What NAS horsepower needed? - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 1Likes
  • 1 Post By DanPackMan
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 10 Old 01-26-2018, 02:31 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
wekya's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Taiwan
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 36 Post(s)
Liked: 11
What NAS horsepower needed?

I'm trying to decide how to go for my second NAS. My first lacks horsepower due to lack of budget when purchased. This new one, I will pay to get power, as I've learned my present one is a bit weak. I want to use a powerful NAS to drive/push video to the OPPO if possible, but I worry about a degradation in video quality. Sometimes I will send a video from my HTPC to the HDMI IN on the OPPO, rather than have the player pull from the NAS. The picture quality, and colourspace, of inputting from the HTPC direct via HDMI to OPPO is much worse. I'm uncertain if a NAS doing transcoding will have any effect on the picture quality.


My goal of the better NAS will be to push video directly from the NAS to the OPPO. My key here is to gain a better, more polished and stable, user interface like Kodi/Plex (or whatever you can suggest) that allows for playlists etc.

The QNAP ts-45x is what I think I want. I'm leaning to the 451, but maybe, with your input, I'll step up to the 453. It seems Syno doesn't have as deep a bench for apps. Right now I have a minor kluge needed to run Minimserver. I'm hoping the new NAS will become the "control point"....for video only, Linn knows how to make a front end. So, if I want to use a NAS to send video via Ethernet ((DLNA?) to the OPPO so it can make the great video it is designed to do. Hopefully using a more modern, stable and function rich UI of Kodi etc. I'm not certain that I will ever want to view 4K content, but please include that in your suggestions.

Asus VivoPC HTPC Win10 i5 16GB RAM Intel graphics OR Oppo 105D>Panasonic P50ST60.
Audio: Linn MDSM/2>Linn 6100/D>Linn Aktiv Ninkas (Linn K600 and silver RCAs), OR Optical out from Oppo>Vizio S4251w-B4 5.1
Synology 215j, Asus AC88U router
wekya is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 10 Old 01-26-2018, 03:27 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Brian Hampton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Posts: 8,917
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1295 Post(s)
Liked: 755
I bought a low end NAS Lenovo IX-300D. (Now I have 5 of that model)

I haven't experienced the high end models and I'm sure they do amazing things.

However, the idea that they run Plex doesn't really appeal to me. A high end NAS can run Plex but the CPU and such inside is still fairly low end. So I think pairing a low end NAS with a networked PC you can run Plex and transcode to several clients with better results. I have a networked PC with an i7 and 16GB RAM and SSD and it serves to multiple areas in the house,.. I believe it can transcode several streams at once.

My low end NAS has never disappointed me. It's network storage,.. doesn't also need to be a PC.

(I'm sure people who paid super big prices though for a NAS want to believe it's worth it so they will let you know how great that is.)
Brian Hampton is offline  
post #3 of 10 Old 01-26-2018, 04:07 AM
Senior Member
 
andygiddings's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Coppell, Texas
Posts: 258
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 118 Post(s)
Liked: 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by wekya View Post
I'm trying to decide how to go for my second NAS. My first lacks horsepower due to lack of budget when purchased. This new one, I will pay to get power, as I've learned my present one is a bit weak. I want to use a powerful NAS to drive/push video to the OPPO if possible, but I worry about a degradation in video quality. Sometimes I will send a video from my HTPC to the HDMI IN on the OPPO, rather than have the player pull from the NAS. The picture quality, and colourspace, of inputting from the HTPC direct via HDMI to OPPO is much worse. I'm uncertain if a NAS doing transcoding will have any effect on the picture quality.


My goal of the better NAS will be to push video directly from the NAS to the OPPO. My key here is to gain a better, more polished and stable, user interface like Kodi/Plex (or whatever you can suggest) that allows for playlists etc.

