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post #1 of 20 Old 09-30-2017, 10:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Outdoor Antenna suggestions Nampa, ID (SOLVED)

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...e6a4754382588c

Hello all, I have a Samsung 65ks8000 TV and we're currently using https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1, the 1byone 50 Mile Range Amplified HDTV Antenna. It works great except it only works when it's in this spot right here and it looks horrible. That's the East facing wall of the house, if I mount it on the north facing, which is an indoor wall and where the TV is, it gets 2-3 channels.



The Wife wants it gone and I've been looking at getting an antenna for outside. Unfortunately the house isn't wired for anything. The coax was installed on the outside of the house and the only practical place where I could DIY would be to mount it here as it's already wired but it's not going to be ideal. It's on the south west corner of the house, attached to the first story. The house itself would appear to block a direct line of sight to the broadcast antenna which if I understand that TV Fool map are north east from me.

I was about to buy the RCA Yagi antenna and then got overwhelmed with choices. I'd really like to keep this under $100.00 Heck if it could be $50.00ish I'd be extremely happy. THANKS!


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post #2 of 20 Old 09-30-2017, 12:22 PM
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This should be pretty easy. You have lots of strong stations all LOS and in the same direction. You do have VHF stations so you need a VHF & UHF antenna. The RCA antenna outside should work for you.

You're right that the southwest corner of the house is not a good choice. You could mount it somewhere on the north side and just run the cable over the roof to where the dish is now is and use a barrel connector to connect the TV antenna coax to the existing dish coax.

Or possibly you could remove the dish and add an extension pole long enough for the RCA to clear the peak of the roof unless your house is the same as your neighbor's with a second story blocking the view to the northeast.

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post #3 of 20 Old 09-30-2017, 12:27 PM
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I take it the DirecTV dish is no longer in use?

If not, the first thing I'd try is sticking your antenna up on that mast, temporarily, to see how it does. That'll give you some idea as to what you'll need. The change in elevation gets you above house walls and appliances and siding and all that other multipath-inducing and signal attenuating stuff. If you get just about everything, then something as simple as this might do. If there are still issues, start with something such as this attached to that mast and aimed at Boise.

My motto is "start cheap and keep receipts." If the latter doesn't work from that corner of the house, it shouldn't be a lot of effort to move up to the peak of the house and install the whole thing there. Probably easier than crawling through the attic and fishing line to the opposite side of the house.
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post #4 of 20 Old 09-30-2017, 12:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calaveras View Post
This should be pretty easy. You have lots of strong stations all LOS and in the same direction. You do have VHF stations so you need a VHF & UHF antenna. The RCA antenna outside should work for you.

You're right that the southwest corner of the house is not a good choice. You could mount it somewhere on the north side and just run the cable over the roof to where the dish is now is and use a barrel connector to connect the TV antenna coax to the existing dish coax.

Or possibly you could remove the dish and add an extension pole long enough for the RCA to clear the peak of the roof unless your house is the same as your neighbor's with a second story blocking the view to the northeast.
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I take it the DirecTV dish is no longer in use?

If not, the first thing I'd try is sticking your antenna up on that mast, temporarily, to see how it does. That'll give you some idea as to what you'll need. The change in elevation gets you above house walls and appliances and siding and all that other multipath-inducing and signal attenuating stuff. If you get just about everything, then something as simple as this might do. If there are still issues, start with something such as this attached to that mast and aimed at Boise.

My motto is "start cheap and keep receipts." If the latter doesn't work from that corner of the house, it shouldn't be a lot of effort to move up to the peak of the house and install the whole thing there. Probably easier than crawling through the attic and fishing line to the opposite side of the house.
Thank you for the replies!

You're correct, that dish isn't used anymore, we're Netflix, Amazon Prime and OTA only.

