ATI HDTV Wonder: Step-by-Step WMCE - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 162 Old 02-28-2005, 07:36 PM - Thread Starter
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In another thread, we think we've come up with a step-by-step guide for a successful installation of the ATI HDTV Wonder hd tv tuner card and another analog tv tuner in Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005.

A few caveats: (1) the procedure assumes a new installation of Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005 on a clean hard drive, (2) the procedure does not apply to a plain Windows XP installation, (3) you will use the latest applicable Windows Updates and drivers, and (4) it is essential that you install a DVD decoder like Nvidia's DVD decoder.

Also, we strongly recommend that you properly analyze your antenna requirements before hand. See AntennaWeb.org and CheckHD.com.

1. Install Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005 without the tv tuner cards. Do the Windows Update. Don't go into MCE to setup TV yet, of course.
2. Install the HDTV Rollup update from Microsoft, if not previously installed
3. Install the analog TV tuner drivers. Shutdown.
4. Physically install the analog TV tuner in the PCI slot. Restart. Check Device Manager
5. Install the HDTV Wonder driver from ATI. Shutdown.
6. Physically install the ATI card in a PCI slot
5. ReStart. The card gets detected and set up automatically. Check Device Manager.
6. Launch MCE and setup TV channels that you want; you need an internet connection.

See our friend "psxjunky" #2 message below for additional important information.

Briefly, the ATI HDTV Wonder will not work in WMCE without the presence of an analogue TV tuner with hardware MPEG encoding unless you use the so-called Kram drivers. The Kram drivers are a hacked version of ATI's Catalyst drivers, the WMCE portion of which is used to make the ATI HDTV Wonder work. However, there are reports that the quality of the TV from the analogue part of the HDTV Wonder is not very good. As this software is not official, you are generally on your own as to getting them to work.

The ATI HDTV Wonder and the Avermedia AverTVHD MCE A180 are presently the only two HD tuners that have been certified for the WMCE "Logo". However, there are other HD tuners that work in WMCE that are not on the certififed "logo" list. For instance, Dvico reports that it's FusionHDTV model works, and has WMCE drivers and instructions on its website.

The ATI HDTV Wonder, the Avermedia AverTVHD MCE A180, and the FusionHDTV will not work in WMCE unless there is also present an analogue tuner with hardware MPEG encoding. As far as we know, there are no hacked drivers like Kram's for the Fusion and Aver cards that will make them work in WMCE without an analogue tuner.

Notes: you can get away with physically installing the analog TV card as you are installing Windows MCE. We don't think it will cause an issue. It is essential that you install a DVD decoder like Nvidia's decoders.

Microsoft says that unofficially Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005 does not support two HD tuners. Like several other users, I can verify that two HD tuners does work in WMCE 2005. I have installed and working an ATI HDTV Wonder and an AverTVHD MCE A180. Two HD tuners makes possible recording two HD programs simultaneously.

A USB analogue TV tuner will serve these purposes as well as a PCI analogue tv card. Hauppauge's USB2 tuner is an example. After setting up the channels in WMCE, you can remove the analogue tuner.

Lastly, your best MCE pc system design is one for a high performance computer. Trying to do this on the cheap or with spare pc parts will increase your risk of a poorly performing system or of outright failure. After all, you will be processing video in all its forms. MS's and ATI's recommended (not minimum) system requirements are good starts.

We do not guarantee that the above procedure will work for you or with all system configurations. We are volunteers, not paid by anyone, and have no connections with Microsoft, ATI, or any other company. To the extent copyright laws are applicable, I grant a non-exclusive right to all individuals for private copying and use. There are no warranties of any kind, and where an express or implied warranty may apply, total damages shall be limited to one centUSA. In other words, use the above at your own risk.

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post #2 of 162 Old 02-28-2005, 09:54 PM
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Thanks for taking the time to put this together, GeekFunk ! This guide should help anyone trying to get started with MCE 2005 and ATI HDTV Wonder.

I wanted to add a couple points to make this guide even more helpful.