The QNAP ts-45x is what I think I want. I'm leaning to the 451, but maybe, with your input, I'll step up to the 453. It seems Syno doesn't have as deep a bench for apps. Right now I have a minor kluge needed to run Minimserver. I'm hoping the new NAS will become the "control point"....for video only, Linn knows how to make a front end. So, if I want to use a NAS to send video via Ethernet ((DLNA?) to the OPPO so it can make the great video it is designed to do. Hopefully using a more modern, stable and function rich UI of Kodi etc. I'm not certain that I will ever want to view 4K content, but please include that in your suggestions.
I've used Synology NAS to achieve what you are looking for with 4k content and no issues - both the DS 216+II (Celeron N3060) and DS718 (Celeron J3355) work without a hitch pulling the data from the Oppo 203. Starts quickly, great PQ/SQ and no buffering. No need for Plex, just use the Network facility in the Oppo to view the MKV and press play. For a more user friendly interface I use the ATV4K with Infuse. You don't need a powerful processor or an app as you're not transcoding

Room 1 system: Paradigm Reference Active 7.2 system, Anthem AVM50, Oppo BDP-103. Pioneer Elite 610HD. Room 2: Samsung 65HU8550 with SEK3500, Paradigm Monitor 5.1 system, Denon AVR-X2400H, Oppo BDP-203, Nvidia Shield, Apple TV 4k
andygiddings is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 10 Old 01-26-2018, 04:24 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
DanPackMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: NC
Posts: 1,640
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 411 Post(s)
Liked: 1045
Quote:
Originally Posted by wekya View Post
I'm trying to decide how to go for my second NAS. My first lacks horsepower due to lack of budget when purchased. This new one, I will pay to get power, as I've learned my present one is a bit weak. I want to use a powerful NAS to drive/push video to the OPPO if possible, but I worry about a degradation in video quality. Sometimes I will send a video from my HTPC to the HDMI IN on the OPPO, rather than have the player pull from the NAS. The picture quality, and colourspace, of inputting from the HTPC direct via HDMI to OPPO is much worse. I'm uncertain if a NAS doing transcoding will have any effect on the picture quality.
.
NAS transcoding will generally not improve video picture quality wrt colorspace, however it may improve actual playback (stuttering, artifacts) if the the player cannot handle the original file data rate or codec. It sounds like your HTPC colorspace is not satisfactory but your OPPO output is. For best results, most typically want to stream the native file and not transcode at all. Is there a reason you cannot play all your native NAS files dircectly on your OPPO now? That part wasn't clear to me. I only bring it up because just getting a more powerful NAS might not solve your picture quality problem.

Whether or not you use PLEX or a DLNA server will not matter with picture quality if you are playing the native files. It will be the same quality as if you were accessing them directly. But its certainly nice to have a good NAS.

Last edited by DanPackMan; 01-26-2018 at 04:30 AM.
DanPackMan is offline  
post #5 of 10 Old 01-26-2018, 09:58 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Jon S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Sunny Hawaii
Posts: 4,396
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1101 Post(s)
Liked: 389
I have a QNAP TS-853A and a TS-453 Pro, both using Intel Celeron processors. I can tell you that there are times the stream will lag when two devices are streaming from the NAS (most my videos are 1080P compressed, about 2GB/hour in size so they are not that big). If you are planning to transcode (change resolution on the fly, such as converting to 720P), then the Celeron will barely be adequate on one stream.

Right now, I feel the Celeron is just about covers my needs as I usually only have one video streaming at a time. I do not think the Oppo supports Kodi or Plex. I am using DLNA on my Sony Blu-Ray players to access the NAS. It does what I need it to do. I am connecting via Wi-Fi and as long you have a good signal, it will suffice. The drawback for you is that DLNA does not support playlists.

if you are considering streaming 4K, then you will definitely need a fast CPU in the NAS. I cannot stream a full 4K video at all right now. Remember, to stream full 4K, you will need HDMI 2.0a and these units only have HDMI 1.4a or older which does not support full 4K (HDMI 1.4a supports 4K resolution, but not 4:4:4 color space or 60Hz or HDR).

