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post #1 of 17 Old 09-19-2019, 01:04 AM - Thread Starter
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Question Active HDMI Cable Options, Cabernet vs Ruipro?

Hello,

I am trying to run HDMI from my computer to my excellent new TV. 4k 60fps HDR.

My current length requirement is about 35 ft. I would want to future-proof (with regards to length; I'm not going to HDMI 2.1 or 8k any time soon) if the price were feasible and if it didn't degrade my results.

I'm going to try to play games with the setup, so latency would be an issue. I've looked at active cables, hdmi-cat converters, and powered hdmi extenders, and right now it looks like active cables would work best for me.
For reference:

HDMI Extender: https://www.amazon.com/AV-Access-Ext...SIN=B073QL6YT3

HDMI>CAT Adapter: https://www.amazon.com/AV-Access-Ext...SIN=B073QL6YT3

I've seen Ruipro recommended on these forums, but I also see Redmere / Spectra 7 / Cabernet cables for much lower prices at Monoprice. https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=12735

I just noticed that these cables don't do HDCP 2.2 so I'll have to see if that will impact PC output for gaming, but Sorry this info came from a user in the Q&A section. The product page clearly states it is HDCP 2.2 compliant.

otherwise what else might be worse about them? Worse bending angles? Anything else?

I've noted that some active cables don't recommend connecting the output to anything but the display. Check out the "This Optical HDMI Cable is not compatible with A/V receivers." line for this cable: https://www.amazon.com/ATZEBE-Fiber-...EV7ZDHMY2SY2VF

I'd seen that caveat on a couple of active optical cables, so I started believing that they all had that limitation. It looks like the Ruipro cables don't have that limitation, however. I'm still a little curious about why some of these cables wouldn't work with receivers.
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Last edited by slateX; 09-19-2019 at 01:27 AM.
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post #2 of 17 Old 09-19-2019, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by slateX View Post
Hello,

I am trying to run HDMI from my computer to my excellent new TV. 4k 60fps HDR.

My current length requirement is about 35 ft. I would want to future-proof (with regards to length; I'm not going to HDMI 2.1 or 8k any time soon) if the price were feasible and if it didn't degrade my results.

I'm going to try to play games with the setup, so latency would be an issue. I've looked at active cables, hdmi-cat converters, and powered hdmi extenders, and right now it looks like active cables would work best for me.
For reference:

HDMI Extender: https://www.amazon.com/AV-Access-Ext...SIN=B073QL6YT3

HDMI>CAT Adapter: https://www.amazon.com/AV-Access-Ext...SIN=B073QL6YT3

I've seen Ruipro recommended on these forums, but I also see Redmere / Spectra 7 / Cabernet cables for much lower prices at Monoprice. https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=12735

I just noticed that these cables don't do HDCP 2.2 so I'll have to see if that will impact PC output for gaming, but Sorry this info came from a user in the Q&A section. The product page clearly states it is HDCP 2.2 compliant.

otherwise what else might be worse about them? Worse bending angles? Anything else?

I've noted that some active cables don't recommend connecting the output to anything but the display. Check out the "This Optical HDMI Cable is not compatible with A/V receivers." line for this cable: https://www.amazon.com/ATZEBE-Fiber-...EV7ZDHMY2SY2VF

I'd seen that caveat on a couple of active optical cables, so I started believing that they all had that limitation. It looks like the Ruipro cables don't have that limitation, however. I'm still a little curious about why some of these cables wouldn't work with receivers.
All of this has been discussed before in this forum, but if you want to rehash it again in one thread, that's fine.

Initially, active cables were designed to extend the cable length, without losing signal integrity, by drawing a little power from the sink end (5mA from the 5V HDMI input). This works very well for 1080i/p, and could be easily accomplished using existing, copper-only cables. Redmere was one of the first companies to successfully patent the chipsets to accomplish that. As video standards became more demanding (4k and then 4k HDR) the chipset technology started to fall behind and issues arose. Redmere was eventually bought out by Spectra and they improved considerably on the technology and designed the new generation of chipsets, Spectra 7 HT8181, which were more robust and work very well for 1080i/p and, to a certain extent, 4k HDR.

Copper cable does have its technical limitations, which can be overcome somewhat by a thicker wire gauge. However, that introduces its own set of issues. Loss of flexibility which can greatly diminish bend radius and increased strain on the HDMI input.

