Guide: Building a 4K HTPC for madVR - Page 55 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1621 of 3486 Old 11-28-2018, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by audit13 View Post
Good luck.

Please report back with your findings.

As for the nVidia drivers, I'm using a very old driver version because the colour depth settings for 23 and 24 Hz keep reverting to 8 BPC from 12 BPC when the machine is rebotted.
I have received DP->HDMI adaptor and sound worked straight away, no settings required, finally playing Dolby Atmos, and others no problem. Thanks very much for help! Now with everything is finally setup, and lots of adapters used, I can sit down and enjoy the movie
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4K JVC DLA-X7900BE (RS540); 7.1 Audio: Atmos, DTS-HD, True-HD, Screen: Black Widow Dulux DS1 (on the wall); TV: 4K LG 55'
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post #1622 of 3486 Old 11-28-2018, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denisoftus View Post
I have received DP->HDMI adaptor and sound worked straight away, no settings required, finally playing Dolby Atmos, and others no problem. Thanks very much for help! Now with everything is finally setup, and lots of adapters used, I can sit down and enjoy the movie
That's great news Thanks for reporting back.
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post #1623 of 3486 Old 11-29-2018, 11:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noob00224 View Post
I swaped my components with others and found the issue: the CPU.
On Intel's website the model is listed as supporting x16 lanes:
PCI Express Configurations ‡ Up to 1x16, 2x8, 1x8+2x4
https://ark.intel.com/products/97143...ache-3-50-GHz-

I'm also in the process in upgrading the CPU and system board, probably the OS as well. Will post updates with how the 4K HDR 60fps samples are running.
Upgraded the cpu, system board and os to w10 x64. The card is now in x16 3.0. I can select dxva copy back2 and d3d11.
The 4K HDR 60fps samples work fine now.
Thanks guys.

Regarding a previous post, where the input was truehd and the output PCM (in lav audio status). Is this not what it's suposed to be? I have never seen anything else on my setup (xonar dgx + headphones)?
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post #1624 of 3486 Old 11-30-2018, 04:01 AM
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nothing wrong with PCM.
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post #1625 of 3486 Old 11-30-2018, 05:53 AM
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A lot wrong, DolbyAtmos and DTS:X are not decoded by PCM as it should be.


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post #1626 of 3486 Old 11-30-2018, 05:54 AM
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which is not really true and you should read his question.
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post #1627 of 3486 Old 11-30-2018, 05:59 AM
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I read it, and yes, it is wrong.
When I have the wrong settings playing a Dolby Atmos movie and my Yamaha gets a PCM signal, the Dolby Atmos stream is shown as 5.1.0 and not 5.1.4.
Only when switch back to bitstream and the output from LAV is TrueHD, then my Yamaha decodes the DolbyAtmos signal as 5.1.4.


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post #1628 of 3486 Old 11-30-2018, 06:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom886 View Post
I read it, and yes, it is wrong.
When I have the wrong settings playing a Dolby Atmos movie and my Yamaha gets a PCM signal, the Dolby Atmos stream is shown as 5.1.0 and not 5.1.4.
Only when switch back to bitstream and the output from LAV is TrueHD, then my Yamaha decodes the DolbyAtmos signal as 5.1.4.
Sometimes posts are far too brief and important details get lost... I think that what @mightyhuhn is trying to say is that in the context of how the other poster is using things, PCM is fine as Dolby Atmos and DTS:X aren't needed in his situation. But you are correct that if Dolby Atmos and/or DTS:X are important to you, then PCM would not be the correct output format and bitstream would be needed.
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post #1629 of 3486 Old 11-30-2018, 06:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom886 View Post
I read it, and yes, it is wrong.
so you just ignore the analogue soundcard and the headphones yes?
Quote:
When I have the wrong settings playing a Dolby Atmos movie and my Yamaha gets a PCM signal, the Dolby Atmos stream is shown as 5.1.0 and not 5.1.4.
i still don't see how a analogue soundcard cares?
Quote:
Only when switch back to bitstream and the output from LAV is TrueHD, then my Yamaha decodes the DolbyAtmos signal as 5.1.4.
it doesn't decode it to 5.1.4 or what ever it mixes the decoded PCM to that.
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post #1630 of 3486 Old 11-30-2018, 07:23 AM
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Haven't seen any analogue soundcard, sorry for that.
Still, coming back to your original statement

Quote:
Originally Posted by mightyhuhn View Post
nothing wrong with PCM.
I was referring to this.

