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post #4411 of 4451 Old 06-14-2019, 10:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by six_rabbits View Post
...

BTW, this PC runs 24/7... isn't this required to schedule/execute the HDHomeRun captures?
...
If everything is set up properly the HTPC will Hibernate until the next scheduled capture or I start the HTPC to view a capture. Set "Wake Lead Time" to 90 seconds or more as needed by right clicking a HDHR tuner in CW_EPG options.

At least that's how mine operates and has do so for many years.

It is set to hibernate after 10 minutes of no activity so if I walk away I usually start a FM station to play or a shuffled list of music to play. If I forget it goes into hibernation. With a smart Power Strip the HDHR tuners are also powered down, as least that is how Terry's system was reported to operate in past years.

SHF
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post #4412 of 4451 Old 06-15-2019, 01:20 AM - Thread Starter
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Stephen, Six_Rabbits is using the new CWHelper, which works just fine with the latest SiliconDust Windows software and any HDHR tuner. If you don't use the new CWHelper, then you either have to use older SiliconDust software or (as you describe) use the CW_EPG Options right-click channel scan to create CW_EPG channel lists with rf frequencies and protocols included. However, this is a red herring to the present question, because, in either case, the FusionHDTV interface is the same.

Six, thanks for your additional research. I'm happy to work with you to sort this out and I hope that we can thereby figure out a more reliable interface. (But, as Stephen mentioned, it's not unknown for FusionHDTV to fall over all by itself without CW_EPG's help)

There has been no change in the CW_EPG (actually CWHelper) FusionHDTV interface since it was introduced, so changing versions would not help. If you're seeing differences between the XP and W7 systems they're likely because of the different OS-Fusion interactions. In that regard, there is a very important point that I forgot to mention before (because it's been years since I did this myself). In W7, assuming that you haven't completely disabled UAC, you must set the security permissions on the FusionHDTV program folder to allow "everybody" Full Access. The reason for that is that FusionHDTV (regrettably) stores its data files in that same folder and by default W7 (and newer Ws) copies them into and out of a shadow "VirtualStore" folder that it masquerades as the program folder. This causes enormous confusion in cases such as this where more than one app is accessing the same file and may actually be part of your database error issue. The Full Access setting keeps the OS from performing this "magic" and makes things work the same as in XP.

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post #4413 of 4451 Old 06-15-2019, 01:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post
If everything is set up properly the HTPC will Hibernate until the next scheduled capture or I start the HTPC to view a capture. Set "Wake Lead Time" to 90 seconds or more as needed by right clicking a HDHR tuner in CW_EPG options.

At least that's how mine operates and has do so for many years.

It is set to hibernate after 10 minutes of no activity so if I walk away I usually start a FM station to play or a shuffled list of music to play. If I forget it goes into hibernation. With a smart Power Strip the HDHR tuners are also powered down, as least that is how Terry's system was reported to operate in past years.

SHF
Yes, I have several test systems and all are set up as Stephen describes using smart strips to power everything down whenever the PC is not setting up captures, capturing, or playing them back. IMO no HTPC should be running 24/7.

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post #4414 of 4451 Old 06-15-2019, 07:34 PM
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Hi Terry,

I've tried a bunch of things, taking notes along the way. That process is the numbered list attached. Executive summary: nothing I tried has helped. Details are in the attachment.
-- Sharing Fusion's folder in Program Files
-- Rolling back CW_EPG 4.3.1 to 4.2.1 but keeping CwHelper 4.3.0.606
-- With CW_EPG 4.2.1, rolling back CwHelper 4.3.0.606 to 4.0.8.508
-- Near step 27 in the attachment, the connection between Fusion and CW EPG broke.
-- Was unable to fix, so removed Fusion software.
-- Even without Fusion software, CW EPG was unsuccessful in scheduling HDHomeRun

Finally, the best I could hope for was to get back to my previous functionality. I restored the C: drive to its previous backup point from before the Fusion card and software was installed. I'm now back where I started and HDHomeRun scheduling is working again, using CW EPG 4.3.1 and CwHelper 4.3.0.606.

Do you have any ideas regarding what I might try next?

