Xbox One and PlayStation 4 Roundup - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 02:31 PM
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Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

It's all nonsense. Most here would probably consider me the authority for gaming tech on AVS...take it from me, just total nonsense. There are very, very few things they can do on "the cloud" to increase real-time graphical fidelity, certainly absolutely nothing they can use it for to increase resolution and framerate.

Don't believe the hype.

how are they able to run advanced games on basic tablets/cell phones using this technology then? MS certainly weren't the first to do this(if they ever will) and it wasn't from them that I heard of the potential.

what's your take on that esram? I know nothing about that, but reviewers seem to suggest it COULD make up the difference IF programmers learn how to use it effectively

I think in any case, the 'graphics' are equal from what I can see. that is, whether or not the ps4 is technically superior, the gameplay is basically the same. just like with the 360/ps3. it's not like we're talking about one running UHD at 60fps and the other 720p at 30fps, they are minor improvements that aren't noticeable without side by side screen captures.
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post #32 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 02:36 PM
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Originally Posted by sytech View Post

Some of the new 4K displays have something call Splitview that allows 2 people to game on one screen at the same time, if the wear polarized glasses. Each of them gets the full size of the screen at 1080p instead of the full 2160p.



Yup, but you need the PS 3D games that offer it. I have the Sony 84" 4K for my kids media/gaming room, and did just buy both the PS4 and the Xbox One, but neither of those currently have games that support this capability. I'll have to use the PS3 for the split view games.





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post #33 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 02:47 PM
 
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Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post

how are they able to run advanced games on basic tablets/cell phones using this technology then? MS certainly weren't the first to do this(if they ever will) and it wasn't from them that I heard of the potential.

what's your take on that esram? I know nothing about that, but reviewers seem to suggest it COULD make up the difference IF programmers learn how to use it effectively

I think in any case, the 'graphics' are equal from what I can see. that is, whether or not the ps4 is technically superior, the gameplay is basically the same. just like with the 360/ps3. it's not like we're talking about one running UHD at 60fps and the other 720p at 30fps, they are minor improvements that aren't noticeable without side by side screen captures.

To most at AVS 1080P and 720P are easily distinguishable. Will gameplay be different because of it? No. But graphical fidelity most assuredly will, even more so in motion. Here's a simple comparison of 720P scaled to 1080P to 1080P native on BF4 PC; there is simply not enough pixel density to render some of the far off detail and debris: http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/46013/picture:1

Advanced games on tablets? Not really sure what you mean, but tablet hardware has come a long way and can run some impressive stuff locally. Otherwise the new thing is streaming games remotely, much like you get your streaming video content. The games are rendered on high powered hardware in the cloud and a video signal is sent to the user. The user sends input signals back. Unfortunately, it's latency dependent and with the state of ISP's with latency issues and bandwidth caps, it's going to be years before networks are up to that thing for games that require very low latency such as competitive first person shooter. If ever.

Using the cloud for synchronous or even asynchronous computing just really isn't feasible unless it's a game system that doesn't matter in the first place. There's just going to be too much latency when you're talking about milliseconds over the net and micro or pica seconds in rendering on local hardware.
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post #34 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post

how are they able to run advanced games on basic tablets/cell phones using this technology then? MS certainly weren't the first to do this(if they ever will) and it wasn't from them that I heard of the potential.

Which games?
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what's your take on that esram? I know nothing about that, but reviewers seem to suggest it COULD make up the difference IF programmers learn how to use it effectively

The esram helps a ton, it will never fully close the gap. Most reviewers don't know anything about tech, they're just regurgitating the marketing spiel. Even if devs learn to use the Xbox hardware more effectively, they're also learning how to use the ps4 more effectively at the same time, so it's a wash. The Xbox will always be behind the ps4. Always.
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I think in any case, the 'graphics' are equal from what I can see. that is, whether or not the ps4 is technically superior, the gameplay is basically the same. just like with the 360/ps3. it's not like we're talking about one running UHD at 60fps and the other 720p at 30fps, they are minor improvements that aren't noticeable without side by side screen captures.

Sure, not everyone cares about graphics, resolution etc. But the difference is there, and I think the AVS crowd is ground zero for people who care about that kind of thing.