HDBT is another technology which has worked well in the past. Connecting a solid core CAT-6 cable (non-CCA and not the CAT-6 ethernet patch cable) to an active tx/rx interface allows one to extend the cable run over longer distances as well without losing signal integrity. The beauty of HDBT is that one can remove the HDBT interface and replace it if it fails overtime, or replace it with newer chipset technology without removing the cable. However, it too requires power so an external power source is needed. Usually in the form of a USB-like dongle which plugs into a wall outlet. Valens is the company who provides the proprietary chipsets for HDBT and they are working on new chipsets that will be able to handle 4k HDR much better than what is currently being offered. I'm not sure if they are offering HDBT with the new Valens chipsets yet or not. There will still be some video compression with HDBT so that may be an issues to some. CAT-6 defines 8 wires for data transport, so HDBT needs to process/convert the data before transporting via the 8 copper wires to HDMI, which requires 19+1 copper wires.

Hybrid fiber cables are 4 glass fiber cores surrounded by 8 solid copper wires. Hence the term "hybrid". The 4 optical wires are for high speed data transfer instead of the traditional HDMI copper 1-12 wires. The 8 copper wires are used for the low speed data transfer instead of the traditional HDMI copper 13-19 +1 wires. Basically the fiber carries all of the high speed video data whereas the copper carries options like ARC, HDCP, and EDID. The end result is zero data loss and compression (as defined by HDMI 2.0 and 2.1 specifications) as long as the source/sink end HDMI chipsets are able to handle the signaling.

ARC/eARC is still being problematic for runs over about 30m for any type of cabling. So if that is something you need, and you have a run over 50', there may be problems with any type of cable. The hybrid fiber folks are working on it. 15m doesn't seem to be an issue.

There can be issues at the HDMI sink end with the power requirements. 5mA off of a 5V input is not much but as the bandwidth increases (48Gbps) any fluctuation can affect signal integrity, so something like a voltage inserter may be needed which ensures a constant and reliable power source. And this works with any type of active cabling.

The ideal situation for any cable connection, be it active or passive, is to have a single cable run from source to sink, without any adapters, extenders, wall plates, etc in-between. As mentioned before, any "interruption" in the signal path can result in sparkles, audio/video dropouts, etc. That is not to say that adapters and extenders don't work, they do, but when problems occur, that's the first thing to look at. The cable is just a data pipe. It can not improve the signal quality beyond what the source is sending and the sink is receiving, regardless of marketing claims, so you want to keep that connection as simple as possible.

Bend radius is another often over-looked issue. If the cable installation results in sharp bends, that can eventually affect the signal path because the bending may damage the wiring inside and that will cause issues over time. Thick cables work well but as mentioned, the trade off is loss of flexibility which becomes important if you have a long run and are installing in-wall. You also run the risk of damaging the HDMI input because of the extra "weight" of the cable on the connector end. Active cables are usually much thinner because they are powered so a thicker wire gauge is not needed. The hybrid fiber cables can even have a much better bend radius due to their design.

It is interesting that the ATZEBE specifically mentions that it is not compatible with A/V receivers. I'll have to look into that but my guess is that there is some some sort of design/power issue. If that's the case, I wouldn't use them.

The ONLY way to future proof any type cabling is to use conduit if you have a long run installed in-wall or don't have easy access to your cabling. Period.

This should be moved to the HDMI forum as it is specific to HDMI.
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post #3 of 17 Old 09-19-2019, 09:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slateX View Post
Hello,

I am trying to run HDMI from my computer to my excellent new TV. 4k 60fps HDR.

My current length requirement is about 35 ft. I would want to future-proof (with regards to length; I'm not going to HDMI 2.1 or 8k any time soon) if the price were feasible and if it didn't degrade my results.
Check out the PDF in the first post of this thread: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/168-h...hdmi-2-0b.html

Currently using the 40-foot Ruipro cable mentioned in the PDF and have no issues. Also have a 40-foot Monoprice HOSS cable (active but not fiber optic) with no issues either. Note that the PDF specifically calls out that Monoprice Cabernet cable as NOT working.

Last edited by DAK; 09-19-2019 at 09:25 AM.
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post #4 of 17 Old 09-19-2019, 12:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post
All of this has been discussed before in this forum, but if you want to rehash it again in one thread, that's fine.

