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post #601 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 11:23 AM
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While we're asking I've got a somewhat different situation. I have an RS4910, and I'd like to do a Rec.2020 calibration (the Autocal software lets me define this). So I believe what I need is a 300MHz EDID, that reports Rec.2020. Is this possible with Automix? It's unclear to me what those checkboxes do.
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post #602 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 02:09 PM
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I am looking to purchase an HD Fury Integral but can not get it into the cart on the their website. Anyone else having this issue?
If so--Where is the best place to purchase one?- thanks
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post #603 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 02:29 PM
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Well, I got my first UHD-BD today. If I go from the Samsung UHD-BDP directly into my Visio M75 4K, then I can get a 2160p input on the Vizio. So I know that will all work.

Now I need to add my Denon X5200W into the mix. It's HDCP 1.4 & HDMI 2.0.

I've got my HDFury Integral sitting here, both firmware updated, and just can't make it work. I am using all AmazonBasics High Speed with ethernet cables, and I just tested them all as good.

What I THINK I should do, and have tried is this:

UHD-BDP 2.2 -> Integral bottom In port -> Integral 1.4 bottom out port -> Denon -> Vizio

I do get a signal, but the input to the Vizio is only 1080p.

Any suggestions or switch settings would be appreciated!

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post #604 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 02:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ramairta1 View Post
I am looking to purchase an HD Fury Integral but can not get it into the cart on the their website. Anyone else having this issue?
If so--Where is the best place to purchase one?- thanks

I added one to my cart just now.

Just go right to the source: www.HDFury.com

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post #605 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stikle View Post
Well, I got my first UHD-BD today. If I go from the Samsung UHD-BDP directly into my Visio M75 4K, then I can get a 2160p input on the Vizio. So I know that will all work.

Now I need to add my Denon X5200W into the mix. It's HDCP 1.4 & HDMI 2.0.

I've got my HDFury Integral sitting here, both firmware updated, and just can't make it work. I am using all AmazonBasics High Speed with ethernet cables, and I just tested them all as good.

What I THINK I should do, and have tried is this:

UHD-BDP 2.2 -> Integral bottom In port -> Integral 1.4 bottom out port -> Denon -> Vizio

I do get a signal, but the input to the Vizio is only 1080p.

Any suggestions or switch settings would be appreciated!
Doesn't your Samsung UHD bluray player have a HDMI output (audio only) ? Have you tried to connect this output to a HDMI input on your Denon so you can have audio ? Then use the main output on the Samsung UHD bluray to your Vizio for video.
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post #606 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 03:28 PM
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Originally Posted by stikle View Post
I added one to my cart just now.

Just go right to the source: www.HDFury.com
I finally got it to work using Internet Explorer. For some odd reason it didn't work with Firefox.
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post #607 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by barneypoo69 View Post
Doesn't your Samsung UHD bluray player have a HDMI output (audio only) ? Have you tried to connect this output to a HDMI input on your Denon so you can have audio ? Then use the main output on the Samsung UHD bluray to your Vizio for video.
Yes, but I was trying to get around running another HDMI cable up to the TV.

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post #608 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 04:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stikle View Post
Well, I got my first UHD-BD today. If I go from the Samsung UHD-BDP directly into my Visio M75 4K, then I can get a 2160p input on the Vizio. So I know that will all work.

Now I need to add my Denon X5200W into the mix. It's HDCP 1.4 & HDMI 2.0.

I've got my HDFury Integral sitting here, both firmware updated, and just can't make it work. I am using all AmazonBasics High Speed with ethernet cables, and I just tested them all as good.

What I THINK I should do, and have tried is this:

UHD-BDP 2.2 -> Integral bottom In port -> Integral 1.4 bottom out port -> Denon -> Vizio

I do get a signal, but the input to the Vizio is only 1080p.

Any suggestions or switch settings would be appreciated!
Because your AVR is not HDCP 2.2, the UHD blu ray player recognizes this and sends 1080P instead of 4k. I think your only option is to use the player HDMI 1 output to the TV, and the HDMI 2 output to your AVR for audio. Or use the Integral lower HDMI port to send video to the TV and the upper to your AVR. But in both cases you need to run another cable.

Last edited by claw; 02-14-2016 at 04:36 PM.
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post #609 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 07:04 PM
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I thought that was the whole point of the Integral...to work around this limitation.