1. MCE HDTV Update Rollup 1 can be found here

2. If you do plan on using an analog tuner with MCE, take note that MCE only supports analog tuners which can do hardware based MPEG2 encoding. Some examples of these types of cards are - Hauppauge WinTV PVR series (models 150, 150MCE, 250, 250MCE, 350, 500MCE, USB2 etc.), AVerMedia M1500, ATI E-Home Wonder, eVGA NVTV etc. If you already have an analog TV tuner card and not sure if it supports hardware based encoding, look at its specification and ask here. If you are planning to buy a new analog TV tuner, consider the Hauppauge cards - they are most well known and widely supported. You may also want to look at the new ATI Theater 550 based cards (e.g. ATI TV Wonder Elite)

3. If you are already planning to use MCE 2005 with the ATI HDTV Wonder, do NOT bother about installing ANY of ATI's own software (MultiMedia Center, DTV app, GuidePlus etc.). In fact, do not even touch the CD that comes with the ATI HDTV Wonder card. Specifically, DO NOT install the HDTV Wonder driver that is on the CD ... most likely it is an older version that will cause you a great deal of heartache. Instead just download the latest Windows MCE driver for the HDTV Wonder from ATI (check here or get the latest download (as of Feb 09, 2005) from here). Install *JUST* the HDTV Wonder driver ... no other ATI software.

Note: The only exception to this would be the ATI DVD Decoder, which you may want to install (and will need the original CD if you want to do so). However, you will be better off with the NVIDIA DVD Decoder anyway (which you can find here

4. When Windows MCE starts up after following all the steps mentioned above in the guide, use the setup wizard (or go into Settings->TV->Setup TV Signal to setup the analog channels and Settings->TV->Setup Digital TV Signal to set up the HD channels)

Good luck and post a question here if you run into any issues !
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post #3 of 162 Old 02-28-2005, 10:36 PM
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Everyone but me may already know this but I just found this out:

MCE will not work with ONLY the ATI HDTV Wonder installed.

There must be a supported analog tuner installed or you won't get past Settings->TV.
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post #4 of 162 Old 03-01-2005, 08:42 AM - Thread Starter
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psxjunky

Thanks.

But, everyone should know that you have provided the most important part to this procedure, and everyone should be grateful to you for that.

warloadbb - you're right, but there are privately developed drivers, called Kram drivers, for the HDTV Wonder that will cause the HDTV Wonder to run without the presence of an analog tv tuner in WMC. Of course, we are not dealing with that procedure here, and it makes the installation more complicated.

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post #5 of 162 Old 03-01-2005, 09:42 AM
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Wow, good info. I was about to get an HDTV Wonder card for my new MCE 2k5 machine as the only tuner card installed. I guess I'll get me an SD card first and then add the HDTV Wonder card.

Good info!

I am on acquisition mode...
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post #6 of 162 Old 03-01-2005, 09:53 AM
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If you check around the posts here you'll find a FIX to allow you to use ONLY the ATI HDTV Wonder card with MCE - using it as both the Analog and Digital tuners. Just use the search option!
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post #7 of 162 Old 03-01-2005, 01:45 PM
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If someone, who is using ONLY the ATI HDTV Wonder in MCE 2005 (without using an SD card as well), is reading this post - could you please let us know the step-by-step procedure of how to get this done.

I have seen this question asked many times (How do I use JUST the ATI card without using an analog tuner ?), so having this information captured in this installation guide will be very useful. I am sure this information is burried somewhere deep in the huge ATI thread, but given that this is such a common question, having it here separately makes sense.
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post #8 of 162 Old 03-02-2005, 12:17 AM
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I followed this procedure exactly, including not touching the HDTV's install CD.

I have:

Settings->TV->Setup TV Signal

but I DON'T have:

Settings->TV->Setup Digital TV Signal

Everything looks great in Device Manager.

I have no idea what to try as far as troubleshooting.
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post #9 of 162 Old 03-02-2005, 12:34 AM
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Wow. Ok, I wasn't bothering to fully setup Settings->TV->Setup TV Signal for my analog (via Theatrix 550).

Now that I have, I've now got Settings->TV->Setup DIGITAL TV Signal!

I DID go through the analog setup enough to get no signal on Antenna settings. Apparently MCE detected that I wasn't getting any signal on my analog and so wasn't letting me setup my Digital.

WEIRD.
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post #10 of 162 Old 03-02-2005, 02:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Warlordbb

So, you're saying it works?

Glad to hear it.

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post #11 of 162 Old 03-02-2005, 02:42 PM
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vpersaud,

Don't mean to impose. Can you can point us directly to the link where we use only the ATI HDTV wonder exclusively?

The whole issue about the ATI HDTV Wonder is sooooooooooooooo long, you can get lost in it!

Thanks
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post #12 of 162 Old 03-02-2005, 03:23 PM - Thread Starter
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The Kram modification of the Catalyst drivers will get the HDTV Wonder going in MCE without the presence of an analog TV tuner.

