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post #1 of 23 Old 02-12-2020, 06:02 PM - Thread Starter
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3D with MKV MVC files HTPC?

For those watching 3D MKV MVC files on a Windows 10 HTPC can you please advise what your setup is including display device, if you're using an A/V receiver, etc.?

I have an Epson 5040UB projector that has an HDMI 2.0 input and an HDMI 1.4 input. I also have a Denon X6300H A/V receiver and own the latest PowerDVD Ultra and a license for Windows 10.

On the HTPC I'd also like to be able to stream 4K HDR from Netflix/Disney+ etc. and play 4K UHD rips (MKV/M2TS) which I don't think will be a problem but I'm confused what I need in order to playback 3D MKV MVC files.

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post #2 of 23 Old 02-13-2020, 11:44 AM
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You don't seem to need anything else. If you can play UHD, then you should be able to play 3D too. You need an HDMI 1.4 chain, which you already do if you have HDMI 2.0. Of course, you need 3D glasses with the projector, whatever standard and adapter its manual specifies.
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post #3 of 23 Old 02-13-2020, 01:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roussi View Post
You don't seem to need anything else. If you can play UHD, then you should be able to play 3D too. You need an HDMI 1.4 chain, which you already do if you have HDMI 2.0. Of course, you need 3D glasses with the projector, whatever standard and adapter its manual specifies.
I don't have a video card yet. I was hoping to hear from people that have Windows 10 HTPCs and are playing 3D MKV MVC files and can explain their exact setup. Perhaps you can explain what you mean by HDMI 1.4 chain?
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post #4 of 23 Old 02-13-2020, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post
I don't have a video card yet. I was hoping to hear from people that have Windows 10 HTPCs and are playing 3D MKV MVC files and can explain their exact setup. Perhaps you can explain what you mean by HDMI 1.4 chain?
HDMI 1.4 chain means every component in the video chain - video card, AVR, display - is minimum HDMI 1.4 capable. I said that as I did not check your AVR. Any modern video card or Intel processor will do, especially one that can do UHD. The only non-trivial item is the software player, but you have that covered with PowerDVD.

For the UHD playback, it is more complicated, you have to read up.

My setups are AMD RX480 directly to UHD/3D TV (JS9000); and GT430 to an old Sony HDMI1.4 AVR to HT2150ST (edit: DLP 3D projector; PowerDVD on both).

Last edited by Roussi; 02-13-2020 at 03:08 PM.
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post #5 of 23 Old 02-13-2020, 05:25 PM
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Please correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Nvidia remove the 3dtv play on their drivers over a year ago? I think you have to use one of the first rtx drivers if you want to retain 3d playback in Windows.

Latley I just use a disc player for 3d. For 4K, makemkv to rip and playback with madvr, or if I don't rip then my Panny 820 disc player.

I also have a Epson pj (6050) and a Marantz AVR.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

Last edited by MMoser; 02-13-2020 at 05:36 PM.
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post #6 of 23 Old 02-13-2020, 09:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roussi View Post
HDMI 1.4 chain means every component in the video chain - video card, AVR, display - is minimum HDMI 1.4 capable. I said that as I did not check your AVR. Any modern video card or Intel processor will do, especially one that can do UHD. The only non-trivial item is the software player, but you have that covered with PowerDVD.

For the UHD playback, it is more complicated, you have to read up.

My setups are AMD RX480 directly to UHD/3D TV (JS9000); and GT430 to an old Sony HDMI1.4 AVR to HT2150ST (edit: DLP 3D projector; PowerDVD on both).
I pulled up some info on your graphics card and it says this:
With HDMI® 2.0b, DisplayPort™ 1.3 HBR3, and DisplayPort 1.4 HDR2support, the Radeon™ RX 480 graphics card will have you prepared for the new standard of display technologies.
I'm assuming each of those are a separate connector on the video card. So does that mean for watching 3D you use the DisplayPort 1.4 connector of your video card (with an adapter to HDMI) but for UHD file playback you use the HDMI 2.0b connector?
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post #7 of 23 Old 02-14-2020, 08:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post
I pulled up some info on your graphics card and it says this:
With HDMI® 2.0b, DisplayPort™ 1.3 HBR3, and DisplayPort 1.4 HDR2support, the Radeon™ RX 480 graphics card will have you prepared for the new standard of display technologies.
I'm assuming each of those are a separate connector on the video card. So does that mean for watching 3D you use the DisplayPort 1.4 connector of your video card (with an adapter to HDMI) but for UHD file playback you use the HDMI 2.0b connector?
HDMI 2.0 is backward compatible with (includes) 1.4. This is why if it can do UHD, then it can do 3D. I have the TV plugged into the HDMI; one of the DisplayPorts is used for HDMI1.4 adapter to a Rift.
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post #8 of 23 Old 02-14-2020, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by MMoser View Post
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Nvidia remove the 3dtv play on their drivers over a year ago? I think you have to use one of the first rtx drivers if you want to retain 3d playback in Windows.

