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post #1 of 9 Old 08-03-2015, 07:54 PM - Thread Starter
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HDMI or HDBaset for 4K?

In a nutshell which way would you go? Ramblings below...

Thanks to DirectTVs recent implementation of HDCP (it is what it is, live with it), I'm now looking for a HDMI or HDBaset matrix for my home. Not going to add additional receivers or other options from DTV for reasons I won't get into now.

Searching for a reliable setup, I came across Atlona and Gefen. Atlona is very $$$, Gefen not as bad. Atlona has a 10 year warranty, wow! Tells you something about their quality, no? Of course you're paying for the warranty in the price. Gefen warranty is 2 years (I think?) and a brand I am familiar with, although I don't own any of their products, probably due to price, LOL. But no HDCP 2.2.

Reading on the Atlona website, I see their spec for 4K video cable lengths (in/out) is only 3 meters (~15' on their (not yet released) HDMI matrix (AT-UHD-H2H-44M). http://atlona.com/product/at-uhd-h2h-44m/ Way too short for my home.

Atlona,s AT-UHD-PRO3-44M http://atlona.com/product/at-uhd-pro3-44m/ is not out yet either, and I don't see lengths mentioned in the specs. So I'm wondering if 4K over HDBaset will offer the lengths most of us need to distribute content throughout our homes.

History: Late 90's - future-proofing - hah!, I ran 2 RG-6 and 2 Cat5e's to each location.The RG6 is worthless for what I need today. Luckily I installed conduit to most locations (3 story house - challenging for conduit). BTW: If you want to "future proof", forget about the cable technology of the day and make sure each location has at least 1" or larger conduit, now you are future proofed (topic for another discussion).

Why Atlona? Not at all thrilled about the premium price, but they have a 10 year warranty. That says something. Can't tell you how many reviews I've read where the (name your brand/model) craps out in a few months or a year. As of this writing, Atlona has the only matrix with 2.2HDCP (that I have found) and that is very important if you care about 4k (future-proofing HAH!).

By the way I also inquired about Gefen products via their web contact link. Very impressed with Gefen, if only for their responsiveness. They replied to my email within a couple of hours, for that I give them an A+. If a manufacturer replies that fast, that says alot. However, the Gefen currently does not have 2.2 HDCP. If I am going to pay a premium, I want the latest HDCP for 4K (HDCP 2.2) even if I don't have any 4k equipment today.

We're all trying to stay ahead of the curve. Good luck with that! LOL
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post #2 of 9 Old 08-04-2015, 05:10 AM
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Can you wait a year? Distributing 4K will be cheaper. Rent the client boxes for a year. I know it's a hard pill to swallow. New tech is also glitchy.

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post #3 of 9 Old 08-04-2015, 09:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nowandthen View Post
In a nutshell which way would you go? Ramblings below...

Thanks to DirectTVs recent implementation of HDCP (it is what it is, live with it), I'm now looking for a HDMI or HDBaset matrix for my home. Not going to add additional receivers or other options from DTV for reasons I won't get into now.

Searching for a reliable setup, I came across Atlona and Gefen. Atlona is very $$$, Gefen not as bad. Atlona has a 10 year warranty, wow! Tells you something about their quality, no? Of course you're paying for the warranty in the price. Gefen warranty is 2 years (I think?) and a brand I am familiar with, although I don't own any of their products, probably due to price, LOL. But no HDCP 2.2.

Reading on the Atlona website, I see their spec for 4K video cable lengths (in/out) is only 3 meters (~15' on their (not yet released) HDMI matrix (AT-UHD-H2H-44M). http://atlona.com/product/at-uhd-h2h-44m/ Way too short for my home.

Atlona,s AT-UHD-PRO3-44M http://atlona.com/product/at-uhd-pro3-44m/ is not out yet either, and I don't see lengths mentioned in the specs. So I'm wondering if 4K over HDBaset will offer the lengths most of us need to distribute content throughout our homes.

History: Late 90's - future-proofing - hah!, I ran 2 RG-6 and 2 Cat5e's to each location.The RG6 is worthless for what I need today. Luckily I installed conduit to most locations (3 story house - challenging for conduit). BTW: If you want to "future proof", forget about the cable technology of the day and make sure each location has at least 1" or larger conduit, now you are future proofed (topic for another discussion).

Why Atlona? Not at all thrilled about the premium price, but they have a 10 year warranty. That says something. Can't tell you how many reviews I've read where the (name your brand/model) craps out in a few months or a year. As of this writing, Atlona has the only matrix with 2.2HDCP (that I have found) and that is very important if you care about 4k (future-proofing HAH!).

By the way I also inquired about Gefen products via their web contact link. Very impressed with Gefen, if only for their responsiveness. They replied to my email within a couple of hours, for that I give them an A+. If a manufacturer replies that fast, that says alot. However, the Gefen currently does not have 2.2 HDCP. If I am going to pay a premium, I want the latest HDCP for 4K (HDCP 2.2) even if I don't have any 4k equipment today.

We're all trying to stay ahead of the curve. Good luck with that! LOL
I am an Atlona dealer and I can tell you that you can't go wrong. Not only do they have a 10 year warranty but they have a 1 year advanced replacement policy, and they have 24/7 tech support. They are by far the most forward thinking of the manufactures I work with so they always have the latest technology. They are not expensive compared to Extron, Kramer, AMX, Crestron, Wyrestorm, Hall Research, etc. They are in the middle which I think is the correct place for them.
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post #4 of 9 Old 08-04-2015, 12:45 PM
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Yeah, what Neurorad said. You're going to drop a ton on gear that may be changing with 4K support still its infancy (really still gestating!) - $7-8 per box per month and they're small enough to tuck behind the TV and use the RF remotes.