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post #35 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post

I feel this way too. although to be honest, I stopped gaming completely when I was in high school, so I almost missed the 360/ps3 launch completely.

I stopped gaming also after senior year in high school and played less and less the following years. They just can't hold my interest the way they used to. I honestly wish they did because I remember having so much fun with them. This, I'm not sure if it's due to the games not being as entertaining, or if I'm simply not entertained by them anymore. I feel like the content of the games had much more effort put into them then they do now. Now it's all about graphics, features and all kinds of funky ways to interact with the game.
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I wasn't sure if this gen's lack of excitement was about me, or the products.

I think it's probably a combination of the two.
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post #36 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

To most at AVS 1080P and 720P are easily distinguishable. Will gameplay be different because of it? No. But graphical fidelity most assuredly will, even more so in motion. Here's a simple comparison of 720P scaled to 1080P to 1080P native on BF4 PC; there is simply not enough pixel density to render some of the far off detail and debris: http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/46013/picture:1

Advanced games on tablets? Not really sure what you mean, but tablet hardware has come a long way and can run some impressive stuff locally. Otherwise the new thing is streaming games remotely, much like you get your streaming video content. The games are rendered on high powered hardware in the cloud and a video signal is sent to the user. The user sends input signals back. Unfortunately, it's latency dependent and with the state of ISP's with latency issues and bandwidth caps, it's going to be years before networks are up to that thing for games that require very low latency such as competitive first person shooter. If ever.

Using the cloud for synchronous or even asynchronous computing just really isn't feasible unless it's a game system that doesn't matter in the first place. There's just going to be too much latency when you're talking about milliseconds over the net and micro or pica seconds in rendering on local hardware.

as I said, only with side-by-side screen captures.

xboxone and ps4 both support 1080p video games. I think it's a little quick to say ps4 games will always look better because of one or two examples currently available(let alone compared to a pc??). it's up to the software to take advantage of what either console has to offer. i'm sure like always, some games will be tailored to one console and then ported to the other. so if developers continue to be bought out by MS, the ps4's version isn't going to be all that much better.

the ps3/360 playing 720p games is probably still noticeably 'worse' than the ps4/xbone. but between the two new consoles, they are so close.

I do believe you're probably right about latency, but I wonder if there's a way to maintain critical processing locally, and allow the 'cloud' to worry about the background. ie, if an NHL game has everything on ice processed by the console, but the crowd is processed in the cloud. forgive me if this is absurd, i'm not a programmer

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post #37 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 04:56 PM
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For the power comparison, Microsoft will never close the gap. The PS4 has 50% more raw power (18 vs 12 CUs) and double the ROPs (32 vs 16) The Xbox One also reserves 10% of it's GPU power for Kinect and the OS, this is a handicap the PS4 does not share. The ROPs is the most telling as it just isn't enough for consitant 1080p.

Then there is system bandwith, 176GBps vs 68GBps (Esram has to act as frame buffer and bandwith aid, and there is only 32MB of it to go around, which limits it's ability to help) Microsoft released a bunch of press releases through Eurogamer that gave outrageous numbers to their bandwith, but all of that has been debunked as nothing but PR math. This is a gap that will never be closed.

Then there is the matter of the 32MB itself as a frame buffer, it is just too small for 1080p. (Especially at 60fps) Forward rendered games can still make it work (this is why Forza has baked in lighting) but anything using deferred rendering (any modern engine) then the framebuffer will simply be too large for the esram to fit. This is why so many games are below 1080p, the console just wasn't designed to handle it. There are too many bottlenecks.

Unless Microsoft releases a mid generation hardware refresh they will never close the power gap. Sony holds the power and pricing advantage on this one.
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post #38 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 05:48 PM
 
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Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post

as I said, only with side-by-side screen captures.

As I said, not here.

It's ~40% more pixels on screen. It's very noticeable.
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post #39 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 05:51 PM
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Battlefield 4 is the only sub 1080p game at launch on the PS4 (900p) and the drop is instantly noticeable on my TV. I keep hoping for a patch to up the resolution like Assassin's Creed got.
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post #40 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post


As I said, not here.

It's ~40% more pixels on screen. It's very noticeable.