[…]
Yes. I saw mentioned somewhere that you can install the 3D driver separately, together with the latest video driver.
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post #9 of 23 Old 02-14-2020, 02:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Roussi View Post
HDMI 2.0 is backward compatible with (includes) 1.4. This is why if it can do UHD, then it can do 3D. I have the TV plugged into the HDMI; one of the DisplayPorts is used for HDMI1.4 adapter to a Rift.
Thanks. It seems it's more complicated than that though. Here's an article I found: https://www.intel.com/content/www/us...s-drivers.html
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post #10 of 23 Old 02-14-2020, 03:37 PM
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Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post
Thanks. It seems it's more complicated than that though. Here's an article I found: https://www.intel.com/content/www/us...s-drivers.html
Oh, ok, didn't know about this (Intel dropping 3D support). My Cherry Trail tablet does 3D just fine. And a dedicated card, rather than Intel integrated, is more useful for UHD anyway.
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post #11 of 23 Old 03-04-2020, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Roussi View Post
Oh, ok, didn't know about this (Intel dropping 3D support). My Cherry Trail tablet does 3D just fine. And a dedicated card, rather than Intel integrated, is more useful for UHD anyway.
That's a strange article since all of their modern CPU's still support InTru 3D... maybe they are cautioning against assuming the board will attach HDMI port directly as opposed to splitting it off the DisplayPort.
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post #12 of 23 Old 03-04-2020, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by MMoser View Post
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Nvidia remove the 3dtv play on their drivers over a year ago? I think you have to use one of the first rtx drivers if you want to retain 3d playback in Windows.

Latley I just use a disc player for 3d. For 4K, makemkv to rip and playback with madvr, or if I don't rip then my Panny 820 disc player.

I also have a Epson pj (6050) and a Marantz AVR.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
That's correct, so I'm looking into madVR with Jriver front-end that according to their documentation can play 3D in HW agnostic manner without the need for nVidia 3D-vision drivers. I'm going to test using an RTX 2020 with current drivers to see if that's actually possibly.
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post #13 of 23 Old 03-05-2020, 09:11 AM
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Just updating this. I tested with madVR and Jriver MC front-end using RTX2080 and I did need to install the last (April 2019) 3D Vision driver from nVidia. 3D MVC frame packing using ISO or folder structure works like a charm. I have an Epson PJ, Denon AVR, and some XPAND RF glasses.

nVidia made a garbage move in dropping the 3D Vision support for what appears to be thin reasoning.
Intel UHD/Iris 3D support is good to go for HDMI 1.4, but spotty for HDMI 2.0 depending on the board implementation?
I will test AMD Radeon soon and see if that's a viable option.

I realize 3D is fading out but it's so freaking awesome on a PJ. Can't let it go just yet!
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post #14 of 23 Old 03-05-2020, 12:34 PM
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Thanks for the update! My setup is similar to yours, Epson, Denon, Xpand. Was the only way you got 3D drivers to work was by using the older April 2019 driver?

I heard there was a work-around to use the latest drivers by patching the 3D back in.

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post #15 of 23 Old 03-05-2020, 12:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by henkeli View Post
Just updating this. I tested with madVR and Jriver MC front-end using RTX2080 and I did need to install the last (April 2019) 3D Vision driver from nVidia. 3D MVC frame packing using ISO or folder structure works like a charm. I have an Epson PJ, Denon AVR, and some XPAND RF glasses.

nVidia made a garbage move in dropping the 3D Vision support for what appears to be thin reasoning.
Intel UHD/Iris 3D support is good to go for HDMI 1.4, but spotty for HDMI 2.0 depending on the board implementation?
I will test AMD Radeon soon and see if that's a viable option.