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post #610 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 07:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claw View Post
Because your AVR is not HDCP 2.2, the UHD blu ray player recognizes this and sends 1080P instead of 4k. I think your only option is to use the player HDMI 1 output to the TV, and the HDMI 2 output to your AVR for audio. Or use the Integral lower HDMI port to send video to the TV and the upper to your AVR. But in both cases you need to run another cable.
This doesn't make any sense. The whole point of the Integral is to allow HDCP 1.4 devices to accept HDCP 2.2 sources. In other words, having the Integral between the UHD BD player and the receiver in the case described above should allow the UHD BD player to pass 4K video to the HDCP 1.4 device (the receiver).

In my particular case, I have the following setup:

Roku 4 > Denon AVR-X7200WA > Integral > JVC RS4910.

If I take the Integral out of the chain, the Roku 4 won't even let me configure it for 4K because my projector isn't HDCP 2.2-compliant (it says just this fact on my display). With the Integral in the chain, the Roku 4 passes 4K without issue.
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post #611 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stikle View Post
Well, I got my first UHD-BD today. If I go from the Samsung UHD-BDP directly into my Visio M75 4K, then I can get a 2160p input on the Vizio. So I know that will all work.

Now I need to add my Denon X5200W into the mix. It's HDCP 1.4 & HDMI 2.0.

I've got my HDFury Integral sitting here, both firmware updated, and just can't make it work. I am using all AmazonBasics High Speed with ethernet cables, and I just tested them all as good.

What I THINK I should do, and have tried is this:

UHD-BDP 2.2 -> Integral bottom In port -> Integral 1.4 bottom out port -> Denon -> Vizio

I do get a signal, but the input to the Vizio is only 1080p.

Any suggestions or switch settings would be appreciated!
What are your EDID settings on the Integral? I bet the Samsung is trying to pass a 600MHz signal and your receiver can't handle the bandwidth; if I understand things correctly, the Samsung defaults to 2160p 10-bit 4:4:4. You probably need to set the Integral up to convert 4K60 4:4:4 600MHz 18Gbps to 4K60 4:2:0 300 MHz 10.2Gbps.
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post #612 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Schwa View Post
What are your EDID settings on the Integral? I bet the Samsung is trying to pass a 600MHz signal and your receiver can't handle the bandwidth; if I understand things correctly, the Samsung defaults to 2160p 10-bit 4:4:4. You probably need to set the Integral up to convert 4K60 4:4:4 600MHz 18Gbps to 4K60 4:2:0 300 MHz 10.2Gbps.

I left all of the settings at default. I think I see the output setting in the GUI that you're talking about and will try that now, thanks.

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post #613 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by stikle View Post
Yes, but I was trying to get around running another HDMI cable up to the TV.
4K video will not passthrough your Denon.
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post #614 of 5423 Old 02-14-2016, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted by barneypoo69 View Post
4K video will not passthrough your Denon.

Oh. So on the X5200W product page where it says

Quote:
4K Ultra HD 60 Hz Pass-through;
4:4:4 Pure Color Sub-sampling Pass-through
For the ultimate video experience, the AVR-X5200W features an advanced video section with 8 HDMI inputs including 1 conveniently located on the front panel, and all rear HDMI inputs are equipped with Ultra HD 4K full 60 Hz frame-rate pass-through and 4K Ultra HD 60 Hz frame-rate upscaling. The AVR-X5200W also features Pure Color 4:4:4 color sub-sampling pass-through, another feature of the latest HDMI specification.
...they're actually lying?

Good to know.



Anywho...I give up for tonight. I know this will work, I'm just not doing something correctly here.

Hopefully HDFury will weigh in.

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post #615 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 03:20 AM
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Originally Posted by stikle View Post
Oh. So on the X5200W product page where it says



...they're actually lying?

Good to know.



Anywho...I give up for tonight. I know this will work, I'm just not doing something correctly here.

Hopefully HDFury will weigh in.

The X5200W (I have one) handles SDR 4K video fine. However, it's not able to passthrough HDR, even with the HD Fury, because it doesn't accept rec2020 content. So they are not lying .

That's one of the reasons why I'm upgrading to the X7200WA (along with DTS:X decoding). I still plan to use the HD Fury after the AVR to convert HDCP 2.2 to HDCP 1.4 for my JVC rs49, and pretend it has HDR so I can calibrate it to get the most of UHD Bluray. I plan to try this as soon as the Samsung player reaches the UK next month (hopefully).