Initially, active cables were designed to extend the cable length, without losing signal integrity, by drawing a little power from the sink end (5mA from the 5V HDMI input). This works very well for 1080i/p, and could be easily accomplished using existing, copper-only cables. Redmere was one of the first companies to successfully patent the chipsets to accomplish that. As video standards became more demanding (4k and then 4k HDR) the chipset technology started to fall behind and issues arose. Redmere was eventually bought out by Spectra and they improved considerably on the technology and designed the new generation of chipsets, Spectra 7 HT8181, which were more robust and work very well for 1080i/p and, to a certain extent, 4k HDR.

Copper cable does have its technical limitations, which can be overcome somewhat by a thicker wire gauge. However, that introduces its own set of issues. Loss of flexibility which can greatly diminish bend radius and increased strain on the HDMI input.

HDBT is another technology which has worked well in the past. Connecting a solid core CAT-6 cable (non-CCA and not the CAT-6 ethernet patch cable) to an active tx/rx interface allows one to extend the cable run over longer distances as well without losing signal integrity. The beauty of HDBT is that one can remove the HDBT interface and replace it if it fails overtime, or replace it with newer chipset technology without removing the cable. However, it too requires power so an external power source is needed. Usually in the form of a USB-like dongle which plugs into a wall outlet. Valens is the company who provides the proprietary chipsets for HDBT and they are working on new chipsets that will be able to handle 4k HDR much better than what is currently being offered. I'm not sure if they are offering HDBT with the new Valens chipsets yet or not. There will still be some video compression with HDBT so that may be an issues to some. CAT-6 defines 8 wires for data transport, so HDBT needs to process/convert the data before transporting via the 8 copper wires to HDMI, which requires 19+1 copper wires.

Hybrid fiber cables are 4 glass fiber cores surrounded by 8 solid copper wires. Hence the term "hybrid". The 4 optical wires are for high speed data transfer instead of the traditional HDMI copper 1-12 wires. The 8 copper wires are used for the low speed data transfer instead of the traditional HDMI copper 13-19 +1 wires. Basically the fiber carries all of the high speed video data whereas the copper carries options like ARC, HDCP, and EDID. The end result is zero data loss and compression (as defined by HDMI 2.0 and 2.1 specifications) as long as the source/sink end HDMI chipsets are able to handle the signaling.

ARC/eARC is still being problematic for runs over about 30m for any type of cabling. So if that is something you need, and you have a run over 50', there may be problems with any type of cable. The hybrid fiber folks are working on it. 15m doesn't seem to be an issue.

There can be issues at the HDMI sink end with the power requirements. 5mA off of a 5V input is not much but as the bandwidth increases (48Gbps) any fluctuation can affect signal integrity, so something like a voltage inserter may be needed which ensures a constant and reliable power source. And this works with any type of active cabling.

The ideal situation for any cable connection, be it active or passive, is to have a single cable run from source to sink, without any adapters, extenders, wall plates, etc in-between. As mentioned before, any "interruption" in the signal path can result in sparkles, audio/video dropouts, etc. That is not to say that adapters and extenders don't work, they do, but when problems occur, that's the first thing to look at. The cable is just a data pipe. It can not improve the signal quality beyond what the source is sending and the sink is receiving, regardless of marketing claims, so you want to keep that connection as simple as possible.

Bend radius is another often over-looked issue. If the cable installation results in sharp bends, that can eventually affect the signal path because the bending may damage the wiring inside and that will cause issues over time. Thick cables work well but as mentioned, the trade off is loss of flexibility which becomes important if you have a long run and are installing in-wall. You also run the risk of damaging the HDMI input because of the extra "weight" of the cable on the connector end. Active cables are usually much thinner because they are powered so a thicker wire gauge is not needed. The hybrid fiber cables can even have a much better bend radius due to their design.

It is interesting that the ATZEBE specifically mentions that it is not compatible with A/V receivers. I'll have to look into that but my guess is that there is some some sort of design/power issue. If that's the case, I wouldn't use them.

The ONLY way to future proof any type cabling is to use conduit if you have a long run installed in-wall or don't have easy access to your cabling. Period.

This should be moved to the HDMI forum as it is specific to HDMI.
I don't get it. Aren't the ways to run HDMI over a long distance very pertinent to the topic of distributing A/V around the home?

Edit: Otto: you speak as though you represent a company or are acting as an authority but your title only says "Addicted Member." Could you help clarify the role you are playing here? I have been communicating under the assumption I was simply speaking to other users, some of whom have more experience or are more devoted than me. The "user-user" assumption has created the context that defines how I am writing my posts.

