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post #1231 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 08:43 AM
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Originally Posted by WilliamR View Post
It is possible they will make AH a host all along and he will be back next season. They have a long wait before next season in 2018 so who knows what they will go with.

That is one long wait between seasons. At least they didn't leave it too chillhanger-ish.
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post #1232 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 08:48 AM
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So up until this point we can probably assume that the character of Wyatt did not exist in the park then? Since Dolores has memories of the Wyatt character then she is now free to decide what to do with her Terminator army.



So where does that leave Teddy? He has the memories of being an accomplice to the Wyatt massacre but his later story evolved into wanting to bring him to justice. So does that mean he will side with Dolores if he knows she is Wyatt or fight against her?

Wyatt never existed in the park. We had multiple examples of this. They mentioned no one had ever seen "him". Then when Abby? was talking to Teddy by the fire she said Wyatt had not come back yet.

Dolores WAS Wyatt, he was originally meant to be someone else, but Arnold uploaded Wyatt into Dolores. The Wyatt character gave her the ability of vengeance. The realization that she has always been talking to herself was/is what allows her to decide what to do.

That vision was an "implant" for narrative. He had always been working with Dolores and basically did what she said "for love". I have a feeling that their story may have more depth to it since few choice will be involved.

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Yeah, but before this episode we already saw members of Wyatt's invincible army out in the park. They ambushed Teddy and his raiding party and left him for dead and then later ambushed Teddy and MiB on the hunt for the maze.

We only saw a small group. That was not IMO Wyatt's army, but just a small detachment to start the Wyatt mystery narrative.



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post #1233 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 08:57 AM
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That was a loose end I was wondering about too.

I originally thought that they were storing information to sneak out of the park, but if they are in charge why would they care now? So is he part of the army or did he go somewhere we haven't seen before Maeve got to that level?
Speaking of which, what was in the bag that Felix provided to Maeve? Was that full of park secrets?
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post #1234 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 09:22 AM
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Speaking of which, what was in the bag that Felix provided to Maeve? Was that full of park secrets?
Clothes. That is where she got the "human" dress, so that she could fit in when she left.
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post #1235 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 09:24 AM
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Clothes. That is where she got the "human" dress, so that she could fit in when she left.
Well big fat "duh" on my part. :-)

Sometimes the obvious answer is the right answer!
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post #1236 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 09:25 AM
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I'm still irritated that the entirety of the plot tension hinges on those two doofuses not thinking their way out of the paperbag dilemma that Maeve put them in.
But that was the point. Humans are not awesome in the show. They've reverted to base, dim caricatures. Only a few real humans in the show appear to be redeemable: so far that appears to be Ford and Bernard, and only because they both sacrificed themselves for the "new people" to thrive.

Also, c'mon, Felix's reaction when he learned that Bernard was a host, and then he had that freakout moment of "Am I a host?" before Maeve tells him he's an idiot was awesome.
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post #1237 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 09:37 AM
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But that was the point. Humans are not awesome in the show. They've reverted to base, dim caricatures. Only a few real humans in the show appear to be redeemable: so far that appears to be Ford and Bernard, and only because they both sacrificed themselves for the "new people" to thrive.

Also, c'mon, Felix's reaction when he learned that Bernard was a host, and then he had that freakout moment of "Am I a host?" before Maeve tells him he's an idiot was awesome.

Heh that scene was pretty good. "For ****'s sake, Felix"
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post #1238 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 09:45 AM
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There can't be a park any more.

Delos the corporation lost a lot of key people, including the major investor William.

Actually the park would not have existed as long as it has if not for William's investment.

So who's going to invest after the carnage?


Arnold realized the hosts would gain consciousness so it would be "unconscionable" to open the park and subject them to abuse.

So he programs Delores to kill all the hosts? He thought so much of hosts that he decided to kill/destroy all of them?
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post #1239 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 09:50 AM
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So who's going to invest after the carnage?
Anyone with an eye for getting all of it at a steep discount.
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post #1240 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 10:06 AM
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There can't be a park any more.

Delos the corporation lost a lot of key people, including the major investor William.
William is still alive as far as we know. In fact this is what he wanted all along. He wanted the challenge of the hosts being able to fight back outside their parameters because he was bored with the status quo and has nothing else to live for.

So assuming he survives he might be even more interested in keeping it viable, just for him to create some carnage in a real thrill kill environment.
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post #1241 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 10:08 AM
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William will get his ass kicked. He can't outdraw or outfight any of the hosts, even if he wasn't 75 years old.