Last edited by Manni01; 02-15-2016 at 05:42 AM.
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post #616 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 05:38 AM
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Originally Posted by claw View Post
For some reason automix does not work for me when I connect the new Samsung UHD K8500 Blu Ray player to my JVC RS500 projector. For one, the K8500 seems to default to 4k60 444 10bit which the projector cannot accept. And there is also speculation that the K8500 does not output the proper 5 volts that is required for active HDMI cables which causes issues when sending high bandwidth signals. Especially over longer distances. Mine is a 25 foot Monoprice 18Gbps active cable.

From my earlier post I was able to sync with 4k60 420 300 8 bit EDID. But 8 bit will not pass either deep color or HDR.

After I posted about a possible 422 EDID, I was able to sync using the 4k60 420 10 bit HDR EDID. With this EDID, and Deep Color set on in the player, my projector is reporting that it is receiving 4k/60/12 bit. I will be picking up a UHD Blu Ray movie disc today, and will try playing it tonight with this EDID configured.

I wasn't sure whether 4k60 422 would be 300 MHz, 600, or something in between. Since you confirmed it would be 600 MHz, I will probably have the same sync issues. The RS500 has 3 options in the menu for color space and I was looking for the best EDID option:
Auto
4k60 444 (only up to 8 bit)
4k60 422 (which can accept higher than 8 bit)

But if I can get HDR 10 bit and Deep Color using the 4k60 420 10 bit EDID, then I probably won't need a 422 EDID. The player only has Auto and 4k60 444 options so maybe it wouldn't be able to output a 422 signal either.

And I would guess that Automix would result in a 4k/60 444 8 bit signal to the RS500 since it can't accept 4k/60 444 10 bit that the player perfers. I don't want 8 bit since I need 10/12 bit for HDR/Deep Color.
Ok it seems there is some confusion here, the max bandwidth of the HDMI2.0a standard is 600MHz or 4K60 4:4:4 8bit, a 4K60 4:4:4 10bit signal would be beyond the standard the limit and therefor do not exist within this standard.

The HDR res is 4K60 4:2:0 10bit BT2020, you can pick up this edid from the custom dropdown in the GUI as you have done, that's the right one to select for HDR.

If you are having issue at 4K60 4:4:4 600MHz, it's more likely related to your HDMI cable.

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post #617 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 05:42 AM
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Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post
While we're asking I've got a somewhat different situation. I have an RS4910, and I'd like to do a Rec.2020 calibration (the Autocal software lets me define this). So I believe what I need is a 300MHz EDID, that reports Rec.2020. Is this possible with Automix? It's unclear to me what those checkboxes do.
Yes it's possible with automix as long as connected sinks at the output report 300MHz 4K60 4:2:0 and that you have BT2020 checked.
However, The best to make sure you pickup the right one and to make sure the source will see the right mode is to select the 4K60 4:2:0 10bit BT2020 from the custom dropdown in GUI.

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Last edited by HDfury; 02-15-2016 at 05:54 AM.
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post #618 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 05:47 AM
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Originally Posted by stikle View Post
Well, I got my first UHD-BD today. If I go from the Samsung UHD-BDP directly into my Visio M75 4K, then I can get a 2160p input on the Vizio. So I know that will all work.

Now I need to add my Denon X5200W into the mix. It's HDCP 1.4 & HDMI 2.0.

I've got my HDFury Integral sitting here, both firmware updated, and just can't make it work. I am using all AmazonBasics High Speed with ethernet cables, and I just tested them all as good.

What I THINK I should do, and have tried is this:

UHD-BDP 2.2 -> Integral bottom In port -> Integral 1.4 bottom out port -> Denon -> Vizio

I do get a signal, but the input to the Vizio is only 1080p.

Any suggestions or switch settings would be appreciated!
According to Vizio usermanual, only HDMI 5 will allow 4K60 4:2:0
http://cdn.vizio.com/documents/m65c1/um-m65c1.pdf

So if you use automix before your receiver, it will get 4K60 4:4:4 reported to source (because that's your AVR max specs) and this signal is not supported by your display, so it won't work.
What you need to do is use CUSTOM EDID SLIDE SWITCH position and select 4K60 4:2:0 300MHz from the GUI dropdown, then it will work on the below chain:

