if its an awesome viewing experience either. Just thinking out loud here.... id replace a $300 bulb every year to not need another projector.... But this doesn't consider usuability/ startup and brightness.
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post #140 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 12:37 PM - Thread Starter
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If the Sony was already mounted in their demo room chances are it’s also calibrated which I doubt the Epson was if they lifted it off the shelf. Ask anyone with the Epson that had theirs calibrated they will tell you there’s a world of difference.

On a plus note it’s great you are won over to the whole PJ experience, no matter which one you end up with you will never look back, not only movies but sporting events will never be the same again.

Here’s my Epson with the exact same image for a YouTube 4K demo.

Pre Calibrated
https://www.dropbox.com/s/r3kgrlzt0j...%2057.jpg?dl=0

After Calibration
https://www.dropbox.com/s/8g8i3hr95u...%2052.jpg?dl=0

Not only are the blacks better but the colours are now accurate.
Is it weird that i kind of prefer the pre- calibrated image..? Guess that's why i prefer samsung LCD to sony LCD. For some reason color accuracy just isn't big on my list. I like the poppier comic book colors. However i bet i would prefer the post calibrated version in a dark scene.
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post #141 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 12:57 PM
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The best I've found is to calibrate the image, then sometimes add a bit of extra blue, reducing that orange look to skin tones. Depends on how the calibration looks, as to whether I'll adjust it further. I usually only add a bit of coolness to the image, not a ton. I find this gives a more neutral skin tone across a wider range of content, though it can make some content a tiny bit less saturated looking, but usually it's not noticeable as much as it reduces those orangish looking skin tones. Of course if you overdo it, then it will look way too clinical.

**Updated Projector Calculator Released NOV 2017**
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post #142 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 01:59 PM
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Can you give me the short answer about what height ideally i would need to mount the NX5 or 6050. Top of my screen will be roughly 87.5" Like in a perfect scenario the lens is at the top of the screen.... etc.

Does lens shift have any drawbacks like keystone correction does?

I see your point about bulb life. 1000 hours on a bulb equates to a new bulb / year at ~20 hours/week. I don't see myself down there that often but i wouldn't be shocked if its an awesome viewing experience either. Just thinking out loud here.... id replace a $300 bulb every year to not need another projector.... But this doesn't consider usuability/ startup and brightness.
A cheap 1080p DLP mounted close to the screen would be brighter than both the JVC and Epson. Laser more so. Laser starts immediately.

Lens shift on the NX5 or the 5050/6050UB should not be an issue, although it's technically not recommended to be used at 100%. One user with a 5xxxUB series claims there is no distortion with 100% vertical lens shift. The 6050UB and NX5 should have better lens quality.

Height of an 120" screen in 16:9 format is 58.8". Half of that is 29.4".

If the screen ends at 87.5", then the middle of the screen would be at 58.1" height.

80% on the NX5 would be 47.04" and 96% on the Epson is 56.44".

So the JVC's center of lens can be up to 105.14" and 114.54‬" for the Epson.


Not going to bother with the Epson, since it's well withing range, but for the JVC, if the projector would be attached to the ceiling (105") with the shallowest mount (3 inches ?). Height of the NX5 is 9.5", lens is around the center = 4.75"
Center of lens would be ~8" from the ceiling, so 97" high.

With the center of the lens at 97" and center of the screen at 58.1" (38.9‬" difference), or around 83% of what the vertical lens shift can do.


If you're asking at which height the projector should be mounted at, it depends on the mount's height. But even with the NX5 flush against the ceiling, it would still not reach 100% of it's vertical lens shift.

It should be fine with 83% of the vertical lens shift, but I'd also like others comments on this topic.

A solid mount is required for the NX5 since it's 43lbs. The Epson is 25lbs.
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post #143 of 154 Old 02-06-2020, 04:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by DunMunro View Post
Many members of the forum view larger screens from the same or closer distance. THX is a just a recommendation.

This chart shows that you won't be getting full benefit of 4K at that size:

http://s3.carltonbale.com/resolution_chart.html

but the main thing is that the room itself is very large and you want to have lots of people viewing the image, and so it should be as large as possible. I'm viewing a ~145in screen at the same distance. Early in the thread I showed a UHD52ALV projecting onto a ~200in screen, now that might be overkill, but the image itself looked great.
Well you sent me back down the rabbit hole of considering a 150" AT screen... so thanks for that! hah!

- I actually leaning back that way now, so the JVC is a bad fit there.

I am honestly thinking the best path for me is to order an Epson 6050 bring it home and play with screen size on the wall, before I have to commit.
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post #144 of 154 Old 02-07-2020, 10:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Just ordered the Epson 6050. Cant wait for it to get here to start playing with screen sizes. Thanks to all for the advice so far!
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post #145 of 154 Old 02-11-2020, 08:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Woah! I think i underestimated how awesome this is gonna be!
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post #146 of 154 Old 02-11-2020, 09:42 PM
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Woah! I think i underestimated how awesome this is gonna be!
Is it projected on the grey wall?

How bright is it?
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post #147 of 154 Old 02-12-2020, 04:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Is it projected on the grey wall?

How bright is it?
Yes just projected on the wall. The walls are more of a navy. The pictures I posted were in eco mode between 150" and 130".

It is plenty bright! I am really pleased. If i turn on any of the can light zones (with the exception of the ones directly over the screen) the picture still looks really good and has good blacks and contrast.

It should perform superb for parties and even better for movie night

The 10 LED cans over the screen wash the picture out a little as expected but its still watchable. The screen that size puts off so much light itself, there's not really any reason why I would ever want those cans on while watching anything.
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post #148 of 154 Old 02-12-2020, 06:26 AM
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Originally Posted by purduesd View Post
Woah! I think i underestimated how awesome this is gonna be!
Glad you like it. It is amazing what image quality you can get in your home these days. Ten years ago, even at double the money, you could not get anything close to this.
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post #149 of 154 Old 02-12-2020, 06:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Glad you like it. It is amazing what image quality you can get in your home these days. Ten years ago, even at double the money, you could not get anything close to this.
It really is... I had no idea a home projection setup could look like this, when i started shopping for 85" TVs. I think i made the right choice for my circumstances. Thanks for the sale and support Mike! Now I have at least 2 weeks of agony, before i can move in and get it set up permanently!
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post #150 of 154 Old 02-12-2020, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by purduesd View Post
Yes just projected on the wall. The walls are more of a navy. The pictures I posted were in eco mode between 150" and 130".

It is plenty bright! I am really pleased. If i turn on any of the can light zones (with the exception of the ones directly over the screen) the picture still looks really good and has good blacks and contrast.

It should perform superb for parties and even better for movie night

The 10 LED cans over the screen wash the picture out a little as expected but its still watchable. The screen that size puts off so much light itself, there's not really any reason why I would ever want those cans on while watching anything.
Seriously mate if you can project on to the wall itself instead of going for a screen then have a chat with @MississippiMan as his screen paint by all accounts is amazing and will give you the whole deep blacks when watching at night in the dark and allow you to watch with some lights on like an ALR screen.

Cuffed that you are so happy with your 6050ub, I know as an owner I am a little bias but I reckon it’s a cracking all rounder.

Epson EH-TW9400 - QualGear Fixed Frame 100” - Sony x700 BRP & Panasonic 420 BRP - Sony 1080 AVR - IPL Acoustics M1TLs & IPL Acoustics AVC Pro Centre, Four KEF surrounds & 2 Sub boxes (10” Sub + 10” Passive Radiator)
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