I feel like using the term "if you want to rehash it here" shows some frustration. I do appreciate your focused lesson, so thank you. Maybe it is worth putting this info in a sticky?

I admit I was a bit rambling in my post and I will try to be more focused in the future.

Thank you for clarifying the factors that may affect my "Redmere vs Ruipro" question. It is funny that you mention bending at the connector. I found two versions of the Ruipro 10m on Amazon, one a bit cheaper than the other. I wrote them to ask the difference between the versions, and their rep stated that it had to do with bending around the connectors (the more expensive cable being better with bending at the connectors).

A theory about the receiver issue with the ATZEBE cables is that maybe some receivers don't provide power unless that input is selected? Or maybe because the receiver power and TV power can cycle independently, some sort of handshake isn't reliable?

FWIW last night I found some settings in my Yamaha receiver (it looked like a toggle but it opened a full menu) that make me want to put my foot in my mouth with my complaints about CEC and ARC... so far. I got my system doing the full CEC and ARC thing pretty quickly, but it is too early to say they are reliable. shrug.

I pulled the trigger on the cheap monoprice Spectra cable. If their product page says it supports HDCP 2.2, and I find that it doesn't, then I'll be sure to spread the word in their reviews section and get my money back for the Ruipro solution. Doing any of this is a financial stretch right now, so I'll try to get away with what I can.

Last edited by slateX; 09-19-2019 at 12:41 PM.
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post #5 of 17 Old 09-19-2019, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slateX View Post
I don't get it. Aren't the ways to run HDMI over a long distance very pertinent to the topic of distributing A/V around the home?

Edit: Otto: you speak as though you represent a company or are acting as an authority but your title only says "Addicted Member." Could you help clarify the role you are playing here? I have been communicating under the assumption I was simply speaking to other users, some of whom have more experience or are more devoted than me. The "user-user" assumption has created the context that defines how I am writing my posts.

I feel like using the term "if you want to rehash it here" shows some frustration. I do appreciate your focused lesson, so thank you. Maybe it is worth putting this info in a sticky?

I admit I was a bit rambling in my post and I will try to be more focused in the future.

Thank you for clarifying the factors that may affect my "Redmere vs Ruipro" question. It is funny that you mention bending at the connector. I found two versions of the Ruipro 10m on Amazon, one a bit cheaper than the other. I wrote them to ask the difference between the versions, and their rep stated that it had to do with bending around the connectors (the more expensive cable being better with bending at the connectors).

A theory about the receiver issue with the ATZEBE cables is that maybe some receivers don't provide power unless that input is selected? Or maybe because the receiver power and TV power can cycle independently, some sort of handshake isn't reliable?

FWIW last night I found some settings in my Yamaha receiver (it looked like a toggle but it opened a full menu) that make me want to put my foot in my mouth with my complaints about CEC and ARC... so far. I got my system doing the full CEC and ARC thing pretty quickly, but it is too early to say they are reliable. shrug.

I pulled the trigger on the cheap monoprice Spectra cable. If their product page says it supports HDCP 2.2, and I find that it doesn't, then I'll be sure to spread the word in their reviews section and get my money back for the Ruipro solution. Doing any of this is a financial stretch right now, so I'll try to get away with what I can.
The A/V forum can be a little more broad in that it covers automation etc. Questions concerning HDMI specifically really should go to the HDMI forum because that is more about HDMI and its many issues, not just distribution. It's up to you but I think you would get better response on your HDMI-specific questions than here.

I am just a user and do not represent anyone. I have tested short length Ruipro hybrid fiber cables at their request (in a consumer setting) but that's it. Ruipro graciously allowed me to keep the cables. As I have mentioned, a lot of us here on AVS recommend Ruipro cables because that's the cable that has the most favorable reviews by actual AVS users, at least for the long 4k HDR cable runs. Anything under about 25', the recommendation is for Premium High Speed HDMI cables (with the QR label). Lots of cable mfrs submit their cables for ATC certification (passive, up to 25' copper-based) so one can always find good prices on them from a variety of mfrs. All you need to look for is the name Premium name and the QR label.