UHD-BPD 2.2 > INTEGRAL> DENON X5200 > VIZIO HDMI5

It's useless to feed a receiver with it's max signal if the display in the setup do not support this max specs but it remains possible. (see next answer)
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Last edited by HDfury; 02-15-2016 at 05:58 AM.
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post #619 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 05:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwa View Post
What are your EDID settings on the Integral? I bet the Samsung is trying to pass a 600MHz signal and your receiver can't handle the bandwidth; if I understand things correctly, the Samsung defaults to 2160p 10-bit 4:4:4. You probably need to set the Integral up to convert 4K60 4:4:4 600MHz 18Gbps to 4K60 4:2:0 300 MHz 10.2Gbps.
Yes that's an option, but doing this you are creating a 600MHz for nothing (for sound only !) and you could work this way:

UHDBP2.2 > INTEGRAL > BOT OUT to RECEIVER at 4K60 4:4:4 and TOP OUT to TV at 4K60 4:2:0

While if you just use CUSTOM EDID and select 4K60 4:2:0 you can drive longer HDMI cables and do not enter HDMI cable issue at 600MHz and work with one chain setup instead of split chain setup:

UHD BP 2.2 > INTEGRAL > RECEIVER > VIZIO HDMI5.

both will work.

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post #620 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 05:54 AM
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Originally Posted by HDfury View Post
Yes it's possible with automix as long as connected sinks at the output report 300MHz 4K60 4:2:0 and that you have BT2020 checked.
The best to make sure you pickup the right one and to make sure the source will see the right mode is to select the 4K60 4:2:0 10bit BT2020 from the custom dropdown in GUI.
The Integral has become an absolute requirement for flawless operation of the samsung UHD player. Even for owners of the new RS400, RS500, & RS600.

I am using it to convert 4K/60 4:4:4 8 bit to 4k/60 4:2:0 8bit. This allows the players menu and youtube to work flwaless, even over a 50ft monoprice cabernet cable. 4K/60 4:4:4 does not play well with the JVC projector even with short cables.

I can sucessfully use both the 4k/60-420 8bit setting, and the 4k/60-420 10 bit HDR BT2020 All Sound setting.

Myself and other members are finding that HDR on the JVC is kind of a mess. Is there any way we can get a custom EDID that would allow us to have 4k/60-420 10bit BT2020, but have the HDR flag removed. We basically would like to be able to toggle on/off HDR, and the JVC gives no control of this.

The only way to get SDR is by switching back to 8 bit currently.

If a 4k/60-420 10bit BT2020 All Sound EDID could be added, I think there would be tons of JVC owners who would greatly benefit.

All the UHD movies are currently 4k/24-444 10or12bit HDR Bt2020. But since the player will only output 4k/60 4:4:4 8bit for its system menu and youtube, it makes use of the player totally unreliable without the 4:2:2>4:2:0 conversion!
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post #621 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 06:04 AM
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Originally Posted by stikle View Post
Oh. So on the X5200W product page where it says



...they're actually lying?

Good to know.



Anywho...I give up for tonight. I know this will work, I'm just not doing something correctly here.

Hopefully HDFury will weigh in.
Your Denon is not HDCP 2.2 compliant. All 4K uses HDCP 2.2 copy protection now.

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post #622 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 06:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HDfury View Post
Yes it's possible with automix as long as connected sinks at the output report 300MHz 4K60 4:2:0 and that you have BT2020 checked.
However, The best to make sure you pickup the right one and to make sure the source will see the right mode is to select the 4K60 4:2:0 10bit BT2020 from the custom dropdown in GUI.
Thanks for the reply, maybe I was missing something but I thought the only option I saw in the dropdown was BT2020 and HDR, however my display (RS4910) is not HDR capable, so I need a 4K60 4:2:0 10 bit BT2020 without HDR.

Of course I'm not even sure the native gamut of my RS4910 is wide enough to make this worthwhile, but I'd like to try at least
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post #623 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 07:00 AM
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Thanks for the reply, maybe I was missing something but I thought the only option I saw in the dropdown was BT2020 and HDR, however my display (RS4910) is not HDR capable, so I need a 4K60 4:2:0 10 bit BT2020 without HDR.

Of course I'm not even sure the native gamut of my RS4910 is wide enough to make this worthwhile, but I'd like to try at least
The native gamut of the rs4910 will give you around 85% of P3.
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post #624 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 07:21 AM
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Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post
Thanks for the reply, maybe I was missing something but I thought the only option I saw in the dropdown was BT2020 and HDR, however my display (RS4910) is not HDR capable, so I need a 4K60 4:2:0 10 bit BT2020 without HDR.