You are right, in his case no choice, but as a generic statement I gave an generic feedback, because still think this could be misleading for others.


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post #1631 of 3486 Old 12-01-2018, 09:47 AM
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Hi, i'm looking for a card to my htpc to use madvr. I'm going to use it to improve 1080p vídeos and downscaling 4k vídeos with hdr to sdr conversion for a 1080p projector.

I've read here that amd cards have some issues but i don't know if it applies in what i want yo do.

What card would you recommend for my setup? (My budget is around 200$)

Thanks
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post #1632 of 3486 Old 12-01-2018, 02:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by albur View Post
Hi, i'm looking for a card to my htpc to use madvr. I'm going to use it to improve 1080p vídeos and downscaling 4k vídeos with hdr to sdr conversion for a 1080p projector.

I've read here that amd cards have some issues but i don't know if it applies in what i want yo do.

What card would you recommend for my setup? (My budget is around 200$)

Thanks
Personally, I would look for a 1060 3 GB as a starting point.
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post #1633 of 3486 Old 12-04-2018, 07:32 AM
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@Onkyoman

Do you think i'll be able to run drivers for WIn7 on Windows 8.1 with old motherboard MSI P45 Neo? While i'm waiting for my GTX1060 6GB i'm planing to reinstall the windows to win8 because its better OS for MAdVR. I just saw that there is no drivers for win8 from this mboard. What do you think?

JVC DLA-X35, 150" 2.35:1 Flat Screen
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post #1634 of 3486 Old 12-04-2018, 10:47 AM
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Is there any disadvantages on having an internal NAS drive in the HTPC box, as opposed to having the NAS drive in an external NAS?

I have a Netgear 102 which supports two 4TB drivers.
I only have one 4TB disc, and i'm debating between buying another 4TB disc, or just buy a 8TB NAS drive to place it inside the HTPC box.
I can only think of potential heat and noise, am i missing anything?

(I don't have an HTPC yet, i will start building the HTPC next month, after Christmas and new year holidays).
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post #1635 of 3486 Old 12-04-2018, 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by neo_2009 View Post
Is there any disadvantages on having an internal NAS drive in the HTPC box, as opposed to having the NAS drive in an external NAS?

I have a Netgear 102 which supports two 4TB drivers.
I only have one 4TB disc, and i'm debating between buying another 4TB disc, or just buy a 8TB NAS drive to place it inside the HTPC box.
I can only think of potential heat and noise, am i missing anything?

(I don't have an HTPC yet, i will start building the HTPC next month, after Christmas and new year holidays).
Performance wise, it really won't make a huge difference either way, especially if your network is hard wired and Gigabit. If you just want 1 or 2 drives, it may make sense to just stick them in the HTPC as long as the noise or heat from the drive(s) won't be an issue in the case and location you go with for the HTPC. My HTPC is in a Norco server case in the basement where noise and heat aren't an issue and has 16 drives plus a SSD for the OS in it.
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post #1636 of 3486 Old 12-04-2018, 01:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vao View Post
@Onkyoman

Do you think i'll be able to run drivers for WIn7 on Windows 8.1 with old motherboard MSI P45 Neo? While i'm waiting for my GTX1060 6GB i'm planing to reinstall the windows to win8 because its better OS for MAdVR. I just saw that there is no drivers for win8 from this mboard. What do you think?
It should work. I can't guarantee it.
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post #1637 of 3486 Old 12-04-2018, 02:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vao View Post
Do you think i'll be able to run drivers for WIn7 on Windows 8.1 with old motherboard MSI P45 Neo? While i'm waiting for my GTX1060 6GB i'm planing to reinstall the windows to win8 because its better OS for MAdVR. I just saw that there is no drivers for win8 from this mboard. What do you think?
You should be able to run Win10 using Win10's included chipset drivers.

