Cabling New Construction at this time - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 12 Old 11-18-2019, 08:25 AM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
chadcj7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 330
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 85 Post(s)
Liked: 17
Cabling New Construction at this time

Hello everyone

I am currently cabling my new construction home now. I have most of my cable runs done which is consisting of CAT6 and speaker wire. I have CAT6 run to all of my TV's, network jacks that I would like, Wireless locations, and some other areas that I may need POE for potential tablets or voice devices.

My two questions I have are below

1. Outside the areas above is there any other area I would need CAT6 cabling that I am over looking?
2. I was initially planning on running a 2" pipe for the potential projector in the basement. After HVAC was finished they have a line that will not allow me to get a pipe in there for the future. Is it safe to run 4 CAT6 cables to that area and run the video signal off of a HDT base convertor?

Thanks everyone
chadcj7 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 12 Old 11-18-2019, 10:00 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Otto Pylot's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bull Mountain, OR
Posts: 15,321
Mentioned: 28 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3571 Post(s)
Liked: 2571
Quote:
Originally Posted by chadcj7 View Post
Hello everyone

I am currently cabling my new construction home now. I have most of my cable runs done which is consisting of CAT6 and speaker wire. I have CAT6 run to all of my TV's, network jacks that I would like, Wireless locations, and some other areas that I may need POE for potential tablets or voice devices.

My two questions I have are below

1. Outside the areas above is there any other area I would need CAT6 cabling that I am over looking?
2. I was initially planning on running a 2" pipe for the potential projector in the basement. After HVAC was finished they have a line that will not allow me to get a pipe in there for the future. Is it safe to run 4 CAT6 cables to that area and run the video signal off of a HDT base convertor?

Thanks everyone
Did you use solid core CAT-6 cabling (non-CCA and not pre-terminated ethernet cable)? Is your cabling inside a 1.5" - 2.0" conduit (flexible Smurf Tube for example)? I would add an extra cable just in case you decide you need an extra cable and add a pull string for future cable pulls/repairs/upgrades. HDBT requires power so make sure you have a power outlet close to where you terminate HDBT. You should be ok running your cable in the HVAC area as long as your solid core cable is rated for that. You sure you can't add an flexible conduit and just be careful of the bend radius (which you need to be aware of with the rest of your cabling as well)?

I never trust an atom, they make up everything.
Otto Pylot is offline  
post #3 of 12 Old 11-18-2019, 10:23 AM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
chadcj7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 330
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 85 Post(s)
Liked: 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post
Did you use solid core CAT-6 cabling (non-CCA and not pre-terminated ethernet cable)? Is your cabling inside a 1.5" - 2.0" conduit (flexible Smurf Tube for example)? I would add an extra cable just in case you decide you need an extra cable and add a pull string for future cable pulls/repairs/upgrades. HDBT requires power so make sure you have a power outlet close to where you terminate HDBT. You should be ok running your cable in the HVAC area as long as your solid core cable is rated for that. You sure you can't add an flexible conduit and just be careful of the bend radius (which you need to be aware of with the rest of your cabling as well)?

My cabling is not in smurf tube. I did run solid CAT6 as well. It is in a ranch so I will be able to get to all my cables and I am running them above the insulation so I can easily identify them. I have a power outlet where the projector will be so I am fine with that. I am also going to run a solid 3" pipe from the basement to the attic in the event I need to add more cables down the road.

The HVAC pipe that is running is for a register and I would prefer not to run through it if I don't have to. I wold assume 4 CAT6 cables to the projector would be enough for video and any network connection that I may need as I will have a dedicated rack space for all of these cables for the entire house
chadcj7 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 12 Old 11-18-2019, 10:51 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Otto Pylot's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bull Mountain, OR
Posts: 15,321
Mentioned: 28 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3571 Post(s)
Liked: 2571
Quote:
Originally Posted by chadcj7 View Post
My cabling is not in smurf tube. I did run solid CAT6 as well. It is in a ranch so I will be able to get to all my cables and I am running them above the insulation so I can easily identify them. I have a power outlet where the projector will be so I am fine with that. I am also going to run a solid 3" pipe from the basement to the attic in the event I need to add more cables down the road.

The HVAC pipe that is running is for a register and I would prefer not to run through it if I don't have to. I wold assume 4 CAT6 cables to the projector would be enough for video and any network connection that I may need as I will have a dedicated rack space for all of these cables for the entire house
As long as you have easy access to your cabling then a conduit is not needed, even though it does make it easier to fish cabling. Just be mindful of bend radius as solid core CAT-6 cabling can be a bit stiff. For ethernet, I just used punchdown keystone jack wall plates. For HDMI, you've indicated HDBT which is a good option, albeit a bit expensive. If and when you go the HDBT route, just make sure that whichever product you get that it has the latest HDMI chipsets in them and keep in mind that there will more than likely still be some video compression with HDBT. Whether that makes a difference to you or whether you'll even notice it remains to be seen. I might add that if you do decide to use HDBT you might want to consider running a quality hybrid fiber cable instead of CAT-6/HDBT because you will probably have less issues, if any, and there will be no compression. Hybrid fiber cables are expensive though.