I know some of the more expensive and newer QNAP units does have HDMI 2.0 and supports 4K, but i am not sure which ones (TS-x73e series maybe), but they are really expensive.

If it's not a BIG screen, it's not a theater...
Jon S is offline  
post #6 of 10 Old 01-26-2018, 10:24 AM
Senior Member
 
andygiddings's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Coppell, Texas
Posts: 258
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 118 Post(s)
Liked: 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon S View Post
I have a QNAP TS-853A and a TS-453 Pro, both using Intel Celeron processors. I can tell you that there are times the stream will lag when two devices are streaming from the NAS (most my videos are 1080P compressed, about 2GB/hour in size so they are not that big). If you are planning to transcode (change resolution on the fly, such as converting to 720P), then the Celeron will barely be adequate on one stream.

Right now, I feel the Celeron is just about covers my needs as I usually only have one video streaming at a time. I do not think the Oppo supports Kodi or Plex. I am using DLNA on my Sony Blu-Ray players to access the NAS. It does what I need it to do. I am connecting via Wi-Fi and as long you have a good signal, it will suffice. The drawback for you is that DLNA does not support playlists.

if you are considering streaming 4K, then you will definitely need a fast CPU in the NAS. I cannot stream a full 4K video at all right now. Remember, to stream full 4K, you will need HDMI 2.0a and these units only have HDMI 1.4a or older which does not support full 4K (HDMI 1.4a supports 4K resolution, but not 4:4:4 color space or 60Hz or HDR).

I know some of the more expensive and newer QNAP units does have HDMI 2.0 and supports 4K, but i am not sure which ones (TS-x73e series maybe), but they are really expensive.
The Oppo 203 doesn't have any app support but, as mentioned earlier, can easily stream a complete 4K UHD rip from a Celeron based NAS. This is a single stream over ethernet. It also works very well with an ATV4K and Infuse Pro.

Room 1 system: Paradigm Reference Active 7.2 system, Anthem AVM50, Oppo BDP-103. Pioneer Elite 610HD. Room 2: Samsung 65HU8550 with SEK3500, Paradigm Monitor 5.1 system, Denon AVR-X2400H, Oppo BDP-203, Nvidia Shield, Apple TV 4k
andygiddings is offline  
post #7 of 10 Old 01-26-2018, 10:12 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
wekya's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Taiwan
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 36 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Speaking to the various posts chronologically, I am buying a NAS to get away from also having a PC burning, or worse still, from having to boot it when I want to consume media. I have an excellent HTPC, but I'm too lazy to waddle over and actually press a button to start it. I too have less powerful NAS, and it is great at it's job.


This new NAS is hopefully going to save me from the garbage UI, and common crashing, the Oppo presents me with. I don't know what the 20x Oppo's are like (someone here has both--comments??!), but my 105D doesn't allow playlists, scrubbing forward or back in a file, it crashes if any changes are made to the media folder it is reading on the NAS, but it gives me a dang fine picture. Because of this I want to avoid the Oppo software, while revelling in it's hardware capabilities. I wanted to make this thread display device agnostic, not about the Oppo per se, as I hope this thread can be used by anyone outputting video from a NAS, but I guess it does need to be considered in my case, so thanks.


As for changing the resolution, at the moment I don't want to do that. Most of my media is 1080p, and I think any 720p eventually presented to the video chain will at least be upconverted by my tv (am I correct on this?}. In the future I may wind up DOWNconverting 4K material as I think my Panasonic is my monitor until it, or I, die(s). I don't presently have more than one stream of video, and I say stream meaning here video being created. In the future there may be other users who would be obtaining video files (but not asking for a transcode) from the NAS. That to me is maybe more limited by LAN bandwidth than horsepower of the NAS? For the record the Oppo is wired ethernet to the router, which is (will always be) also wired ethernet to the NAS.