 

Yep, I notice the difference between 720p, 900p and 1080p in an instant with no assistance needed. I think a lot of people are being deceived by the "comparison" videos floating around on the web, encoded at low bitrates and 720p/30fps.  In practice, its easy to pick out which of the two looks better. 

 

And even if the differences are miniscule, it still begs the question of why you'd want to spend $100 more on the xbox one. I hear all the time about how the common man doesn't care about power, as demonstrated by the weaker system usually selling more....mostly because it's cheaper IMO. This time around the cheaper box is significantly more powerful. Who wants to pay more for less?


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post #41 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

As I said, not here.

It's ~40% more pixels on screen. It's very noticeable.

To be fair it isn't going to be noticeable to everybody just as some people don't distinguish the difference from DVD to Blu-Ray. For you and me it is clear as day but others maybe not.

Something like Battlefield 4 it isn't just a superior resolution on the PS4 the Xbox One version is missing graphical features the PS4 and PC version have as well. Something like 2K4 it appears the Xbox One version is missing AA or it isn't implemented as well.

Great article showing some of the early differences:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7528/the-xbox-one-mini-review-hardware-analysis/4
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post #42 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 06:44 PM
 
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Yep, I notice the difference between 720p, 900p and 1080p in an instant with no assistance needed. I think a lot of people are being deceived by the "comparison" videos floating around on the web, encoded at low bitrates and 720p/30fps.  In practice, its easy to pick out which of the two looks better. 

Yup, low bitrate, poor codec encoded, smeared youtube video of a good HD capture is a problem. And it doesn't help that most game review sites are woefully unprepared to show content in full HD detail, even more so than Youtube. Even DF had to put up downloads to compliment their technical articles, since youtube and their own players were not up to the task. Then you get into the display device on the user end, with phones and tablets now being the norm, they might not even be able to display the difference if their display device is sub 1080P. Many still are up until the latest hardware.

Gamersyde is fast becoming the only place you can grab close to native captures to play on your own TV to see the difference. Pretty invaluable service as we go from 720P to 1080P to 4K (it'll be a while for that one).
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And even if the differences are miniscule, it still begs the question of why you'd want to spend $100 more on the xbox one. I hear all the time about how the common man doesn't care about power, as demonstrated by the weaker system usually selling more....mostly because it's cheaper IMO. This time around the cheaper box is significantly more powerful. Who wants to pay more for less?

I do think this is one interesting aspect of this go around, because it is the first time the the more powerful system is also cheaper AND apparently easier to develop for. As far as I can remember with consoles, it hasn't happened before. Then again, it might also mean nothing since the media has told us again and again consoles are a dying consumer good and everyone will just play candy crush and like.
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post #43 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 06:50 PM
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Game resolutions are actually more noticable than movie resolutions. Consider that games render in real time with limited AA at various resolutions. Aside from a handful of games, they are stuck rendering at resolutions no better than 1080p native. Running them at native resolution these games will display artifacts, upscaling from 720p or 900p just makes them even more noticeable.

Even with 480p DVD you have a source that has limitless details and is recorded and mastered in resolutions that can exceed 4k. They don't have these short comings.

One fun thing about PS4 games is that those with 720p displays get free super sampling of the image, thanks to all of them (so far) being over 720p. Few console games render above 1080p sadly, so those with 1080p displays are stuck with a few artifacts.
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post #44 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 07:28 PM
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Realistically, how noticeable will the difference be on the average consumers POS TV? This forum is hardly representative of the average console gamer. I would assume (yes I will be making an ass out of all of us) that many of the consumers of these devices will not be playing on high or even moderately quality displays.

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post #45 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 07:36 PM
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Realistically, how noticeable will the difference be on the average consumers POS TV? This forum is hardly representative of the average console gamer. I would assume (yes I will be making an ass out of all of us) that many of the consumers of these devices will not be playing on high or even moderately quality displays.

Difference between ps3 to ps2 or xbox 360 to xbox on a standard definition CRT is still dramatic to me. Resolution is only one aspect.
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post #46 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 08:00 PM
 
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Realistically, how noticeable will the difference be on the average consumers POS TV? This forum is hardly representative of the average console gamer. I would assume (yes I will be making an ass out of all of us) that many of the consumers of these devices will not be playing on high or even moderately quality displays.