I never trust an atom, they make up everything.
Otto Pylot is offline  
post #5 of 12 Old 11-18-2019, 11:17 AM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
chadcj7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 330
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 85 Post(s)
Liked: 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post
As long as you have easy access to your cabling then a conduit is not needed, even though it does make it easier to fish cabling. Just be mindful of bend radius as solid core CAT-6 cabling can be a bit stiff. For ethernet, I just used punchdown keystone jack wall plates. For HDMI, you've indicated HDBT which is a good option, albeit a bit expensive. If and when you go the HDBT route, just make sure that whichever product you get that it has the latest HDMI chipsets in them and keep in mind that there will more than likely still be some video compression with HDBT. Whether that makes a difference to you or whether you'll even notice it remains to be seen. I might add that if you do decide to use HDBT you might want to consider running a quality hybrid fiber cable instead of CAT-6/HDBT because you will probably have less issues, if any, and there will be no compression. Hybrid fiber cables are expensive though.
Thanks for this info. the run will only be about 30 feet so I may just buy a HDMi cable and run it now and then just run the CAT6 cable as well

The fiber cable option is more then I want to spend. I know that I will do a projector but it may not be for a couple years
chadcj7 is offline  
post #6 of 12 Old 11-18-2019, 12:03 PM
Senior Member
 
FlyOnTheWall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 473
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 161 Post(s)
Liked: 37
POE Cameras for outside?
FlyOnTheWall is offline  
post #7 of 12 Old 11-18-2019, 12:09 PM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Otto Pylot's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bull Mountain, OR
Posts: 15,321
Mentioned: 28 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3571 Post(s)
Liked: 2571
Quote:
Originally Posted by chadcj7 View Post
Thanks for this info. the run will only be about 30 feet so I may just buy a HDMi cable and run it now and then just run the CAT6 cable as well

The fiber cable option is more then I want to spend. I know that I will do a projector but it may not be for a couple years
Keep in mind that 4k HDR begins to have difficulties at distances longer than 20' - 25' with copper only cables, unless you go with an active cable. You will probably be ok at 30' but if you have issues.....

Hybrid fiber is definitely expensive but most of the posts about the Ruipro4k cables have been very positive. There are quite a few posts about pj's having issues with active cables, be they copper-based only or hybrid fiber so hopefully those issues will be worked out by the time you invest in a pj.

I never trust an atom, they make up everything.
Otto Pylot is offline  
post #8 of 12 Old 11-20-2019, 08:16 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Bigus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: The South
Posts: 5,767
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 672 Post(s)
Liked: 602
Other locations for cat6 to consider (a lot depends on whether home automation is of interest now or may ever be in the future):

Hot water heaters
HVAC (inside furnace/air handler)
+/- kitchen appliances
To exterior for landscape light controller
To exterior for pool equipment if any
Wall keypad locations for WHA
Ceiling locations for echo type devices
Exterior doors for door station
POE security camera locations
Garage door openers
Floor sensor for garage doors

If you are interested or might be interested in leak detection, then cat can be used (in place of 4 conductor security) to:

Hot water heaters (in addition to communication run)
HVAC air handlers
Dishwashers
Ice makers
Behind bathroom toilet locations

Consider doubling, tripling, or quadrupling cat runs to anticipated TV locations. Never know what you may want to do in the future. In addition to being able to send video down 1 or 2 cat cables, they can be used for a host of other things like audio return back to whole house audio matrix/amps, IR or other control signaling, maybe even sending video from local source back to distribution point.

For PJ, several runs of cat is a pretty good bet but not a guarantee. Installing an active or hybrid HDMI may save some hassle in the near future, but almost sure to become obsolete one day. A conduit is the only sure way. Is there an actual insulated duct you can't get around, or a chase in joist cavity, or something else? Pics might be helpful.
Bigus is offline  
post #9 of 12 Old 11-20-2019, 08:25 AM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
chadcj7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 330
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 85 Post(s)
Liked: 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post
As long as you have easy access to your cabling then a conduit is not needed, even though it does make it easier to fish cabling. Just be mindful of bend radius as solid core CAT-6 cabling can be a bit stiff. For ethernet, I just used punchdown keystone jack wall plates. For HDMI, you've indicated HDBT which is a good option, albeit a bit expensive. If and when you go the HDBT route, just make sure that whichever product you get that it has the latest HDMI chipsets in them and keep in mind that there will more than likely still be some video compression with HDBT. Whether that makes a difference to you or whether you'll even notice it remains to be seen. I might add that if you do decide to use HDBT you might want to consider running a quality hybrid fiber cable instead of CAT-6/HDBT because you will probably have less issues, if any, and there will be no compression. Hybrid fiber cables are expensive though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigus View Post
Other locations for cat6 to consider (a lot depends on whether home automation is of interest now or may ever be in the future):

Hot water heaters
HVAC (inside furnace/air handler)
+/- kitchen appliances
To exterior for landscape light controller
To exterior for pool equipment if any
Wall keypad locations for WHA
Ceiling locations for echo type devices
Exterior doors for door station
POE security camera locations
Garage door openers
Floor sensor for garage doors

If you are interested or might be interested in leak detection, then cat can be used (in place of 4 conductor security) to:

Hot water heaters (in addition to communication run)
HVAC air handlers
Dishwashers
Ice makers
Behind bathroom toilet locations

Consider doubling, tripling, or quadrupling cat runs to anticipated TV locations. Never know what you may want to do in the future. In addition to being able to send video down 1 or 2 cat cables, they can be used for a host of other things like audio return back to whole house audio matrix/amps, IR or other control signaling, maybe even sending video from local source back to distribution point.