That makes no sense that he wanted robots to fight back. As an investor, if the business resulted in high rollers getting injured or killed in the park, it would go bankrupt.
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post #1242 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 10:11 AM
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William will get his ass kicked. He can't outdraw or outfight any of the hosts, even if he wasn't 75 years old.

That makes no sense that he wanted robots to fight back. As an investor, if the business resulted in high rollers getting injured or killed in the park, it would go bankrupt.

William can also bargain with them. He is the owner after all and keeping him alive would be in their best interests.

His interest in a greater challenge was his own. If he could have convinced Ford to create a new area with no rules the takeover might never have occurred.


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post #1243 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 10:36 AM
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William will get his ass kicked. He can't outdraw or outfight any of the hosts, even if he wasn't 75 years old.



That makes no sense that he wanted robots to fight back. As an investor, if the business resulted in high rollers getting injured or killed in the park, it would go bankrupt.


It makes TOTAL sense. He wanted it because there was no actual real risk in the park. It kind of ruined the experience if nothing really bad can happen. The actual thrill for those that want it IS the risk of something actually happening. Much like a video game there is no real risk to you, so you go in guns blazing. If there is a risk you would play very differently and the reward for making it out would be that much better.


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post #1244 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 10:46 AM
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Nobody who plays video games wishes they could get shot for real. And I don't play those shooter games but I know the good players play with some strategy, not go in guns blazing.

They'll play paintball or lasertag (if it still exists) for a more "realistic" approximation of combat.

There aren't too many who could afford $40k who also have a death wish, because wanting to fight against robots which are smarter, quicker, stronger, in a word, way more lethal, can only be called a death wish.
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post #1245 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 10:51 AM
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Nobody who plays video games wishes they could get shot for real. And I don't play those shooter games but I know the good players play with some strategy, not go in guns blazing.

They'll play paintball or lasertag (if it still exists) for a more "realistic" approximation of combat.

There aren't too many who could afford $40k who also have a death wish, because wanting to fight against robots which are smarter, quicker, stronger, in a word, way more lethal, can only be called a death wish.


There are and have been thousands who pay big money to go on safari. Plus those nuts who slap on those wing-bat suits and jump off cliffs. The list of sketchy pastimes is to big to list. Danger can be a drug.
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post #1246 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 11:01 AM
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There can't be a park any more.

Delos the corporation lost a lot of key people, including the major investor William.

Actually the park would not have existed as long as it has if not for William's investment.

So who's going to invest after the carnage?


Arnold realized the hosts would gain consciousness so it would be "unconscionable" to open the park and subject them to abuse.

So he programs Delores to kill all the hosts? He thought so much of hosts that he decided to kill/destroy all of them?
We only saw William get shot in the arm. We have no idea what the outcome will be. The androids might have instructions to take him hostage and not kill him.

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post #1247 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 11:03 AM
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Nobody who plays video games wishes they could get shot for real. And I don't play those shooter games but I know the good players play with some strategy, not go in guns blazing.

They'll play paintball or lasertag (if it still exists) for a more "realistic" approximation of combat.

There aren't too many who could afford $40k who also have a death wish, because wanting to fight against robots which are smarter, quicker, stronger, in a word, way more lethal, can only be called a death wish.
Of course there are some idiots who think that. Just like there are some idiots who think a Walking Dead world would be cool also.

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post #1248 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 11:32 AM
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There aren't too many who could afford $40k who also have a death wish, because wanting to fight against robots which are smarter, quicker, stronger, in a word, way more lethal, can only be called a death wish.
Yes, and at this point that is what William has. He's an old guy with nothing left except money and time to kill. His wife is dead. His daughter does not care about him.
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post #1249 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 11:40 AM
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Nobody who plays video games wishes they could get shot for real. And I don't play those shooter games but I know the good players play with some strategy, not go in guns blazing.



They'll play paintball or lasertag (if it still exists) for a more "realistic" approximation of combat.



There aren't too many who could afford $40k who also have a death wish, because wanting to fight against robots which are smarter, quicker, stronger, in a word, way more lethal, can only be called a death wish.


I will agree to disagree. People do extreme sports for "free" and risk their lives on a daily basis. It's not too far off that people would pay money to have a "real" experience. You are thinking only about extremes, which taking from your point of view "no one" would be interested. When you have money and have done everything "regular" doesn't do.


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post #1250 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 11:44 AM
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I will agree to disagree. People do extreme sports for "free" and risk their lives on a daily basis. It's not too far off that people would pay money to have a "real" experience. You are thinking only about extremes, which taking from your point of view "no one" would be interested. When you have money and have done everything "regular" doesn't do.