I'm way out of my knowledge's depth on what DLNA does/is, and what the potential front end PLEX/KODI/whatevs. This is a secondary reason for my posting this, and I hope later readers can benefit if this is explained too. All I think I want to do here is no longer ask the Oppo to pull video (using it's Soviet style UI), and getting the NAS to push video to a passive Oppo, but allowing it (or Sony etc.) to work it's video magic.

Asus VivoPC HTPC Win10 i5 16GB RAM Intel graphics OR Oppo 105D>Panasonic P50ST60.
Audio: Linn MDSM/2>Linn 6100/D>Linn Aktiv Ninkas (Linn K600 and silver RCAs), OR Optical out from Oppo>Vizio S4251w-B4 5.1
Synology 215j, Asus AC88U router
wekya is offline  
post #8 of 10 Old 01-27-2018, 05:01 AM
Senior Member
 
andygiddings's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Coppell, Texas
Posts: 258
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 118 Post(s)
Liked: 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by wekya View Post
Speaking to the various posts chronologically, I am buying a NAS to get away from also having a PC burning, or worse still, from having to boot it when I want to consume media. I have an excellent HTPC, but I'm too lazy to waddle over and actually press a button to start it. I too have less powerful NAS, and it is great at it's job.


This new NAS is hopefully going to save me from the garbage UI, and common crashing, the Oppo presents me with. I don't know what the 20x Oppo's are like (someone here has both--comments??!), but my 105D doesn't allow playlists, scrubbing forward or back in a file, it crashes if any changes are made to the media folder it is reading on the NAS, but it gives me a dang fine picture. Because of this I want to avoid the Oppo software, while revelling in it's hardware capabilities. I wanted to make this thread display device agnostic, not about the Oppo per se, as I hope this thread can be used by anyone outputting video from a NAS, but I guess it does need to be considered in my case, so thanks.


As for changing the resolution, at the moment I don't want to do that. Most of my media is 1080p, and I think any 720p eventually presented to the video chain will at least be upconverted by my tv (am I correct on this?}. In the future I may wind up DOWNconverting 4K material as I think my Panasonic is my monitor until it, or I, die(s). I don't presently have more than one stream of video, and I say stream meaning here video being created. In the future there may be other users who would be obtaining video files (but not asking for a transcode) from the NAS. That to me is maybe more limited by LAN bandwidth than horsepower of the NAS? For the record the Oppo is wired ethernet to the router, which is (will always be) also wired ethernet to the NAS.

I'm way out of my knowledge's depth on what DLNA does/is, and what the potential front end PLEX/KODI/whatevs. This is a secondary reason for my posting this, and I hope later readers can benefit if this is explained too. All I think I want to do here is no longer ask the Oppo to pull video (using it's Soviet style UI), and getting the NAS to push video to a passive Oppo, but allowing it (or Sony etc.) to work it's video magic.
I have both a 103 and 205. I've never had a crash on either even when the NAS directory changes. The 203 will operate as a Digital Media Player using DLNA but can also play files directly from a SMB/CIFS or NFS shared folder. I use NFS and have my media organized as per normal media server structure. Once you've got the file playing, the usual playback controls are available. Have never tried playlists so don't know whether this is supported or not. In terms of how fancy the UI is - its a folder structure, simple as that.

If you want something fancier I think you'll have to bypass the Oppo altogether and either get a streamer or use a NAS with HDMI out. Buying a 203 when you only want 1080 seems a waste when practically any streamer will cover what you need, as will almost any NAS.

In terms of the streamer applications, there are really two choices - a player app which directly streams your media from the NAS and has a gui (compared to a directory list). Some of these can be had for free from the NAS suppliers (Synology has both the media server and the front end app) or you can use Kodi/Infuse/MrMC etc (Kodi is also free). The alternative is to go for a Plex Server/Client which has additional features to the player apps (which you may/may not need).

