Ripping Blu-Rays II - Page 264 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #7891 of 11583 Old 06-04-2015, 03:36 PM
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4K and Dolby Atmos. I'm going to add that to my local Florida distributorships that specialize in snow shoes and swamp land.

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post #7892 of 11583 Old 06-04-2015, 08:50 PM
 
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"Some favorable legal decision just recently?"

All I can find is no one outside the company needs to know why they've changed their minds.

Has the feel like download it if you want, you're on your own.....
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post #7893 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 07:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
IMHO

re: 3D
People who wear glasses are shut out of 3D TV's. I wear glasses. I have a 3D plasma that came with two pair of what they call "3D glasses". Try watching for more than 10 min with the 3D glasses layered over top a pair of typical eye-wear. Not a good experience or one to be repeated. My wife wears contacts. I handed her a pair of the glasses and she looked at me like I was crazy if I expected her to have to wear them to watch TV.
.
That depends on your sets 3D glasses and what you can use with it. I have two different kinds of 3D glasses for my Sony HW30 projector and they will go over glasses nicely. GRANTED: I won't watch more than one 3D movie at a time due to the glasses (active tech).

BUT give me the same active experience using passive glasses (like those used in theaters) on a 4K set and I'm a very VERY happy guy.
ps- my better half - she wears the glasses.

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post #7894 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by pepar View Post
...but Atmos, IMHO, is an industry desperately in search of The Next Big Thing. I also think that about 4k in the video industry.
Even if that's true, couldn't that be said for EVERY technology advancement we've ever seen?

Is Atmos or 4K necessary? Of course not, but they can sure both be fun! Plenty of people poopooed Blu-Ray when it came out too. Same with 1080p. Same with DTS. So on and so forth. Every time we'd see an industry advancement, I've heard your exact same argument.

I was plenty happy with a rocking hifi setup back in the day, but that doesn't mean I don't enjoy multichannel audio these days! I was plenty happy with DTS. Doesn't mean I don't love DTS-HD MA! Now I'm stoked about Atmos and DTS:X. An industry desperately in search of the the next big thing? Sure, but whatever...I'm excited!
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post #7895 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post
Dolby Digital plus has identiCal requirements as Dolby True HD for playback.
I'm not sure what you mean by requirements. I have noticed DD+ on Netflix but my receiver always lights up Dolby Digital. Do receivers need a DD+ chip to decode it? I'll look into this.
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post #7896 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 08:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Montucky View Post
Even if that's true, couldn't that be said for EVERY technology advancement we've ever seen?

Is Atmos or 4K necessary? Of course not, but they can sure both be fun! Plenty of people poopooed Blu-Ray when it came out too. Same with 1080p. Same with DTS. So on and so forth. Every time we'd see an industry advancement, I've heard your exact same argument.

I was plenty happy with a rocking hifi setup back in the day, but that doesn't mean I don't enjoy multichannel audio these days! I was plenty happy with DTS. Doesn't mean I don't love DTS-HD MA! Now I'm stoked about Atmos and DTS:X. An industry desperately in search of the the next big thing? Sure, but whatever...I'm excited!
I don't recall the poo-poo'ing of 5.1, 1080p, Dolby Surround/Digital/True HD, DTS ES/HD MA or Blu-ray. Perhaps because the average person could see and hear AND DEPLOY the gear to benefit from improvement.

You can have an IMAX Private Theater in your home; are you excited about that as well?


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post #7897 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 08:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnBlanker View Post
I'm not sure what you mean by requirements. I have noticed DD+ on Netflix but my receiver always lights up Dolby Digital. Do receivers need a DD+ chip to decode it? I'll look into this.
I'm curious about that too. I have a cheap receiver in the bedroom that can play regular Dolby Digital just fine but not DD+ from Netflix. DD+ lights up the Pro Logic II and 5.1 indicators but I only get crackly noises from the speakers.
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post #7898 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by johnBlanker View Post
I'm not sure what you mean by requirements. I have noticed DD+ on Netflix but my receiver always lights up Dolby Digital. Do receivers need a DD+ chip to decode it? I'll look into this.
typically when I watch content from Netflix, Amazon, Vudu etc, it uses DD+. DD+ lights up on my Denon 4520 and also on my Sony Speaker bar. I streamed and watched two movies on Netflix last night. Both 5.1 audio tracks were using DD+. To listen to the bitstreamed DD+ you need a receiver capable of decoding the advanced audio codecs. Which does include DD+ and Dolby True HD.