I realize 3D is fading out but it's so freaking awesome on a PJ. Can't let it go just yet!

Hi. where did you get this 3d vision driver - link? Is it separate from nvidia card drivers (that cannot be reverted - i have 2080 super)


Also - any link to jriver steps on this? Thanks!

Some guy
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post #16 of 23 Old 03-06-2020, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by MMoser View Post
Thanks for the update! My setup is similar to yours, Epson, Denon, Xpand. Was the only way you got 3D drivers to work was by using the older April 2019 driver?

I heard there was a work-around to use the latest drivers by patching the 3D back in.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
Yes, had to install those drivers and turn on 3D-Vision from the nVidia Control Panel. Then, the toggle switch for 3D Display appeared in the Windows 10 "Display Settings"

You can have madVR auto switch that toggle when 3D content is played, and vice versa.

I read through that workaround to slipstream the driver into current releases but I want something more officially supported so I am not going to buy nVidia for my HTPC build.
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post #17 of 23 Old 03-06-2020, 09:24 AM
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Originally Posted by steevo123 View Post
Hi. where did you get this 3d vision driver - link? Is it separate from nvidia card drivers (that cannot be reverted - i have 2080 super)


Also - any link to jriver steps on this? Thanks!
I cannot post links yet due to being new here, but you can search for the driver and nVidia has a page or two dedicated to explaining that you can keep using the driver but they will not be supporting it past April 2020. The driver was released in April 2019 and it does show that RTX 20-series are applicable. It is just a normal driver install but it's from last year, and includes the 3D-Vision driver in the list of options still. You can always just install the current drivers at any time. There's no impact to the HW.

Likewise, just go to the Jriver wiki and look under Blu Ray -> 3D support and there is a link to their forum thread where they explain what to do. Essentially you have to get 3D Vision up and running in nVidia Control Panel and then check to see that Windows 10 "Display Settings" has a toggle for 3D. The thread explains what to do for the settings in madVR and Jriver MC.
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post #18 of 23 Old 03-06-2020, 09:41 AM
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OK - very good news!

I swapped out my RTX2080 with an RX 580 GPU to test things out.
I let Windows 10 pull a driver for the card, and by default the Windows 10 "Display Settings" had the 3D toggle switch. Yessss.

So everything just werkt and I can play all my 3D MKV, ISO, and BDMV in all their frame-packing glory.

I have since installed the current AMD drivers and everything still works great. I will be building out the rest of my new HTPC with a Ryzen 5 3600 (I guess the 2600 is getting hard to find in stock now), a B450 ITX board, and the RX 580.

madVR only really uses the GPU 3D processing, it does not use hardly any GDDR for my setup. With Jriver Red October HQ on, display quality set to High, and the default madVR settings I am seeing the following resource loads:

+ Blu Ray 1080P = ~20% GPU usage, no GPU fans need to activate, temps around 40 deg
+ Blu Ray 1080P 3D MVC = ~30% GPU usage, no GPU fans need to activate, temps around 40 to 45 deg
+ 4K UHD HDR10/HDR10+/DolbyVision source file = ~40% to 50% GPU usage, still no GPU fans, temps around 45 deg

If I apply certain image enhancements like compression artifacts and noise reduction then the GPU spikes to like 99%. So they get left off. There's only a light resource penalty for most of the other things if I were to want them.

madVR is just too cool for school. It applies tone mapping for my 4K UHD source files even though I use an Epson 2150 1080P PJ. Looks great!
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post #19 of 23 Old 03-27-2020, 01:48 PM
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I got 3D working again with the help of Robert256 from the mtbs3d forum. I am on 442.74 with my 1050 TI card. Just download BringBack3DV.zip and follow inside instructions.
https://www.mtbs3d.com/phpBB/viewtop...168206#p168206

PS: 3D movies works for me only with Powerdvd and sadly not with MPC-BE.
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post #20 of 23 Old 04-02-2020, 01:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post
For those watching 3D MKV MVC files on a Windows 10 HTPC can you please advise what your setup is including display device, if you're using an A/V receiver, etc.?
Hi WynsWrld98,

I just want to share my setup since I frequently play MKV 3D (either side by side or over-under) files from my PC. I don't use projector but LG 3D TV as my PC monitor.