I might have an issue, I just checked with the HOA and only satellite dishes are allowed on the homes, TV antennas are not unless I draw up plans and submit them for approval to the "architectural committee". I went outside and looked around the entire neighborhood and while satellite dishes are EVERYWHERE there isn't a single TV antenna to be seen. The good news is that where the dish is right now is hidden from the street but if I extend it up then I'll run into issues.

I think I'll take your advice and move my current antenna there and see what kind of reception I get. My local Walmart has the RCA Mini Yagi for 44.00 in stock so I might just start there since I can take it back.
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post #5 of 20 Old 09-30-2017, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joe_sun View Post
Thank you for the replies!

You're correct, that dish isn't used anymore, we're Netflix, Amazon Prime and OTA only.

I might have an issue, I just checked with the HOA and only satellite dishes are allowed on the homes, TV antennas are not unless I draw up plans and submit them for approval to the "architectural committee". I went outside and looked around the entire neighborhood and while satellite dishes are EVERYWHERE there isn't a single TV antenna to be seen. The good news is that where the dish is right now is hidden from the street but if I extend it up then I'll run into issues.

I think I'll take your advice and move my current antenna there and see what kind of reception I get. My local Walmart has the RCA Mini Yagi for 44.00 in stock so I might just start there since I can take it back.
Show this to the HOA
https://www.fcc.gov/media/over-air-r...n-devices-rule

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post #6 of 20 Old 09-30-2017, 01:33 PM
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Lightbulb OTA YES! HOA's can die!

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You're correct, that dish isn't used anymore
Does this mount face the direction you need?

51 degrees magnetic.

Which way in relation to that dish would it face?

You need to have clearance for the elements,so long as it faces within the 180 degree arc that the dish aces.

This will work:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Most of the J mounts are only 18-24 inches, and depending on which way you face you might have a clearance issue... When I did my conversion I put a 6ft pole in the J mount, but your DBS uses a different size than the standard J Mounts for DBS.

Keep possibly 2 of the runs for the LNB's, one to use, one for an in place spare. Trace it back, there should be a large metal box which has the 3 LNB inputs, and then outputs to each run into how ever many RX's you had. Remove that SWITCH, its not compatible with OTA.

So you have:

antenna -- coax down to side---- lightning arrestor--- ground block---- then you can find the run to that old TV(s) and connect it up.

Do you need more than that TV??

You possibly may need to get an DISTRIBUTION AMP depending on signal levels, and cable runs.

If you need more than that TV, how far are each run, and just confirm you have RG6 cable. It really should be, but just confirm it.. Safe is better...


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I might have an issue, I just checked with the HOA and only satellite dishes are allowed on the homes, TV antennas are not unless I draw up plans and submit them for approval to the "architectural committee".
BZZT! Don't work that way, so long as you meet the criteria.

Do you OWN THE LAND and THE PROPERTY? Yes. Then they can POUND SAND! Your property is 100% EXCLUSIVE USE.

As another poster pointed out 47 CFR 1.40 aka OTARD.

https://www.fcc.gov/media/over-air-r...n-devices-rule

OVERRULES this little tin star's.

If they persist in their ILLEGAL ways, I am sure you can find or might know a paralegal who can write up one of these stern letters on legal firm letterhead and shut them up. Barring that, file with the FCC! When they get a NAL for $5,000, to start, they will shut up!


In the past there was a way to do this, and leave the dish on the mount, but Winegard has disco'd that mount, and I've had to find a couple of them recently via some NOS places.
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post #7 of 20 Old 09-30-2017, 02:22 PM
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As you can tell people here are not at all sympathetic to HOA rules restricting antennas.

Any rules that require pre-approval of TV antennas in most cases are prohibited. Don't let them bully you.

https://www.fcc.gov/consumers/guides...tellite-dishes
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post #8 of 20 Old 09-30-2017, 02:31 PM
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Yeah, unless you live in a multi-unit building with a shared roof, they don't have a case. If it WORKS from the southwest corner of the building and the antenna can't be seen from the street, that'll make them happier. Plus, you're replacing an external structure with an even less-obtrusive external structure. Take it from me: DO submit the request. Can't stress that enough. Let them reject that before you show them the FCC regs and start fighting. Putting it up without submitting the request is a bigger problem to deal with than putting it up after they've rejected the request. They can't require pre-approval. They CAN require submission of plans.