Thanks!
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post #4415 of 4451 Old 06-15-2019, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by six_rabbits View Post
..
Do you have any ideas regarding what I might try next?

Thanks!
Should Terry be off on one of his round the Earth trips I do have a plan to get you to a stable state with CW_EPG using just your HDHR tuners.

I will wait for his response or if you wish guide you into the CW_EPG I have in heavy active use being CW_EPG's stress tester.

SHF
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post #4416 of 4451 Old 06-15-2019, 11:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by six_rabbits View Post
I've tried a bunch of things, taking notes along the way.
Excellent work, thanks. I think that this may be your misstep:
Quote:
-- Sharing Fusion's folder in Program Files
You need to eliminate Windows VirtualStore action on that folder, not "share" it. The way to do that is to go to the Security properties in Windows Explorer (see my attached illustration of the correct settings). After you've made that change to the folder's Security settings, search for "VirtualStore" folders and delete any FusionHDTV subfolders before restarting the PC.

As I wrote earlier there's been no change in CW_EPG(CWHelper) interactions with FusionHDTV since the first public release supporting it, so changing CW_EPG or CWHelper versions will only coincidentally change what happens.

Also, it's normal for CWHelper versions prior to the one I sent you not to have a persistent tray icon and only show one during HDHR captures.

It's still true that FusionHDTV is a tricky beast so I'm not sure that you'll be out of the woods with the above change, but I think it will make the database error popups go away (or at least less frequent). Also, regardless of what the CW_EPG status windows show, if the capture appears in FusionHDTV's tray app window it should be OK.

FusionHDTV scheduling has been a very low priority for us for quite a while due to lack of user interest. But with your help I'm hopeful that we can make it work better. I have some ideas that will take some internal team effort and time to try out. Please be patient.
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post #4417 of 4451 Old 06-17-2019, 06:11 AM
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Hi SFischer1,

Thanks for offering to help. I had been having no success with the HDHR tuners until Terry sent a modified version of CwHelper. Since then, CW EPG has been working flawlessly with the HDHR tuner*. Should the situation change, I will reach out. The support I've gotten from you and Terry has been outstanding in both speed and accuracy.

(*It's a big improvement over the XP+MyHD+Fusion setup previously, which suffered from a memory leak that I tolerated for over a decade. It would hang every week or less, usually during the wee hours of Monday morning.)

Hi Terry,

I'm sorry that I completely misunderstood the concept of Windows VirtualStore. I'm delaying the re-installation of Fusion software until I'm satisfied that I haven't broken something, i.e. the machine survived its restoration to a time before my attempts to fix it. Then I'll do as you suggest and report back.

"...FusionHDTV scheduling has been a very low priority for us for quite a while due to lack of user interest. But with your help I'm hopeful that we can make it work better. I have some ideas that will take some internal team effort and time to try out. Please be patient..."

Please don't feel like there's a reason to hurry on my behalf... this current setup is already a significant improvement over its XP predecessor, running with just the HDHR tuners.

Thanks for all your help and support. You guys rock.

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post #4418 of 4451 Old 06-17-2019, 08:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by six_rabbits View Post
Hi SFischer1,

Thanks for offering to help. I had been having no success with the HDHR tuners until Terry sent a modified version of CwHelper. Since then, CW EPG has been working flawlessly with the HDHR tuner*. Should the situation change, I will reach out. The support I've gotten from you and Terry has been outstanding in both speed and accuracy.
...
Checking a few points, you are running W7 SP1 and the User Account Slider is at the very bottom for the single Administrator account you are using.

Compatibility for CW_EPG.exe and CwHelper.exe are both set for Windows XP Service Pack 3.

I have never set permissions for all Users to Full Control as Terry has suggested, I have Users Permission set to Read & Execute.

I did not run into the Silicon Dust change that Terry and the team are addressing as I was using CW_EPG to do the scans and Fusion recording have not been scheduled for five or more years. Having Fusion doing captures has been stopped completely due to it's total unreliability for OTA. I have four (4) Fusion tuners, they all may work fine using NON Silicon Dust software. I keep a Fusion tuner in my HTPC (2) to play very damaged captures only.