Depends. XB1 games might even look better for some of those POS TV's if they're native 720P (or old quality 720P native TV's), as there will be no scaling, or the artifacting that goes along with it. There's also some reports of weirdness in the XB1 scaler thats causing crushed blacks and a post sharpening filter applied to the scaled images that are not present when sending 720P native.

I do agree that every Joe COD might not notice or care much if he does. But there is a very noticble difference, that even a surprising number of people are picking up on.
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post #47 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 08:32 PM
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Most 720p screens are 1366:768 so scaling would still be involved and PS4 games would benefit from the super sampling effect.
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post #48 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 08:36 PM
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I sure hope that Microsoft does a re-release with better hardware down the road. I just don't know if I could buy a Play Station... Either way I am set with PC for at least another couple years, I can wait and see.

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post #49 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 08:46 PM
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I sure hope that Microsoft does a re-release with better hardware down the road. I just don't know if I could buy a Play Station... Either way I am set with PC for at least another couple years, I can wait and see.

They will not release another version that is financial death to the system. That will segregate system owners BAD move.

Every one is forgetting Microsoft has stated the system will do cloud computing later in the life cycle. I think it will work like PC's where if you have the bet speed you can change your graphics setting to low, med and high. Enhancing graphics and AI.

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post #50 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 08:54 PM
 
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The cloud isn't going to help with rendering. I wouldn't hold my breath if you're hoping it will.

It can and will offer dedicated servers, remote data, and maybe even crunching large data sets like Forza does for better AI. But even Forza needs to grab the AI routines and run them client side in real time. The cloud buzzword isn't some magical new thing, and there hasn't been some crazy leap in what they can use it for over other cloud computing systems.

Their best bet is to use it to offer game streaming and backwards compatibility along the lines of Sony's Gaikai, but even they came out and said it wasn't feasible for them due to latency (which makes one wonder about Sony and if they have a dud on their hands). If thats the case for simply streaming video of a game run remotely and accepting inputs, it's not going to bode well for offloading real-time rending from your console to the cloud. ISP's are simply not there yet. In fact, they've been moving in the opposite direction for all but those with the deepest pockets.
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post #51 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 09:01 PM
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post #52 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 09:18 PM
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The cloud sure as hell hasn't been turned on yet then based on how the comparisons are. Somebody needs to tell MS to flip the switch, even just a little mist or fog from the cloud to bring it a closer to the PS4 games would be nice.
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The next console war will be fought in the heavens. tongue.gif

Be prepared

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post #54 of 1036 Old 11-24-2013, 10:02 PM
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I didn't notice it mentioned here yet, will the current PS4 play native 4k video?

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post #55 of 1036 Old 11-25-2013, 12:14 AM
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just keep in mind how pathetic both the ps3 and xbox 360 were at launch compared to current offerings. the 360 had component video output still...

I think most of what you're looking for on the ps4 WILL come with future updates. the hardware is more than capable of doing everything the ps3 does and more. i'm pretty sure they had to rush development to get it released, and those were the things they crossed off the 'must have at launch' list. but if they want to sell consoles a year from now, they will need those features.

anyway, not saying you should be happy buying one now, just that I wouldn't write off the consoles. i'm sure 2-3yrs from now, nobody is going to think the ps3 or 360 is better than the ps4 or xbone anymore