Room 1 system: Paradigm Reference Active 7.2 system, Anthem AVM50, Oppo BDP-103. Pioneer Elite 610HD. Room 2: Samsung 65HU8550 with SEK3500, Paradigm Monitor 5.1 system, Denon AVR-X2400H, Oppo BDP-203, Nvidia Shield, Apple TV 4k

Last edited by andygiddings; 01-27-2018 at 05:09 AM.
andygiddings is offline  
post #9 of 10 Old 01-27-2018, 05:08 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
lockdown571's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,269
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 401 Post(s)
Liked: 296
If your goal is good picture quality, then you should be avoiding transcoding completely. If you don't transcode, your NAS does not have to be powerful at all. Sounds like your real issue is a color space problem with your HTPC. I don't have an Oppo, so I'm not super familiar with it. Is there no way to directly play the videos over your network to the oppo without using the HTPC? Does the Oppo only support DLNA for network play? Can your current NAS not run a DLNA server? Honestly, I think using the Oppo for streaming videos anyways is a mistake because of Cinavia (although maybe it doesn't enforce cinavia over the HDMI in?).

Have you thought about using a streamer device like a Nvidia Shield or Apple TV 4K instead of the Oppo? Then you could connect to your current NAS over SMB via Kodi/SPMC/Infuse/MrMC and direct play your files. Note the Apple TV 4K does not bitstream HD audio (although MrMC and Infuse can decode TrueHD and DTS-MA to PCM) and the Shield currently does not switch automatically between 709 and 2020 color spaces.
lockdown571 is offline  
post #10 of 10 Old 01-27-2018, 05:57 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
DanPackMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: NC
Posts: 1,640
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 411 Post(s)
Liked: 1045
Quote:
Originally Posted by wekya View Post
but my 105D doesn't allow playlists, scrubbing forward or back in a file, it crashes if any changes are made to the media folder it is reading on the NAS, but it gives me a dang fine picture..
These do not sound like problems a new NAS will necessarily fix. Even very slow NAS devices should be able to handle one stream of access, including fast forward, etc. But I suppose that could be a problem with very very slow NAS. But since your HTPC doesn't have a problem, I'd say the NAS isn't the problem causing this. It could possibly be a faulty network connection to your OPPO, or the OPPO itself.

Do you have the same problems with the OPPO if you place that movie folder in a shared directory on a PC? I'd test that for comparison purposes if I could.

Also, if you don't like the user interface on our OPPO, the only way to fix it is to replace it (or update its software if that is possible, I'm not an OPPO user) You won't get another user interface by installing a new NAS. You 'might' find a way to use PLEX or other media app on a phone that will tell the OPPO what to play, sort of like a remote control.

Have you tried to find a way to have your HTPC power up via remote?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wekya View Post
I'm way out of my knowledge's depth on what DLNA does/is, and what the potential front end PLEX/KODI/whatevs.
DLNA is a service program that runs on your NAS (or media server) that announces to other devices on your network what movies and music you have stored there. Its a standard developed by the industry that never was strictly enforced, so results vary. It is a feature of most media server programs, including PLEX. Most media players look for that service when connected to your network.

PLEX is a media server program that does the same thing as DLNA but has its own nonDLNA way of doing it. It keeps a database of all your movies and music, and feeds that info to other PLEX clients (playback devices) you have. PLEX is also a media playback software which sits on your phone or HTPC and gets its inputs from your PLEX server. It is generally free software that does this very well, therefore a popular choice. You install it on your NAS if not already installed. PLEX will automatically transcode media to a lower quality for devices that cannot handle the native file, before sending to the device.

There is also PLEX add on feature for KODI, if you have that installed as your media playback software on a device.
techflaws likes this.

Last edited by DanPackMan; 01-27-2018 at 06:12 AM.
DanPackMan is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Networking, Media Servers & Content Streaming

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off