The HDHR ignoring one of the two Virtual Channels is getting a lot of bad posts in many threads and the repack may produce many more Fusion cards being sent to the Electronic recycling dump.

------------------------------------

Be prepared for MSFT ending W7 support in January, based on my attempts to use Vista when my W7 laptop died, it will be very nasty. I will have a HTPC with W10 ready soon and expect the backup HTPC will follow soon after, a new mother board needed perhaps.

-------------------------------------

When ATSC 3.0 is available I will get a HDHR 3.0 tuner, but signs are showing up that will not be compatible with CW_EPG. Blame Hollywood and Mickey Mouse.

SHF
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post #4419 of 4451 Old 06-17-2019, 09:28 PM - Thread Starter
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A few quick corrections for Stephen's post.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post
W7 SP1 and the User Account Slider is at the very bottom for the single Administrator account you are using.
It is not necessary to disable UAC to run CW_EPG or FusionHDTV and it does not matter how many or what kind of accounts are set up on the PC, as this suggests.
Quote:
Compatibility for CW_EPG.exe and CwHelper.exe are both set for Windows XP Service Pack 3.
After making the change to folder permissions, DO NOT set CW_EPG.exe or CWHelper.exe (or FusionHDTV.exe, etc.) to Windows XP compatibility! With the correct folder permissions in W7 and W10, they run just fine in all Windows from XP through 10.
Quote:
I have never set permissions for all Users to Full Control as Terry has suggested, I have Users Permission set to Read & Execute.
Setting more limited permissions for Everyone on the FusionHDTV Program Files folder may be OK, but is untested by me. Making the change that I recommended is all that is needed to run FusionHDTV compatibly with CW_EPG.

HDHomerun users: Please check out our free Cliff Watson EPG PVR software to schedule your recordings.
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post #4420 of 4451 Old 06-17-2019, 09:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TPeterson View Post
A few quick corrections for Stephen's post.It is not necessary to disable UAC to run CW_EPG or FusionHDTV and it does not matter how many or what kind of accounts are set up on the PC, as this suggests.After making the change to folder permissions, DO NOT set CW_EPG.exe or CWHelper.exe (or FusionHDTV.exe, etc.) to Windows XP compatibility! With the correct folder permissions in W7 and W10, they run just fine in all Windows from XP through 10.Setting more limited permissions for Everyone on the FusionHDTV Program Files folder may be OK, but is untested by me. Making the change that I recommended is all that is needed to run FusionHDTV compatibly with CW_EPG.
The best advice from you that I paid dearly for not heeding sooner was to use my HTPC for HTPC use only. You have changed your advice on many points from before.

That strongly suggests only one Admin account, as to not reducing UAC to "Never notify", that was found to be necessary years ago.

As to the other comments, they have changed from years before, some of which are changes in W10 that have not been done in W7.

Being the CW_EPG stress tester I can say what I suggested works and will not hit you like Flash did a few days ago. IE appeared to disappear and the comments on the Internet were not helpful. I thankfully had a restore point that when applies the IE problems among others went away.

Flash will be reinstalled only after another System Image is created. Beware!!!

SHF

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post #4421 of 4451 Old 06-17-2019, 10:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes, as other things change, so do recommendations. Disabling UAC has become unnecessary because of the recommended change to folder Security permissions. After that, the UAC setting is irrelevant because VirtualStore's confounding is removed. (We had to discover that because W10 doesn't play nicely if one defeats its UAC) Also, the improved stability of Windows since XP has made it less important for an HTPC to be "single purpose". It was very important for Win95.

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post #4422 of 4451 Old 06-17-2019, 11:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post
That's the account that no part of Windows limits. ("ADMINISTRATOR").
Not quite true in W10, as of its first release anyway. I found that some functions were unavailable when one enables and runs via that account. E.g., the new-style apps won't run, which means that one cannot access or use the MSFT online Store (including the W10 HDHomerun app) unless MSFT has relented on that. (Things do change, and I've not looked at that setting for several years)

But this is getting increasingly OT and unhelpful. My point is that I have recommended current settings known to make FusionHDTV compatible with CW_EPG in W7. Other settings may work, but they also may mess up that delicate beast.

