near Shelley, ID looking for amplifier or antenna advice - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 39 Old 05-03-2020, 04:03 PM - Thread Starter
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In the rafters near the power outlet readings.
3 (36) 85%, Signal Q 91%, Symbol Q 100%
6 (23) 100%, Signal Q 85% - 100%, Symbol Q 0% - 100%
8 (8) 76%, Signal Q 0% - 50%, Symbol Q 0% - 100%
10 (17) 100%, Signal Q 0% - 100%, Symbol Q 0% - 100%
15 (15) 63%, Signal Q 87%, Symbol Q 100%
28 (28) 50%, Signal Q 0% - 49%, Symbol Q 0% - 100%
31 (31) 52%, Signal Q 72%, Symbol Q 100%

When I collected my earlier readings I saw the signal quality and symbol quality jumping around for some stations some times. I thought maybe the RadioShack amp was having issues (it was another thrift store find) and only saw it a couple times so I ignored it because I was collecting signal strength reading. However, this time there were 3 stations with this issue and the RadioShack amp wasn't being used. If I clicked View and watched the station often the signal quality and symbol quality would settle and not jump around as much. There was a firmware update for the HDHomeRun box a couple weeks ago and I'm thinking that might have changed its behavior. Current firmware version is 20200225. Or, maybe there really is a problem with the balun or antenna.
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post #32 of 39 Old 05-03-2020, 04:28 PM
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I have connected to the HDHomeRun box directly to the antenna in the past but for the last batch of readings above it wasn't connected that way. The HDHomeRun was back in its usual place in the kitchen. It was after the passive 4 output splitter and after whatever cables and splitters might be in the walls. I didn't have the RadioShack amp connected.
Oh, OK. I think the readings are valid for no amp. OTA signals do vary all the time.

I still think you need more amplification before splitting. Your readings suggest a CM 7777HD + CM3410 as above. I have two 7777HD anps that I use for testing; they have two gain settings. I use them indoors; I don't think the housing is suitable for outdoor use.

I still don't understand why the signals from your antenna aren't stronger based on your signal report.

If you can not measure it, you can not improve it.
Lord Kelvin, 1883
www.megalithia.com/elect/aerialsite/dttpoorman.html
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post #33 of 39 Old 05-03-2020, 05:04 PM
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In the rafters near the power outlet readings.
3 (36) 85%, Signal Q 91%, Symbol Q 100%, 292 degrees
6 (23) 100%, Signal Q 85% - 100%, Symbol Q 0% - 100%, 202 degrees
8 (8) 76%, Signal Q 0% - 50%, Symbol Q 0% - 100%, 292 degrees
10 (17) 100%, Signal Q 0% - 100%, Symbol Q 0% - 100%, 292 degrees
15 (15) 63%, Signal Q 87%, Symbol Q 100%, 212 degrees
28 (28) 50%, Signal Q 0% - 49%, Symbol Q 0% - 100%, 39 degrees
31 (31) 52%, Signal Q 72%, Symbol Q 100%, 212 degrees

When I collected my earlier readings I saw the signal quality and symbol quality jumping around for some stations some times. I thought maybe the RadioShack amp was having issues (it was another thrift store find) and only saw it a couple times so I ignored it because I was collecting signal strength reading. However, this time there were 3 stations with this issue and the RadioShack amp wasn't being used. If I clicked View and watched the station often the signal quality and symbol quality would settle and not jump around as much. There was a firmware update for the HDHomeRun box a couple weeks ago and I'm thinking that might have changed its behavior. Current firmware version is 20200225. Or, maybe there really is a problem with the balun or antenna.
Those signals look stronger.

I think the erratic behavior is caused by multipath because the antenna isn't aimed directly at the transmitters, which would explain why there are two antennas.

