Guide: Building a 4K HTPC for madVR - Page 114 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3391 of 3714 Old 09-22-2019, 11:33 AM
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I just went through the guide on how to setup madVR by Onkyoman, i am running it through Jriver 25's latest version.

it came pre-installed on my HTPC which i received a couple of weeks ago. some settings were already there, and i can see it running in the taskbar when a movie plays, and definitely it improved the image of my current temporary projector(1080p) I would like to check a few settings and want to make use of my 2060 SUPER 8GB to its full capability, do you recommend i read the full guide? or are there any shortcuts? i am sure there are a few tweaks or things i can do to even push it further for the moment.

Or do you suggest that i wait till i get a 4K native PJ and do the above?

Any tips would be helpful, i have no issues in reading and learning rather than copying someone else's settings that might not work for me.

Thanks everyone for the help in advance.

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post #3392 of 3714 Old 09-22-2019, 02:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mightyhuhn View Post
madVR is not HDCP compliant and streaming services are usually not working at UHD on windows PCs or need special CPU/iGPU and software which is not madVR.



a HTPC doesn't sound like something you want.



as always copy protection only hurts user that don't work around it.
So as of now and for a long time what I'm asking for is not available and won't be for years to come or never?

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post #3393 of 3714 Old 09-22-2019, 02:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Balbolito View Post
I just went through the guide on how to setup madVR by Onkyoman, i am running it through Jriver 25's latest version.

it came pre-installed on my HTPC which i received a couple of weeks ago. some settings were already there, and i can see it running in the taskbar when a movie plays, and definitely it improved the image of my current temporary projector(1080p) I would like to check a few settings and want to make use of my 2060 SUPER 8GB to its full capability, do you recommend i read the full guide? or are there any shortcuts? i am sure there are a few tweaks or things i can do to even push it further for the moment.

Or do you suggest that i wait till i get a 4K native PJ and do the above?

Any tips would be helpful, i have no issues in reading and learning rather than copying someone else's settings that might not work for me.

Thanks everyone for the help in advance.
Try starting with the base sample settings provided in the last section of the guide. Watch some content for a period of time and then look at the control panel again to decide if you want to experiment with any other settings such as those under pixel shader tone mapping, image enhancements, upscaling refinement or artifact removal.

Descriptions are provided for all of those added enhancements in each section of the guide. Whether they should be used or not is a matter of preference.
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post #3394 of 3714 Old 09-22-2019, 02:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jorgebetancourt View Post
So as of now and for a long time what I'm asking for is not available and won't be for years to come or never?

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk
The ability to play paid streaming apps through a player supported by madVR is unlikely ever to happen.

The madVR Envy was created for the very purpose of addressing the lack of support for these sources on Windows.
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post #3395 of 3714 Old 09-22-2019, 03:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Onkyoman View Post
The ability to play paid streaming apps through a player supported by madVR is unlikely ever to happen.



The madVR Envy was created for the very purpose of addressing the lack of support for these sources on Windows.
Got it. Need to figure this out but the envy right now is way out of league for me.

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post #3396 of 3714 Old 09-23-2019, 03:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Onkyoman View Post
Try starting with the base sample settings provided in the last section of the guide. Watch some content for a period of time and then look at the control panel again to decide if you want to experiment with any other settings such as those under pixel shader tone mapping, image enhancements, upscaling refinement or artifact removal.

Descriptions are provided for all of those added enhancements in each section of the guide. Whether they should be used or not is a matter of preference.
Thank you appreciate it and thanks again for the guides.

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post #3397 of 3714 Old 09-23-2019, 05:50 AM
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Originally Posted by jorgebetancourt View Post
Got it. Need to figure this out but the envy right now is way out of league for me.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


Yeah I’m not confident they have pitched it at the right price/audience. We shall see how the market responds once it goes on sale though.
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post #3398 of 3714 Old 09-23-2019, 06:43 AM
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Could someone suggest what card to get for my system? I keep reading conflicting threads and can’t decide how much power I actually need.

My HTPC is a pentium g3258, asus z87-a mobo, and 8gb ram. This will run to a Denon x1400h and then to a Sony 65x950g. I need a vid card to output the 4K content since the pentium can’t do 4K. I will also play a mixture of older content 480/720/1080 as I slowly update my collection. I would like to utilize the madVR upscaling, but don’t want to spend more than $200. I understand that limits what I can fully achieve with madVR.
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post #3399 of 3714 Old 09-23-2019, 07:21 AM
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Nvidia 1050 TI will get you basic 1080p - 4k scaling and is within your budget.

1060, 1070 also. Look at picking up a used card for more bang for your buck. Prices fluctuate.
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post #3400 of 3714 Old 09-23-2019, 07:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doubles1283 View Post
Could someone suggest what card to get for my system? I keep reading conflicting threads and can’t decide how much power I actually need.