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post #4423 of 4451 Old 06-18-2019, 10:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TPeterson View Post
As I wrote earlier there's been no change in CW_EPG(CWHelper) interactions with FusionHDTV since the first public release supporting it, so changing CW_EPG or CWHelper versions will only coincidentally change what happens.
Apologies to Six_Rabbits, after reviewing some development history I find that there was a change in the FusionHDTV scheduling interface between CW_EPG 4.2.x and 4.3.x that was occasioned by the need to support Java8. That could cause a difference in behavior between those two versions. We're working to better understand the occasional database error and I hope to have a more robust solution in the near future.

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post #4424 of 4451 Old 07-31-2019, 07:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Exclamation Big news for a very few folks

The handful of you CW_EPG users who still would like to use FusionHDTV with it on post-XP Windows PCs are now in luck. We have sussed out the issues that were introduced by more-recent Java-Windows incompatibilities and now have an update for CWHelper.exe that works just as well on Windows 7+ as the original did on XP.

Of course CW_EPG doesn't do anything to make FusionHDTV itself more stable so you'll have to tinker with getting the latter installed correctly (see my comments above about how that is done). But once you have a FusionHDTV installation that doesn't fall over by itself, CW_EPG can schedule captures on it that are as good and reliable as running FusionHDTV stand alone.

Installing a new CWHelper.exe in an existing CW_EPG setup involves a few detailed steps so I want to provide individual help on that. If you're one of the subject group, please PM me for the new sw and instructions.

Meanwhile, for the rest of us, there will be a major CW_EPG update in the not-so-distant future, but don't hold your breath please.
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post #4425 of 4451 Old 08-11-2019, 11:33 AM - Thread Starter
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FusionHDTV

I just terminated my successful FusionHDTV reliability test of CW_EPG/CWHelper.

I’ve long regarded as unfinished, but low-priority, business our workaround for the lapse in Windows/Java support under W7/10 and Java8 for the original official FusionHDTV capture-notification scheme. But a couple months ago a CW_EPG user who’d just migrated from WXP asked about this on AVS Forum, so I bumped up its priority and Dale Seng and I went to work on it. We now have a very solid mechanism for scheduling capture/watch events on FusionHDTV rigs and I found that 2 of the 3 Fusion tuners that I tested have drivers that work pretty well under W7 and W10. The third one fails to work at all under W10 but is OK in W7 (where I had been using it for years). I just stopped a (W10) test of the FusionHDTV7 Express after it had captured without a hitch 41 ten- to 15-minute events scheduled by CW_EPG with S3 sleep between each event.

So CW_EPG finally has good support for FusionHDTV in the current Windows environment and that will be included in the next full release, which is in the works, but based on the lack of PM responses to my previous post I guess nobody (not even the handful that I envisioned) cares about that orphan anymore.

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post #4426 of 4451 Old 10-30-2019, 12:48 PM
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Is anyone else having troubles scheduling captures today? Everything worked normally yesterday, but today when I click on "Schedule Matches," it reports "0 Items Successfully Scheduled" even though it should he 9.

If I try to manually schedule a recording, I get:


But the log shows:

This is the same message that the log shows for recordings that I try with the "Schedule Matches" button.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.
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post #4427 of 4451 Old 10-30-2019, 12:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tawill View Post
Is anyone else having troubles scheduling captures today? Everything worked normally yesterday, but today when I click on "Schedule Matches," it reports "0 Items Successfully Scheduled" even though it should he 9.

If I try to manually schedule a recording, I get:


But the log shows:

This is the same message that the log shows for recordings that I try with the "Schedule Matches" button.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.
Would love to provide help, but your apparent attempts to paste stuff into your post have failed so I can't see what you're saying.

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post #4428 of 4451 Old 10-30-2019, 01:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tawill View Post
Is anyone else having troubles scheduling captures today? Everything worked normally yesterday, but today when I click on "Schedule Matches," it reports "0 Items Successfully Scheduled" even though it should he 9.