But if you're hard-set on spending that money - don't spend extra for 4K support. You'll probably upgrade/replace/move before you have (a) content to distribute, and (b) multiple 4K displays to receive it. Beyond your primary location - do you really think you'll notice 4K? And how often in the next 3 years do you think you'd watch the premium 4K content in those locations? Lastly - if you wait a while, the cost on all this stuff is going to come down, and it's going to be more stable...

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post #5 of 9 Old 08-04-2015, 09:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jautor View Post
Yeah, what Neurorad said. You're going to drop a ton on gear that may be changing with 4K support still its infancy (really still gestating!) - $7-8 per box per month and they're small enough to tuck behind the TV and use the RF remotes.

But if you're hard-set on spending that money - don't spend extra for 4K support. You'll probably upgrade/replace/move before you have (a) content to distribute, and (b) multiple 4K displays to receive it. Beyond your primary location - do you really think you'll notice 4K? And how often in the next 3 years do you think you'd watch the premium 4K content in those locations? Lastly - if you wait a while, the cost on all this stuff is going to come down, and it's going to be more stable...

Jeff
Got it! Thanks to all replies. All very informative and helpful.

I'm not a young pup, so my eyes aren't what they used to be. So perhaps 4K is a waste for me. You'd think I would have learned by now that trying to stay ahead of the curve is a pricey roll of the dice.

I prefer to send my one DVR output to multiple locations rather than rent more boxes. My TV viewing habit typically means I have rewound a live program, so when I move to the kitchen or bedroom I can continue where I was in the den. I'll pay good money to not give Directv more money. Not logical, but I hate seeing that ever-growing bill each month. I'd rather fork over the money one time and forget about it At least for a few years.

I am just "OK" with the 480i to my 32" bedroom TV, not thrilled but is watchable for the most part. 480i to the 17" kitchen TV is fine. All this is being distributed via a Monoprice component to composite converter and Channel Vision modulator. It's the HDCP protection recently implemented by Directv (or whoever) that has me looking for a solution. I have to unplug the HDMI cable to the TV in the den in order to watch TV in the bedroom or kitchen. I figured if I'm going to solve that problem then I might as well get the latest and greatest. Sounds like a poor decision at this time.

Any recommendations on HDMI to HDMI matrices or HDMI to HDBaset matrices? 4 in 4 out is about right for me. I also have a Roku and a security camera system I want to distribute. Non 4K is OK if price isn't horrible and reliability is there.
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post #6 of 9 Old 08-05-2015, 09:45 AM
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Here are some WyreStorm HDBaseT out, they are fairly affordable and reliable:

https://www.conferenceroomav.com/Mat...DBaseT_Out/4X4

Intelix gives you your choice of HDMI or HDBaseT out but I have been disappointing with their quality and customer service:

https://www.conferenceroomav.com/Mat...r_HDMI_Out/4X4

Geffen's HDMI in and HDMI out is by far the cheapest

https://www.conferenceroomav.com/Gef...2K-444-BLK.cfm
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post #7 of 9 Old 08-05-2015, 08:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by harveyAV View Post
Here are some WyreStorm HDBaseT out, they are fairly affordable and reliable:

https://www.conferenceroomav.com/Mat...DBaseT_Out/4X4

Intelix gives you your choice of HDMI or HDBaseT out but I have been disappointing with their quality and customer service:

https://www.conferenceroomav.com/Mat...r_HDMI_Out/4X4

Geffen's HDMI in and HDMI out is by far the cheapest

https://www.conferenceroomav.com/Gef...2K-444-BLK.cfm
Thanks for the links Harvey, I had/have the Geffen in my Amazon cart, but still researching. The advantage of the Wyrestorm HDBaseT is buit in 2 way IR. I guess they (most systems with 2-way IR) expect you to have your own programmable remote at each sink location. I suppose it may be cheaper to buy a low-cost programmable remote than buy the OEM remote.
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post #8 of 9 Old 08-06-2015, 09:57 AM
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Thanks for the links Harvey, I had/have the Geffen in my Amazon cart, but still researching. The advantage of the Wyrestorm HDBaseT is buit in 2 way IR. I guess they (most systems with 2-way IR) expect you to have your own programmable remote at each sink location. I suppose it may be cheaper to buy a low-cost programmable remote than buy the OEM remote.
Please keep this in mind when buying Pro A/V online, I am not sure what kind of service Amazon would offer but they are responsible for requesting the RMA from Gefen if you had a repair. This is directly from the Gefen web site:

Gefen can directly issue an RMA# for repair returns only for all goods purchased through a dealer/distributor.

Proof of purchase may be required to accept an RMA request as a "warranty" repair.

All returns for credit/exchange must go through the original dealer/distributor the goods were purchased from. Gefen cannot issue any credit for any goods not purchased directly from Gefen.
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post #9 of 9 Old 08-06-2015, 05:20 PM
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4K - no matrix is currently ready for what Ultra-HD Blu-ray is bringing to the party - Resolution is only one part of that particular Jigsaw!

Display devices - you mention different capabilities at different Displays, that is going to be an issue with an HDMI Matrix or Distribution Amp as all end points will be supplying the signal the Source is set to Output.

IR - for maximum flexibility you want a Matrix with Routed, Broadcast and Internal IR, that way the Matrix, an AVR and your Sources can all be catered for. Additionally a Matrix with simple 4-button Zone Remotes greatly simplifies Source selection in each Zone.

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