I have talked to Ruipro about their two different hybrid fiber cables. The answer, as you discovered, is that they had a production run of cables that just didn't have the bend radius at the connector end that they had hoped for. The rest of the cable and connectors were just fine. So like any company they put a slightly different product number on the cable and allowed it to be distributed. The cables are so thin and light that bending at the connector end shouldn't be an issue for most users unless your equipment is in a very tight space and there is very little room between the connector and wall.

If a cable has been tested and certified to meet the HDMI 2.0 hardware specifications then that covers HDCP 2.2 so with an ATC certified cable there's no worries. However, HDMI.org does not allow for certification by an ATC for active cables, so you do need to be careful when purchasing active cables and/or extenders.

HDMI inputs will only provide power when something is connected to them. If all of the HDMI inputs are the current HDMI specification then that's part of the hardware profile. The only exception is that some HDMI inputs will include ARC/eARC as part of the hardware protocols, and those inputs are usually labeled either on the device as ARC or are detailed in the OM.

As I had mentioned, some HDMI inputs may not be consistent in their power output (there's still some speculation on that) so that's why some suggest using an external power source like an Power Inserter between the cable and the HDMI input. It could be that ATZEBE cables use a proprietary HDMI chipset that has issues with some receivers. I have read up some on ATZEBE cables and the opinions are mixed, mostly not favorable, but I've not heard that folks have had issues connecting them directly to a receiver. I've only done a cursory search on them so maybe there's more to the story. I have no problems or issues connecting active cables to my receivers, and I've been doing that for years.

Which Yamaha receiver do you have? I just replaced my old RX-V371 for the downstairs HTS with a new TSR-5830 because I just need something simple for that system. The upstairs HTS, which is a 65 C8 OLED uses a new A-780 as the hub. ARC/CEC is disabled on both systems.

I hear ya about the Rupro cables. They are expensive, and I wouldn't recommend them for any runs under 25'. But in my experience, they are very well made, extremely easy to work with, and perform as expected. In the limited testing that I did at home, they performed as well as BJC Premium High Speed HDMI cables (certified for HDMI 2.0) which is what I was using at the time. I've left the Ruipro cables on both of my systems and have not had any issues with 1080 ( the downstairs LCD) and 4k HDR (the upstairs OLED).

Just remember that no cable mfr can give you a 100% guarantee that their cables will work as expected in every single system and setup, regardless of their marketing claims. What works for you may not work for someone else.

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post #6 of 17 Old 09-20-2019, 08:44 AM
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We use Chromis Pinnacle 4K cables.

DPL Labs certified, and we have not had any issues, on any of our installs with them.

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We use Chromis Pinnacle 4K cables.

DPL Labs certified, and we have not had any issues, on any of our installs with them.
Those are good cables but there is nothing in the link that indicates certification by DPL. DPL does have its own certification program and they may in fact use an ATC as well but active cables, at this point in time, are not certfiable by HDMI.org. They also indicate a bandwidth of "up to 18Gbps", which can mean anything, so I would imagine as the length increases, bandwidth tapers off. If they work that's all that matters.

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Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post
Those are good cables but there is nothing in the link that indicates certification by DPL. DPL does have its own certification program and they may in fact use an ATC as well but active cables, at this point in time, are not certfiable by HDMI.org. They also indicate a bandwidth of "up to 18Gbps", which can mean anything, so I would imagine as the length increases, bandwidth tapers off. If they work that's all that matters.


Are any HDMI 2.1 hybrid fiber cables available? Do these cable technology need any external power in any situation ?


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post #9 of 17 Old 09-23-2019, 09:15 AM
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Are any HDMI 2.1 hybrid fiber cables available? Do these cable technology need any external power in any situation ?


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There really isn't an "HDMI 2.1" cable. The cables, once certified and/or approved will be marketed as Ultra High Speed HDMI cables (48Gbps), to infer that the cables have been tested for HDMI 2.1 option sets, either completely or partially. That name, once registered by HDMI.org will be used to distinguish them from Premium High Speed HDMI cables (18Gbps). Part of the HDMI specifications is that HDMI cables be not labeled with the hardware specification unless specific options sets that fall will within the HDMI 2.1 specification are listed. IOW, a cable can say HDMI 2.1 eARC capability, etc.

Hybrid fiber cables are active cables, in that they draw a little bit of power from the sink end, just like their copper-only counterparts. Being as they are active, there are no certification programs by an ATC (Authorized Testing Center) available for them or any other type of active cables. Depending on the connected devices, cable length, etc a voltage inserter may be necessary to ensure that there is consistent power available (5v) for the connector end (sink side). It is connected between the sink connector and the HDMI input and does require an external power source. Most folks do not need to use a voltage inserter but it is something to be aware of.