From another forum:

http://www.whatsnsb.com/MCE4.10kv.zip

This is download of the Kram drivers. I haven't used them myself as I have analog tuner.

New Box: One Fusion 5 RT Gold and a Powercolor Theater 550 Pro in microBTX system
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post #13 of 162 Old 03-02-2005, 04:08 PM
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Reading up on it, looks like ony Kram can make it work without an analog tuner.

I don't have the luxury of plugging in another analog tuner.

My Asus P5AD2 Premium Motherboard only has two PCI slots. One slot is taken by my sound card and the other one the HDTV Wonder.
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post #14 of 162 Old 03-02-2005, 04:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Andaleon

Dang, man. Your Asus P6AD2 motherboard has a helfire onboard 8-channel producing audio chpset.

This is how it is described on Asus's website:

"Enjoy high-end sound system on your PC! The onboard 8-channel HD audio (High Definition Audio, previously codenamed Azalia) CODEC enables high-quality 192KHz/24-bit audio output, jack-sensing feature, retasking functions and multi-streaming technology that simultaneously sends different audio streams to different destinations. You can now talk to your partners on the headphone while playing a multi-channel network games. All of these are done on one computer. The Dolby Digital Live technology from Dolby Lab encodes the multi-channel audio source into AC-3 bit-stream and outputs it to S/PDIF port in real time"

I'd say, dump that PCI sound card.

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post #15 of 162 Old 03-02-2005, 04:52 PM
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Thanks for the input GeekFunk.

However, the M-Audio Delta Audiophile 102 "DOES" sound much better than the internal audio of the Asus P5AD2.

They can give me all the reviews they want. I am talking based on what I hear. And sounding good is very important to me..

Thanks......
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post #16 of 162 Old 03-02-2005, 05:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Cool.

Is that your room in the link?

New Box: One Fusion 5 RT Gold and a Powercolor Theater 550 Pro in microBTX system
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post #17 of 162 Old 03-05-2005, 01:59 PM - Thread Starter
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I just edited the procedure to add that you need an internet connection during the set up of the channels in WMCE.

New Box: One Fusion 5 RT Gold and a Powercolor Theater 550 Pro in microBTX system
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post #18 of 162 Old 03-05-2005, 04:36 PM
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So will this kind of process work for the Fusion tuner, too?
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post #19 of 162 Old 03-05-2005, 05:19 PM - Thread Starter
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S Griffin

I believe it will, although I haven't tried it.

If someone will send me a FusionHDTV card, I'll run it through the procedure and report back here on the results.

However, go to the Dvico website, review the FAQs there, and you'll probably run across an anwer that includes a similar WMCE install procedure for the Fusion card.

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post #20 of 162 Old 03-05-2005, 05:48 PM
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Thanks. I found some information on their site. They do say that an analog tuner needs to be installed first. Unfortunately, their KB states that MCE doesn't support a QAM HDTV tuner.
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post #21 of 162 Old 03-05-2005, 06:01 PM
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bump
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post #22 of 162 Old 03-05-2005, 08:15 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by GeekFunk
Cool.

Is that your room in the link?

Yes that's my set-up, although I'm in the process of changing the Krell FPB-300Cx amp to Pass Labs X-600 monoblocks.

The DWIN DLP is also going. A Sony Qualia is taking its place.
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post #23 of 162 Old 03-05-2005, 10:02 PM
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GeekFunk,

Thank you for the detailed instructions, they work like a charm.

All,

I have continually had problems with MCE 2005 abrubtly exiting when changing HDTV channels. I never see this when I am changing analog channels.

I am using:

Hauppage WINTV150 board with the latest MCE drivers from their web site.
Radeon 9700 with the latest MCE drivers from the ATI web site
ATI HDTV Wonder with the latest MCE driver from the ATI web site
My mother board is an ASUS P4C800 Deluxe
SATA Hard drive
Intervideo Windvd 6 Platinum for the MPEG2 Decoders

I just did a bare metal rebuild using GeekFunk's directions, and I only put on the MCE drivers for all of the hardware.

Has anyone else had this problem, if so did you resolve it and if you resolved it how did you resolve it. I have rebuilt this PC about 6 times now, trying various combinations trying to get this issue resolved.

Thank you
Bryan
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post #24 of 162 Old 03-06-2005, 12:50 AM
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Bryan - may be you could try a different MPEG2 decoder ? You can download a trial version of the NVIDIA DVD Decoder here ... this is officially supported by Windows MCE.


