JVC X790R - Predicted Brightness: Help me chose a projector - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 06:17 AM - Thread Starter
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JVC X790R - Predicted Brightness: Help me chose a projector

118x109x45" DxWxH

2.40:1, 1.2 Gain (CineGrey 3D)

19.68' / 235" Throw, 1.29x Zoom


High / Low Lamp


What kind of brightness would you guys estimate once accurately calibrated to P3 with filter inserted?

I've been looking at the Epson 6050UB but the brightness lowers drastically once calibrated, even lower than the JVC.

JVC seem to have the upper hand here, price difference is minimal.


I plan to watch 4K HDR content, mostly HDR, maybe 10% SDR.

Thank you!
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post #2 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 06:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Vitus4K View Post
118x109x45" DxWxH

2.40:1, 1.2 Gain (CineGrey 3D)

19.68' / 235" Throw, 1.29x Zoom


High / Low Lamp


What kind of brightness would you guys estimate once accurately calibrated to P3 with filter inserted?

I've been looking at the Epson 6050UB but the brightness lowers drastically once calibrated, even lower than the JVC.

JVC seem to have the upper hand here, price difference is minimal.


I plan to watch 4K HDR content, mostly HDR, maybe 10% SDR.

Thank you!
I would not count on the 3D actually having 1.2 gain. The 5D material rated by the manufacturer to be 1.5 gain measured 1.0. Without P3 filter the Epson calibrates brighter than the JVC. With P3 filter, the JVC calibrates brighter than the Epson. I would guess that you are about 26/27FL with filter in place with the JVC. Your long throw is hurting you. I used 1.0 for the gain, but I do not know if that number is slightly high or slightly low, but I bet it is close.

Last edited by Mike Garrett; 04-06-2020 at 06:33 AM.
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post #3 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 06:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
I would not count on the 3D actually having 1.2 gain. The 5D material rated by the manufacturer to be 1.5 gain measured 1.0. Without P3 filter the Epson calibrates brighter than the JVC. With P3 filter, the JVC calibrates brighter than the Epson.
Thanks Mike!

No, I would never trust manufacturers gain ratings either, always measure to be sure, and I will, just mentioned the fabric for reference.

Big help knowing the JVC will end up brighter.


Does clamping down the iris/aperture affect maximum throw distance in my case?

How far could I clamp it down?
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post #4 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 06:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Vitus4K View Post
Thanks Mike!

No, I would never trust manufacturers gain ratings either, always measure to be sure, and I will, just mentioned the fabric for reference.

Big help knowing the JVC will end up brighter.


Does clamping down the iris/aperture affect maximum throw distance in my case?

How far could I clamp it down?
For HDR, I would be looking for more brightness, not less. So I would not clamp down the iris at all.
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post #5 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 06:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
For HDR, I would be looking for more brightness, not less. So I would not clamp down the iris at all.
Thanks!

I guess you would choose the JVC over the Epson?
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post #6 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 06:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Vitus4K View Post
Thanks!

I guess you would choose the JVC over the Epson?
For me, yes, but I have a room that is optimized for contrast.
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post #7 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 07:03 AM
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The JVC will have superior black but the Epson will handle HDR content better than the x7900 will, unless you add MadVR. In my case the guy that calibrated my 9400 give me two option for HDR content, one with the filter in place and one without, for me personally on my 100" screen I have never felt the need to use the preset without the filter because it's way too bright in my opinion but it's there if needed.

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post #8 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 07:20 AM - Thread Starter
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For me, yes, but I have a room that is optimized for contrast.
Right, I think the native contrast is a benefit no matter the room, as long as you control the light as much as possible.

The better the projector, the better the image, it does not help having me hating a too bright image, it's almost all hands to the JVC.


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Originally Posted by Luminated67 View Post
The JVC will have superior black but the Epson will handle HDR content better than the x7900 will, unless you add MadVR. In my case the guy that calibrated my 9400 give me two option for HDR content, one with the filter in place and one without, for me personally on my 100" screen I have never felt the need to use the preset without the filter because it's way too bright in my opinion but it's there if needed.
I understand, thanks for sharing.

I plan to try the HDFury LLDV DTM trick, combined with Arves curves or similar.

I think and hope that the black floor of the JVC will blow Epson out the water when perfectly calibrated.