If I try to manually schedule a recording, I get:


But the log shows:

This is the same message that the log shows for recordings that I try with the "Schedule Matches" button.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.
Trying this again. The first file shows the result that I get when I try a manual capture. The second is the corresponding log entry. I also get that same log entry for each capture that I try using the "Schedule Matches" button.
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post #4429 of 4451 Old 10-30-2019, 01:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Much better, thanks.

The error message in the log indicates that communication between CW_EPG and the Capture Manager process has become corrupted. Have you tried restarting the PC? If not, you could do that or, if you're familiar with the Task Manager you can use it to terminate the Capture Manager and then restart it by opening CW_EPG.

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post #4430 of 4451 Old 10-30-2019, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TPeterson View Post
Much better, thanks.

The error message in the log indicates that communication between CW_EPG and the Capture Manager process has become corrupted. Have you tried restarting the PC? If not, you could do that or, if you're familiar with the Task Manager you can use it to terminate the Capture Manager and then restart it by opening CW_EPG.
This is actually occurring on 2 separate systems. One is running CW_EPG ver 4.2.1.0 and the other running ver 4.3.1.0. Both systems have been restarted twice since I first noticed the problem.
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post #4431 of 4451 Old 10-30-2019, 02:17 PM - Thread Starter
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I will PM you instructions for providing me more diagnostics on this. In any case, be assured that it's not a global problem.

EDIT: It turned out that tawill's problem was due to a bug in CW_EPG's filename handling ("%" causes an error). Now we'll make sure that the bug doesn't propagate into the upcoming new release (any day now!).

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post #4432 of 4451 Old 10-31-2019, 04:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Cool New App Version Posted

The oft-threatened release of a new, improved version of CW_EPG is here. Updating is very easy and highly recommended for current users.

New stuff in this version includes:

- Added dark theme with option to use light (Windows) theme
- Simplified channel mapping
- Speeded up several app processes
- Added support for newer HDHR tuners’ VC-only tuning mode
- Added CWHelper system tray icon with right-click options to access Capture Editor, Configuration Page, and safe Shutdown
- Improved FusionHDTV scheduling reliability
- Added hover-hint information to Programs To Match, Scheduled Items, and History
- Various bug fixes (e.g., handle non-ASCII characters in filenames)
- Compact schedules and history database files on each non-Auto run
- Added 3 new filename options: movie date, first-aired date, and episode number
- Added resizing of Listings/Matches split via title double click and separator mouse drag
- Enlarged app display window and made it scale for 720, 1080, and 2160 screen heights


Please see the first post in this thread (linked in my sig) for more information.

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post #4433 of 4451 Old 10-31-2019, 06:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Warning: If you were one of the 3 pioneer downloaders (with the arrows in your back to show for it) you got version 4.4.0.2 rather than 4.4.0.3. Please redo the download now to get the correct version. (Nothing terrible would happen if you were to run 4.4.0.2, but it does have a couple of subtle bugs that were squashed at the 11th hour) Sorry for the inconvenience!

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post #4434 of 4451 Old 11-01-2019, 12:05 PM - Thread Starter
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I've just performed the update on an old system and have a few tips.
  1. The new version treats channel mapping very differently from the previous one. This was done to greatly simply the mapping process for users. The new version attempts to use existing channel maps and largely succeeds in that, but you may see some anomalies. If so, you can likely fix them automatically by performing the right-click "Scan for Channels" on the tuners in the Options Tuners list for any tuners that show oddities. Then exit CW_EPG and restart it.
  2. There is a cosmetic bug in the installer that in some cases leaves behind the old shortcut in the Windows Startup menu. This causes CWHelper to try to start a second time upon Windows boots. No harm is done by this, but a spurious error message is left in CWHelper's logs. If this offends you, just use the Task Manager's Startup tab to disable one of the "Capture Manager" items.
  3. The eagle-eyed will notice that the Access database (.mdb) files in CW_EPG's data folder are much smaller than with the previous version. Don't worry, all the real data are still there but CW_EPG now cleans out the deadwood after every non-Automatic run.