Also, do you have any HDTV channels enabled in MCE for which you do NOT get a strong enough signal ?

What happens when you just try to play a single HD channel with good signal ? Does that play fine ?
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post #25 of 162 Old 03-06-2005, 01:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally posted by bgarcia
GeekFunk,

Thank you for the detailed instructions, they work like a charm.

All,

I have continually had problems with MCE 2005 abrubtly exiting when changing HDTV channels. I never see this when I am changing analog channels.

I am using:

Hauppage WINTV150 board with the latest MCE drivers from their web site.
Radeon 9700 with the latest MCE drivers from the ATI web site
ATI HDTV Wonder with the latest MCE driver from the ATI web site
My mother board is an ASUS P4C800 Deluxe
SATA Hard drive
Intervideo Windvd 6 Platinum for the MPEG2 Decoders

I just did a bare metal rebuild using GeekFunk's directions, and I only put on the MCE drivers for all of the hardware.

Has anyone else had this problem, if so did you resolve it and if you resolved it how did you resolve it. I have rebuilt this PC about 6 times now, trying various combinations trying to get this issue resolved.

Thank you
Bryan

bgarcia

Thanks for your kind words.


As for your specific problem, I have not seen anyone report a similar issue in the forums that I've been tracking.

So, it may be something that is unique to your system.

When you say 'abrubtly exiting" when you change a HD channel, do you mean that the Media Center shell shuts down, leaving you with a Windows XP desktop?

New Box: One Fusion 5 RT Gold and a Powercolor Theater 550 Pro in microBTX system
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post #26 of 162 Old 03-06-2005, 01:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by bgarcia
GeekFunk,

Thank you for the detailed instructions, they work like a charm.

All,

I have continually had problems with MCE 2005 abrubtly exiting when changing HDTV channels. I never see this when I am changing analog channels.

I am using:

Hauppage WINTV150 board with the latest MCE drivers from their web site.
Radeon 9700 with the latest MCE drivers from the ATI web site
ATI HDTV Wonder with the latest MCE driver from the ATI web site
My mother board is an ASUS P4C800 Deluxe
SATA Hard drive
Intervideo Windvd 6 Platinum for the MPEG2 Decoders

I just did a bare metal rebuild using GeekFunk's directions, and I only put on the MCE drivers for all of the hardware.

Has anyone else had this problem, if so did you resolve it and if you resolved it how did you resolve it. I have rebuilt this PC about 6 times now, trying various combinations trying to get this issue resolved.

Thank you
Bryan

I have same problem with my Fusion II card. Whenever I change to CBS channel while it broadcasts HDTV program, MCE2k5 just exits. I don't have this problem with ABC and NBC.
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post #27 of 162 Old 03-06-2005, 08:54 PM
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GeekFunk,

Yes, When sometimes when I change channels the MCE shell exits, and I find my self back at the XP desktop, and sometimes I get the critical error popup where it gives me an opportunity to report the problem to Mickey Soft.

Thx
Bryan
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post #28 of 162 Old 03-06-2005, 09:13 PM
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With only limited testing, it appears that replacing the Intervideo decoder with the Nvidia decoder may have solved my problem. I will do some more testing, over the next few days, but with about 15 minutes of continious channel changing I did not have one exit from Media Center.

Thank you to all for the help.

Bryan
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post #29 of 162 Old 03-09-2005, 02:03 PM - Thread Starter
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I just watched a Microsoft Webcast for OEMs about the Media Center Extenders. There was a keen interest in HDTV and WMCE. One questioner asked about ATI's HDTV card.
Well, wouldn't you know it, the MS presenter confused things further. He tried to clarify the difference between the ATI All-in Wonder and the ATI HDTV All-in-Wonder, which of course is non-existent.
It is my view that HDTV is going to be the "Must Have" home technology of 2005, and aWindows XP Media Center Edition 2005 computer will be high on the list of "must have" Christmas gifts.
Yet, I don't know of any OEMs or vendors who are selling WMCE boxes with an ATI HDTV Wonder.
Someone's going to recognize this need, and fulfill this market demand.

New Box: One Fusion 5 RT Gold and a Powercolor Theater 550 Pro in microBTX system
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post #30 of 162 Old 03-10-2005, 06:36 PM
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Brian,

Did you ever resolve your problem?

I am having a similar problem with MCE freezing when changing between HD channels.

I have also rebuilt my system and I tried different decoders/ sound cards etc.

Thanks for any suggestions!

md
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