I was running Win10 on an Asus P5W-DH and Asus P5Q for a while.
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post #1638 of 3486 Old 12-05-2018, 12:17 PM
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thanks to you both....
i'll give a try.
if not i'll back to win7 until upgrade the whole pc.

JVC DLA-X35, 150" 2.35:1 Flat Screen
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post #1639 of 3486 Old 12-07-2018, 01:17 PM
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I own a JVC X970R projector, and have been using the HDR curves you can load into the projector. On my screen, I get about 97 nits on my ~1200hr bulb. I might get 110 nits max on a new bulb. That's on high lamp. My image size is 138" scope screen (~110" 16:9). I have a 15' throw.

I've heard that building a HTPC and using MadVR allows me to get a big improvement over using the Manni's gamma curve way that I've been using up until now.

Is this still true? Would it likely yield a much better HDR result for my setup? If so, what kind of CPU and GPU do I need?

Also, and maybe more importantly, I have become a set it and forget it kind of person. I don't mind investing some time setting it all up and experimenting with the right settings, but I no longer have the time or the patience to spend with ongoing adjustments, etc.
I'd rather just keep using my existing method if that is what using MadVR would be like.

But if it can be setup with a day or two of tweaking at most, I'm all in - where do I start?
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post #1640 of 3486 Old 12-07-2018, 03:06 PM - Thread Starter
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I think the improvement from Manni's curves is moderate. In madVR language, that can mean a significant difference. Depends on how picky you are. Some that transition think madVR is too red in color. In reality, the JVC curves are handling some bright colors incorrectly and producing a cooler color tone. So madVR is more accurate in color compared to the current JVCs. I think it is also more detailed, but I haven't seen the custom curves to comment.

For support, I have produced two short tutorials on HDR to SDR that are reasonably easy to follow. When the new build is available, I will post them here. HDR to SDR with madVR does work best when you use MKV rips and not actual discs or ISOs because you can pre-measure all of your files with madMeasureHDR to create dynamic metadata. This allows you to select profiles to fit the brightness of each source. This is fairly similar to how Manni's curves work, but madVR relies on its own measurements instead of the MaxCLL or mastering display peak to select a curve.

I am also in the process of editing the entire madVR guide linked in the first post to move to AVS Forums. That should be a good resource when finally finished. If you're curious, I would avoid reading the first (devices/hdr) and last (settings) sections because I have edited those sections already, but can't update them until there is a new build. The rest of the intermediate sections are close to ready to move. I think the first and last sections are currently the worst and hardest to use.

Once you get everything set up, there isn't that much to configure. But you may find yourself adjusting things to your taste on a regular basis. I can't say you will never touch the control panel. This is more of a feature for tweakers, especially during the long development process.

The bigger issue is the matter of building a suitable PC and its expense. For tone mapping, you will want at least a GTX 1060 6GB. They may be expensive where you come from, not to mention the rest of the required parts.

Something to think about...
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Last edited by Onkyoman; 12-07-2018 at 03:14 PM.
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post #1641 of 3486 Old 12-08-2018, 08:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Onkyoman View Post
I think the improvement from Manni's curves is moderate. In madVR language, that can mean a significant difference. Depends on how picky you are. Some that transition think madVR is too red in color. In reality, the JVC curves are handling some bright colors incorrectly and producing a cooler color tone. So madVR is more accurate in color compared to the current JVCs. I think it is also more detailed, but I haven't seen the custom curves to comment.

For support, I have produced two short tutorials on HDR to SDR that are reasonably easy to follow. When the new build is available, I will post them here. HDR to SDR with madVR does work best when you use MKV rips and not actual discs or ISOs because you can pre-measure all of your files with madMeasureHDR to create dynamic metadata. This allows you to select profiles to fit the brightness of each source. This is fairly similar to how Manni's curves work, but madVR relies on its own measurements instead of the MaxCLL or mastering display peak to select a curve.