I really didn't get the PS3 until my Blu Ray Player just got so frustrating with not having updates and all the failures, where my friend with a PS3 could play everything on release day. So I bought a PS3 for it's flawless BluRay capability. Never really did any gaming with it. Just this past month the PS3 offers me a whole new excitement as it is one of the few platforms that gets the New Netflix 3D streaming with over 55 titles at launch. For a 3D enthusiast, the PS3 is very much state of the art. As for Xbox, I really only got that to get ready for Kinect and had fun with it for awhile. Plus, I wanted an HD DVD player. So, I'll be keeping my 360 until it dies. I rarely use it. I use the PS3 daily, for Netflix, Amazon Prime and Vudu. Never for games. I agree with you that for someone like me, it's time to wait and see what better is offered by PS4 when it is over it's newness. In 2-3 years, I hope to have a simpler way to get my streaming video services from a Roku or similar. I think Sony lost it (for me) by not having the full HD 1080p 3D for Netflix from the start. I seriously would have been out there buying one. But if I need to wait 2-3 years, Oh my! By then there will be so many competitors out there for my specific needs I doubt I'll spring for the higher cost of a PS4. I wish Sony and Microsoft well in the gaming world. I'm not in that community, especially with the online competition stuff.
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I'm somewhat of a spectator these days, too (started with the Sega Master System as a little tyke in the 80s, actively pursuing through the Dreamcast....and later grabbed a 360 for a short time). I was rooting for the underdog (MS) in the last gen, but I'm going to be silently cheering for the other team this time thanks to the more singular focus Sony has taken in making a kick-ass gaming console. Should I ever decide to buy one, that would be the primary focus for me. My Oppo is robust enough for the rest of my home theater entertainment needs.
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post #57 of 1036 Old 11-25-2013, 05:41 AM
 
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Yep can't wait to see how they do in the rest of the world. What really gets me about Microsoft is how US centric they are. How is launching a product in 13 countries and netting the same sales the playstation did In 1 country considered good.

How could selling one million consoles in one day not be considered good?
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post #58 of 1036 Old 11-25-2013, 05:46 AM
 
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I didn't notice it mentioned here yet, will the current PS4 play native 4k video?

I do not think it can yet, since the new HDMI 2.0 spec was just recently approved and the test kits for certification are not yet available. Sony said they put in a chip capable of doing it (the expected specs have been known for some time while awaiting formal approval) and should be able to use a firmware upgrade to enable 4k video (the real, 60Hz version and not the current, gimped version).
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post #59 of 1036 Old 11-25-2013, 07:52 AM
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I purchased both of these consoles (I've owned every console since the original NES) and got a chance to spend some quality time with both this past weekend. Here are my impressions of each:

PS4:
Pros:
-Raw horsepower. This is a serious gaming machine, with GDDR5 RAM and 32 ROPs. I don't think any of the launch games (at least the ones I played) really show off this power, but I'm sure we'll see some great-looking AAA games in the near future.
-Controller is infinitely better than previous controller (which was a 15 year old design). It's larger, more ergonomic, and feels much more solid. The integrated touchpad works well enough.
-Streamlined interface (compared to PS3)
-Aesthetics. This is a compact, sleek machine, not the ghastly beast that the original PS3 was, or the VCR-looking Xbox One. However, this comes at a cost (see cons)

Cons:
-All that power + compact design = HEAT! After a couple of hours of spirited gameplay, this thing sounded like a jet engine and was giving off some serious heat.
-No DLNA/MP3/CD support. Sony decided to axe these features in order to push their own music/video services. BIG slap in the face to consumers.
-Limited app selection (I didn't even find a Youtube app). This will obviously improve over time, but at launch it's pretty sparse.
-No 3D blu-ray support at launch.

Overall, the PS4 feels like two steps forward (raw power and improved controller), and a LOT of steps backward when compared to the PS3. I used my PS3 to consume all of my media (Netflix/amazon streaming, DLNA streaming of content on my media PC, blu-ray/3D blu-ray, youtube, etc). The PS4 can do very little by comparison. I'm sure it will be an awesome game machine, but little more (unless Sony decides to reverse some of these decisions with future software updates).

Xbox One:
Pros:
-Kinect voice control. I thought this would be gimmicky, but it works surprisingly well. I didn't use it all the time, but for switching between different activities it was very useful. It's also nice to be able to turn on/off my Xbox, TV, DVR, and receiver with a simple voice command.
-TV integration. I was watching the Pats/Broncos game last night, and it was nice to be able to say "Xbox go to FIFA 14" at halftime and instantly switch from TV to a video game. Oh, and to be able to "snap" the NFL app to check my fantasy scores while watching the game was simply awesome.
-All in one media hub. Microsoft has been pushing this console as such (hence the name), and at launch I'd say they're really close to hitting that goal. The only things holding it back are no 3D blu-ray support, and limited DLNA support. These can be easily addressed with future patches, so I'm not too worried about it.
-Controller. The Xbox 360 controller was my favorite of all time, and this one is even better.
-Overall interface. It is light years ahead of the old 360 interface, and far better than the PS4 interface. I know not everyone is a fan of the Windows 8 style interface, but here I think it works well and is very intuitive. The impressive voice controls make it even better (I rarely had to repeat myself or shout to be understood).
-The sound of silence. I had this thing on all day yesterday, watching TV, playing games, playing a blu-ray, etc, and I never heard the console revving it's fans like the PS4 did. I believe the extra bulk of the Xbox really helps here, and I'm happy with the tradeoff.