My HTPC is a pentium g3258, asus z87-a mobo, and 8gb ram. This will run to a Denon x1400h and then to a Sony 65x950g. I need a vid card to output the 4K content since the pentium can’t do 4K. I will also play a mixture of older content 480/720/1080 as I slowly update my collection. I would like to utilize the madVR upscaling, but don’t want to spend more than $200. I understand that limits what I can fully achieve with madVR.
I would say whatever you decide on get the next best card, if you want the 1060 get the 1070, if it's the 1070 then get the 1080.

Just so you are a bit more future-proof. just my opinion.

most important thing in your new HTPC would be the GPU.

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post #3401 of 3714 Old 09-23-2019, 09:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doubles1283 View Post
My HTPC is a pentium g3258, asus z87-a mobo, and 8gb ram. This will run to a Denon x1400h and then to a Sony 65x950g. I need a vid card to output the 4K content since the pentium can’t do 4K. I will also play a mixture of older content 480/720/1080 as I slowly update my collection. I would like to utilize the madVR upscaling, but don’t want to spend more than $200.
1060 6GB is fine for a 4k HDR display (hdr passthrough), you can take a look here what settings you can use with it.

Personally I think that there's no reason for future proofing at this point:
- madshi wants to utilise nvidia tensor cores
- but we don't have any ETA for this, so it can take e.g. a year as well
Meaning, there's no point of buying old cards that you actually don't need now and no point of buying new cards either now, newer/better cards will be available ~half a year later.

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post #3402 of 3714 Old 09-23-2019, 10:30 AM
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Can anyone kindly provide me with a link to madVR 'Test Build 86'?
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post #3403 of 3714 Old 09-23-2019, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by magicj1 View Post
Can anyone kindly provide me with a link to madVR 'Test Build 86'?
Post 5974 here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-di...projector.html
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post #3404 of 3714 Old 09-23-2019, 05:08 PM
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Anybody have the issue of their JVC projector triggering the HDR flag even when MadVR is set to pixel shaders? It only does it when I go into fullscreen mode and about 50% of the time. Drives me crazy. I have to switch to passthrough then back to pixel shaders and it fixes it.

Nvidia, LAV, tried all kinds of settings.

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post #3405 of 3714 Old 09-23-2019, 09:22 PM - Thread Starter
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What color gamut are you sending: SDR BT.2020 or DCI-P3?
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post #3406 of 3714 Old 09-24-2019, 03:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chros73 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahmadss View Post
I have gtx1060 6gb with I5 7500 and ssd drive. Display is sony x930e
Here are my settings using the same (underclocked) GPU:
- d3d11 mode in LAV video (madvr image processing is much faster compared to the other modes)
- hdr passthrough to 4k hdr display
- in nVidia panel
-- power management set to "Adaptive"
-- output: RGB, FULL, 12bit

Profile rules under scaling algorithms:
Code:
if (srcHeight <  577) and (deintFps <  26) "0576p25"
if (srcHeight <  577) and (deintFps <  31) "0576p30"
if (srcHeight <  577) and (deintFps <  51) "0576p50"
if (srcHeight <  577) and (deintFps >= 51) "0576p60"
if (srcHeight <  721) and (deintFps <  26) "0720p25"
if (srcHeight <  721) and (deintFps <  31) "0720p30"
if (srcHeight <  721) and (deintFps <  51) "0720p50"
if (srcHeight <  721) and (deintFps >= 51) "0720p60"
if (srcHeight < 1080) and (srcHeight > 1030) and (srcWidth < 1920) and (deintFps <  26) "1079p25"
if (srcHeight < 1081) and (deintFps <  26) "1080p25"
if (srcHeight < 1081) and (deintFps <  31) "1080p30"
if (srcHeight < 1081) and (deintFps <  51) "1080p50"
if (srcHeight < 1081) and (deintFps >= 51) "1080p60"
if (srcHeight < 2161) and (deintFps <  26) "2160p25"
if (srcHeight < 2161) and (deintFps <  31) "2160p30"
if (srcHeight < 2161) and (deintFps <  51) "2160p50"
if (srcHeight < 2161) and (deintFps >= 51) "2160p60"
else                                       "Default"
Profile rules under rendering (there's spare GPU power with current settings, hence the different dithering algo for >[email protected] content):
Code:
if (srcWidth > 1919) and (deintFps <  26) "1080p25"
else "Default"
You can give me the link Dowload file???
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post #3407 of 3714 Old 09-24-2019, 07:12 AM
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You can give me the link Dowload file???
There's no download file, just the screenshots. You have to go through them manually if you are interested.