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post #10 of 17 Old 09-24-2019, 12:50 AM - Thread Starter
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Hey Otto et al,
Just a quick feedback reply here, I need to grab some zzz's and I'll be busy for a few days but I intend to fully reply to your post.

I was able to get the 35 ft Cabernet cable to work at 4k 60Hz but I'm still working at getting HDR to come through. It is a direct connection from my graphics card to my Sony A1E input, and the sound goes through to my receiver through ARC. My video card settings are 4k, 4:2:2, and 10bpc (10 bit color depth) Windows 10 also has a master "HDR" switch in the display settings which is turned on. 5.1 audio seems to be working but I need to test and I'll eventually want Atmos/Dolby:X.

By "not working" I mean that when I turn on a game, the screen will display for a second or two, then get blocky and maybe green, then the game will minimize and I will go to my desktop. When I go into the display settings of my Sony A1E, it shows that it is getting an HDR image on the desktop.

I have read that I might have more luck with HDR if I change my settings to RGB format (vs YCbCr color format) and 8bpc (8 bit depth) so I need to check that out as well.

I've checked with Destiny 2 and Metro Exodus so it's not just one game. I have a few others I can check.

Monoprice claims that the Cabernet cable won't work through a receiver, and I asked them if they could explain that limitation (and if they could show me where on the product page they have warned purchasers about it...). My receiver does 4k passthough, I'm not sure if that would be a good test. It's an old Yamaha RX A720.

The thing is, I have a purchased Ruipro 18Gbps 15m cable that is sitting here sealed on my desk. I want to open it up and see if it makes all my problems disappear.... Amazon has an okay return policy...

Edit: going with RGB 8 bpc got Metro Exodus to work in HDR, although it appeared to struggle. Destiny 2 just won't work at all on the big screen and I suspect that game is a little special as it won't play with all HDR settings turned off. Sea of Thieves (my backup test game) is broken.

There is another option, called "Output dynamic range", that only appears when in RGB mode (maybe only in 8 bit mode). This defaults to Limited, when switched to "Full" it appears that Metro has a few extra glitches (like the game rendering 1/4 screen shifted down and right for the introduction), but I haven't been able to do long-term testing.

There was an option for

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@slateX - I don't understand why they are saying an active cable won't work if the receiver is the sink end. I've been using them that way for years, copper-only and hybrid fiber, and have never had any issues. My main system upstairs has a hybrid fiber cable connecting my devices to my Yamaha A-780, and then a hybrid fiber cable from the A-780 to the 65 C8. Zero issues. The downstairs system has active copper cables from the devices to the Yamaha TSR-5830, and then a hybrid fiber cable from the TS-5830 to the LG LCD. Zero issues. I've also used passive Premium High Speed HDMI cables on both systems with no issues.

I don't use the panel as the hub of my HTS, I use a receiver as the hub/switch, which is what a lot of us do with no issues.

However, I don't need or want to use a computer connected to my system and am not a gamer (no X-box, etc) so I would look much more closely at your connected devices because it sounds like a setting somewhere or an HDMI chipset compatibility issue.

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post #12 of 17 Old 09-25-2019, 08:33 PM - Thread Starter
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@Otto _Pylot, my guess would be that maybe the consumer has to pay attention to powering on the receiver or maybe there is a little bit of complexity that starts when a receiver is involved? Maybe they decided it's better just to say "no receivers" instead of saying "maybe receivers if you do it a certain way"? I dunno.

Yes, you are right about the computer adding a degree of complexity. In which case, I can only say I'm happy I got lucky with the cheaper cable this time.
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post #13 of 17 Old 09-26-2019, 03:13 PM
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The one rule, which I'm not sure was mentioned is this: There is no such thing as future-proofing wiring.

The HDMI 2.1 specification is already starting to come out and that covers 48Gb/s cabling.

HDMI 2.0 is 18Gb/s cabling.

So, you aren't going to future-proof a thing with a active copper or a active fiber cable. You are only going to get things going for today and perhaps tomorrow. But, not next Wednesday.

If the run between locations is extremely difficult, the second rule is something that is screamed: RUN CONDUIT!!! (sorry for yelling)

1.25" Carlon Resigard is what I typically recommend. They have different versions, and that's fine. But a 1.25" or larger flexible conduit rated for in-wall use is absolutely the only way to future-proof your home video setup.