I am also in the process of editing the entire madVR guide linked in the first post to move to AVS Forums. That should be a good resource when finally finished. If you're curious, I would avoid reading the first (devices/hdr) and last (settings) sections because I have edited those sections already, but can't update them until there is a new build. The rest of the intermediate sections are close to ready to move. I think the first and last sections are currently the worst and hardest to use.

Once you get everything set up, there isn't that much to configure. But you may find yourself adjusting things to your taste on a regular basis. I can't say you will never touch the control panel. This is more of a feature for tweakers, especially during the long development process.

The bigger issue is the matter of building a suitable PC and its expense. For tone mapping, you will want at least a GTX 1060 6GB. They may be expensive where you come from, not to mention the rest of the required parts.

Something to think about...
Thanks for this, two questions:

1. The HTPC with that card while it's working a file I'm sure gets quite noisy (fan noise)? I wouldn't want that in my room where I'm trying to reduce noise (projector is bad enough).

2. Would the newer JVC projectors (I know no one has them yet and there is a delay) likely negate most of the benefits of MADvr with their tone mapping built in, etc.? I'm just deciding whether to pour money into an HTPC when in a year or two I may upgrade to one of the newer JVCs.
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post #1642 of 3486 Old 12-08-2018, 08:50 AM - Thread Starter
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1. It comes down to buying the right card. You don't have to push your card to the limit to use madVR. That is why I would recommend a GTX 1060.

Noise tests like these for the 1060 are worth consulting to buy a quieter card: https://us.hardware.info/reviews/713...d-temperatures.

It is unlikely you would notice the fan during video playback.

2. I would expect the next generation of JVC projectors will get the color right, but it won't offer anything but static tone mapping. madVR has already moved on to dynamic tone mapping. It also offers some processing to make the image sharper.

The new Sony HDR projectors are not a good indicator for current tone mapping quality with projectors. I saw a review where the reviewer recommended using a Panasonic Blu-ray player to handle tone mapping duties due to the inconsistency of the tone mapping from the projector. The Panasonic Blu-ray player and madVR are basically on the same level in terms of tone mapping quality. I think madVR is actually better at this point.

Hard to say without any reviews about the new JVC projectors...But I doubt it will do a BETTER job than madVR.

Last edited by Onkyoman; 12-18-2018 at 05:56 AM.
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post #1643 of 3486 Old 12-10-2018, 05:04 PM
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I'm getting some odd garbled/pixelated scenes in 4k movies here lately and I can't seem to figure out why. All my hardware and software is unchanged. I've been watching Mkv files off an external 4tb wd 2.5" HD (use it for portability reasons when I travel), perhaps it filling up is causing a slow down problem?

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

--------------------------------------------------
Source: HTPC w/madVR, Video: Epson 5040, 150" 16:9, Audio: Onkyo RZ 830 avr, 5.1.4 Atmos setup. 5 speaker Energy C Series: L/R C300's, C C-C100, SR/SL C50's, 4 in-ceiling Micca R-8c. Subwoofer: MiniMarty um18 w/NX3000D.
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post #1644 of 3486 Old 12-10-2018, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidinGA View Post
I'm getting some odd garbled/pixelated scenes in 4k movies here lately and I can't seem to figure out why. All my hardware and software is unchanged. I've been watching Mkv files off an external 4tb wd 2.5" HD (use it for portability reasons when I travel), perhaps it filling up is causing a slow down problem?

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I play 4k files off a 1 TB Seagate usb 2.0 drive that is over 97% full with no issues.
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post #1645 of 3486 Old 12-11-2018, 02:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidinGA View Post
I'm getting some odd garbled/pixelated scenes in 4k movies here lately and I can't seem to figure out why. All my hardware and software is unchanged. I've been watching Mkv files off an external 4tb wd 2.5" HD (use it for portability reasons when I travel), perhaps it filling up is causing a slow down problem?

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
If the video is simply dropping frames and the decoder queue in madVR is empty, it could be network latency.