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post #7899 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 09:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post
I don't recall the poo-poo'ing of 5.1, 1080p, Dolby Surround/Digital/True HD, DTS ES/HD MA or Blu-ray. Perhaps because the average person could see and hear AND DEPLOY the gear to benefit from improvement.
Man, I do. I remember plenty of people telling me that Blu-Ray wasn't THAT much better, and wasn't worth the cost over DVD. I remember people trying to talk me out of "wasting my money" on a 46" 1080p TV because one supposedly couldn't tell the difference in TVs under a certain size. I remember a salesman trying to talk me into a difference receiver than the one I wanted that was my first DTS capable unit. It happens every time there are advancements.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post
You can have an IMAX Private Theater in your home; are you excited about that as well?

Oh DEFINITELY! Even if I can't employ that now, I think it's awesome we could have something like at home. That picture IS exciting. Would I pay extra for "IMAX-ready" equipment? Well, of course not. But I would think it rocked that it's out there for those who could utilize it!

Can I use a 7.2.4 or 9.2.2 set up NOW? Nope, but I'm working on it!!!
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post #7900 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 09:21 AM
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I dont wanna open a new thread so lets try it here:
I wanna rip my blu ray collection with makemkv for my dune 303d and I´m looking for an external blu ray drive.
I´m using a macbook air 2012 with usb 3.0...what´s the fastest drive i can get and how long will it take?
These are two options I guess?
LG BE14NU40 (usb 3, larger and 20 bucks more expensive)
Samsung SE-506CB/RSBD (usb 2, smaller and cheaper)
Is it worth to get the LG..is the samsung good enough...or any other options?
I dont wanna burn any blu rays, so it will be just reading / ripping.

Thanks
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post #7901 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 09:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Ken.F View Post
I'm curious about that too. I have a cheap receiver in the bedroom that can play regular Dolby Digital just fine but not DD+ from Netflix. DD+ lights up the Pro Logic II and 5.1 indicators but I only get crackly noises from the speakers.
DD+ (enhanced AC3) is a codec between DD (AC3) and True HD. Whereas DD (AC-3) supports 5 channels at a max bitrate of 640kbit/s, DD+ supports 15 channels at a max bitrate of 6.144 Mbit/s. DD+ is still a lossy codec. True HD is lossless and supports 8 channels (7.1) at a max bitrate of 18Mbps.

Your receiver must be new enough to specifically support DD+ bitstreams.

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post #7902 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
DD+ (enhanced AC3) is a codec between DD (AC3) and True HD. Whereas DD (AC-3) supports 5 channels at a max bitrate of 640kbit/s, DD+ supports 15 channels at a max bitrate of 6.144 Mbit/s. DD+ is still a lossy codec. True HD is lossless and supports 8 channels (7.1) at a max bitrate of 18Mbps.

Your receiver must be new enough to specifically support DD+ bitstreams.
Ah, mine will decode DDTHD/DTSMA, I guess I need to check it it supports DD+

EDIT. Duh, it does and I actually remember seeing the DD+ on the screen from the yamaha display. I just remembered.
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post #7903 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 09:41 AM
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Ah, mine will decode DDTHD/DTSMA, I guess I need to check it it supports DD+
My Onkyo is 6-7 yr old and supports DTS & DTS-HD and DD & True-HD but not DD+.

I know, it needs to be updated. I'm just too lazy right now to want to tackle an equipment rip-down and re-plugging a bunch of wires/cables -- not to mention studying a new AVR manual and reprogramming all the activities on my Harmony. lt's a substantial energy barrier.

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post #7904 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 09:57 AM
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easily the hardest component to upgrade/demo/replace. It's a beast of a project. Especially the learning piece. I really don't want to spend so much time learning a new AVR. I wish they made mid-end ($6-800 range) without all the bells and whistles. I want the higher wattage but not all the crap. My 10 year old yamaha htr 5660 only does DD/DTS 6.1 and it has a menu that you could set in about 30 seconds flat. And it sounds amazing. It has bass/treble knobs. knobs!
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post #7905 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
My Onkyo is 6-7 yr old and supports DTS & DTS-HD and DD & True-HD but not DD+.

I know, it needs to be updated. I'm just too lazy right now to want to tackle an equipment rip-down and re-plugging a bunch of wires/cables -- not to mention studying a new AVR manual and reprogramming all the activities on my Harmony. lt's a substantial energy barrier.
engh. upgrade for what? I think most people would be hard pressed to tell the difference between DD+ and straight DD.
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post #7906 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Montucky View Post
Can I use a 7.2.4 or 9.2.2 set up NOW? Nope, but I'm working on it!!!
Alrighty then, may the wind be at your back.