PC :
Ryzen 5 2400G with integrated Radeon RX Vega 11 Graphics
(before I use Intel i5 with integrated HD4600 Graphics)
I never use a dedicated Graphic card.

For the 3D mkv player, I have Media Player Classic Home Cinema (MPC-HC) installed on the PC.
And I use ffdshow video and ffdshow audio for the codec.

The connection :
PC HDMI-out to 3D TV HDMI-in
3D TV optical audio out to A/V receiver optical audio in.

In ffdshow audio setting, I set the audio pass-through feature as the 3D movies mostly with DTS or DD.
In ffdshow video setting for the subtitle I choose "stereoscopic" placement, so if the 3D movie is side by side, the subtitle show both on the left side and right side in MPC HC player.

So, I think there is no 3D video processing at all by the PC but the LG 3D TV who do the process.
When I play the 3D mkv movie, MPC-HC (with ffdshow codec) show two images, left and right (and left and right subtitle if any). I make it full screen display, then I turn on the 3D feature button on the 3D TV, now the image is a whole (not separated left and right anymore) but blurry as we need the 3D glasses to see that "emulated" left and right images into one. And the DTS/DD audio of the 3D mkv file is processed by my A/V receiver.

That's all of my setup.
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post #21 of 23 Old 04-02-2020, 01:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by reko tomo View Post
Hi WynsWrld98,

I just want to share my setup since I frequently play MKV 3D (either side by side or over-under) files from my PC. I don't use projector but LG 3D TV as my PC monitor.

PC :
Ryzen 5 2400G with integrated Radeon RX Vega 11 Graphics
(before I use Intel i5 with integrated HD4600 Graphics)
I never use a dedicated Graphic card.

For the 3D mkv player, I have Media Player Classic Home Cinema (MPC-HC) installed on the PC.
And I use ffdshow video and ffdshow audio for the codec.

The connection :
PC HDMI-out to 3D TV HDMI-in
3D TV optical audio out to A/V receiver optical audio in.

In ffdshow audio setting, I set the audio pass-through feature as the 3D movies mostly with DTS or DD.
In ffdshow video setting for the subtitle I choose "stereoscopic" placement, so if the 3D movie is side by side, the subtitle show both on the left side and right side in MPC HC player.

So, I think there is no 3D video processing at all by the PC but the LG 3D TV who do the process.
When I play the 3D mkv movie, MPC-HC (with ffdshow codec) show two images, left and right (and left and right subtitle if any). I make it full screen display, then I turn on the 3D feature button on the 3D TV, now the image is a whole (not separated left and right anymore) but blurry as we need the 3D glasses to see that "emulated" left and right images into one. And the DTS/DD audio of the 3D mkv file is processed by my A/V receiver.

That's all of my setup.
I create my MKV files with MakeMkv and I believe they are frame packed which is higher resolution than SBS? I'm still trying to learn all of this.
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post #22 of 23 Old 04-02-2020, 11:12 PM
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Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post
I create my MKV files with MakeMkv and I believe they are frame packed which is higher resolution than SBS?
What I found from the internet, yes .. the frame packed is higher resolution than SBS.

I think the option like this :
A. if the user want a full-frame 3D resolution, then it needs a 3D "frame-packed" video format, player which support "frame-packed" format, dedicated GPU which support to process 3D "frame-packed" video and at least 1.4 HDMI cable connection. If these all meet the criteria, when played by the computer, the 3D projector (or the 3D TV) will automatically recognize that the inputted video is 3D "frame-packed".

B. if the user doesn't mind to have a half resolution (SBS or OU) 3D video display, then it's more simple. The setup like mine is doable .

Quote:
I'm still trying to learn all of this
Me too

Thank you.
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post #23 of 23 Old 04-02-2020, 11:26 PM
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Sorry I forgot to ask....

Quote:
Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post
I'm still trying to learn all of this.
Do you intentionally want to have MKV file from the Bluray disk? Such as (maybe) to reduce file size.

If not, have you tried to just make an iso file from the Bluray disk ?
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