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post #3408 of 3714 Old 09-24-2019, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chros73 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by doubles1283 View Post
My HTPC is a pentium g3258, asus z87-a mobo, and 8gb ram. This will run to a Denon x1400h and then to a Sony 65x950g. I need a vid card to output the 4K content since the pentium can&#226;€&#x2122;&#xfe0f;t do 4K. I will also play a mixture of older content 480/720/1080 as I slowly update my collection. I would like to utilize the madVR upscaling, but don&#226;€&#x2122;&#xfe0f;t want to spend more than $200.
1060 6GB is fine for a 4k HDR display (hdr passthrough), you can take a look here what settings you can use with it.

Personally I think that there's no reason for future proofing at this point:
- madshi wants to utilise nvidia tensor cores
- but we don't have any ETA for this, so it can take e.g. a year as well
Meaning, there's no point of buying old cards that you actually don't need now and no point of buying new cards either now, newer/better cards will be available ~half a year later.
Thanks, I’ll be on the look out for a 1060. Are the nvidia cards more preferably than the amd ones? I keep seeing deals on Rx 580s.
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post #3409 of 3714 Old 09-24-2019, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by doubles1283 View Post
Thanks, I’ll be on the look out for a 1060. Are the nvidia cards more preferably than the amd ones? I keep seeing deals on Rx 580s.
They seem to be preferred, they were usually recommended almost exclusively until recently. The developer of madvr is releasing a hardware version and it has an Nvidia gpu inside if that tells you anything.

If you have $200 to spend you should be able to find a 1070, which is a nice boost over a 1060. I saw some 1070ti's the other day for about $225. These were previous mining cards but still good deals.

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post #3410 of 3714 Old 09-24-2019, 08:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Onkyoman View Post
What color gamut are you sending: SDR BT.2020 or DCI-P3?
BT.2020

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post #3411 of 3714 Old 09-25-2019, 04:50 AM - Thread Starter
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I'm not sure why the projector would switch to HDR mode. It could be a bug with madVR or the projector is recognizing the BT.2020 color space and is using that alone to trigger HDR playback. But I don't think this is a common issue with other JVC projectors.

Try checking report BT.2020 to display and see if the projector behaves any differently.
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post #3412 of 3714 Old 09-25-2019, 07:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Onkyoman View Post
Nothing if you don't apply a dynamic target nits to the measurement files with Soulnight's tool. The live algo doesn't work with the measurement files. It uses its own frame measurements.
Isn't there a way for madvr to use/be aware of the measurement file and still be able to modify the values in the hdr tab?
Like Soulnight's tool but without this part:
Populate all measurement files with custom display target nits values as provided by a user-defined formula with the optional ability to dynamically adjust the display target nits for each detected movie scene as the video plays.

Soulnight's tool makes the image a few shades darker than the live algo (all the time), and does not have the FALL threshold in v.87.
Would a lower dynamic tuning work to match the live algo?
Don't have the knowledge to use the Custom option.


What is the min scene dur supposed to be?
It was set to 100 in the monitor tab and 0 in the PJ. Don't remember changing this value.

Can't search the thread with min scene dur, get results with just scene, how can searches be made with multiple words?
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post #3413 of 3714 Old 09-25-2019, 08:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Onkyoman View Post
I'm not sure why the projector would switch to HDR mode. It could be a bug with madVR or the projector is recognizing the BT.2020 color space and is using that alone to trigger HDR playback. But I don't think this is a common issue with other JVC projectors.



Try checking report BT.2020 to display and see if the projector behaves any differently.
Thank you. Still happens after I set it to report BT.2020 to the JVC. Any other ideas? Guess I should ask on the JVC threads.

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Thanks!
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post #3414 of 3714 Old 09-26-2019, 12:33 AM
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Originally Posted by CoryW View Post
Thank you. Still happens after I set it to report BT.2020 to the JVC. Any other ideas? Guess I should ask on the JVC threads.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
Let's see the screenshot of your HDR tab. What build you running? You sure you have "output video in HDR format" unchecked?

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post #3415 of 3714 Old 09-26-2019, 01:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Balbolito View Post
most important thing in your new HTPC would be the GPU.
Yep , for sure.....

I just replaced my Nividia 1080TI with the 2080TI....... the more processing power you can have the more you can explore the many options/config avaialble .
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post #3416 of 3714 Old 09-26-2019, 04:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noob00224 View Post
Isn't there a way for madvr to use/be aware of the measurement file and still be able to modify the values in the hdr tab?
Like Soulnight's tool but without this part:
Populate all measurement files with custom display target nits values as provided by a user-defined formula with the optional ability to dynamically adjust the display target nits for each detected movie scene as the video plays.


What do you want to change? The targets for each scene are automatically created by a formula. If you changed the dynamic tuning, you would have to repopulate the entire measurement file because that information is fixed before playback.