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post #7907 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by johnBlanker View Post
engh. upgrade for what? I think most people would be hard pressed to tell the difference between DD+ and straight DD.
If you use Netflix it's a choice between DD+ and 2 channel stereo. My receiver doesn't play DD+ so I'm stuck with stereo.
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post #7908 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 11:47 AM
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And it sounds amazing. It has bass/treble knobs. knobs!
Mine too! Knobs! Glorious knobs! Newer receivers that blow my old Technics away in just about every aspect take a LOT of fiddling around with to get them to sound as good as mine does.

While I've moved on, there will ALWAYS be a place in my home for the Technics and its wonderful simplicity, not to mention loads of usable power. I only have to have the bass knob a hair past neutral and don't even have to turn the volume up halfway to get sound that could rattle my house apart, and that's WITHOUT a subwoofer. Muahaha!
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post #7909 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Armoky View Post
I dont wanna open a new thread so lets try it here:
I wanna rip my blu ray collection with makemkv for my dune 303d and I´m looking for an external blu ray drive.
I´m using a macbook air 2012 with usb 3.0...what´s the fastest drive i can get and how long will it take?
These are two options I guess?
LG BE14NU40 (usb 3, larger and 20 bucks more expensive)
Samsung SE-506CB/RSBD (usb 2, smaller and cheaper)
Is it worth to get the LG..is the samsung good enough...or any other options?
I dont wanna burn any blu rays, so it will be just reading / ripping.

Thanks
USB3 is always nice to have with its higher throughput, but it all depends on the drives read spead. If it approaches the limits of 2.0, then get the 3, but with older drives 2.0 was more than enough. That said, I've had my LG BD burner for MANY years of dutiful service. Not sure how they fair these days, but I wouldn't hesitate to buy another if their reputation has held up.
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post #7910 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 12:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
DD+ (enhanced AC3) is a codec between DD (AC3) and True HD. Whereas DD (AC-3) supports 5 channels at a max bitrate of 640kbit/s, DD+ supports 15 channels at a max bitrate of 6.144 Mbit/s. DD+ is still a lossy codec. True HD is lossless and supports 8 channels (7.1) at a max bitrate of 18Mbps.

Your receiver must be new enough to specifically support DD+ bitstreams.
Keep in mind that the Dolby Digital Plus audio bitstream that accompanies Netflix video is only 192 kb/s. It was the primary reason for implementing it, to half the amount of data transferred. Netflix used to use a 384 kb/s stream for audio and DD+ has saved them in bandwidth costs. Basically the same audio quality at half the bitrate.
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post #7911 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 01:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
My Onkyo is 6-7 yr old and supports DTS & DTS-HD and DD & True-HD but not DD+.

I know, it needs to be updated. I'm just too lazy right now to want to tackle an equipment rip-down and re-plugging a bunch of wires/cables -- not to mention studying a new AVR manual and reprogramming all the activities on my Harmony. lt's a substantial energy barrier.
I didn't even think that was possible since DD+ and DTS-HD are lossy advanced audio codecs. And to be able to support lossless Dolby True HD and DTS-HD MA the chips that decode those should also handle the lossy advanced codecs.

Every receiver/speaker bar I've owned that could decode Dolby True HD/DTS-HD MA could also decode Dolby Digital Plus and DTS-HD. Since all those are advanced audio codecs.

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post #7912 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 01:31 PM
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I didn't even think that was possible since DD+ and DTS-HD are lossy advanced audio codecs. And to be able to support lossless Dolby True HD and DTS-HD MA the chips that decode those should also handle the lossy advanced codecs.

Every receiver/speaker bar I've owned that could decode Dolby True HD/DTS-HD MA could also decode Dolby Digital Plus and DTS-HD. Since all those are advanced audio codecs.
DTS is lossy.
DTS-HD is lossless.

The full name is DTS-HD Master Audio.

For some reason people talk about DTS-HD and DTS-MA as if they were separate entities.

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post #7913 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 01:55 PM
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DTS is lossy.
DTS-HD is lossy. Ironically, or weaselly masterfully, the full name is DTS-HD HR (High Resolution).
DTS-HD Master Audio is lossless.

All three are separate products.

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post #7914 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 01:55 PM
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DTS is lossy.
DTS-HD is lossless.

The full name is DTS-HD Master Audio.

For some reason people talk about DTS-HD and DTS-MA as if they were separate entities.
There's also DTS-HD High Resolution which is lossy and was often referred to as DTS-HD. I only know this because I was quite confused when I first got my first receiver with DTS-HD and it had both MA and HR listed.
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post #7915 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
DTS is lossy.
DTS-HD is lossless.

The full name is DTS-HD Master Audio.

For some reason people talk about DTS-HD and DTS-MA as if they were separate entities.
They are. DTS-HD (I guess HR as peper mentioned) is equivalent to DD+.