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post #9 of 20 Old 09-30-2017, 04:25 PM
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Your signals are strong enough you could mount Hi-VHF/UHF Antenna in your ATTIC (or perhaps a convenient Closet)....

You shouldn't "NEED" need an Amplifier for up to 4 drops.

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post #10 of 20 Old 09-30-2017, 07:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank you everyone for the replies. So just to answer some questions and an update.

We only have 1 TV, I know it's weird but that's all we have.

I got the application from the HOA BUT RIGHT ON THE FORM it says this application isn't necessary for a personal TV antenna as long as it's one meter or less in diameter so I'm good to go.

If I have some sort of 5-6ft extension added to my J Pipe then I think it would clear just about everything, any suggestions?

I have a 50.00 gift card to Amazon so I'm thinking of just getting the RCA Yagi since it's 45.00 shipped, any reason not to?
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post #11 of 20 Old 09-30-2017, 08:02 PM
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Lightbulb Go for it! But careful with housing tin stars

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We only have 1 TV, I know it's weird but that's all we have.


We don't want to discuss the number TV's and PC displays.


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I got the application from the HOA BUT RIGHT ON THE FORM it says this application isn't necessary for a personal TV antenna as long as it's 39" or less in diameter so I'm good to go.
CAREFUL! They are MIXING AND MATCHING DEFINITIONS!

The OTARD rules cover DISHES upto 39" inches, in the lower 48, and any size in AK.

"...antennas including direct-to-home satellite dishes that are less than 39.37" in diameter (or of any size in Alaska), TV antennas, and wireless cable antennas."

See those commas, in the LAW, these are important!

There are NO SIZE RESTRICTIONS for OTA/BROADCAST Part 73 V|UHF antennas. That comes down to what you need to receive the signals in your area.

This is classic that they do NOT KNOW WHAT THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT! Nor do they know their BS is illegal.

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If I have some sort of 5-6ft extension added to my J Pipe then I think it would clear just about everything, any suggestions?
Before doing that....

What do you have in the direction of the TX site? Trees, type, distance, other homes? Type? Number of floors? Any with metal roofs?

Standard J Mounts are a 1.66"OD, and will take a 1.5" OD SWAGGED pole. 3 Star carries these....BUT

https://www.3starinc.com/satellite-d...st-166-od.html

"will NOT work for DIRECTVs SL3/5) "

Your DBS company on the dishes with the 3 LNA's started using 1.5" OD pipes, thus the 3 Star ones don't fit.

https://www.3starinc.com/mast_pipe.html


If you know some one in the "trades" plumber, HVAC, they may have a "swagger" tool that can take the plain 1.5" OD pipe and create the needed swaged end. Maybe even some of the rental places have one you can rent for an hour or so. That may be too off the wall for them??? Way too mechanical for me!

You can measure it and see which pipe you have. If you have an older one, then you can get the swagged end one from 3 Star.

Since Dish uses the standard mounts, I just took the 3 Star one, shoved it in, hit with a rubber mallet a few times. Drilled a hole through it. Put a bolt through it. Done.

Do the above once you find a pipe that fits.

If you do that you probably need to run a new run of RG6, since even with the extra in the arm of the dish. you might not have enough. I had enough.

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I have a 50.00 gift card to Amazon so I'm thinking of just getting the RCA Yagi since it's 45.00 shipped, any reason not to?
Nope, I would go for it. I get all the 55 channels of the muxes in my area with it. I am pleased with it. It will take about 5 minutes to snap into place the elements.
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post #12 of 20 Old 09-30-2017, 09:59 PM
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What RCA yagi? Remember, you have VHF stations as well as UHF.