Cons:
-It really is ugly. The comparisons to an 80s-era VCR are pretty accurate. However, the extra size helps with cooling so I don't have a problem with it.
-Less powerful compared to PS4. In practice, I didn't notice much difference in graphical quality between PS4/Xbox One games, but I didn't play the same game on both consoles so it's difficult to compare.
-Limited DLNA support. There is no DLNA streaming app currently available, but I was able to use the Xbox as a DLNA receiver with no issues. They could easily add a native app with a future upgrade.
-No 3D blu-ray support. Again, this can be easily addressed in the future.

Overall, I feel like the Xbox One is a step forward in nearly every regard compared to the previous generation, and I would say I enjoyed my time with the Xbox more than the PS4 simply due to the fact that it can do far more things. Regarding resolution-gate, there are 1080p games on the Xbox One, and I expect all AAA first-party titles will be 900p/1080p. My guess is that the PS4 was simply easier to optimize for the launch window, given its extra power. Battlefield, COD, etc were just quick ports, so I doubt they dedicated a lot of resources to optimizing them on the Xbox. Next year's releases could be a different story.

Anyhow, I'm excited that a new console generation has (finally) arrived, and I'm really looking forward to what these companies can do with their premium franchises (God of War, Uncharted, Halo, Gears, etc). It's a good time to be a gamer!
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post #60 of 1036 Old 11-25-2013, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by tsaville View Post

I purchased both of these consoles (I've owned every console since the original NES) and got a chance to spend some quality time with both this past weekend. Here are my impressions of each:

PS4:


Overall, the PS4 feels like two steps forward (raw power and improved controller), and a LOT of steps backward when compared to the PS3. I used my PS3 to consume all of my media (Netflix/amazon streaming, DLNA streaming of content on my media PC, blu-ray/3D blu-ray, youtube, etc). The PS4 can do very little by comparison. I'm sure it will be an awesome game machine, but little more (unless Sony decides to reverse some of these decisions with future software updates).

Xbox One:


Overall, I feel like the Xbox One is a step forward in nearly every regard compared to the previous generation, and I would say I enjoyed my time with the Xbox more than the PS4 simply due to the fact that it can do far more things. Regarding resolution-gate, there are 1080p games on the Xbox One, and I expect all AAA first-party titles will be 900p/1080p. My guess is that the PS4 was simply easier to optimize for the launch window, given its extra power. Battlefield, COD, etc were just quick ports, so I doubt they dedicated a lot of resources to optimizing them on the Xbox. Next year's releases could be a different story.

Anyhow, I'm excited that a new console generation has (finally) arrived, and I'm really looking forward to what these companies can do with their premium franchises (God of War, Uncharted, Halo, Gears, etc). It's a good time to be a gamer!

QFT!!!

I also bought both consoles and have been testing them this past weekend. And i agree in all your points except for sound in the PS4 mine was very quiet even after 4 hours of Madden 25 game play. But i think xbox360 takes it just because is more fun to watch, interface, and options. I spent the entire saturday watching Bones S8 on netflix got an achievement on my Xbox1 for it. How cool is that? (Well is not a big deal i was just surprised to see achievements by watching netflix). Plus the xbox one is outputing 7.1 sound. Don't know about you guys but thats a plus for me compared to its predecessor!!!

I know people get excited about benchmarking, specs etc.etc..but i don't think it applies to consoles as much as it does to PC's. I mean look at the last console war. xbox 360 had clearly less power than the ps3 and they were almost evenly matched on sales after 8 years. Whats the point of having the most powerful machine if your experience is going to be dull? Xbox one may have lesser specs than its counterpart but it surely can do more now.

The games experience and enticing features will determine this new console war. The edge might come to whoever gets their hands on a similar Oculus Rift design....just saying.
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