Of course, if this is post-construction, getting conduit in place can be unrealistic and you may also have easy access to running a new HDMI cable at any point, which is just as good as conduit. So, conduit or a pathway is all you really want and need.

From there, Otto hit the nail on the head with his statements. I have not used any of the fiber or active options at this point, but I would almost feel more confident in fiber for absolutely NO reason at all. I think that fiber really hits the nail on the head when you get beyond 50 feet of distance, but at 40' cable length, I would get the Monoprice stuff which is well reviewed on their website and has a very good price point.

Since I have a 4K projector in my basement, a good 30+ feet from the receiver, I guess I need to order a cable and try it out. I will not be dropping the extra cash on a fiber cable. As cool and as reliable as I think fiber is, for runs under 50' which I can get access to, I will stick with copper.

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post #14 of 17 Old 09-26-2019, 03:58 PM - Thread Starter
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@AV_Integrated

I hear ya man. I didn't explain my situation, which is:

I'm renting 2-bedroom 1-floor apartment.
I just moved into this apartment.
Money is tight.
The only reason I upgraded anything was that I got an insane deal on a 4K TV. The TV isn't getting an upgrade any time soon and it won't get HDMI 2.1 sadly (It's a 2017 Sony A1E OLED 77". There is no way I could afford a similar TV that is newer and also has HDMI 2.2, not in 5 years).

I would run conduit, but right now I could basically punch a hole in the wall between my TV and Computer rooms

Am I missing something?
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post #15 of 17 Old 09-26-2019, 05:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slateX View Post
@AV_Integrated

I hear ya man. I didn't explain my situation, which is:

I'm renting 2-bedroom 1-floor apartment.
I just moved into this apartment.
Money is tight.
The only reason I upgraded anything was that I got an insane deal on a 4K TV. The TV isn't getting an upgrade any time soon and it won't get HDMI 2.1 sadly (It's a 2017 Sony A1E OLED 77". There is no way I could afford a similar TV that is newer and also has HDMI 2.2, not in 5 years).

I would run conduit, but right now I could basically punch a hole in the wall between my TV and Computer rooms

Am I missing something?
Well, if you are just running a cable around the room, then get the cheapest one which meets the specification.

Like I said HDMI 2.1 is in the works, but it doesn't actually exist yet. So, there is nothing to worry about when it comes to the HDMI 2.1 specification. Just get a 18Gb/s HDMI 2.0 rated cable. The key is the 18Gb/s rating. This is something that Monoprice advertises up front on their cables, and I would go with them at their very fair price point.

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post #16 of 17 Old 10-10-2019, 12:46 AM
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NO ONE has an hdmi 2.1 fiber cable yet ? Surprised. They were announced at CES 2018.


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post #17 of 17 Old 10-10-2019, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by blake View Post
NO ONE has an hdmi 2.1 fiber cable yet ? Surprised. They were announced at CES 2018.


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There never will be a cable labeled as "HDMI 2.1". There will be cables labeled as Ultra High Speed HDMI cable (UHS Cable) that will meet some or all of the HDMI 2.1 hardware specifications. However, according to the HDMI.org's marketing rules, the HDMI 2.1 options that have been tested for, or are available for the UHS cable must be listed. The term "Ultra" should be trademarked by HDMI.org, like "Premium" is now but being as active cables can't receive the "certification" from HDMI.org, the term is being muddied.

Ruipro should be releasing their Ruipro8k cable in the coming weeks. It is a hybrid fiber cable that has been tested by an ATC to meet the HDMI 2.1 specifications. But, it is an active cable so it will not be labeled as certified. There will be other fiber/hybrid fiber cable mfrs coming out with their cables as well (Black Week is coming). Ruipro has a very good reputation around here from actual AVS users so that's why we mention them more than others.

The problem with certifying cables for HDMI 2.1 is that there are no consumer devices available yet that have the HDMI 2.1 chipsets that are capable of some, or all of the option sets. Laboratory testing is one thing, but until devices are available in the wild, and being used in the multitude of consumer setups, there is no way of determining how they will actually perform. eARC and VRR don't count because they can be achieved with the current HDMI 2.0 chipsets should the mfr choose to implement them.


The cables announced at CES were prototypes.

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Last edited by Otto Pylot; 10-10-2019 at 09:11 AM.
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