I have all the tools required.

Also heard Epson's LCD chips degrade over time, JVC is as solid as it gets, I would presume.
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post #9 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 08:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Vitus4K View Post
Right, I think the native contrast is a benefit no matter the room, as long as you control the light as much as possible.

The better the projector, the better the image, it does not help having me hating a too bright image, it's almost all hands to the JVC.




I understand, thanks for sharing.

I plan to try the HDFury LLDV DTM trick, combined with Arves curves or similar.

I think and hope that the black floor of the JVC will blow Epson out the water when perfectly calibrated.

I have all the tools required.

Also heard Epson's LCD chips degrade over time, JVC is as solid as it gets, I would presume.
Epson has not had a degrading panel problem in many years. Non issue these days.
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post #10 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 08:05 AM - Thread Starter
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Epson has not had a degrading panel problem in many years. Non issue these days.
Thanks for confirming, nice addition to these boards.

JVC still comes out brighter, and probably has the best potential with a finely calibrated HDR picture.

Thanks all!
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post #11 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 08:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Vitus4K View Post
Thanks for confirming, nice addition to these boards.

JVC still comes out brighter, and probably has the best potential with a finely calibrated HDR picture.

Thanks all!
If you have a dark room I would use the JVC with the filter on, and if your room has lighter walls the the Epson without the filter.
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post #12 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 08:52 AM
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Epson has not had a degrading panel problem in many years. Non issue these days.
Not even the dreaded red issue?

My friend got a Epson recently and after like 11 months the corner started to turn red and it started growing out into the picture until half his screen was slightly tinted red after awhile.

Epson replaced it, but now the replacement is starting to do that all over again from a different corner.
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post #13 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 09:27 AM
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Not even the dreaded red issue?

My friend got a Epson recently and after like 11 months the corner started to turn red and it started growing out into the picture until half his screen was slightly tinted red after awhile.

Epson replaced it, but now the replacement is starting to do that all over again from a different corner.
I have not had a customer with an Epson panel issue in years. Epson used to have a panel degrading issue many years ago, when they used organic panels. Epson switched to inorganic to get rid of the problem.

Added
This sounds like a new issue. I wonder if Epson has changed a glue type.
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post #14 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Vitus4K View Post
Right, I think the native contrast is a benefit no matter the room, as long as you control the light as much as possible.

The better the projector, the better the image, it does not help having me hating a too bright image, it's almost all hands to the JVC.




I understand, thanks for sharing.

I plan to try the HDFury LLDV DTM trick, combined with Arves curves or similar.

I think and hope that the black floor of the JVC will blow Epson out the water when perfectly calibrated.

I have all the tools required.

Also heard Epson's LCD chips degrade over time, JVC is as solid as it gets, I would presume.
I can’t speak for past Epsons but currently there’s no issue with their panels.

No doubt about it the x7900 has superior black levels, even the x5900 is way better but when viewed in isolation you would be surprised to hear it doesn’t look dramatically better. Don’t get me wrong here the x7900 is a superior machine and if you can get one at little more than the Epson I too would probably jump at it but using its own software it’s not as successful dealing with HDR as the Epson, in fact until JVC offered its latest software update on the N series the Epson was right up there with the best of offer.

In my opinion if you want the best out of the X7900 with HDR you really need to link it with a PC and MadVR.

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post #15 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by SirMaster View Post
Not even the dreaded red issue?

My friend got a Epson recently and after like 11 months the corner started to turn red and it started growing out into the picture until half his screen was slightly tinted red after awhile.

Epson replaced it, but now the replacement is starting to do that all over again from a different corner.
My machine is 16 months old with no signs of this, can’t say I have heard any mention of this on the UK forum either. I wonder is there an underlining problem with your friend install that’s having any affect of his projector?

Especially as this is the second time it’s happened.

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post #16 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 10:40 AM
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My machine is 16 months old with no signs of this, can’t say I have heard any mention of this on the UK forum either. I wonder is there an underlining problem with your friend install that’s having any affect of his projector?

Especially as this is the second time it’s happened.
I can't see how. It's up on the ceiling in a vaulted ceiling room with like a 3ft drop pole. There is nothing around it in any direction for at least 3 feet and that's the ceiling.