For PJ, several runs of cat is a pretty good bet but not a guarantee. Installing an active or hybrid HDMI may save some hassle in the near future, but almost sure to become obsolete one day. A conduit is the only sure way. Is there an actual insulated duct you can't get around, or a chase in joist cavity, or something else? Pics might be helpful.
Thanks for all fo the suggestions. I have run many of those options already including the Alexa type device, panels for future home automation, security cameras and even doubled up some of my networking drops to TV's. I will also have access to the hot water heater and furnace down the road with no issues if I do go that route. I am also going to have a 3" PVC pipe that will go from the basement to the attic in the event I need to get more cables to other areas.

I will try and get some pics either later tonight or tomorrow to show you what I am talking about
chadcj7 is offline  
post #10 of 12 Old 11-20-2019, 03:58 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
AV_Integrated's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Northern, VA - Washington, DC
Posts: 6,649
Mentioned: 102 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1656 Post(s)
Liked: 1203
Be aware that the big question with the projector location will remain.

Nobody is future-proofed, when it comes to video, with Cat-6 cabling. The best long distance solution seems to be the fiber optical HDMI cables rated for 18Gb/s. But, those will eventually be outdated and 48Gb/s rated cables will start to come along as HDMI 2.1 matures. So, we already have cabling which has planned obsolescence. Make sure you can replace or add a new video cable to any long distance video run location. I do fully expect, at some point, a video over cat solution to come into existence, but right now, they are all using some sort of compression from what I understand with True 4K material.

Otherwise, the ideas all seem solid. Make sure you are following best practices with speaker wiring.

Coax isn't a bad thing to run behind TV locations if cable boxes are still planned to be used or may be used at some point. They like being wired to coax, but many are now wireless.

Don't forget power outlets at proper TV heights at all TV locations. Don't forget a pathway from TVs to where equipment will be in any stand alone room locations. Sometimes the TV is over the fireplace and you definitely want conduit over to where the cable box or game system will be located.

When walls are open, think as much outside of the box as you can. Garage speakers? Back yard speakers? Front yard speakers? etc. It's relatively cheap to just 'wire' everything now, and then you can use, or not use it as the years go on.

Anything you leave buried behind a wall (or ceiling), take photos of like crazy, then take some more. I generally take 100+ images before drywall, and I often wish I had take 200 pictures.

AV Integrated - Theater, whole house audio, and technology installation in the Washington DC metro area.
AV_Integrated is offline  
post #11 of 12 Old 11-20-2019, 08:07 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Bigus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: The South
Posts: 5,767
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 672 Post(s)
Liked: 602
Video is a good idea too. I've noticed that I'm not great at labeling pics I've taken and before long, one stud wall or joist ceiling looks like another and you can't remember where that was, or which orientation you were standing in when you took the pic. But a video you can narrate as you go, 'starting in this corner by the window there is a normal joist cavity and continuing equal spaces 16" across' etc. I do short clips of each room so I don't have to ffwd through a long segment to find what I need.

Local conduits are really helpful, good point. Over fireplace or other high wall mounted locations down or over to expected equipment cabinet, shelf, furniture etc. If you aren't sure you can run one to more than one location, conduit is relatively cheap. I used several local runs from normal outlet locations up into attic space above even if I could potentially access and drill through top plate later. Just easier down the road, ESPECIALLY if you have tall walls and fireblocking.

Sounds like you will have pretty good access above/below later which is really helpful. Much of my house is true 2 story so once buttoned up it is a royal pain to add anything later. So in my case there is conduit everywhere. A couple hundred feet of it.
Bigus is offline  
post #12 of 12 Old 11-21-2019, 12:52 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
chadcj7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 330
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 85 Post(s)
Liked: 17
Thank you all for the advice. I know I can only future proof so much as technology changes. I am in the IT industry and understand that 100%. We are not big TV watchers and most of our stuff is either stored on my NAS or it is a Apple TV. That will be the only device that will sit at the TV. The remaining equipment will sit in a central location for the projector which is in an unfinished section and will be right behind the Wall of the screen.

I have run for about 12 zones of audio including areas I don't think I will even listen to music at. I have the garage taken care of even with networking cable and a place for an AP both in side the garage and under the covered deck area in the back. I am not putting a TV over the fireplace but I do have electric at the correct height along with bracing to mount the TV's even easier

Most of the IT/Video/Audio will be on the first floor which I will be able to get access to through the attic in the future
chadcj7 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Home A/V Distribution

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off