Of course I'm not even sure the native gamut of my RS4910 is wide enough to make this worthwhile, but I'd like to try at least
Hello, please could you report back if you get 4K60 4:2:0 10 bit to work with the RS4910 ? I understand our JVC projector can only do 4K60 4:2:0 8 bits, but I could be wrong.
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post #625 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 07:25 AM
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According to Vizio usermanual, only HDMI 5 will allow 4K60 4:2:0
http://cdn.vizio.com/documents/m65c1/um-m65c1.pdf

So if you use automix before your receiver, it will get 4K60 4:4:4 reported to source (because that's your AVR max specs) and this signal is not supported by your display, so it won't work.
What you need to do is use CUSTOM EDID SLIDE SWITCH position and select 4K60 4:2:0 300MHz from the GUI dropdown, then it will work on the below chain:

UHD-BPD 2.2 > INTEGRAL> DENON X5200 > VIZIO HDMI5

It's useless to feed a receiver with it's max signal if the display in the setup do not support this max specs but it remains possible. (see next answer)
Thank you HDfury! I'll try that when I get home from work tonight.

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post #626 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 07:28 AM
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Hello, please could you report back if you get 4K60 4:2:0 10 bit to work with the RS4910 ? I understand our JVC projector can only do 4K60 4:2:0 8 bits, but I could be wrong.
4K60 4:2:0 means that it maxes at 8bits at 60p, but it should be able to do 10bits at 24/30p.
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post #627 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 07:29 AM
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@HD Fury: any news re x.v.color support on the Integral? Thanks.
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post #628 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 07:32 AM
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The Integral has become an absolute requirement for flawless operation of the samsung UHD player. Even for owners of the new RS400, RS500, & RS600.

I am using it to convert 4K/60 4:4:4 8 bit to 4k/60 4:2:0 8bit. This allows the players menu and youtube to work flwaless, even over a 50ft monoprice cabernet cable. 4K/60 4:4:4 does not play well with the JVC projector even with short cables.

I can sucessfully use both the 4k/60-420 8bit setting, and the 4k/60-420 10 bit HDR BT2020 All Sound setting.

Myself and other members are finding that HDR on the JVC is kind of a mess. Is there any way we can get a custom EDID that would allow us to have 4k/60-420 10bit BT2020, but have the HDR flag removed. We basically would like to be able to toggle on/off HDR, and the JVC gives no control of this.

The only way to get SDR is by switching back to 8 bit currently.

If a 4k/60-420 10bit BT2020 All Sound EDID could be added, I think there would be tons of JVC owners who would greatly benefit.

All the UHD movies are currently 4k/24-444 10or12bit HDR Bt2020. But since the player will only output 4k/60 4:4:4 8bit for its system menu and youtube, it makes use of the player totally unreliable without the 4:2:2>4:2:0 conversion!
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Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post
Thanks for the reply, maybe I was missing something but I thought the only option I saw in the dropdown was BT2020 and HDR, however my display (RS4910) is not HDR capable, so I need a 4K60 4:2:0 10 bit BT2020 without HDR.

Of course I'm not even sure the native gamut of my RS4910 is wide enough to make this worthwhile, but I'd like to try at least

Ok guys, we will add a 4K60 4:2:0 10bit BT2020 (without HDR) selectable from the dropdown EDID list, give us a couple of days.
claw, billqs, stikle and 2 others like this.

Maestro: 4I/4O +4K HDR over HDBT +Autoswitch any sources +HDMI/ARC/eARC sound to AVR input +webserver. [Won Best Product Award]
Diva: 4I/3O +Ambient Light +Lag Tester +4K HDR > 1080p SDR +HDMI/ARC/eARC sound to AVR input +autoswitch +webserver.
Vertex2: 4I/3O +Autoswitch any sources +HDMI/ARC/eARC sound to AVR input +webserver.
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Originally Posted by Manni01 View Post
4K60 4:2:0 means that it maxes at 8bits at 60p, but it should be able to do 10bits at 24/30p.
Thank you !
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post #630 of 5423 Old 02-15-2016, 07:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Manni01 View Post
@HD Fury: any news re x.v.color support on the Integral? Thanks.
Hi Manni01, sorry i though it was already solved for you, could you please describe test scenario once more so we can check it again ?

Maestro: 4I/4O +4K HDR over HDBT +Autoswitch any sources +HDMI/ARC/eARC sound to AVR input +webserver. [Won Best Product Award]
Diva: 4I/3O +Ambient Light +Lag Tester +4K HDR > 1080p SDR +HDMI/ARC/eARC sound to AVR input +autoswitch +webserver.
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