I go around and calibrate friends and stuff projectors and I have seen a fair number of Epsons with the red tint issue.

You can google it and find plenty of people reporting the issue as well. Probably it's less more recently but I was surprised even a friends LS10500 had the same issue even though that's LCoS not LCD. I think it's the polarizer panels, not the LCD panels that have the issue.

Even my old Panasonic AE-8000U started red tinting on one side (though that took about 5 years) and as far as I understand it uses Epson 3LCD tech.

Here is my friend's replacement Epson after about 6 months.

https://i.groupme.com/1000x750.jpeg....f80fe399.large

First one did the same thing after 11.

The model is https://www.projectorcentral.com/Eps...inema_1450.htm

But I have seen it on various other Epson models including UB as I have gone around to friends and other places to do some calibrations. I have nothing against Epson but it's just something I have notices more than a couple times.

The only projectors I have never seen any sort of color degradation over time are all DLPs and JVC LCoS. All the older Sonys I have calibrated all had varying levels of Blue tint that needed to be corrected but at the cost of a little contrast.

JVCs have gamma droop. My NX5 had it right out of the box, but after I fixed it, it has not changed in the 300 hours I have used it so far since.

DLPs seem to remain the mot stable over the years in all regards in my experience. They also tend to have less dust blobs as well.

If only RBE didn't bother me so much and they weren't such low contrast haha.

Last edited by SirMaster; 04-06-2020 at 10:46 AM.
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post #17 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 11:45 AM
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I can't see how. It's up on the ceiling in a vaulted ceiling room with like a 3ft drop pole. There is nothing around it in any direction for at least 3 feet and that's the ceiling.

I go around and calibrate friends and stuff projectors and I have seen a fair number of Epsons with the red tint issue.

You can google it and find plenty of people reporting the issue as well. Probably it's less more recently but I was surprised even a friends LS10500 had the same issue even though that's LCoS not LCD. I think it's the polarizer panels, not the LCD panels that have the issue.

Even my old Panasonic AE-8000U started red tinting on one side (though that took about 5 years) and as far as I understand it uses Epson 3LCD tech.

Here is my friend's replacement Epson after about 6 months.

https://i.groupme.com/1000x750.jpeg....f80fe399.large

First one did the same thing after 11.

The model is https://www.projectorcentral.com/Eps...inema_1450.htm

But I have seen it on various other Epson models including UB as I have gone around to friends and other places to do some calibrations. I have nothing against Epson but it's just something I have notices more than a couple times.

The only projectors I have never seen any sort of color degradation over time are all DLPs and JVC LCoS. All the older Sonys I have calibrated all had varying levels of Blue tint that needed to be corrected but at the cost of a little contrast.

JVCs have gamma droop. My NX5 had it right out of the box, but after I fixed it, it has not changed in the 300 hours I have used it so far since.

DLPs seem to remain the mot stable over the years in all regards in my experience. They also tend to have less dust blobs as well.

If only RBE didn't bother me so much and they weren't such low contrast haha.
You are not kidding on the red tint. You say it keeps creeping into the image more? That looks bad.

Added
DLP once was king of the HT projector world. If they could solve their low contrast problem, they would probably be king again.

Last edited by Mike Garrett; 04-06-2020 at 11:49 AM.
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post #18 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 11:49 AM
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You are not kidding on the red tint. You say it keeps creeping into the image more? That looks bad.
Yeah it starts out small and over time gets worse and worse.

Eventually it will look like this:

https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...DeAQ..i&w=4128
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Sure don't look like Christmas!

I'll stay away from these, thanks for sharing.
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post #20 of 21 Old 04-06-2020, 02:18 PM
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Sure don't look like Christmas!

I'll stay away from these, thanks for sharing.

Well I am not trying to discourage as I think the Epson can be great. Just that this is a possibility that I have seen.

It’s probably a lot less common on the latest generation or 2 of Epson UB but I don’t have enough data.

Even if it does happen Epson warranty is extremely good about it.
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Well I am not trying to discourage as I think the Epson can be great. Just that this is a possibility that I have seen.

It’s probably a lot less common on the latest generation or 2 of Epson UB but I don’t have enough data.

Even if it does happen Epson warranty is extremely good about it.
I decided on the JVC, thanks anyway!
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