If you can not measure it, you can not improve it.
Lord Kelvin, 1883
www.megalithia.com/elect/aerialsite/dttpoorman.html
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post #34 of 39 Old 05-03-2020, 06:10 PM - Thread Starter
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I think the erratic behavior is caused by multipath because the antenna isn't aimed directly at the transmitters, which would explain why there are two antennas.
I went on to the roof and tried pointing the antenna directly at the tower location for 6 and then the tower location for 3, 8, and 10. Whatever is causing the erratic signal it wasn't resolved by pointing at the tower for 6. I tried pointing at the tower location for 3, 8 , and 10. That helped some but not completely. Looking in the direction of the 3, 8, and 10 towers I noticed there is a row of cottonwood trees on another property that are leafed out and waving in the wind. In the end I pointed the antenna at a midway point between the two clusters of towers. That seems to have cleared up most of the instability but 10 is still having issues.

While I was on the roof I noticed the antenna spine is bent a little. The U bolt holding the antenna to the mast has been tightened a bit too much. I didn't over tighten it and no one else has been up there for a long time so the bent spine isn't new but I think it could cause some multipath no matter which way I point the antenna.
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post #35 of 39 Old 05-03-2020, 06:28 PM
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Thank you for making the additional tests.

Trees certainly can mess with the signals.

I think I've run out of ideas.

Good luck and stay well.

Best regards,
rabbit

If you can not measure it, you can not improve it.
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post #36 of 39 Old 05-07-2020, 08:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank you for making the additional tests.

Trees certainly can mess with the signals.

I think I've run out of ideas.

Good luck and stay well.

Best regards,
rabbit

Thank you for your help.


I ordered some things. Maybe later I'll give an update.












Earlier I mentioned using the HDHomeRun box with an Ethernet to WiFi bridge. I thought that would work but I tried it and I couldn't get it to work. The HDHomeRun box's Ethernet port lights indicate the box acquires a good LAN IP address when connected to the LAN by the bridge adapter but the stream viewing program and Config GUI program can't find the HDHomeRun on the network. Perhaps whatever the software uses for identifying the box on the network, that thing can't be detected when using the Ethernet to WiFi bridge.
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post #37 of 39 Old 05-08-2020, 09:52 PM
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When I had issues with the CM-7778v3 I emailed Channel Master support and tried some things they told me to do. I had no trouble setting up the power injector and connecting it to the amp but Channel Master had me check that. To their credit their email support is good. Their responses were quick and indicated they understood me. Sometimes you get email support that is based in a different country and the responses are off but that wasn't my experience with Channel Master. However, the support person concluded my signal booster was working like it should and I don't understand how the company could intend the product to work the way it did. Anyway, I was able to return the amp without much trouble so I agreed to disagree and sent it back.
Given it's the better UHF of the two, I'd take the UHF section off of the combo and combine what's left with the UHF Yagi. Or remove the bottom antenna, entirely.
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post #38 of 39 Old 05-08-2020, 11:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Given it's the better UHF of the two, I'd take the UHF section off of the combo and combine what's left with the UHF Yagi. Or remove the bottom antenna, entirely.
Someone else mentioned that, word for word, earlier in this thread. I looked at the antennas. I thought maybe I could just unscrew some things and rescrew some things to put them together but looks like it wouldn't be that easy. I don't have experience working with metal. I'm worried that if I tried putting them together I'd probably ruin both antennas. The lower disconnected UHF-only antenna is still on the mast just because I don't have a convenient place to put it.


I was Googling about combining signals from more than one antenna. I found an article about stacking at http://www.dennysantennaservice.com/...enna-html.html The lower antenna looks similar and I thought maybe the lower antenna on the roof where I live was put there in an attempt at stacking.
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post #39 of 39 Old 05-13-2020, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by wirewalker View Post
Someone else mentioned that, word for word, earlier in this thread. I looked at the antennas. I thought maybe I could just unscrew some things and rescrew some things to put them together but looks like it wouldn't be that easy. I don't have experience working with metal. I'm worried that if I tried putting them together I'd probably ruin both antennas. The lower disconnected UHF-only antenna is still on the mast just because I don't have a convenient place to put it.


I was Googling about combining signals from more than one antenna. I found an article about stacking at The lower antenna looks similar and I thought maybe the lower antenna on the roof where I live was put there in an attempt at stacking.
the erratic behavior is caused by multipath because the antenna isn't aimed directly at the transmitters, which would explain why there are two antennas.
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