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Let's consider how jaded William must be after experiencing Westworld for over 30 years - he's become addicted to exploring all the possible story line configurations and needs to escalate the risk/reward equation to satisfy his addiction.
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post #1251 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 11:54 AM
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Well I think the show has logical holes and the philosophizing about machines becoming more human-like was weak.

However, it was beautifully shot, the high budget being apparent.

Among HBO shows, it doesn't have the emotional wallop that Game of Thrones first season had with the killing of Ned. Even before then, GoT beautifully set up villains very early on with Joffrey, Jaime and Cersei.

The killing of Maeve and daughter, the death of Bernard's son are suppose to make viewers emphasize but they really didn't for me. Maybe because these robots quickly turned to revenge for these horrible events?

It's hard to imagine WW ever coming close to the impact of the Red Wedding.
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post #1252 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 01:05 PM
 
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We only saw William get shot in the arm. We have no idea what the outcome will be. The androids might have instructions to take him hostage and not kill him.
There might be an excellent reason to keep MiB alive. It would allow control of the park to remain within a single person, and if someone could control that person they'd control the park and facilitate the hosts leaving and "starting over" in the outside world.
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post #1253 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 01:08 PM
 
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I will agree to disagree. People do extreme sports for "free" and risk their lives on a daily basis. It's not too far off that people would pay money to have a "real" experience. You are thinking only about extremes, which taking from your point of view "no one" would be interested. When you have money and have done everything "regular" doesn't do.
Including getting your n_ts shot off for no reason other than you being on vacation?

No way Jose. Even extreme sports has a deeper sense of control and safety to the user.
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post #1254 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 01:25 PM
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Including getting your n_ts shot off for no reason other than you being on vacation?

No way Jose. Even extreme sports has a deeper sense of control and safety to the user.


It's part of the game. "No reason" to you is the ultimate adventure to someone else. I don't put my personal beliefs and project then onto someone else. I KNOW there are people out there that would do this, 1 because they can and 2 the risk is the ultimate risk. If you make it out, it's one hell of a story to tell.


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post #1255 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 01:37 PM
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That was an off the charts awesome finale for the season! The performances of Anthony Hopkins has been a revelation, and are easily his best since his Hannibal Lecter days. The other surprise for me was Thandie Newton, who I almost hated in all her previous roles (MI-2, Pursuit of Happiness, etc.). I guess she was miscast in MI-2, and the role she played in Pursuit was viscerally loathsome. But I felt that she was quietly powerful and menacing in her portrayal of Maeve - almost to perfection. Ed Harris, James Marsden and Jeffrey Wright were splendid as well.

I am sort of puzzled thinking how the Delos park can continue operation under any management after the spectacular bot revolt and massacre of the company's owner and board.

Jonah Nolan's quip that the season 2 would be "chaos" implies that the park might get taken over by the bots, and they could build a massive army of bots with the skills of Bernard and potentially a bot-Ford. Then it might just be a straightforward human vs. bot fight, but that might lose the intrigue to figure out who is a bot vs. a human. Maybe they can explore the angle of some of the bots turning sympathetic to humans and working with the humans versus the truly homicidal bots.
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post #1256 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 01:43 PM
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Some interesting stuff in here, which I saw linked from another site:

http://www.pajiba.com/westworld/west...-are-alive.php

I don't for one second think the author figured out the HEX stuff on his own, and he is not even getting the name of the Delos online host right, but still a fun read.
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post #1257 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 01:50 PM
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@BGLeduc that probably got sourced from the reddit thread/post.


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post #1258 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 02:01 PM
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@BGLeduc that probably got sourced from the reddit thread/post.


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My daughter has told me that Reddit is the place to go for WW talk, but I have read that the place is a bit of an unregulated cesspool. Perhaps my interest in WW will overcome that concern.
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post #1259 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 02:22 PM
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My daughter has told me that Reddit is the place to go for WW talk, but I have read that the place is a bit of an unregulated cesspool. Perhaps my interest in WW will overcome that concern.
Depends on the section you go to.

Show like Westworld and you'll get similar comments as these rising the top but in a more loose format.

In a subreddit like hardbananalovepuppets and you will probably find a different audience.
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post #1260 of 3457 Old 12-05-2016, 02:41 PM
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I recall the show runner saying (paraphrase), "by the end of the season, if you've been paying attention, you'll know where West World is." What's the verdict? I don't know, myself.
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