Just like DTS-HD MA is equivalent to Dolby True HD. But either way they are all advanced audio codecs and the same HDMI version is needed to be able to play back all of those advanced audio codecs.

I know initally, in 2006, my HD DVD and BD players decoded the advanced audio codecs internally and sent them out as multi-channel pcm to my receivers.

It wasn't until 2008 when I got my first receiver that could decode the advanced audio codecs. And then later my Sony speaker bar could decode the advanced audio codecs. I guess I'll be stuck here for awhile since I am unable to take advantage of ceiling speakers for the new Atmos or DTS:X audio codecs. So I can't see going beyond my current 9.1 setup.

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post #7916 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post
They are. DTS-HD (I guess HR as peper mentioned) is equivalent to DD+.

Just like DTS-HD MA is equivalent to Dolby True HD. But either way they are all advanced audio codecs and the same HDMI version is needed to be able to play back all of those advanced audio codecs.
Yes, I believe you are correct about DD+ and DTS-HD, and temporally they they were twins. Re the codecs, to use a law analogy, whatever the "highest" code you have is, the predecessors are "lesser includeds."

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post #7917 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 02:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post

I know initally, in 2006, my HD DVD and BD players decoded the advanced audio codecs internally and sent them out as multi-channel pcm to my receivers.

It wasn't until 2008 when I got my first receiver that could decode the advanced audio codecs. And then later my Sony speaker bar could decode the advanced audio codecs. I guess I'll be stuck here for awhile since I am unable to take advantage of ceiling speakers for the new Atmos or DTS:X audio codecs. So I can't see going beyond my current 9.1 setup.
Content drove the newest codecs and the media players always had the newest ... and outputted them decoded in analog form. And they were the least expensive way to "upgrade" one's system. Hence the importance of having 5.1/7.1 analog inputs on one's receiver/prepro.

Everyone remember AC-3 and an RF input to accept Laserdisc audio?

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post #7918 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post
DTS is lossy.
DTS-HD is lossy. Ironically, or weaselly masterfully, the full name is DTS-HD HR (High Resolution).
DTS-HD Master Audio is lossless.

All three are separate products.
"DTS-HD" is not a parent or separate format, it is simply the root name of the DTS-HD audio formats of which there are two.

There is DTS-HD Master Audio and DTS-HD High Resolution Audio.
Both are comprised of the lossy 1.5 Mbps DTS core and the HD extensions. DTS-HD High Resolution Audio is a subset which limits the bitrate to 6Mbps for BluRay. It is used when disk space is an issue. DTS-HD High Resolution is not lossless. Only DTS-HD MA and True HD are lossless audio formats.

Most of the time when posters cite DTS-HD they are referring to the lossless DTS-HD MA track -- they either just don't know the full name or are too lazy to type the full name. I am profoundly guilty of the latter -- I refer to it as DTS-HD all the time. It would be far better to refer to it as DTS-MA and avoid confusion -- I will make the effort henceforth.
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post #7919 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
"DTS-HD" is not a parent or separate format, it is simply the root name of the DTS-HD audio formats of which there are two.

There is DTS-HD Master Audio and DTS-HD High Resolution Audio.
Both are comprised of the lossy 1.5 Mbps DTS core and the HD extensions. DTS-HD High Resolution Audio is a subset which limits the bitrate to 6Mbps for BluRay. It is used when disk space is an issue. DTS-HD High Resolution is not lossless. Only DTS-HD MA and True HD are lossless audio formats.

Most of the time when posters cite DTS-HD they are referring to the lossless DTS-HD MA track -- they either just don't know the full name or are too lazy to type the full name. I am profoundly guilty of the latter -- I refer to it as DTS-HD all the time. It would be far better to refer to it as DTS-MA and avoid confusion -- I will make the effort henceforth.
This HD/HD HR/HD MA thing and what people incompletely/incorrectly call them seems semantical at this point amongst people who know really know what they are. But I completely agree that there is confusion because it is ... confusing. It all encourages imprecise descriptions because it causes imprecise understandings. Pentium processors had that going on as well.

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post #7920 of 11583 Old 06-05-2015, 10:57 PM
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While I've moved on, there will ALWAYS be a place in my home for the Technics and its wonderful simplicity
Remember those CD player remotes having +10 keys where pressing +10, +10, 7 would result in song 27 starting to play? No such luck on current devices. The clueless bums at Sony can't even be bothered to use it on dedicated players like the HAP-S1 let alone regular stereo systems. With USB slots that can handle 32+ GB sticks with thousands of songs you can click 250 times on the folder+ button to get anywhere. That's progress.

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