Quote:
Originally Posted by noob00224 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by noob00224 View Post
Soulnight's tool makes the image a few shades darker than the live algo (all the time), and does not have the FALL threshold in v.87.
Would a lower dynamic tuning work to match the live algo?
Don't have the knowledge to use the Custom option.
Soulnight's tool uses a formula where 0-100 nits is always left uncompressed. This makes each target scale with the scene peak.

You can match the formula of the live algorithm by entering 1 into the no compression limit field under the Custom option.

Quote:
Originally Posted by noob00224 View Post
What is the min scene dur supposed to be?
It was set to 100 in the monitor tab and 0 in the PJ. Don't remember changing this value.

Can't search the thread with min scene dur, get results with just scene, how can searches be made with multiple words?
I'm not sure. I left the scene detection parameters at its defaults.
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post #3417 of 3714 Old 09-26-2019, 07:30 AM
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Quote:
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Let's see the screenshot of your HDR tab. What build you running? You sure you have "output video in HDR format" unchecked?
Thanks again for the help! Please see attached screenshot, as well as NVIDIA settings (and I have tried numerous driver builds and still happens). I am running madVR test build 86 (and this has been happening intermittently for a while, even before build 86). The "output video in HDR format" checkbox is definitely unchecked.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	madVR_HDR_Tab.jpg
Views:	29
Size:	200.8 KB
ID:	2620116   Click image for larger version

Name:	nVidia_Settings.jpg
Views:	31
Size:	109.5 KB
ID:	2620120  

Thanks!
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post #3418 of 3714 Old 09-26-2019, 07:49 AM
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Originally Posted by CoryW View Post
Thanks again for the help! Please see attached screenshot, as well as NVIDIA settings (and I have tried numerous driver builds and still happens). I am running madVR test build 86 (and this has been happening intermittently for a while, even before build 86). The "output video in HDR format" checkbox is definitely unchecked.
You have profiles in this area, therefore can you two more screenshots:
- One for the same screen you showed of madVR but in the 1080p profile,
- One for showing screen before this that has the script that determines when which profile is used

Also you say the problem is intermittent right? Notice in the screenshot you provided that the 2160p profile is bold? That means madVR thinks its active. When you reproduce the problem, can you load the ctrl+s screen and see what profile madVR thinks is active at that exact moment? Having a different profile active sometimes would at least explain the problem and the seemingly intermittent nature of it.

Video: JVC RS4500 135" screen in pure black room no light, htpc nvidia 1080ti.
Audio: Anthem mrx720 running 7.1.4, McIntosh MC-303, MC-152, B&W 802d3 LR, B&W HTM1D3 center, B&W 805d3 surround, B&W 702S2 rear, B&W 706s2 x 4 shelf mounted for atmos, 2 sub arrays both infinite baffle: 4x15 fi audio running on behringer ep4000 + 4x12 fi audio running on 2nd ep4000.
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post #3419 of 3714 Old 09-26-2019, 08:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Onkyoman View Post
What do you want to change? The targets for each scene are automatically created by a formula. If you changed the dynamic tuning, you would have to repopulate the entire measurement file because that information is fixed before playback.



Soulnight's tool uses a formula where 0-100 nits is always left uncompressed. This makes each target scale with the scene peak.

You can match the formula of the live algorithm by entering 1 into the no compression limit field under the Custom option.



I'm not sure. I left the scene detection parameters at its defaults.

Want to change the settings on the fly (dynamic tuning, no compression limit, and others), for testing, but with madvr knowing the file's info in advance.

What is the default scene detection settings, these ones? https://www.avsforum.com/forum/26-ho...l#post58393616


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Originally Posted by Onkyoman View Post
As a test case, I would create a measurement file external to Soulnight's tool by dragging and dropping the file onto madMeasureHDR and then optimize it with the dynamic clipping/dynamic target nits tool. The dynamic clipping feature is working much better with the measurement tool than the live tone mapping.
What dynamic clipping/target nits tool? pandm1967's tool?

Last edited by noob00224; 09-26-2019 at 08:15 AM.
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post #3420 of 3714 Old 09-26-2019, 09:02 AM
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Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
You have profiles in this area, therefore can you two more screenshots:
- One for the same screen you showed of madVR but in the 1080p profile,
- One for showing screen before this that has the script that determines when which profile is used

Also you say the problem is intermittent right? Notice in the screenshot you provided that the 2160p profile is bold? That means madVR thinks its active. When you reproduce the problem, can you load the ctrl+s screen and see what profile madVR thinks is active at that exact moment? Having a different profile active sometimes would at least explain the problem and the seemingly intermittent nature of it.

Sure thing. Here you go. Everything seems okay with all of this though.
Attached Thumbnails
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Thanks!
Cory
Audio: Ascend Acoustics, Sennheiser HD 598, Denon AVR-S710W
Video: JVC RS400, 92" DES Abyss screen, HTPC/RTX 2080/i7 8700k 4.9GHz/madVR, Panasonic DMP-UB900 for streaming
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