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Last edited by TPeterson; 11-01-2019 at 12:42 PM.
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post #4435 of 4451 Old 11-04-2019, 04:38 PM
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I held off a couple of days before upgrading my second system to 4.4.0.3. The first one upgraded fine and I have seen no problems on it, but the second one is giving me at least 2 problems.

The first occurs when I open CW_EPG. I get the pop-up shown in the attached file "short host name error.jpg." I have to click OK 6 times to get rid of it. Yes, this computer's host name is "Emp1" and it has never caused any problem before. After the 6th click, I get a second pop-up, shown in the attached file "No tuners defined.jpg." If I open the Options window, I get what is shown in attached file "Options 11-4-19.jpg." The channel mappings are there, but no tuners. Clicking "Scan for Tuners" does find the correct tuners as shown in "After Scanning for tuners.jpg." But nothing appears in the "Selected Tuner's Channels" display. I have tried right-clicking on a tuner and selecting "Scan for Channels" which it seems to do, but nothing appears. If I try to manually schedule a capture, I get "CAPTURE SCHEDULE FAILED."

Any help would be appreciated.
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post #4436 of 4451 Old 11-04-2019, 05:24 PM - Thread Starter
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You found a bug, Sir. I inserted a test on the computer name length at one point trying to nail down an early problem and then forgot that it was there before turning 4.4.0 loose on the innocent public. My apologies. I'll post version 4.4.0.4 soon with that particular bug smashed.

Thanks for the feedback!

P.S.: You're stuck with the 6 popups until either 4.4.0.4 or you increase the computer's name by at least 2 characters, but I think that the Tuner's channels will show up after you click again on Scan for Tuners (not channels) and then click Save Settings and reopen Options.

P.P.S.: Version 4.4.0.4 is now the current download (i.e., host-name popups are gone). Unless you ran into tawill's problem (i.e., a computer name with fewer than 5 characters), you probably don't need to bother with this update.

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Last edited by TPeterson; 11-05-2019 at 11:14 AM.
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post #4437 of 4451 Old 11-05-2019, 11:21 AM - Thread Starter
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With tawill's help (thanks!) we've unearthed a new (to our test population) breed of HDHR firmware that confuses the current CWHelper's attempt to discover tuner capabilities.

If your HDHR's name begins with "103" and you encounter blank channel lists*, as in tawill's attached screenshots two posts above this one, please follow the instructions on page 16 of the ReadMe to reconfigure CWHelper to treat all HDHR units as "traditional".


*Edit: N.B. that this is not generic to "103" HDHR units, as our other "103" units show up as supporting only "traditional" tuning anyway.

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Last edited by TPeterson; 11-05-2019 at 01:48 PM.
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post #4438 of 4451 Old 11-05-2019, 04:58 PM
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For anyone who may be having the same blank channel list problem: per TPeterson's suggestion, I followed the ReadMe page 16 procedure which did allow the channel list to appear. Which in turn allowed me to schedule captures.

Thanks Terry!
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post #4439 of 4451 Old 11-09-2019, 04:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Exclamation Another tip for updaters

Make sure that your tuners all have current channel scans. This is particularly important if you make use of channel restrictions for automatic scheduling, because CW_EPG now uses the PSIP channel names rather than the Schedules Direct naming for those designations and automatically converts from the old to the new names. But if your tuner's channel list is not current (i.e., it contains a no-longer-used PSIP name) that conversion is thwarted and the match with the restriction will not be recognized, resulting in no recording!

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post #4440 of 4451 Old 11-10-2019, 01:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Exclamation A tip for the "It ain't broke, don't fix it!" folks

One motivation for getting this update rolled out was that its revised channel-mapping procedure is designed to make easier the channel shuffling that we're all going to see in the FCC's impending "repack". The new Selected Tuner's Channels list shows the current correspondence between the PSIP channel information and the SD channel names so when there's a channel-assignment change you can simply perform a new Scan for Channels on the tuner to update its list and then confirm that the desired channels all have correct mappings by clearing and rechecking their check-boxes. That transfers any changes in the lineup to CW_EPG's Mapped Channels.

Although many CW_EPG users are likely comfortable with what they've been using for years, this feature may make the update more compelling for some.

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