However, if the image is corrupt, it is usually a problem with the file or media player. If you are using MPC-BE, try playing the same file with MPC-HC. You need to configure the internal copies of LAV Filters before playing anything with MPC-HC.

If both players show the same issue, try copying one of these movies to your PC and play it locally rather than off the hard drive.

You might need to replace the rip if something is wrong with the file. If the file plays locally, you might need to use some diagnostic software to check the health of your hard drive.
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post #1646 of 3486 Old 12-14-2018, 03:10 AM
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I would appreciate any help regarding the selection of a video card (or else I will be looking into other platforms, mainly firetv sitck 4k or apple tv 4k).

- My current PC system is based on biostar X370GT5-NF motherboard, ryzen 3 2200g cpu, geil evo potenza 2x4gb ram, windows 10 os.
- The audio/video setup is PC > Denon s730h > benq w1070 projector + 5.1.2 atmos speakers.

I will have a 4k projector in 10 days and below are my needs/wishes:

1. Netflix 4k HDR + atmos + if possible auto frame rate switching.
2. Able to play 4k HDR + pass through atmos (lossless) via hard disk (file sizes will be big so NTFS is required) - planning to use Kodi.
3. Able to use/play IPTV (windows store has some IPTV applications but couldn't find one which I like - just to mention).

Since (i) my mobo doesn't have hdmi 2.0 and (ii) raven ridge apu's still didn't get playready driver support, I am planning to buy a video card.

Just for above purposes which card would suffice (I am on a budget and thinking to get a RX 560 4gb but I am not sure whether it will deliver what I am after)?

Thanks!

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post #1647 of 3486 Old 12-14-2018, 05:15 AM - Thread Starter
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1. You could use the Windows Netflix app, but I think it sucks compared to one on the Apple TV 4K or Nvidia Shield.

2. The PC could do that. You might want to buy a GTX 1050 3GB or GTX 1050 Ti if you want to use madVR. The RX 560 is pretty slow by comparison. Kodi doesn't support HDR passthrough on Windows. You could Kodi as your front-end, but you would have to use a media player that supports madVR to play HDR content. Also, SMB sharing works fine on Windows for any type of file sharing.

madVR's HDR tone mapping is worth using if you own a projector. You could get this to work with a GTX 1050.

3. Kodi has some IPTV add-ons. So do most other media front-ends.

Neither the Firestick or Apple TV can do lossless Atmos passthrough. You'd have to look at the Shield TV for that. The PC isn't great for streaming apps, but it is good at playing lossless rips.
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post #1648 of 3486 Old 12-14-2018, 02:52 PM
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Is MadVR worth using for HDR over using the Panasonic 820's dynamic tone mapping when paired with a JVC projector (X970R)?
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post #1649 of 3486 Old 12-14-2018, 04:42 PM - Thread Starter
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In terms of tone mapping quality, they should be pretty similar. It's not like you need to sell your UB820 and build a PC. If you already have a capable PC, then why not? Eventually, madVR should have more customization and could distance itself more in terms of image quality.

Here is a comparison between the two from a group of guys in Germany (you might have to translate it English, not sure):

http://download.seven-c.de/files/uhd/hdrshootout2/

I've compared the scene with the golden stairs from Guardians of the Galaxy with the latest build of madVR, and the stairs look like the same bright gold as the Panansonic. So madVR has improved some since this comparison.
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post #1650 of 3486 Old 12-16-2018, 10:04 PM
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Hey guys, I'm experiencing a weird issue since upgrading my HTPC. I swapped out my Mobo and CPU last month, and ever since in very dark scenes with changing light conditions, the brightness of the TV's backlight jumps wildly and incredibly quickly, creating almost a strobe effect.


This happens in every movie I watch now, if not in the video, then as the credits are scrolling over a black background.

My TV is just a standard 1080p HDTV with no UHD (TV will be replaced in a couple months when my house is ready). I bought a new receiver at the same time, but took it out of the signal chain for this video to verify it's the output from the HTPC. I don't see this on any other input source. I've also updated the Intel video card drivers and the problem did not go away.

Anybody have any ideas what this could be? It's incredibly distracting.
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