I'd at least TRY the existing mast before doing anything else. If it works, you're done.
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post #13 of 20 Old 10-01-2017, 06:45 AM - Thread Starter
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What RCA yagi? Remember, you have VHF stations as well as UHF.

I'd at least TRY the existing mast before doing anything else. If it works, you're done.
The one that TampBayOTA posted https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...KIKX0DER&psc=1

In the description it says UHF and VHF

I need to get on the roof today after church, take some measurements and hook up the old antenna at that spot to see if I get an reception and then I'll go from there.

TampaBayOTA you asked what what was in the way line of sight, I have to get on the roof to see, I can't 100% tell from the ground and I spent most of yesterday at my In-laws. There shouldn't be any metal roofs from here to there, the land is very flat and the towers are on a mountain.
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post #14 of 20 Old 10-01-2017, 07:47 AM
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Good way to start. Keep receipts and packing materials.
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post #15 of 20 Old 10-01-2017, 07:55 AM
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This what I use today works great but after few years it will drift in the wind and have go out side to see where it pointing so now I am lock it so does not turn now

https://www.amazon.com/ViewTV-Outdoo...n%3A6025772011

I use Tablo and Roku this will pick stations over 100 miles away

Dave

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post #16 of 20 Old 10-01-2017, 12:38 PM
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This what I use today works great but after few years it will drift in the wind and have go out side to see where it pointing so now I am lock it so does not turn now

https://www.amazon.com/ViewTV-Outdoo...n%3A6025772011

I use Tablo and Roku this will pick stations over 100 miles away

Dave

You're in a very unusual location where the Bakersfield stations are over 110 miles away but still LOS. This is only true because the transmitters are at 7700' AMSL and the Clovis is not far above sea level without a single hill in between. This does not make that a good antenna. It does show why antenna mileage ratings don't mean anything and almost any antenna will work if you have LOS to the transmitters.
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post #17 of 20 Old 10-01-2017, 01:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Well this is embarrassing.

As I mentioned earlier, today I went out and did my scouting to see what would work best in regards to setting up the new antenna. During that time I noticed something that I had forgotten about. The previous owners had installed an RG6 cable into the upstairs laundry room located in the NE corner of the house. For those paying attention this is exactly where I would need an antenna. I had forgotten about it because it's hidden by the washer and dryer. I now remember when we moved in I wondered why they bothered with it, I guess they had to watch TV while folding clothes? I figured I could run this cable up into the attic and put the new antenna up there but I wasn't sure if this cable was even live.

You see. my house has had Dish and cable and who knows what else so the cable runs are a total mess as the previous installers just cut the wire and spliced into whatever they needed to so I had no idea if it would work. I hooked up my tone generator to the RG6 and luckily it was still a good connection and not only that it terminated in my networking box and not the crawl space! I used a female to female F splice to connect it to the downstairs TV RG6 run, took my old indoor antenna and stuck it up there on the wall for kicks to see what would happen.

BOOM 54 channels including radio and perfect reception! I then RAN into my office to cancel the antenna I had ordered earlier!

it's now hidden from sight in the laundry room and the bonus is it was free!

I'm so sorry for all of you that spent time to help me out, I'm really embarrassed that I had forgotten about that run and how easy of a fix this ended up being but thank you so much for the help!
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post #18 of 20 Old 10-01-2017, 01:28 PM
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FYI I tried 60 & 100 mile antennas they did not get 110 miles range
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post #19 of 20 Old 10-01-2017, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
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FYI I tried 60 & 100 mile antennas they did not get 110 miles range

Antenna mileage is marketing. There's no guarantee that any antenna will receive any station at any distance.
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post #20 of 20 Old 10-03-2017, 06:42 AM
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Yes I know if there a forest fire or fog a close the transmitter less than 30 miles will effect the TV
BUT the only gage I have is the mileage the print on the box. Which is close on a very good day.

Dave

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Antenna mileage is marketing. There's no guarantee that any antenna will receive any station at any distance.
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